X-Men '97 Episode 9 - Tolerance is Extinction Part 2 *spoilers*

[whitecrown]

Terrible. Not every show need to be Invinciblified. We may be adults here, but it is pretty selfish to shut the door behind you and make a property that should be okay to let kids watch to get into comics into a bloodfest. TAS was great because it was mature enough to be enjoyed no matter your age but was safe to show children to get them into comics and the characters. And changing almost all of the costumes is a bad move. Rogue's UA outfit is awful and every character already had their best costumes already save Storm. I do like the Cockrum look on her. Morph's powers make no sense at all. He should not get the powers of his shifted personas. Magneto going full villain again was annoying regression. And Rogue going with him makes no sense at all. And they are completely ignoring continuity in having Charles need them to remove the helmet to get inside his mind, as that was not a concept until the movies and he made Magnus relive his childhood with the helmet on in the first series. Why oh why could they have not just let the people who did the first series handle it.

It's not her UA costume though. This is Rogue's original costume which she always comes back to in pretty much every era. She wore this as part of the Brotherhood before defecting to the X-Men. Didn't come back to it until the late 90s during the Alan Davis run. Then wore it again in the return to AoA in the mid-2000s with a cloak, around the same time she wore a cloak version in the 616 universe when she was leading her own X-Men team. Then she wore a variation with a skirt in UA.

[KurtW95]

I realize the similarities with what she wore in those images, but the design they went with looks way more like the Uncanny Avengers costume IMO.

[whitecrown]

I realize the similarities with what she wore in those images, but the design they went with looks way more like the Uncanny Avengers costume IMO.

UA has a skirt with belt. She doesn't in the show. In her original Brotherhood design, the "belt" doesn't wrap around on both sides. It ends in the middle like her new '97 costume. Notice her gloves and boots, especially the striped pattern of her boots, are identical in the show to her original costume. The only similarities to the UA look is the green/white color scheme.

[Havok83]

Terrible. Not every show need to be Invinciblified. We may be adults here, but it is pretty selfish to shut the door behind you and make a property that should be okay to let kids watch to get into comics into a bloodfest. TAS was great because it was mature enough to be enjoyed no matter your age but was safe to show children to get them into comics and the characters. And changing almost all of the costumes is a bad move. Rogue's UA outfit is awful and every character already had their best costumes already save Storm. I do like the Cockrum look on her. Morph's powers make no sense at all. He should not get the powers of his shifted personas. Magneto going full villain again was annoying regression. And Rogue going with him makes no sense at all. And they are completely ignoring continuity in having Charles need them to remove the helmet to get inside his mind, as that was not a concept until the movies and he made Magnus relive his childhood with the helmet on in the first series. Why oh why could they have not just let the people who did the first series handle it.

morph does not get powers of those he shifts into. If you missed it, this was discussed above anpart of his powers are to change his mass and density so by doing so he is able to give off the appearance that he is using different powers, when in actuality he isnt. Juggernaut is unstoppable but when Morph used that form, he was knocked out pretty easily. If you notice, he is never truly effective whenever he does this bc its not the actual power. The only reason he was able to last as long as he did this episode as Hulk was bc Jean had a TK shield up on him and used it to amplify his strength/durability

Oh and IDA about Magneto becoming a villian as regression. Unlike the comics, he never got a redemption arc in this series. He was a villian in the series finale and tried to kill Scott, Jean and Logan. He appeared a bit more sympathetic when he elarned Charles was dying but he didnt change his stance on how he viewed humanity. Charles choosing him to iherit the school and lead in this series was not earned and didnt make sense in context with Magnetos relationship with the Xmen and view of the world at this time. There's also only been about a month since he took over the school nad he Genosha act so him being headmaster was not that long. Literally within about a month, humanity proved him right and made him feel justified in doign whatever it took to preserve mutantkind

I'm wondering if there'll be any consequences/lasting reprecussions for both Rogue and 'Berto defecting to Erik's side. Like, I'm not saying the X-Men would outright shun either of them coming back, but a lot of relationships are gonna be severely strained, if not out-right burned to the ground(like 'Berto and Jubilee). Also, while it was a bit excessive, Scott was in the right to be angry at Charles for essentially making decisions for both he and Jean/Maddie even if his heart was in the right place.

The X-men shouldnt feel too betrayed by Robrto bc he was only within them for about a month and with the exception of Jubilee, didnt take the time out to form a relationship with him. Its also important to remember that was the only one that wasnt mentored by Xavier so he has no attachment to the dream that they fought for

[Havok83]

I agree. I didn't like his behavior towards Xavier. When Xavier reached out his hand, I thought Cyclops was going to go over and hug him but he just walked right past him. Very entitled behavior. Xavier doesn't deserve this disdain.

I thought Cyclops was a total asshole to Xavier and it was completely misplaced. Didn't like the way he came off in this episode at all.

Other than that my favorite scenes like many were the Jean and Storm ones. Great characterization.

IDA. For almost a year Xavier led him to believe that he was dead. He was fine for a whole now and could have informed him that he was fine, but chose not to as he shacked up with and planned to marry Lilandra. In that time, he handed over leadership of the school to Magneto, their greatest enemy whom tried to kill Scott in the OG series finale, whom ultimately betrayed their cause and went back to being the enemy they always knew him to be. Nothing misplace about that

Even in the original Fatal Attraction, Wolverine was sent to Avalon despite his adamantium skeleton. Xavier created the team to infiltrate the base and he picked Wolverine specifically for his stealth skills (same with Gambit). Rogue and Quicksilver were chosen for their close relationship to Magneto. Jean to help boost Xavier's psychic power.

It was always a dumb choice, even in the original FA. That reason would have worked with almost any other opponent except Magneto whom literally has sensitivity to the electromagnetic spectrum and should be able to feel a large chunk of an unknown metal (adamantium) entering his vicinity

[whitecrown]

IDA. For almost a year Xavier led him to believe that he was dead. He was fine for a whole now and could have informed him that he was fine, but chose not to as he shacked up with and planned to marry Lilandra. In that time, he handed over leadership of the school to Magneto, their greatest enemy whom tried to kill Scott in the OG series finale, whom ultimately betrayed their cause and went back to being the enemy they always knew him to be. Nothing misplace about that



It was always a dumb choice, even in the original FA. That reason would have worked with almost any other opponent except Magneto whom literally has sensitivity to the electromagnetic spectrum and should be able to feel a large chunk of an unknown metal (adamantium) entering his vicinity

But that's an inconsistency with the original show as another poster mentioned a few times here. The X-Men knew they were sending Xavier off to space in the series finale of TAS for his last chance at life, not because they were sending him there to die or be buried. When it was mentioned earlier that the world thought Xavier was dead now, I figured that was just a cover story for the public the X-Men hadn't bothered correcting. The X-Men actually thinking he's dead is a retcon.

Yes, agreed.

[Psy-lock]

People who are confused about Morph's powers should take it up with the original series, in which he imititated the powers of Omega Red, Sasquatch and Angel in a single episode. And it's pretty evident that he can't reproduce the exact strength of Juggernaut and Hulk. Him going at super speed is the only thing that seems a bit iffy to me.

[Havok83]

But that's an inconsistency with the original show as another poster mentioned a few times here. The X-Men knew they were sending Xavier off to space in the series finale of TAS for his last chance at life, not because they were sending him there to die or be buried. When it was mentioned earlier that the world thought Xavier was dead now, I figured that was just a cover story for the public the X-Men hadn't bothered correcting. The X-Men actually thinking he's dead is a retcon.

Yes, agreed.

Retcon or not, it still happened. Charles still chose to never give them an update and he also chose to hand over the school to someone that tried to kill Scott that same day that he left for space. Scott was very justified in calling him out

People who are confused about Morph's powers should take it up with the original series, in which he imititated the powers of Omega Red, Sasquatch and Angel in a single episode. And it's pretty evident that he can't reproduce the exact strength of Juggernaut and Hulk. Him going at super speed is the only thing that seems a bit iffy to me.

lowering his mass/density allowed him to move at an accelerated pace

[whitecrown]

Retcon or not, it still happened. Charles still chose to never give them an update and he also chose to hand over the school to someone that tried to kill Scott that same day that he left for space. Scott was very justified in calling him out

Magneto was generally treated as more sympathetic and less like a terrorist in the original show. In fact, after his debut episode, he more or less felt like an anti-hero and barely a villain. Especially in the S2 plotline where he and Xavier are on the run together. Their friendship was heavily highlighted in the original show unlike now where they seem way more at odds and Magneto seems done with Xavier.

[Exodus]

People who are confused about Morph's powers should take it up with the original series, in which he imititated the powers of Omega Red, Sasquatch and Angel in a single episode. And it's pretty evident that he can't reproduce the exact strength of Juggernaut and Hulk. Him going at super speed is the only thing that seems a bit iffy to me.

why is it iffy though? Aren't Quicksilver's powers based on his anatomy to be able to run fast? Juggernaut's powers and also Hulk's are more complex than this because they are rooted in magic and gamma-radiation. But Quicksilver's body makes him run very fast. I never heard of some "speed force" access or something else. So, I'm good with it.

[Havok83]

Magneto was generally treated as more sympathetic and less like a terrorist in the original show. In fact, after his debut episode, he more or less felt like an anti-hero and barely a villain. Especially in the S2 plotline where he and Xavier are on the run together. Their friendship was heavily highlighted in the original show unlike now where they seem way more at odds and Magneto seems done with Xavier.

Magneto's relationship with Xavier is not his relationship with Scott. Id suggest your rewatch the finale. He literally tried to kill Scott and his wife. When they tried to go to Genosha, he sees the Blackbird in the sky, and causes it to blow up on sight, presumably killing the X-men and he didnt care bc in his words "they could never be apart of our world". Those are actions of a villian. Thats the last thing he did to Scott before Xavier went away. They are not close and they viewed each other as enemies. To expect Scott to just ignore that and not call Xavier out is unrealistically and unreasonable. Its not like he disowned him, refused to forgive and completely turn his back on him. He called him out on abandoning the X-men and unwisely handing everything to someone that hadnt proved he was trustworthy. Scott had every right to do so

[toddcam]

Other than things like the public thinking Xavier is dead, and the X-Men never saying "He's actually alive" where is the evidence they think he's dead at any point? I think people are just looking for reasons to hate on Xavier. None of the X-Men acted surprised by his "survival".

[Havok83]

Other than things like the public thinking Xavier is dead, and the X-Men never saying "He's actually alive" where is the evidence they think he's dead at any point? I think people are just looking for reasons to hate on Xavier. None of the X-Men acted surprised by his "survival".

Whether they think he was dead or not doesnt matter. The issue is he left and never communicated that he actually survived and was doing better. He essentially abandoned them and left everything to Magneto which was a shocker to them

[Psy-lock]

The thing about super speed is it's not just about running fast, but also thinking and reacting fast. So does it mean Morph can change the speed of thought/reaction as well? I know I'm probably overthinking it.

[toddcam]

Whether they think he was dead or not doesnt matter. The issue is he left and never communicated that he actually survived and was doing better. He essentially abandoned them and left everything to Magneto which was a shocker to them

That's fine, and I agree to an extent, but it's a different point. It does matter. Thinking someone's dead is different from wondering if they're dead. It's not the same thing.