Polaris: Queen of Mutants/Mistress of Magnetism Appreciation 2024

[jmc247]

I agree losing Vision and her twins was a great story but the execution by Byrne was lackluster and extreme to her previous characterization. WandaVision did a better job of it imo.

Fans often hold their favorite characters to much much higher standards then the audience and I will say the millions who watched her MCU struggles based on Byrne's (less well written) concept which Bendis built on found the character extremely sympathetic... yes including in MoM. Her meal ticket is punched for a generation. She can get comic ongoings, in crossovers, endless merchandise, video games, etc. and it builds on itself.

One can tell when a character has momentum at their back and that its building on itself. Wanda does. Magneto does. The rest of the family is a much more questionable proposition.

Agreed a character without pathos in comics only can ever be a supporting character.

It´s a shame because she has potential, her story could lead to tell some interesting stories about characters who had seen every perspective of it Charles, Magneto, Government, Private, etc and have an original take of human - mutant relations but for her character to get her strenght back, for this to happen, her story needs to be respected.

She is Magneto´s daughter but he didn´t raise her, she is an original member of the X-men but she didn´t worship Charles or his dream, she worked for the US government, she effectively was a member of Genosha´s government during Magneto´s rule alongside Pietro and had hopes a mutant nation could work, for this writers need to remember Genosha had humans and mutants living there when it was destroyed, not only mutants. She suffered Genosha´s destruction and her father´s death just when they have become close, she is powerful, she has a strong temper, similar to her Dads, she genuinely cares for mutants but doesn´t believe humans have to suffer for mutants to have a better chance and she is willing to work with anybody who agress with her on this. She is Pietro and Wanda´s sister be it for choice or blood and she is one of Pietro, Jean and Scott´s oldest friends.

There is a lot there, writers just need to stop imposing their own fave characters and let her character breathe and be herself.

You are viewing Lorna's character by means of her history as a character. That is not what most comic writers with her do of late and that is why most of them fail.

The Phalanx episode where Lorna appeared and even stood with the X-Men at the end was interesting - no words exchange. Did Alex appear? I need to rewatch that one.

She appeared for a second or two to blast the Phalanx with Forge. Overall, in terms of TAS in its entirety if one wants to view this season as its 8th season Lorna rates as a D lister. One episode with some play and two episodes with very brief nonspeaking cameos.

In comparison she was a solid B list reoccurring cast member on WATXM. I wouldn't be surprised if Wanda doesn't get more play next season as her popularity exploded due to Wandavision when they were writing the second season in 2021. Who knows Lorna might even graduate to the C list next season as that year in the comics Lorna moved up from dumping grounds character on X-Factor to a solid B list X-Man and break out member of the first Krakoa X-Men due to the fan vote.

[Lucyinthesky]

Thank you for the comprehensive write-up. You have a very good memory.

Thanks , I may not be good remembering numbers but the story itself I can remember.

Byrne is often considered one of her worst writers. Whereas Jean and Sue fans love the work he did with them for the most part, Wanda fans are much more of the opinion that he was detrimental to the character because everything horrible that happened to her stemmed from him. The Magneto connection, a retcon of a retcon, was because of Byrne. It was his work on Darker than Scarlet which first villainized her and made her come across as crazy, paving the path for Bendis in the 2000s. Byrne is the same man who disregarded Wanda's marriage and frequently compared Vision to a toaster. He didn't see him as an individual human being so he more or less killed him off, leaving him an empty shell, to instead promote Simon as Wanda's OTL.

Byrne had interesting ideas, I am of the oppinion writers need to put the characters in serious and harsh situations to keep the audience engaged but also to develop them, as nice as fluff can be, catharsis is a big part of storytelling and this can´t get done until you give characters problems. Losing her twins, losing Vision, helped to add complexity and strenght to Wanda´s character but as you said, Byrne wrote it with a lot of spite for Vision and their marriage, he isn´t a bad writer at all but you can tell when he is writting something because he wants to give it his best or because he is just being spiteful and those stories are full of that. WandaVision was a better story that would not have happened without Byrne´s story. So we can get good things out of the bad when other writers see the potential to built from there.

Yes even the family retcon was done with spite, Claremot was excited to introduce Magda and Anya as part of Magneto´s backstory, he wasn´t thinking about connecting him to the twins at all but Byrne added the connection to Wanda and Pietro, making Wanda ressemble Magda a lot and the rest is history. Claremont didn´t like the addition but as a writer of Magneto at the time he could not ignore it but he didn´t engage with it, he just gave some vague commentary to them. It was fun for me to learn that because again, the idea of Wanda and Pietro being related to Magneto is an interesting story, there is potential there but writers need to add to it.

Fans often hold their favorite characters to much much higher standards then the audience and I will say the millions who watched her MCU struggles based on Byrne's (less well written) concept which Bendis built on found the character extremely sympathetic... yes including in MoM. Her meal ticket is punched for a generation. She can get comic ongoings, in crossovers, endless merchandise, video games, etc. and it builds on itself.

One can tell when a character has momentum at their back and that its building on itself. Wanda does. Magneto does. The rest of the family is a much more questionable proposition.

It helped to see her story from being an Orphan to be the sole survivor of her family, you sympathise with her despite her actions and Olsen gave her a lot of heart.

You are viewing Lorna's character by means of her history as a character. That is not what most comic writers with her do of late and that is why most of them fail.

Agreed and I this is what she needs the most, her story needs to be acknowledged

She appeared for a second or two to blast the Phalanx with Forge. Overall, in terms of TAS in its entirety if one wants to view this season as its 8th season Lorna rates as a D lister. One episode with some play and two episodes with very brief nonspeaking cameos.

Yes and she could stay that way but Demayo and other TAS writers truly did their Comic homework so if they already are looking at her and Rachel Grey as a symbol of the X-men heritage on chains because they failed to stop Bastion maybe they have something else for her, it´s not sure but it´s a possibility.

In comparison she was a solid B list reoccurring cast member on WATXM. I wouldn't be surprised if Wanda doesn't get more play next season as her popularity exploded due to Wandavision when they were writing the second season in 2021. Who knows Lorna might even graduate to the C list next season as that year in the comics Lorna moved up from dumping grounds character on X-Factor to a solid B list X-Man and break out member of the first Krakoa X-Men due to the fan vote.

This cartoon is focusing on the X-men as a whole, not just Wolverine or Magneto´s family, so unless they do HoM or Magneto Rex/Dark Seduction on Genosha I don´t think they will tackle Wanda, Lorna or Pietro much.

Edit:Lorna was shown old in the future so she probably is one of the survivors of Genosha who is working to rescue the survivors and that would connect her to the story in the comics. I would like to see that with Forge doing team work with the X-men other X-factors members like Lorna and Pietro could come but given the presence of Captain America in the series, we probably will see Wanda and Pietro in his Avengers team reacting to Magneto´s EMP.

Next season looks like it could be preparing age of apocalypse or Onslaught as well as Nathan´s family story with Jean and Scott.

[jmc247]

Dump a bunch of A-listers there....that might draw initial interest. Still sounds like 10 steps back. In the era of X-Men '97 - this may become reality.

I vote to keep Polaris far away if X-Factor's purpose is defined that way. Too vanilla - too generic - too X-Factor. Title dead in 12 issues or hopefully much less. Nobody reading that.

Government run X-Factor again.

This cartoon is focusing on the X-men as a whole, not just Wolverine or Magneto´s family, so unless they do HoM or Magneto Rex/Dark Seduction on Genosha I don´t think they will tackle Wanda, Lorna or Pietro much.

X-Men Evolution and WATXM did tackle the X-Men as a whole. But, neither series came at it from a Claremont era concept on which characters matter. Evo from a mid to late 90s era understanding of who matters and WATXM from an early 00s understanding.

[salarta]

Like I said, an old beginning.

[Dipter]

Like I said, an old beginning.

Genuine question, Salarta: Is the title of X-Factor irredeemably tainted? Like, best case scenario, if Lorna was leader of the team with no Havok present, would you still be against it?

[GoingGreen]

I think what makes X-Factor irredeemable right now is that it isn't given the Gold Star treatment, and by the end of the 90s run and beyond, X-Factor was a completely self-contained title, with minimal-to-no impact on the greater X-mythos, nor vice versa.

Polaris led X-Factor with minimal casualties through a Hell on Earth War, in which they had to survive attacks from like 7 hell gods. It was one of my favorite modern X-Factor stories. And yet, it was contained entirely within the confines of X-Factor, and is treated as barely canon.

The only thing I think anyone took away from All New X-Factor was that Polaris, Scarlet Witch, and sorta Quicksilver made up by the end. Otherwise, a handful of issues that, again, were entirely self-contained. Most people don't even remember who was on that team.

Because Marvel treats it as a place to just kinda "throw some people in there and see what happens", it hasn't been able to maintain a high enough profile, like in the 90s relaunch with Polaris, Havok, Strong Guy, Quicksilver, Wolfsbane, and Multiple Man (the latter two I'd like to call Wolfgang and Multiple Men, because they become many dogs / men... - does Rahne still do this? I don't remember if they ever said she stopped doing this, and my friends couldn't clarify for me either... anyway)

[salarta]

Genuine question, Salarta: Is the title of X-Factor irredeemably tainted? Like, best case scenario, if Lorna was leader of the team with no Havok present, would you still be against it?

So I have two answers, that I'll flesh out below. I would still be against it right now even if Lorna was leader with no Havok present - especially with the description put out today. I don't think it's irredeemably tainted.

X-Factor has become more of a problem than a help for Lorna. Under current conditions, it isolates her from the wider X-Men and Marvel universe, arbitrarily cuts out everything about her history that isn't X-Factor, and undermines her potential and identity for the sake of fitting within the X-Factor framework.

This became extremely evident to me as a huge problem once we hit 2020 X-Factor. I noticed the problem even before then, but pre-2020, I thought it would just be a matter of making changes to fix what's wrong. But the first step to fixing a problem is recognizing there IS a problem in the first place. There's too much nostalgia for nostalgia sake with Lorna put on a sacrificial altar to achieve that fleeting hit of the nostalgia drug. Too much of not wanting to let the full scope of who she is be revealed, too much of treating her like she's a nobody within the wider X-Men franchise because her history doesn't mesh with a nostalgia-laced concept of her as a 90s supporting character on a satellite team.

2020s X-Factor had a lot of things wrong with it, and I know fans of 90s X-Factor would say not to apply the stain of 2020s X-Factor to 90s X-Factor. And that's a fair thing to say - to a point. The 90s X-Factor is its own thing, but a different writer. But there's an undercurrent that shouldn't be ignored. When your focus is "let's repeat what was done 30 years ago," even in the best of cases, what you have is a derivative work. It's chasing an old high that will never be reached let alone topped. It's limiting at its very inception, because you can only go so far with any possible direction before it gets "too far away" from the nostalgia train.

There's a reason that when it comes to the comics, I say the Genoshan genocide needs to be respected for Lorna, but I do not say "she needs to go through another genocide." In the comics, she's already gone through it. She's developed from it. She needs to move forward, not "repeat the (self-perceived) greatest hits."

And sadly, even in the best of scenarios when it comes to the X-Factor name, right now it's a title that holds her back instead of giving her the freedom and respect for her history that she needs.

[UncannyLZ]

X-Factor and Polaris on the team will really depend on the type of writer is attached to the book. Lorna NEEDS a writer that is a fan of her and X-Factor needs a writer that wants to pull the title out of being an unimportant side book and actually impact the franchise.

[kcekada]

I think X-Factor needs actually be an X-Men team in the series with a specific agenda. I guess they want to keep using that X-Factor name for some reason, but can't say the series was ever that special -- even during the Simonson/Simonson years -- which is probably as good as it got.

[jmc247]

We honestly don't know she is on the retro X-Factor, there will supposedly be other books.

The biggest problem with Lorna and X-Factor of late is she is dropped on the book and she is forced to adapt to the book. Her character is warped radically to fit the book. Her past and motivations is significantly recast.

This looks like it is going to be a government run team. Meaning human government run. Lorna stopping being a US government agent in the late 90s when her team broke their connection to them. Then she became an Acolyte, fought and helped liberate Genosha, joined the government, watched it be destroyed before her very eyes. And, kept a deep amount of burning animosity at the human governments for funding the Sentinels that was last seen in small part in House of X and arguably Fall of X in bloodier fashion.

The only conditions I can imagine Lorna signing up for the government in the modern era are to play them or because she is being forced to like a certain DC squad.

X-Factor being in its own pocket universe is a relatively easy issue to change compared to the vastly bigger issue of Lorna's actual character and history being respected.

[Will Evans]

Haven’t the past three teams of Uncanny Avengers been government run mutant teams?
I remember a couple of folks on this thread wanting Lorna to be on that team.
But now another government led book is coming, and because it doesn’t have Avengers in it, people suddenly want Lorna far away from it?

[whitecrown]

Haven’t the past three teams of Uncanny Avengers been government run mutant teams?
I remember a couple of folks on this thread wanting Lorna to be on that team.
But now another government led book is coming, and because it doesn’t have Avengers in it, people suddenly want Lorna far away from it?

The Avengers don't have the X-Factor stigma. X-Factor is a B-List book, or has been ever since the O5 left it, while the Avengers are an A-List team and the Uncanny Avengers tend to feature A-Listers from both sides of the MU. Putting Lorna on that team would have her profile seriously uplifted alongside heavy-hitters such as Captain America, Spider-Man, Wolverine, Rogue, Thor, Scarlet Witch, etc. whoever is on the team. It's what boosted Havok in the early 2010s when he was made team leader.

[Will Evans]

The Avengers don't have the X-Factor stigma. X-Factor is a B-List book, or has been ever since the O5 left it, while the Avengers are an A-List team and the Uncanny Avengers tend to feature A-Listers from both sides of the MU. Putting Lorna on that team would have her profile seriously uplifted alongside heavy-hitters such as Captain America, Spider-Man, Wolverine, Rogue, Thor, Scarlet Witch, etc. whoever is on the team. It's what boosted Havok in the early 2010s when he was made team leader.

That hurt Alex more than helped.
And Lorna’s problems won’t be solved putting her next to household names.

[whitecrown]

That hurt Alex more than helped.
And Lorna’s problems won’t be solved putting her next to household names.

I disagree. I thought it was his best characterization since the Claremont Outback era. And he was more prominently featured in X-Men media around that time (which didn't last long because of the X-Men ban).
No, but Lorna's problems will definitely be exacerbated from being relegated to X-Factor again. Boosting her profile with A-Listers cannot hurt her.

[salarta]

Haven’t the past three teams of Uncanny Avengers been government run mutant teams?
I remember a couple of folks on this thread wanting Lorna to be on that team.
But now another government led book is coming, and because it doesn’t have Avengers in it, people suddenly want Lorna far away from it?

1) Uncanny Avengers was/is the flagship title on the Avengers side, with meaningful ties throughout the Avengers series of titles and Marvel universe as a whole. That's very different from how X-Factor since the 90s has always been a satellite title isolated from the rest of the X-Men franchise and Marvel universe.
2) At the time, Wanda was on the team. There hadn't been any Magnus family activity between them in a decade by that point. Some people that like Havolaris also wanted her there because of Havok. People wanted her to appear on the book for relationships, not from how the team was put together.
3) You're talking about a literal decade ago, 2014. Opinions can change after ten years. Especially when you factor in things that happened in those ten years - Gifted, everything tied to Jordan White, the X-Men vote, X-Men 97 completely cutting her out of the Genoshan genocide for no good reason, etc. As I've already said, it wasn't until 2020s X-Factor and getting labeled as only X-Factor in Marvel Strike Force that I realized how bad the title X-Factor is for Lorna.
4) It's not "suddenly." I've been against Lorna on another book named X-Factor for at minimum the past 2 years now. 2020s X-Factor was a major eye-opener for a lot of fans.

I don't fault you for not knowing some of these things since you haven't been on these threads much, but given the views of Lorna on Uncanny Avengers you're talking about are from a decade ago, it would've been better to ask if people feel the same way today as they did then rather than imply hypocrisy.