Pro Wrestling! (For Everything WWE, Impact, Indies, AEW, & Japan !) 2024

[BeastieRunner]

Joe hadn't lost much in 2-3 years. He lost 6 months ago to CM Punk. I'm sorry , but people complaining online (and they did as Hook kicked out of one of Joe's moves) is a given. They are gonna complain about whatever Hook did here. But going on with ..."This would make Joe look weak for Swerve is....well its silly. Swerve and Joe didn't really have a singles program til March. The Joe/Hook match happened in December.

Remember when Hangman Page's 1st real title defense as AEW World champion went to a 60 minute draw a couple years ago ? No one was saying how Hangman looked weak against Danielson. Even I complimented the program and felt it should have been one of his PPV programs really. Because it had a good storyline.

The same issue is here.

Also going "This screams the same bad booking he escaped from..."

Not ...even....close. I wonder if people screamed that when Danielson went to a draw 1st match against Hangman Page. "This is the same bad booking he escaped from !"


The best option for Hook is what his dad really is rumored to be wanting....sign that NXT deal. Go to a company that at least is booking people better. Hell even the ring announcers are getting more over comically.

Oi, Super. Do you even like modern wrestling? It's like you purposely misunderstand WWE and AEW stories to parrot bad 80s carny takes. All that ADBD and Joe nonsense was available from IWC when it happened and it was pure nonsense then as it is now with Hook.

People wanted ADBD champ and bitched about it hardcore. And they did say that it was bad, it's part of why Hangman went lukewarm. You gotta remember most of AEW's fanbase are poor American nerdcore. They LIKE guys like Omega, Sabre, Naito, etc. But only ever READ about them. So guys like ADBD are way up on their lists and fantasy booking because it's all they have access to. Hangman got his legs cut on both his runs due to fan response against Indy and former Indy darlings.

Joe is not an established mega star like ADBD. He could not afford a L so early on during his first big title reign when he finally was rehabbed to being a true monster that he should have always been presented as. And a draw would be the same as a loss because he is not Ric Flair. He's a newly rehabbed monster heel. Umaga, Bray, etc. all had the same problem and lost their shine. You can't rehab your main event monster and then job him or draw him to a barely up and comer. Joe isn't even in Jericho's or Bret Hart's level where he could afford a goofy match outcome with a goofy opponent and be fine.

Punk is a superstar regardless of your opinion on him and jobbing anyone to him doesn't really hurt, as it's expected he'll win. It's kinda like saying Orton was hurt by his last loss to Cena, therefore it affects his credibility for his feud with Riddle. Come on, son. Hook is not CM Punk level and he's damn sure not Sting level.

If you're going to fantasy book Hook to the moon a few months ago, there was a ready made option available.

Have Hook retain the FTW belt against Yuta in a slugfest. BCC are impressed and start actively recruiting him, but Hook declines due to his friendship with Orange/Danhausen. BCC tell him to embrace his violent nature and not let Best Friends hold him back.

Hook eventually challenges OC for the International strap but comes up short. He decks Cassidy after a post-match handshake and joins up with BCC as a heeI. He’s a perfect fit for their aesthetic. Then he gets his actual title run with a real title in the feud capper.

Or go full Russo and pair him with Jericho, oh wait ...

You may be into something with Russo secretly working for AEW!

[krazijoe]

Should Hook have beaten Joe or even Jericho? Would it hurt Joe or Jericho of he beat them? The answer is it would not have hurt them. Especially Joe as it was a one off and I can see him Losing to Jericho to further the story.
As for wins and losses...Do you REALLY think Sean(1-2-3 Kid) beating Razor hurt Razor? And it catapulted Sean to the moon.
So, Hook beating either of them would have helped A LOT and hurt neither. Fans love it when a Cocky guy gets their butt handed to them by an underdog.

[Jackalope89]

Honestly, haven't seen any of CM Punk's matches. I've run into some of his promos in various videos. And he's, there. I'm also aware that he's done a lot of controversial things, backstage and even front and center with going off script.

Well, not really a fan. I get having a beef with McMahon, as any fan of WCW or ECW will tell you (looking at the pipe bomb promo). Backstage issues are no stranger to pro-wrestling. Even backstage fights. But assaulting the big boss is the one sure fire way to get canned.

I've come across the type of person the Punk is/portrays in real life. Never really got along with them. I don't go for confrontations, just avoidance.

[BeastieRunner]

Should Hook have beaten Joe or even Jericho? Would it hurt Joe or Jericho of he beat them? The answer is it would not have hurt them. Especially Joe as it was a one off and I can see him Losing to Jericho to further the story.
As for wins and losses...Do you REALLY think Sean(1-2-3 Kid) beating Razor hurt Razor? And it catapulted Sean to the moon.
So, Hook beating either of them would have helped A LOT and hurt neither. Fans love it when a Cocky guy gets their butt handed to them by an underdog.

Joe's not a cocky guy. He's your monster. He beats down heels and faces with impunity.

Jericho is the cocky cock and totally, 100% should have taken the fall to Hook.

Waltman and Hall was not a WT match. And it is not the 80s or 90s. And didn't that end with Kid in a diaper? Lightning Kid was hot off Global IIRC and Hook has been around TV for 2-3 years. That match reference makes more sense for what Jericho did for Action than here.

Again ...

Hook got more over from what happened. Still not sure what the criticism here is other than "Waaaahhhh! it's not what I wanted!" Then Jericho killed Hook's momentum.

[BeastieRunner]

The finish to the Gunther/Kofi match was killer.

And Iyo/Baz was probably the second or third best TV match I've seen on WWE this year.

They’ve got serious good ring chemistry.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Oi, Super. Do you even like modern wrestling? It's like you purposely misunderstand WWE and AEW stories to parrot bad 80s carny takes. All that ADBD and Joe nonsense was available from IWC when it happened and it was pure nonsense then as it is now with Hook.

I like good modern booking honestly. A good story that finishes well. Like the set up and finish to Swerve. Its just often than not Tony's booking hurts the guys. The hot/cold booking has not helped the following people... Ricky Starks , Wardlow , Hook and Ethan Page (who got released comically as Tony started him a push and he disappeared).

People wanted ADBD champ and bitched about it hardcore. And they did say that it was bad, it's part of why Hangman went lukewarm. You gotta remember most of AEW's fanbase are poor American nerdcore. They LIKE guys like Omega, Sabre, Naito, etc. But only ever READ about them. So guys like ADBD are way up on their lists and fantasy booking because it's all they have access to. Hangman got his legs cut on both his runs due to fan response against Indy and former Indy darlings.

I'd say a big reason Hangman Page's run went luke warm was the decision that after a very hot program against Danielson with a good 2+ months , they segued into a program with Lance Archer. Which ...nothing against Archer , but he really wasn't someone to follow Danielson next. It was like...here is this guy , well he's now a #1 contender.

A number of folks could have wanted Danielson as champion sure. But Tony's decision after that solid program really didn't help Page's run.

Joe is not an established mega star like ADBD. He could not afford a L so early on during his first big title reign when he finally was rehabbed to being a true monster that he should have always been presented as. And a draw would be the same as a loss because he is not Ric Flair. He's a newly rehabbed monster heel. Umaga, Bray, etc. all had the same problem and lost their shine. You can't rehab your main event monster and then job him or draw him to a barely up and comer. Joe isn't even in Jericho's or Bret Hart's level where he could afford a goofy match outcome with a goofy opponent and be fine

.

The man literally held a ROH TV title a year and was TNT Champion (once or twice...in that span). He lost very rarely and to CM Punk. What did he have to rehab here ? The guy was the best booked Khan had done in years for his career and even I can't see what more rehabbing to him Tony needed to do.

And I don't think Joe would have a goofy match outcome. You just have both men empty their arsenals against each other in a 15-25 minute match. Joe can always brag , if I had more time...he would have went down eventually.

Punk is a superstar regardless of your opinion on him and jobbing anyone to him doesn't really hurt, as it's expected he'll win. It's kinda like saying Orton was hurt by his last loss to Cena, therefore it affects his credibility for his feud with Riddle. Come on, son. Hook is not CM Punk level and he's damn sure not Sting level.

The difference here is Orton's won , be at the top , middle , upper card and has won and lost against Cena so much...no one minded if he lost to him. Same with Punk.

And again Sting wasn't at Sting level in 1988 , come on son. No one would say Sting in 1988 , months into his 1st push was gonna be the Franchise guy. It just took a match with Flair to do this. Because they wanted to see how well he could do in a draw and it clicked.

But they could have had Sting lose and well...it likely may have cut his legs off early. Flair didn't wanna do that in case Sting was the "guy" ahead. The same way he did with Pillman where he did go over but was due to heelish actions to keep Brian's heat.

Sometimes you have to sit and go...is this guy gonna be someone we build to in a year or two ? Is he the next star ? So we have to protect him in a way for that.

If you're going to fantasy book Hook to the moon a few months ago, there was a ready made option available.

Have Hook retain the FTW belt against Yuta in a slugfest. BCC are impressed and start actively recruiting him, but Hook declines due to his friendship with Orange/Danhausen. BCC tell him to embrace his violent nature and not let Best Friends hold him back.

I brought up the BCC after Hook had a run in mid-card awhile. It means focusing him off the FTW title though.

Hook eventually challenges OC for the International strap but comes up short. He decks Cassidy after a post-match handshake and joins up with BCC as a heeI. He’s a perfect fit for their aesthetic. Then he gets his actual title run with a real title in the feud capper.

Or go full Russo and pair him with Jericho, oh wait ...

You may be into something with Russo secretly working for AEW!

Honestly I think Bischoff is secretly working in AEW. With some things we have seen for months. But either way....the momentum was lost a bit ago and Tony's booking hasn't helped.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Should Hook have beaten Joe or even Jericho? Would it hurt Joe or Jericho of he beat them? The answer is it would not have hurt them. Especially Joe as it was a one off and I can see him Losing to Jericho to further the story.
As for wins and losses...Do you REALLY think Sean(1-2-3 Kid) beating Razor hurt Razor? And it catapulted Sean to the moon.
So, Hook beating either of them would have helped A LOT and hurt neither. Fans love it when a Cocky guy gets their butt handed to them by an underdog.

I'm not saying Hook should beat Joe ...yet. He's not there clearly. Like Sting in 1988...he wasn't THERE to beat Flair then. But once he got his build up the card and went over so many guys in that span...he was.

I'd say a draw was good enough. Joe is still a monster that Hook couldn't put down. Which will drive him....he couldn't get this one guy put down. Joe will have a built in rematch story way down the road , how he knew he could beat Hook but time ran out. You have the perfect set up for a future long term program down that road. (sans title)

[Android 17]

Should Hook have beaten Joe or even Jericho? Would it hurt Joe or Jericho of he beat them? The answer is it would not have hurt them. Especially Joe as it was a one off and I can see him Losing to Jericho to further the story.
As for wins and losses...Do you REALLY think Sean(1-2-3 Kid) beating Razor hurt Razor? And it catapulted Sean to the moon.
So, Hook beating either of them would have helped A LOT and hurt neither. Fans love it when a Cocky guy gets their butt handed to them by an underdog.

Exactly.

That's a really good analogy.

[Jackalope89]

Anyway...

Thoughts on when Otis will have had enough and strike back at Perc Gable?
How about what they actually plan to do with Bronn Breaker? I kind of expected him to pop up in one of the matches, eliminate one guy outside the ring to take his place in the tournament. Didn't happen though.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

As far as Cena beating guys , the only one really hurt Cena going over we can compare this too in a way is...Wade Barrett. A fact even Barrett can't understand why John and Vince pulled a power play at the end. When as Wade details , they shouldn't have.



I also remember folks on CBR then before the board wipe claiming how great a leader onscreen Barrett was. And well he could have been honestly. Barrett would tell his guys ...."Remember the plan....remember the plan..." in spots. Which is fine and dandy if your heel accomplishes the plan. When he doesn't as Wade didn't...it hurt him.

I do remember at this same time a drugged Jeff Hardy as a heel literally led a heel stable and accomplished his deal. A fact he laid out how he did it onscreen and it was like....WWE...if TNA can do this as we saw with a dude like Jeff...why couldn't you do this with Wade Barrett ?