Is it time for DC to move away from "Everything is canon"

[Primal Slayer]

As the title states...is it time to move away from "Everything is Canon" and get back to actually building some type of concrete history again like what we had with Post-COIE ending with New52? Or do you like how loose everything is right now?

Right now DC wants to eat its cake and to eat it too so they try to be vague with a lot of things - Is WW made of clay or is she daughter of Zeus? They won't allow creative teams to explicitly state.

Did Gen 2 sidekicks actually graduate from YJ to Teen Titans?

When was the JL actually formed?

We used to get Whos Who of DC/Secret Files with stats and current history....but they've largely steer cleared of those.

[Riv86672]

It would be nice, but a BEAR to pull off and make work/coherent.

This isn’t something, imo, that can or should be done by committee.

The trick would be choosing the right ‘creative team’ to do the job.

[superduperman]

There's no such thing as "everything's canon". Superman's had how many origins in the last 20 years alone? When did he first get powers? Was he Superboy? What did his ship look like? What did Krypton look like? Supposedly he had the Fleischer suit early on now. But I guess he was also Superboy? Did he grow up with Luthor? I guess Batman's origin is YO again? Maybe? And the less said about Power Girl the better. Just finding a way to fit COIE into the post-Crisis universe was a pain enough. Is Supergirl older than her cousin? Did she grow up on Krypton or was she born after it already blew up?

[Stanlos]

Doesn't the Everything Is Canon thing came along with the Multiverse thing being back. Meaning that we have infinity of verses branching off from each instance's many alternatives. Was that not the thing?

[Primal Slayer]

Doesn't the Everything Is Canon thing came along with the Multiverse thing being back. Meaning that we have infinity of verses branching off from each instance's many alternatives. Was that not the thing?

Maybe but with that came "nothing is definitive". A lot of writers jsut pick and choose what's relevant to their story from various bits of runs

[Stanlos]

Maybe but with that came "nothing is definitive". A lot of writers jsut pick and choose what's relevant to their story from various bits of runs

Yes, that basically what it means. They can write anything from book to book using any of it.

Which means, I hope, that they visit past moments ruined by the DiDidiocy and do them well. Or do future things based on different outcomes. I would like a proper ending to Infinite Crisis. I would like the original AMAZONS ATTACK and to see how volume 2 of WW would have dealt with things without the turds dropped by the DiDidiocy. We could also see a non rainbow GL corps and how it could have gone without that buggery. We could explore alternative Hawks or even revisit what would have happened to the Pre-Crisis verse if the Anti-Monitor was stopped early by the Phantom Stranger or wtf-ever. The possibilities are endless really.

[HsssH]

It would be nice, but a BEAR to pull off and make work/coherent.

This isn’t something, imo, that can or should be done by committee.

The trick would be choosing the right ‘creative team’ to do the job.

Well those creative teams would have to agree on things and develop some kind of a road map. So wouldn't they then be committee as well?

As for the topic, I agree, but I think it is unlikely. Absolute DC will probably try to have more defined continuity, while "main" universe will remain a mess.

[Leancarp900]

I think they already kinda did.

[Riv86672]

Well those creative teams would have to agree on things and develop some kind of a road map. So wouldn't they then be committee as well?

As for the topic, I agree, but I think it is unlikely. Absolute DC will probably try to have more defined continuity, while "main" universe will remain a mess.

^^^I said creative teaM, not creative teamS.

[Factor]

For sure. I don’t think people at DC realise the damage that this lack of definition causes. I’m reading their books but I don’t really know who any of the characters actually are anymore. We don’t know if they went through the character defining arcs we have read, or if they’re just the New 52 versions wearing different costumes.
Starfire is a prime example of that. In a book heavily inspired by Wolfman’s NTT run, her origin is actually from the New 52. Which outright contradicts large portions of her original character arc.
Power Girl is even worse because they allowed the writer to do whatever she wanted, regardless of continuity. So we have basically gotten a complete reset, including of her name and personality. All this while PG has a completely different backstory and personality in Johns’ JSA. It’s all a huge mess because there isn’t a concise direction or a willingness to make things work harmoniously.

I’ve said this before, but they desperately need to figure out which defining moments in their characters’ lives actually happened so that all creatives and editors are on the same page. And then they need to publish something like the simplified 2-page origin stories from post-Infinite Crisis to act as clear character bibles to readers.
The current model doesn’t work in anyone’s favor. It’s not creating better stories and is only alienating readers.

[phonogram12]

Not trying to be contradictory, but I'm honestly fine with it. Since the original Crisis, I've always had to make me own head canon, anyway, because I really didn't like most of the changes that were made.

[Stanlos]

For sure. I don’t think people at DC realise the damage that this lack of definition causes. I’m reading their books but I don’t really know who any of the characters actually are anymore. We don’t know if they went through the character defining arcs we have read, or if they’re just the New 52 versions wearing different costumes.
Starfire is a prime example of that. In a book heavily inspired by Wolfman’s NTT run, her origin is actually from the New 52. Which outright contradicts large portions of her original character arc.
Power Girl is even worse because they allowed the writer to do whatever she wanted, regardless of continuity. So we have basically gotten a complete reset, including of her name and personality. All this while PG has a completely different backstory and personality in Johns’ JSA. It’s all a huge mess because there isn’t a concise direction or a willingness to make things work harmoniously.

I’ve said this before, but they desperately need to figure out which defining moments in their characters’ lives actually happened so that all creatives and editors are on the same page. And then they need to publish something like the simplified 2-page origin stories from post-Infinite Crisis to act as clear character bibles to readers.
The current model doesn’t work in anyone’s favor. It’s not creating better stories and is only alienating readers.

To this day I do not get why they are still mucking around with New Poopy-2 instead of treating everything aboush like a green glowing uranium turd in a synagogue.

[dswynne]

As the title states...is it time to move away from "Everything is Canon" and get back to actually building some type of concrete history again like what we had with Post-COIE ending with New52? Or do you like how loose everything is right now?

Right now DC wants to eat its cake and to eat it too so they try to be vague with a lot of things - Is WW made of clay or is she daughter of Zeus? They won't allow creative teams to explicitly state.

Did Gen 2 sidekicks actually graduate from YJ to Teen Titans?

When was the JL actually formed?

We used to get Whos Who of DC/Secret Files with stats and current history....but they've largely steer cleared of those.

I don't know why you feel the way you do, since there is no evidence that DC is even taking that route. The "everything is canon" thing simply means that past stories are still relevant. That's it. We're still post-Nu52/whatever iteration. And quite frankly, I rather read the stories on their own merit, rather than worry about where in the timeline an event occurs. Besides, if the storyline is popular, it will keep. If not, it will soon be forgotten. No more, no less.

[marhawkman]

I don't know why you feel the way you do, since there is no evidence that DC is even taking that route. The "everything is canon" thing simply means that past stories are still relevant. That's it. We're still post-Nu52/whatever iteration. And quite frankly, I rather read the stories on their own merit, rather than worry about where in the timeline an event occurs. Besides, if the storyline is popular, it will keep. If not, it will soon be forgotten. No more, no less.

Thing is... history is a foundation you build stories on.

You don't NEED to retell an origin story every time you use a character.... if you stick to the way the character was used before.

[All Star Superman]

The "Everything is canon" concept is incredibly stupid. Considering who wanted to implement it makes it unsurprising, however.

The Multiverse is the solution and always has been. COIE could have more easily switched the focus to a new universe and Earth instead of destroying the infinite Multiverse. It looks like DC is realizing this with the rumored Absolute line, though I have a feeling they'll find a way to botch it. I'm somewhat hopeful, though. It's way past time to move on from the post-COIE DCU and its variations.