Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2024

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That was one thing I didn't like and I also don't see Logan as being someone who feels Jean needs to cage the beast (to quote X-Men: The Last Stand). He would help her learn how to express and harness her powers without fear of losing complete control. And I think she could find that balance with him rather than the more repressed Scott who chafed against her new persona as Phoenix even in the 616 reality and struggled to accept her. A bit like that What If? Wedding Album story where the second scenario was a universe where Jean (after becoming Phoenix) finds Logan a better outlet for her passions and doesn't feel the need to deny herself. The first scenario was of course one where Jean fell in love with Warren instead and that's also a coupling I'd like to see more often.

I don't see the need to drag Scott in this conversation. The idea that Scott is repressed and unable to accept Jean's powers overlooks the complexity of their relationship. Besides, Jean and Scott connection goes beyond her powers. They share a history and a deep emotional bond that has been tested time and time again. Their relationship has been portrayed as a partnership of equals, with Scott providing stability and support for Jean, and Jean offering him understanding and strength in return.

Throughout the comics, Jean's struggles with her abilitie are central to her character arc. Saying that Logan would help her learn how to express it is kind of ironic, when he is known for not control himself and never think about consequences. There are multiples examples of Wolverine trying to control Jean in 616 while Scott has been more supportive with her. Those alternate scenarios are just for explorations of possibilities rather than definitive proof of one character being a better match for Jean than another, and there's a reason why in all those scenarios there's no depth and they have to force the relationship while destroying elements of each character.

[whitecrown]

I don't see the need to drag Scott in this conversation. The idea that Scott is repressed and unable to accept Jean's powers overlooks the complexity of their relationship. Besides, Jean and Scott connection goes beyond her powers. They share a history and a deep emotional bond that has been tested time and time again. Their relationship has been portrayed as a partnership of equals, with Scott providing stability and support for Jean, and Jean offering him understanding and strength in return.

Throughout the comics, Jean's struggles with her abilitie are central to her character arc. Saying that Logan would help her learn how to express it is kind of ironic, when he is known for not control himself and never think about consequences. There are multiples examples of Wolverine trying to control Jean in 616 while Scott has been more supportive with her. Those alternate scenarios are just for explorations of possibilities rather than definitive proof of one character being a better match for Jean than another, and there's a reason why in all those scenarios there's no depth and they have to force the relationship while destroying elements of each character.

I brought Scott into this discussion because we specifically saw his reaction to Jean becoming Phoenix. He feels emotionally distanced from her and feels threatened by her burgeoning power and personality shift. This is the same Jean who when Magneto fights her, notes that she likes using her powers as much as Wolverine likes using his claws. Storm even calls Cyclops out on his inability to mourn for Jean because she's too different from who he fell in love with. In fact, this is the issue that John Byrne said in his forum that was when fans started to hate Cyclops because he came across as so unlikable from this scene. How Claremont portrayed Storm as being more in love with Jean than Cyclops. At this point, Dark Phoenix was not a plan so Scott's thoughts here are not foreshadowing what's going to happen to her to make us sympathize with him and think he's in the right. Claremont is actively telling us that Cyclops has an inability to accept Jean for who she is, which is why the What If? where she ends up with Wolverine during this era makes sense.
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Wolverine has never been repressed, especially not in these early issues when he was a loose cannon. He's not the type to restrict Jean or repress her personality or powers. We even see this in X-Men: The Last Stand when Wolverine calls out Xavier upon learning that Xavier "caged the beast" by blocking away Jean's powers, thus creating the Phoenix personality. Xavier uses these words to describe her as Phoenix. The description below sounds far more like someone attuned with Wolverine than Cyclops.

The conscious Jean, whose powers were always in her control...and the dormant side, a personality that, in our sessions, came to call itself the Phoenix―a purely instinctual creature, all desire and joy...and rage.

Both Jean and Wolverine had a bond on a spiritual level and with nature which is more apparent in the Classic X-Men backstories. Like the one where Jean goes to the beach with Danny and Misty and she reveals that she can understand and communicate with dolphins and talks about how her physiology has changed and become something more than human since becoming Phoenix. She lacks the same mortal needs to survive that she used to have. If you claim that Wolverine has no regard for consequences and lacks control, that ignores all the development he continues to get in the years later. Just as Jean changed from Marvel Girl to Phoenix over the years, it's crucial that Wolverine change as well into the more spiritual and temperate man he becomes by the end of Claremont's run. And I can't think of any example where Wolverine has tried to control Jean in the 616 universe.

[whitecrown]

I don't see the need to drag Scott in this conversation. The idea that Scott is repressed and unable to accept Jean's powers overlooks the complexity of their relationship. Besides, Jean and Scott connection goes beyond her powers. They share a history and a deep emotional bond that has been tested time and time again. Their relationship has been portrayed as a partnership of equals, with Scott providing stability and support for Jean, and Jean offering him understanding and strength in return.

Throughout the comics, Jean's struggles with her abilitie are central to her character arc. Saying that Logan would help her learn how to express it is kind of ironic, when he is known for not control himself and never think about consequences. There are multiples examples of Wolverine trying to control Jean in 616 while Scott has been more supportive with her. Those alternate scenarios are just for explorations of possibilities rather than definitive proof of one character being a better match for Jean than another, and there's a reason why in all those scenarios there's no depth and they have to force the relationship while destroying elements of each character.

Here's an example of Scott trying to control Jean. He actually puts his arms on her to manhandle her. Notice the orange energy emitting off of his forehead to convey his anger. The shocked reaction on Jean's face when he actually grabs her like that. The very fact that she has to resort to using her powers to knock him out shows that he's unreasonable and unwilling to listen or respect her agency. In comparison, Wolverine hears what Jean has to say and respects her decision and walks away. It's against his better judgment but he and Storm both show a maturity and respect for Jean and her decisions. Cyclops come across as a controlling patriarchal figure.



Meanwhile, here we see Wolverine expressly talk about how Jean shouldn't suppress her feelings and emotions. He acknowledges the dangers of what can happen if Jean keeps herself under lock and key.

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And going back to my earlier comments on Jean and Wolverine's shared spiritual connection to animals and nature.


“All life is connected. Humans have no more inherent value than animals. I have the powers of a cosmic being and I see things from all angles. I need love and friendship to anchor me because I’m still human.” - Jean, Classic X-Men #13

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Meanwhile, here we see Wolverine expressly talk about how Jean shouldn't suppress her feelings and emotions. He acknowledges the dangers of what can happen if Jean keeps herself under lock and key.

Showing this image where Wolverine is a stalker and a creepy is definitely a choice: "you want me". She is terrified and disgusted.

And Scott's concerns about Jean's powers, especially as Phoenix, stem from genuine fears for her safety and the well-being. He loves her and is afraid of losing her. He is not trying to control Jean, he wants to save her.