X-Men '97 Episode 9 - Tolerance is Extinction Part 2 *spoilers*

[Saturius]

The season started with the X-men and Magneto believing he was dead after not hearing from him or Lilandra, all they knew was that when he left he was dying. So when Magneto was given the school He, Scott and the X-men tried to make things work despite being previous enemies, in part because they believed they owned it to Charles´s memory to try to work together and make his dream a reality, that was a subtle but constant motivation for all of them in the season.

So discovering he not only wasn´t dead but that he married Lilandra without telling them anything, having the means to contact them, it should at least give them some dissapointment or anger, it just isn´t important or relevant to talk about it more than the few commentaries Scott, Rogue and Roberto made.

They weren´t surprised to see him back because Bastion had already released that video of Lilandra and Charles announcing their marriage to the galaxy so seeing him back wasn´t surprising.

I guess I still don't know why they thought he was dead. It was probably crappy that he never contacted them(we know why though) but I don't think Xavier's action rise to the level of just intentionally letting his students believe he was dead. At best they should have just had some doubt instead of definitely thinking he was deceased..

At the end of the day the X-men are grown ass adults. Xavier said his goodbyes and wanted them to lead better lives and did his best to ensure they could. They weren't entitled to anything else so I really just did not like the way Scott dumped all over him. The Xavier hate was just in too much overdrive which is probably why it bothers me so much. But to be fair, I don't think Scott was mad at him because he thought Xavier let him, believe he was dead. Just that he didn't give him the "choice" to stay active in mutant affairs, which still feels silly to me. Your father figure wanted to unburden you from leadership so you could go be happy with your family and you throw that back in his face as though it was some heinous act? Ridiculous.

[Arthas]

I guess I still don't know why they thought he was dead. It was probably crappy that he never contacted them(we know why though) but I don't think Xavier's action rise to the level of just intentionally letting his students believe he was dead. At best they should have just had some doubt instead of definitely thinking he was deceased..

At the end of the day the X-men are grown ass adults. Xavier said his goodbyes and wanted them to lead better lives and did his best to ensure they could. They weren't entitled to anything else so I really just did not like the way Scott dumped all over him. The Xavier hate was just in too much overdrive which is probably why it bothers me so much. But to be fair, I don't think Scott was mad at him because he thought Xavier let him, believe he was dead. Just that he didn't give him the "choice" to stay active in mutant affairs, which still feels silly to me. Your father figure wanted to unburden you from leadership so you could go be happy with your family and you throw that back in his face as though it was some heinous act? Ridiculous.

You said they were not Entitled? Seriously?

The X-Men were family. Scott and Jean in particular are in many ways are basically Xavier's children.

There is a difference between making your close family think you are DEAD and letting them know that you are retiring.

If any of my family pulled such an act without a real needs (witness protection program or something) then I'd gladly cut them off if I ever saw them again.

Also one thing about any relationship is communication and allowing the other party to make their own choices.

If Xavier wanted Scott to 'unburden' himself then he should have talked to him and let him make his own choice.

Giving everything to Magneto? Well let me put it this way, there is a reddit group called "Am I the Asshole?". One of the things that routinely pop up there are situations where you have the "Right" to do something but doing that particular something STILL makes you the AH.

Xavier had the "Right" to do whatever he wanted with his property. What he chose to do still made him an AH.

[Saturius]

You said they were not Entitled? Seriously?

The X-Men were family. Scott and Jean in particular are in many ways are basically Xavier's children.

There is a difference between making your close family think you are DEAD and letting them know that you are retiring.

If any of my family pulled such an act without a real needs (witness protection program or something) then I'd gladly cut them off if I ever saw them again.

Also one thing about any relationship is communication and allowing the other party to make their own choices.

If Xavier wanted Scott to 'unburden' himself then he should have talked to him and let him make his own choice.

Giving everything to Magneto? Well let me put it this way, there is a reddit group called "Am I the Asshole?". One of the things that routinely pop up there are situations where you have the "Right" to do something but doing that particular something STILL makes you the AH.

Xavier had the "Right" to do whatever he wanted with his property. What he chose to do still made him an AH.

I respect your viewpoint but just don't agree with it at all. I think intent behind actions is important and while ultimately Xavier was most likely misguided, he certainly was not intentionally malicious with the actions and choices he undertook.

[Lucyinthesky]

I guess I still don't know why they thought he was dead. It was probably crappy that he never contacted them(we know why though) but I don't think Xavier's action rise to the level of just intentionally letting his students believe he was dead. At best they should have just had some doubt instead of definitely thinking he was deceased..

Sometimes the doubt itself can be worse that knowing for a fact a loved one is dead, if he didn´t said anything, this was akin to having a dissapeared loved one, you keep grieving for them because you are not sure if there is or there is no hope of them being alive.

At the end of the day the X-men are grown ass adults. Xavier said his goodbyes and wanted them to lead better lives and did his best to ensure they could. They weren't entitled to anything else so I really just did not like the way Scott dumped all over him. The Xavier hate was just in too much overdrive which is probably why it bothers me so much. But to be fair, I don't think Scott was mad at him because he thought Xavier let him, believe he was dead. Just that he didn't give him the "choice" to stay active in mutant affairs, which still feels silly to me. Your father figure wanted to unburden you from leadership so you could go be happy with your family and you throw that back in his face as though it was some heinous act? Ridiculous.

I agree the Xavier hate has gotten out of hand but I see this more present in the comics than in the series. They completely destroyed his character in the comics.

In X-men 97 it isn´t hate imo, the X-men are glad Charles is back, they are just a little mad at him, not because they are childs who needed their father figure around to be ok but because Charles is a dear loved one for all of them and they expect to have an honest relationship with him.

I agree it wasn´t Charles intention to make them feel bad or to make Scott think he wasn´t a good enough leader, my guess is that Scott would have liked to be told about Charles plans of giving the School to Magneto before he left because he thought it was good for him and Jean to have their own lifes away from the X-men, that´s how adults comunicate and that´s Charles problem, he knows they are adults but still has the bad habit of making decisions that will affect them without making them aware of those decisions, that could make anybody angry. Charles sharing his plans with Jean and Scott right after everything went so wrong, after a period of time in which they didn´t know anything about him, sounds like an excuse.

[ChildOfTheAtom]

You said they were not Entitled? Seriously?

The X-Men were family. Scott and Jean in particular are in many ways are basically Xavier's children.

they are the UNCANNY X-MEN.. x didn’t need to hold their hands. in this 97 universe they just weren’t prepared to handle things themselves. the X-MEN failed and its not x fault

[Lucyinthesky]

they are the UNCANNY X-MEN.. x didn’t need to hold their hands. in this 97 universe they just weren’t prepared to handle things themselves. the X-MEN failed and its not x fault

On this I agree completely, Charles it not at fault of what happened,Imo the X-men mistake was the fact they trusted the UN, Val Cooper and Kelly to keep Bolivar Trask and Gyrinch on prison, instead Cooper and the UN were direct complicits with Bastion of the destruction of Genosha and OZT plan to turn all mutants into slaves. They were too trusting and should have investigated more. As Trasks said, they were holding hands while we have been placing dominoes.

[Ultimate Captain America]

Where are the Avengers? Cap said he had a team. Why are the X-Men the only heroes trying to stop Bastion and Magneto? lol

Sure, I pointed the similarities of the plot with Ultimatum, why not another one?

[Godzilla2099]

I thought Cyclops could have handled Xavier's Encounter at the Mansion better. Xavier tried to give him and Jean a way out and retire. Be happy. I wish Scott would have been at least able to understand that part. But to his defense, there's no way in hell he'd leave with Magneto running the store.

Cyclops should have kept it very short and sweet: "While I appreciate you thinking of Jean and I...you remember Ororo, right? But no. Instead, you seriously thought Magneto was the wiser choice?"

Overall, the episode was alright. I did like the Cyclops/Cable Moment, Jean vs Sinister, Morph/Beast vs Bastion, and the dilemma Cyclops was face with when he decided to stop Xavier.

I don't get the Rogue Bashing though. She was literally on Genosha. Experienced the entire massacre and has to live with choices she regrets (Gambit). She's far too understandably upset to keep following Xavier's Dream. Finally, like him or not, Magneto made some strong selling points. If I was there I'd really consider joining him.

[FlawedCoil82]

The more I think about it, the more I feel frustrated and totally let down. This could have been a heart-stopping moment if it was naturally built up to and they had not made some extremely unfortunate changes (the uniforms, Rogue’s unbelievable bi-polar loyalty switch, Xavier trying to wipe Magneto’s mind BEFORE he even saw what happened to Wolverine, where he used it as the ultimate “completely out of all other options” moment, etc.). This was just not the way I ever wanted to see FA be adapted to the screen.

I am completely baffled by how hyped people are by this episode. To me, it felt like I was watching an entirely different show. I think they just loathe Wolverine so much that they were thrilled to watch him get wrecked. Thankfully, this guy sums up pretty well how I feel about this episode (though I actually feel like he doesn’t go far enough, such as describing what Rogue does and how too many tragedies and cornerstone moments are being crammed down the X-Men’s throats to where it is just becoming flat out depressing to watch them be unceremoniously destroyed and made to look totally incompetent as a unit against threats that seem like they SHOULD be way less serious than The Dark Phoenix Saga or even the Beyond Good And Evil arc was). And I don’t think they are moving towards AOA as much as they are Onslaught. But regardless…

[ChildOfTheAtom]

She's far too understandably upset to keep following Xavier's Dream. Finally, like him or not, Magneto made some strong selling points. If I was there I'd really consider joining him.

well atleast ppl finally coming around to what some of have been predicting this whole time. the X-MEN as constructed this season won’t last. this team is going to be different after next week

[Kingdom X]

The more I think about it, the more I feel frustrated and totally let down. This could have been a heart-stopping moment if it was naturally built up to and they had not made some extremely unfortunate changes (the uniforms, Rogue’s unbelievable bi-polar loyalty switch, Xavier trying to wipe Magneto’s mind BEFORE he even saw what happened to Wolverine, where he used it as the ultimate “completely out of all other options” moment, etc.). This was just not the way I ever wanted to see FA be adapted to the screen.

I am completely baffled by how hyped people are by this episode. To me, it felt like I was watching an entirely different show. I think they just loathe Wolverine so much that they were thrilled to watch him get wrecked. Thankfully, this guy sums up pretty well how I feel about this episode (though I actually feel like he doesn’t go far enough, such as describing what Rogue does and how too many tragedies and cornerstone moments are being crammed down the X-Men’s throats to where it is just becoming flat out depressing to watch them be unceremoniously destroyed and made to look totally incompetent as a unit against threats that seem like they SHOULD be way less serious than The Dark Phoenix Saga or even the Beyond Good And Evil arc was). And I don’t think they are moving towards AOA as much as they are Onslaught. But regardless…

Didn't she absorb some of Gyrich's psyche in her attempt to locate Trask? She certainly seemed really off mentally by the end of that episode. Add to that the loss of Remy and directly witnessing/ surviving a genocide... I actually think erratic behavior isn't all that surprising. Plus Rogue lacking mental stability and being subject to mood swings is a DIRECT pull from her arc in the Claremont run.

[Will Evans]

Everyone keeps saying everything was too rushed.

Just think of it as a decompressed comic. You still get more story in one twenty-minute episode than you do in a six-dollar issue.

Agreed.
I don’t want filler. I like the pacing of the show.

[Jackraow21]

But regardless…

So... didn't like going back to the pre-90s looks, but also didn't like anything from the comics after 1995, including Age of Apocalypse (which I disagree with him on with regards to his position that most fans didn't like that story). Basically, keep it to 1990-94 only. Pretty tight window, bud. And they might be out of material to adapt in that case. Ha.

Oh well. Maybe it wasn't for everyone, but those first 15-25 issues of Wolverine after Fatal Attractions, where he was on his own with no powers and no metal, was some of the best Logan character work every done. And it was peak Adam Kubert on art duties too. Loved that whole period. After issue #100 it got old, and the feral noseless Wolverine shit jumped the shark for sure. But prior to that? Pure gold.

[FlawedCoil82]

So... didn't like going back to the pre-90s looks, but also didn't like anything from the comics after 1995, including Age of Apocalypse (which I disagree with him on with regards to his position that most fans didn't like that story). Basically, keep it to 1990-94 only. Pretty tight window, bud. And they might be out of material to adapt in that case. Ha.

Oh well. Maybe it wasn't for everyone, but those first 15-25 issues of Wolverine after Fatal Attractions, where he was on his own with no powers and no metal, was some of the best Logan character work every done. And it was peak Adam Kubert on art duties too. Loved that whole period. After issue #100 it got old, and the feral noseless Wolverine shit jumped the shark for sure. But prior to that? Pure gold.

Keep the aesthetics from 1991-1995, but explore other stories (both old and new) with those same aesthetics. I even wanted all new, original stories with that version of the team. That’s what I was hoping “X-Men ‘97” was going to be.

[Frontier]

Didn't she absorb some of Gyrich's psyche in her attempt to locate Trask? She certainly seemed really off mentally by the end of that episode. Add to that the loss of Remy and directly witnessing/ surviving a genocide... I actually think erratic behavior isn't all that surprising. Plus Rogue lacking mental stability and being subject to mood swings is a DIRECT pull from her arc in the Claremont run.

I might be misreading but the way she yelled about Trask like she was worried about him made it sound like she wasn't fully in control of herself when she dropped him compared to when she was talking with Kurt at the beginning.