Creeper (1997) by Len Kaminski

[John Venus]

Read it a few weeks ago and man, is it one of the best Creeper series I've ever read.

I enjoyed the deep dive into Jack Ryder's psychology, how his mother influenced and shaped him and how the incident simply manifested what was already inside Jack. We also got a "team up" between the Creeper and the Joker that somehow worked out really well.

Creeper really comes off as an anti hero in this, at times you're worried he would be a danger to even the people he saves. Len also powered up Creeper in this book because he can paralyze his opponents with a sonic scream in this series and his feather boa is prehensile.

Between this, his IM run and the early 90's JSA series, Len is quickly becoming one of favourite writers.

What are your thoughts on this series? Do you prefer the Creeper to be an alternate personality of Jacks or prefer the original Ditko formula of a sane man pretending to be crazy? Do you prefer his origin tied to the Joker or do you prefer the Creeper to stand on his own?

[Riv86672]

NONONONONONONONO Joker ties.

Personality wise, somewhere in between pretending and alternate; exaggerated I guess.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I liked the idea of Creeper as an alternate personality and im open to him being a joker reject. For ex, Joker tosses him in a vat 3 jokers style but comes out completly different.

[Aarkus]

I have a rather large Creeper tattoo and people are always mistaking it for a Joker piece. drives me up the wall!

that said, if it brings more readers/fans into the character, I'm not against the idea of loosely tying him to Joker. as long as it's tangential and not a focal point of Jack's own story.

[kcekada]

Wasn't there a take where he was hyped up to a perpetual drugged state when he switched over to Creeper. I liked that explanation to explain his psychosis. Always thought it was weird when they went from the briefs to the trunks -- since the entire outfit was a costume. It's not like Jack had yellow legs.

[Robotman]

I love The Creeper and the Kaminski series was great!

I much prefer The Creeper to be either a separate personality or Jack’s insane side coming out. I think Ditko had an interesting concept of a crazy Joker-like character as a superhero theme but he never liked the idea that it was just Ryder pretending to be crazy and he really didn’t have any powers.

I wouldn’t want to see The Creeper explicitly tied to the Joker but the Batman: TAS episode with The Creeper was amazing.

[John Venus]

I love The Creeper and the Kaminski series was great!

I much prefer The Creeper to be either a separate personality or Jack’s insane side coming out. I think Ditko had an interesting concept of a crazy Joker-like character as a superhero theme but he never liked the idea that it was just Ryder pretending to be crazy and he really didn’t have any powers.

I wouldn’t want to see The Creeper explicitly tied to the Joker but the Batman: TAS episode with The Creeper was amazing.

The Ditko version was a sane man who pretended to be crazy when he transformed into the Creeper. There is some overlap with Question and the Creeper; both of them are "controversial" hard hitting reporters, they meet a scientist who gives them a device that allows them to instantly switch to a disguise with a press of a button and they have both been reinvented as otherworldly supernatural characters.

I believe the Question predates Creeper by only a year.

Wasn't there a take where he was hyped up to a perpetual drugged state when he switched over to Creeper. I liked that explanation to explain his psychosis. Always thought it was weird when they went from the briefs to the trunks -- since the entire outfit was a costume. It's not like Jack had yellow legs.

I think that was the Post Crisis retelling of his origin. They inject him with LSD after putting him in the costume and whenever he is in the suit he is in that drugged up state. I think Jack just more body paint initially.

I have a rather large Creeper tattoo and people are always mistaking it for a Joker piece. drives me up the wall!

that said, if it brings more readers/fans into the character, I'm not against the idea of loosely tying him to Joker. as long as it's tangential and not a focal point of Jack's own story.

Can you tell me which pose you went for for your tattoo?

The Kaminski series had a cross over where Creeper met the Joker. It was quite interesting. I think the two characters are similar enough you can have cross overs like that.

[Robotman]

I think the Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde concept works way better for The Creeper than Ryder just parenting to act crazy.

I like the Batman: TAS idea that Ryder kinda likes cutting lose. In that episode Batman actually found the cure for his condition but he took the patch off to let out his Creeper side.

But that brings up the question of his costume/design. Doing a persona change wouldn’t make the speedos and feather boa appear. The Steve Niles series had the red fur grow out of him as part of his transformation, which I guess works. The speedos could just be changed to whatever underwear/pants Ryder was wearing at the time of transformation, like the Hulk.

Some writers have had The Creeper wall-crawl as one of his powers. I think that would be a cool nod to Ditko/Spider-Man. Plus that’s a power that no other DC hero really has.

[John Venus]

I think the Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde concept works way better for The Creeper than Ryder just parenting to act crazy.

I like the Batman: TAS idea that Ryder kinda likes cutting lose. In that episode Batman actually found the cure for his condition but he took the patch off to let out his Creeper side.

But that brings up the question of his costume/design. Doing a persona change wouldn’t make the speedos and feather boa appear. The Steve Niles series had the red fur grow out of him as part of his transformation, which I guess works. The speedos could just be changed to whatever underwear/pants Ryder was wearing at the time of transformation, like the Hulk.

Some writers have had The Creeper wall-crawl as one of his powers. I think that would be a cool nod to Ditko/Spider-Man. Plus that’s a power that no other DC hero really has.

Yeah I like that bit too from B:TAS. Plus the subtle horror of his mind cracking and needing the patch to stay sane.

In the original Ditko series and the Post COIE retelling, it's basically some kind of other dimensional portal thing that hides his suit then he can summon via wrist device to look like the Creeper. He presses the button and the 'suit' appears and when he deactivates it, the suit 'disappears'. Basically it changes the state of his appearance and the device was originally meant to be used for infiltration. The Kaminski series expanded his powers; actual fur on his back instead of a feather boa, the fur was prehensile, he had a sonic scream that can temporarily paralyze someone with fear and of course enhanced strength and agility (but I think he had had before too).