Does Avengers need Spider-Man & Wolverine again!?

[Ultimate Captain America]

Of those, only the West Coast Avengers were considered official Avengers. Thunderbolts were never considered Avengers. Though they wanted and even got Hawkeye and Mockingbird to train them, the Great Lake Avengers were also never officialized as an Avengers team. As you've mentioned, A-Next and Ultimates were from another universe, and, as such not applicable as official Avengers. Avengers Forever was a team whose members were picked from various time-periods. Hank Pym (both), Hawkeye, Cap and Wasp were from the past and long time members. The only new additions, from the future, were Songbird (which sort of became an Avenger in Al Ewing's New Avengers. I think. As I've said, things become kind of complicated after a while) and only Captain Marvel (Genis-Vell) never actually became an Avenger (I think). While I agree that the creation of the West Coast Avengers opened the door to larger membership drives, I stand by my comment that it only felt like it got out of hand after Bendis arrived and started the miracle of teams multiplication.

Peace

Then the problem is with mixing the editorial history of the Avengers and the in-universe history of the Avengers. From an editorial point of view, ALL those teams are Avengers-related (even the Thunderbolts: there were former Avengers villains, had frequent crossovers with the Avengers, Hawkeye moved from one team to the other, and were both managed by the same writer when they started). From an in-universe perspective... perhaps the teams before Wanda's attack other than WCA are not officially recognized, but same goes for other teams after it. The Young Avengers just stole the name, Dark Avengers are all villains and surely nobody acknowledges Norman Osbourne or Bullseye as Avengers, and Savage Avengers were more of a "let's get together for this fight" team-up than a regular team. Even when published in comics that explicitly had "Avengers" in the name.

[ARkadelphia]

RE: Thing WCA

He hung out with WCA from about issue 4-10, Hawkeye pressuring him to join. Finally Ben agreed to join and there was a press conference to announce it. But Ben never showed up. He was back with the Fantastic Four, where he belonged.

Interestingly, Steve Englehart wrote the WCA issues and then took over the FF where he brought him into that book. So the transition was seamless.

[SilverScarlet]

Abso-frickin’-lutely NO!!

[whitecrown]

Spider-Man is a PlayStation exclusive DLC character in Avengers. It didn't do much in terms of sales other than piss people off for being exclusive to PS.

Both Spider-Man and Wolverine are playable in Midnight Suns and although I loved that game, it wasn't exactly a smash hit in terms of sales among casual gamers.

Gaming crowd cares more about the genre and quality of the game than the IP. See Fallout 76. Unfortunately there is also a section of gamers that shout "get woke go broke" to any creative decision they don't agree with for mostly petty, and dare I say, racist, sexist, mysogynistic reasons.

I didn't even realize Spidey made it into the game as DLC. Damage was already done then.

And that's true that Midnight Suns was still a flop even with both of them. I haven't played that game but I heard good things about it and that it didn't deserve its fate unlike the Avengers game.

[K7P5V]

My personal favorite lineups were the "Kooky Quartet" and the early West Coast Avengers team. Characters that are maybe not really strong enough to maintain a solo book, but still pretty interesting.

I know, right?! My personal favorite will always be the 70's lineup (XD)

[Brian Adkins]

MCU popularity I don't think has greatly increased comic book sales for any particular character. I even remember asking those running a few comic book shops if that was the case and the answer was, "relatively little."

And yes, Black Panther is definitively on the current team. Just hesitated because I remembered there was some question as to whether it was T' Challa or not at first? It is.

And now there's Blood Hunt and Blade. And Doctor Strange. And Clea. Talk about Defenders! lol

[Tien Long]

....I wouldn't mind. I'm a huge supporter for Avengers like Stingray, Quasar, Sersi, and Black Knight. I'd love to see them featured more on the Avengers. However, yeah, Wolverine and Spider-Man are some of Marvel's most popular characters. I miss seeing them on the team.

For me, I was against Bendis' line-ups featuring Wolverine and Spider-Man because, strength wise, they weren't that mighty. There has to be class 100, omega level heavy hitters rounding out that team, y'know?

So if there was a team featuring Wolverine and Spider-Man ALONG WITH Quasar, Sersi, Wonder Man, and Thor, then I would consider that to be an Avengers team. Just enough to handle any type of threat.

[Brian Adkins]

Congrats to the current Avengers book for being #5 this week. Without Spider-Man or Wolverine.
The bigger story though was Transformers being #1! But that's a different discussion! lol


https://bleedingcool.com/comics/tran...stseller-list/

[Brian Adkins]

However, in monthly sales Avengers #13 came in at #40 last month.


https://icv2.com/articles/markets/vi...ics-april-2024

[K7P5V]

The Thing was part of a later lineup of the "New Avengers"

Indeed. The 2010 version, to be exact...

Wasn't the Thing a member of the West Coast Avengers for a brief time? Or maybe they asked him and he turned them down.

Initially, he accepted. But couldn't commit, due to a medical condition at the time.

[Alan2099]

Then the problem is with mixing the editorial history of the Avengers and the in-universe history of the Avengers. From an editorial point of view, ALL those teams are Avengers-related (even the Thunderbolts: there were former Avengers villains, had frequent crossovers with the Avengers, Hawkeye moved from one team to the other, and were both managed by the same writer when they started). From an in-universe perspective... perhaps the teams before Wanda's attack other than WCA are not officially recognized, but same goes for other teams after it. The Young Avengers just stole the name, Dark Avengers are all villains and surely nobody acknowledges Norman Osbourne or Bullseye as Avengers, and Savage Avengers were more of a "let's get together for this fight" team-up than a regular team. Even when published in comics that explicitly had "Avengers" in the name.

I was thinking that in-universe, the Avengers have to include them in their files as Avengers, even if they're only listed as something like "unofficial Avengers" or "unsanctioned Avengers team member," if for no other reason than they've have to be able to pulled up files quickly if some villains started kidnapping or attacking everyone that had ever been Avengers.

You're not going to stop Kang or Loki by telling them them, "oh, but Sunspot, Mr. Immortal, and Conan were never officially on the team."

[Nomads1]

[/center]

I really hated how Fireboird was snubbed back in those issues, I was rooting so much for her.

Peace

[Chris0013]

I really hated how Fireboird was snubbed back in those issues, I was rooting so much for her.

Peace

Yeah. Ben really doesn't bring anything to the table that Simon already does. Firebird makes more sense.

[ARkadelphia]

I really hated how Fireboird was snubbed back in those issues, I was rooting so much for her.

Peace

20/20 hindsight and all that, but had she been chosen for membership, then Hank Pym would likely be dead. Oh wait. Nevermind. He’s already dead anyway.

[GAP]

Should Spider Man or Wolverine be an Avengers? Spider Man is a street level hero and Wolverine is already an X Man.