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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857624]I don't mind it as much in non-fiction, real life **** because the first step in fixing a problem is identifying it and putting a spotlight on it.
But in fiction? Especially comic book super hero fiction? That doesn't work. There needs to be a resolution. THe hero has to have a solution.
Since it is fresh in my mind, look at Luke Cage season 2. There is a very real problem presented early in the season: Luke is just putting out fires. It's introduced in the first action sequence I do believe. Yes, he is doing good, but he isn't fixing ****. The real conflict of the season, outside of bustin' head, bushmaster, maria, and the super hero stuff is that he isn't fixing ****.
The season ends with Luke's solution to that problem. We will hopefully find out in season 3 if that solution works and the drama behind that.
If Coates wrote Luke Cage, he'd have luke at the end go, "idk man" fade to black[/QUOTE]
I think they should import that ending into Lukes' comic character. Running Harlems vice underworld would make his character more interesting.
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[QUOTE=Cville;3857641]I think they should import that ending into Lukes' comic character. Running Harlems vice underworld would make his character more interesting.[/QUOTE]
In the comics it sort of runs too close to what Brubaker and Diggle did in Daredevil.
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3857435][B]Look up the actual definition of thrash. That's not what happened. The real defeat of Mephisto came from Tchalla outsmarting him. The punch to the face and the ripping out of the heart was to prevent him from being able to go back to his realmead T'Challa held his heart on the physical plane your trying to say I'm nitpicking as my argument when myself as several other posters in this thread a few pages back are saying the same thing.
Who knows, maybe he was meaning to line it up with Canon but the way he words the isht doesn't align with the Canon or in the case of Namor aligns his name with failure. But your right I'm just nitpicking and don't have an actual point or anything, I'm just hating because it's Coates and would hate even if he had T'Challa save the 616 100x over :cool:. As for the stabbing this is what I posted in my OG:[/B]
[/QUOTE]
thrash
THraSH/
verb
verb: thrash; 3rd person present: thrashes; past tense: thrashed; past participle: thrashed; gerund or present participle: thrashing
1.
beat (a person or animal) repeatedly and violently with a stick or whip.
"she thrashed him across the head and shoulders"
synonyms:hit, beat, strike, batter, thump, hammer, pound, rain blows on; More
assault, attack;
cudgel, club;
informalwallop, belt, bash, whup, whack, thwack, clout, clobber, pummel, slug, tan, sock, beat the (living) daylights out of
"she thrashed him across the head and shoulders"
hit (something) hard and repeatedly.
"the wind screeched and the mast thrashed the deck"
move in a violent and convulsive way.
"he lay on the ground thrashing around in pain"
synonyms:flail, writhe, thresh, jerk, toss, twist, twitch
"he was thrashing around in pain"
struggle in a wild or desperate way to do something.
"two months of thrashing around on my own have produced nothing"
informal
[u][b]defeat (someone) heavily in a contest or match.[/b][/u]
"I thrashed Pete at cards"
move with brute determination or violent movements.
"I wrench the steering wheel back and thrash on up the hill
I looked up the meaning prior to my previous post to u and it does mean to defeat someone. again you are being too nitpicky which I'm sure is because you dont like Coates.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857462]Having a debate with someone with such an incomplete knowledge of Black Panther is folly. Especially when people lacking in T'challa history refuse to acknowledge when they are wrong.
The ridiculous example of T'challa breaking WS brain washing is just... do better lol. Bast have mercy.
Especially since, the Knife of Chieftains was established by the Godfather... PRIEST. Vol 3, #29
[img]https://i.imgur.com/D0CHxyx.jpg[/img]
This is a more true example of, "putting the knife where it belongs" considering T'challa actually succeeded. He killed Klaw in this form and was about to delete Klaw from history until a crowd of people stopped him. No bragging. No lack of focus. Pure 10 steps ahead T'challa with a bonus dose of rage, which is nice to see from T'challa here and there. If there is one person that breaks his focus even a bit and gets him emotion, it should be Klaw. Priest understood that because he's good at comics. Coates uses Thunderball to beat Klaw.
Hickman, who actually read Priest's run, pulled the knife from here. Coates, who has very little knowledge of canon pre-Hickman, just pulled it from Hickman. And considering it appears most of this thread didn't even know the Knife of Chieftain's was a thing before Hickman, I really doubt Coates knew it was a thing before hickman lol.[/QUOTE]
well thank you for making my point for me. there are instances from canon that demonstrate tchalla putting the knife where it belongs. I sincerely appreciate your support in the matter.
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[QUOTE=BlackClaw;3857604]The thing about pointing out problems but offering no solutions is exactly the kind of **** Colonel West was calling Coates out for. Marvel would be doing themselves a huge favor if they just kicked this clown to the curb already.[/QUOTE]
There was a solution to the question about an advanced nation not having a more modernized government. They simply got a more modernized government.
The issue about the missing gods is a valid one if he never answers the question. But if he's just not answering right noe, that's no big deal. So we'll see.
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[QUOTE=XPac;3857677]There was a solution to the question about an advanced nation not having a more modernized government. They simply got a more modernized government.
[/QUOTE]
I don't think he really did because he asked a philosophical question. The question of, "why?"
IMO, to answer that question, he had to show:
#1: Why Wakanda royalty was bad for the Wakandan people. And even more specific, why T'CHALLA as king was bad for Wakanda.
#2: Why the new government would fix what was wrong with #1
He didn't do that. The only satisfactory way to answer those problems is to put real life stuff (democracy better), off panel stuff into it. From a meta view, yes, Monarchy eventually sucks. Yes, the people should have a voice. Yes, tribal fights to decide who gets to be a superpowered king is probably pretty dumb.
But the comic universe isn't real life. The same rules don't apply. You can't ask a question and then turn around and go, "just put real life **** in" and move on.
This is especially more difficult because problem #1 means shitting on the main character of the book. It is doable, but Coates didn't do it. Well, I guess he did **** on T'challa, but not in a way that answers #1 or #2.
... and then he turned around and had T'challa act in full authority in Season 2 and that full autonomy lead to saving the country.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857549]Hell, since im on that subject, how many Klaw fights have their been? Off the top of my head I got:
- original appearance
- volume 1
- priest
- who is the black panther
- the new fantastic four
- coates
- over the edge #6
- cable #54
EDIT:
- Black Panther: The Sound and the Fury #1
Where else?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Cville;3857555]The Ralph Machio one shot that came out in February.[/QUOTE]
Good one.
[QUOTE=XPac;3857588]
I recall them fighting when ULtrons Masters of Evil fought the Avengers. [/QUOTE]
What run is this?
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857691]I don't think he really did because he asked a philosophical question. The question of, "why?"
IMO, to answer that question, he had to show:
#1: Why Wakanda royalty was bad for the Wakandan people. And even more specific, why T'CHALLA as king was bad for Wakanda.
#2: Why the new government would fix what was wrong with #1
He didn't do that. The only satisfactory way to answer those problems is to put real life stuff (democracy better), off panel stuff into it. From a meta view, yes, Monarchy eventually sucks. Yes, the people should have a voice. Yes, tribal fights to decide who gets to be a superpowered king is probably pretty dumb.
But the comic universe isn't real life. The same rules don't apply. You can't ask a question and then turn around and go, "just put real life **** in" and move on.
This is especially more difficult because problem #1 means shitting on the main character of the book. It is doable, but Coates didn't do it. Well, I guess he did **** on T'challa, but not in a way that answers #1 or #2.
... and then he turned around and had T'challa act in full authority in Season 2 and that full autonomy lead to saving the country.[/QUOTE]
I think in the end the monarchy itself wasn't a problem... the monarchy itself actually remained intact.
But I think the inherent problem was that people who were unhappy with government didn't have enough to a voice. The reason we ended up getting a more democratic system is essentially the same reason we ended up getting one everywhere else. In the end, people got what they wanted. Whether or not it's actually an improvement in a practical sense remains to be seen, but the problem was addressed without Wakanda actually losing the monarchy.
And in the comic book universe, real life rules apply when writers decide they apply. Because in theory people in comics can have the same problems as they do in real life, and the same methods of dealing with those problems can apply. Which isn't to say they HAVE to... but it can.
Ultimately this was about having your cake and eating it too. T'CHalla is still king, which allows him to pretty much do all the things he needs to do for storytelling purposes. But the people still get a modernized government which gives them a voice. So everyone wins there.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857462]Having a debate with someone with such an incomplete knowledge of Black Panther is folly. Especially when people lacking in T'challa history refuse to acknowledge when they are wrong.
The ridiculous example of T'challa breaking WS brain washing is just... do better lol. Bast have mercy.
Especially since, the Knife of Chieftains was established by the Godfather... PRIEST. Vol 3, #29
[img]https://i.imgur.com/D0CHxyx.jpg[/img]
This is a more true example of, "putting the knife where it belongs" considering T'challa actually succeeded. He killed Klaw in this form and was about to delete Klaw from history until a crowd of people stopped him. No bragging. No lack of focus. Pure 10 steps ahead T'challa with a bonus dose of rage, which is nice to see from T'challa here and there. If there is one person that breaks his focus even a bit and gets him emotion, it should be Klaw. Priest understood that because he's good at comics. Coates uses Thunderball to beat Klaw.
Hickman, who actually read Priest's run, pulled the knife from here. Coates, who has very little knowledge of canon pre-Hickman, just pulled it from Hickman. And considering it appears most of this thread didn't even know the Knife of Chieftain's was a thing before Hickman, I really doubt Coates knew it was a thing before hickman lol.[/QUOTE]
thanks for posting this. Never forget. When T'Challa use to dagger you that's all they wrote. Plus Ultra'd baby.
CJP, Hudlin, Liss, McDuffie .....you are missed. (Honorable mention to McGregor).
When T'Challa stabbed Namor it was just some normal blade. Namor snapped it with ease. I don't even think Hickman's was Vibranium or anti-mental just some normal steel. Let's also not forget the Black Bolt disrespect.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3857700]Good one.
What run is this?[/QUOTE]
Going from memory here... but I wanna say Avengers vol. 1 54-55. It's when Ultron poses as the Crimson Cowl and forms the Masters of Evil.
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[url]https://www.cbr.com/fantastic-four-ranked-strength/[/url]
T'challa made it in the top 10 of strongest F4 members.
9. BLACK PANTHER
[img]https://static2.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/black-panther-header.jpg?q=35&w=450&h=225&fit=crop&dpr=1.5[/img]
In the wake of Civil War, Sue and Reed Richards temporarily left the team to patch up their marriage. Filling in for them were the new husband and wife duo of Black Panther and Storm.
The king of Wakanda brought his unique set of powers and resources to the team, making up for the absence of Mr. Fantastic’s super-genius level of intellect. Black Panther played an instrumental role in the team’s victories over Galactus, Silver Surfer, and the Frightful Four.
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Are you guys STILL talking about the "translation" of T'Challa?
I wonder what T'Chaka stands for... "He who dies to drive the plot", maybe?
I suppose this would be a bad time to mention that "Ororo", in Swahili, translates to "soft, mild". :)
(And "vegetable oil" in Yoruba. :D )
Seriously, move on. I seriously doubt Coates cares as much as you folks do.
Bast's little kittens...
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[QUOTE=Beware Of Geek;3857788]Are you guys STILL talking about the "translation" of T'Challa?
I wonder what T'Chaka stands for... "He who dies to drive the plot", maybe?
I suppose this would be a bad time to mention that "Ororo", in Swahili, translates to "soft, mild". :)
(And "vegetable oil" in Yoruba. :D )
Seriously, move on. I seriously doubt Coates cares as much as you folks do.
Bast's little kittens...[/QUOTE]
you forgot to mention it origins in Nigerian means "beauty" which is where I think Claremont referenced as in the comics ororo means beauty :)
[url]https://www.names.org/n/ororo/about[/url]
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3857767][url]https://www.cbr.com/fantastic-four-ranked-strength/[/url]
T'challa made it in the top 10 of strongest F4 members.
9. BLACK PANTHER
[img]https://static2.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/black-panther-header.jpg?q=35&w=450&h=225&fit=crop&dpr=1.5[/img]
In the wake of Civil War, Sue and Reed Richards temporarily left the team to patch up their marriage. Filling in for them were the new husband and wife duo of Black Panther and Storm.
The king of Wakanda brought his unique set of powers and resources to the team, making up for the absence of Mr. Fantastic’s super-genius level of intellect. Black Panther played an instrumental role in the team’s victories over Galactus, Silver Surfer, and the Frightful Four.[/QUOTE]
As much as I love T'Challa in the Avengers, I think you can argue FF was really the best usage of him on a team.
It's a small intimate cast, where there was no overlap of redundancy as far as what T'Challa brought to the table. With no Captain AMerica or Iron Man around, there were specific things which T'CHalla was the default go-to guy for. He arguably shined better in that particular team setting than any other.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3857803]you forgot to mention it means "beauty" in Nigerian which is where I think Claremont referenced as in the comics ororo means beauty :)
[url]https://www.names.org/n/ororo/about[/url][/QUOTE]
That's stupid, since she's not Nigerian.