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[QUOTE=evolutionaryFan;5301663]Yeah, but what exactly is the story here? I'm not sure we have a story until Harry's actions/motivations have been explained. I don't understand what's been happening.[/QUOTE]
Oh I agree completely.
It seems like Spencer doesn’t know either.
It’s a bit tiresome to keep hearing people say “No answers this issue, but Next issue will have answers. Watch!”
I mean, how much patiently waiting can we do?
I mean... answers will come eventually. I don’t see the need to stress out about it every issue wondering when they’ll get here.
[QUOTE=Arsenal;5301685]I mean... answers will come eventually. I don’t see the need to stress out about it every issue wondering when they’ll get here.[/QUOTE]
I respectfully disagree. Times are tough right now for many, many people and having a story drag with multiple add-ons to the story for it to all lead to nothing while paying so much money for each book is a big reason to stress it.
Sadly I think this issue is gonna be me hanging up the single issue pulls and just switch to trade paperback. I'm sure Spencer has some hype stories planned but theres just too much setup in the issue to issue read with not much watercooler talk to make about them, especially for an arc that had nearly 20 issues of hyping up Parker's sins and no real revelations outside of Kindred's identity... which just raised more questions. I'm sure years from now the entire run will be fun to read through but it feels so punishing to have hope for big deliveries here, and rather stalling to make whammy issues on landmark issues, on top of feeling constantly disjointed with the main title issues switching artists constantly
OK, so it seems that Last Remains is the second act of a three-act story.
[QUOTE=RD155;5301680]Oh I agree completely.
It seems like Spencer doesn’t know either.
It’s a bit tiresome to keep hearing people say “No answers this issue, but Next issue will have answers. Watch!”
I mean, how much patiently waiting can we do?[/QUOTE]
According to Nick Spencer, Last Remains was just a domino in the chain of dominos to the story he is telling.
[url]https://www.cbr.com/nick-spencer-amazing-spider-man-last-remains-interview/[/url]
"How did he become this? When did the turn happen? What is he after? “Last Remains” is where all that [B]starts to unravel [/B]and there are plenty of twists and turns to this part of the story that I feel confident no one will see coming."
...
"I haven’t done a lot of interviews or talked publicly about the run these last couple years. That’s been by design. I wanted to really try to let the work do the talk and leave it in the hands of the audience. And so far, I’m pretty pleased with the results of that experiment.
But one thing I would say I see, in terms of how the book is often evaluated, that I’d push back against is this notion that there is a main story-- the Kindred story-- and the others arcs are just breathers from that. Little stories. That, I promise you, couldn’t be farther from the truth of it. Each of those arcs, while intimate and character-driven (which I love to do, don’t get me wrong) is there to serve the larger plan. They’re putting something on the board or setting something in motion that will pay off down the road.
I had this on a smaller scale with my Cap run. I can remember the back half of Steve Rogers: Captain America, people saying they didn’t get it-- one issue he’s up in space, the next issue is about Baron Zemo and Cap’s barely in it, the next one is all about Maria Hill. And at the time people were like “it’s all over the place, they should get back to the main story”-- then Secret Empire #0 hits, and you see how everything we did there was part of the plan; it was all interconnected, and people seemed to love the payoff.
[B]Well, this, structurally, is that times ten. Every story is a domino, and when we tip it over, I hope people will be impressed by the scale of it. And these stories really start to get bigger and take a firmer shape in 2021. [/B]And yes, alongside that, you have Kindred.[B] “Last Remains” is the next big piece there.[/B]"
[QUOTE=Arsenal;5301685]I mean... answers will come eventually. I don’t see the need to stress out about it every issue wondering when they’ll get here.[/QUOTE]
Completely disagree.
As a consumer you should be disappointed if a story isn’t progressing and answers are nowhere to be found issue after issue.
Okay so I’ve had a bit of time to digest this and yeah, this has fallen pretty flat - I just can’t work out who’s to blame.
This ISN’T the end of Last Remains, I’m not looking at Peter any differently to before and I don’t think overall much has changed. So was this down to marketing/hype? Because the story clearly isn’t over (and if it IS - that’s weird). This could’ve just been another issue in the series, but wasn’t hyped up as such.
The LR tie ins could have quite easily been told in the main title alongside the main story - and the order of the web added jack **** anyway. Sin-Eater lived past #50 just to die again (even though his death was better in #50) so, again, added jack ****.
I don’t really mind much of what we have been told in terms of Harry and why he hates Peter. As Kindreds first real showing, it’s been entertaining and I look forward to the next one...but the hype surrounding it all hasn’t helped, because we didn’t get what we were hoping. This has been eleven issues and we haven’t got much further aside from finding out it’s Harry, everyone knows that now, and that Peter/MJ/Norman & Fisk are all tied up in it.
[QUOTE=Kingkalamari;5301693]Sadly I think this issue is gonna be me hanging up the single issue pulls and just switch to trade paperback. I'm sure Spencer has some hype stories planned but theres just too much setup in the issue to issue read with not much watercooler talk to make about them, especially for an arc that had nearly 20 issues of hyping up Parker's sins and no real revelations outside of Kindred's identity... which just raised more questions. I'm sure years from now the entire run will be fun to read through but it feels so punishing to have hope for big deliveries here, and rather stalling to make whammy issues on landmark issues, on top of feeling constantly disjointed with the main title issues switching artists constantly[/QUOTE]
Yeah I think the solicits are at fault here. Making you think there is some big revelation in issue 55 that was never planned to happen yet. If they just talked about the issue realistically, and flat out told us this is just Spider-Man's first big encounter and Last Remains starts to unravel the mystery, it would have not have had expectations setup that it was never intended to address.
I mean at the end of the day, we know who Kindred is now, and we can all safely say this is tied to OMD. Before Last Remains, we did not know either of those two things.
It is kind of a dirty trick though that Spencer has an whole run lined up that has a bunch of stories planned out, but on the side of that the whole way through we have Kindred and the OMD carrot hanging in front of us. I think this may be hurting his run more than helping because everyone is so focused on the carrot they aren't paying attention to the actual stories.
[QUOTE=Vortex85;5301714]
we can all safely say this is tied to OMD. [/QUOTE]
How do you know that?
[QUOTE=evolutionaryFan;5301731]How do you know that?[/QUOTE]
- Peter: this doesnt make sense you are past all this Harry, this cant be what you want me to confess
- Harry: your right, this runs much deeper
- Peter: whatever it is you want me to confess ill do it just tell me what it is. Whatever it is I did that cause you to turn yourself into this...
-Harry: Me? Turn myself? YOU DID THIS TO ME
- QUEUE OMD SCENE
- MJ: He doesnt remember
Besides that: in the astral plane we have all the OMD demons including MJ saying her line from the deal “the answer is yes”
Also dr strange is looking into Peters deal with the devil for his marriage
[QUOTE=Vortex85;5301742]
- QUEUE OMD SCENE
[/quote]
Ah ok. I need to re-read OMD. When I saw that scene I thought it was just Harry talking in the present. So when he said "Brand new day" I thought it was just a tease by the author. But if it's a scene straight from OMD then it's pretty clear.
[QUOTE]
Besides that: in the astral plane we have all the OMD demons including MJ saying her line from the deal “the answer is yes”
[/QUOTE]
Was that in issue 54?
[QUOTE=evolutionaryFan;5301752]Ah ok. I need to re-read OMD. When I saw that scene I thought it was just Harry talking in the present. So when he said "Brand new day" I thought it was just a tease by the author. But if it's a scene straight from OMD then it's pretty clear.[/QUOTE]
Yes directly out of ISSUE 545:
[IMG]https://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/9/b0/56ddda739850b/clean.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/AribxGW.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE]Was that in issue 54?[/QUOTE]
Both in issue #51 and #53.LR, actually, MJ is there repeatedly saying "The answer is yes" over and over again. Issue #53.LR went as far as including Kingpin, the assassing who shot Aunt May, and Aunt May along with MJ so it's all the players that led to OMD in Peter's astral plane.
[QUOTE=Vortex85;5301714]Yeah I think the solicits are at fault here. Making you think there is some big revelation in issue 55 that was never planned to happen yet. If they just talked about the issue realistically, and flat out told us this is just Spider-Man's first big encounter and Last Remains starts to unravel the mystery, it would have not have had expectations setup that it was never intended to address.
I mean at the end of the day, we know who Kindred is now, and we can all safely say this is tied to OMD. Before Last Remains, we did not know either of those two things.[/QUOTE]
Looking back at Last Remains as a whole, if you trimmed out all the plots that went nowhere, pretty much the biggest plot points and Spidey/Kindred confrontation couldve just been all in issue #50/51 which wouldve made the great Sins Rising arc even better.
Something like:
-Parker throws off Norman to Sin-Eater, who shoots him at the end of #49 instead of #50 with cliffhanger of the order getting possessed, Parker is a bystander to the bridge destruction, Kindred appears and takes him up on his offer to swap their lives for his, #53 BND retelling/Kindred reveal ending the issue. #51 basically has the Kindred/Spidey fighting and the Order/Sin Eater fight and then the events here in serving as the aftermath.
Instead, we get 10 issues with so much decompression to them and virtually nothing of importance in em in the scope of the main plot. I get setting up dominos for future stories and I love a good mystery, but I wont defend blatant filler which seems so bad faith on Marvel's end during covid times, when contemporary titles to ASM that publish monthly can tell me a better story in 2-3 issues. It's hard not to feel like dedicated fans are being exploited by the pacing and issues, take for example, Superior Spider-Man, as controversial as it is, at least you can pick up a volume or two and get a story with numerous plot beats across it, whereas Last Remains doesnt really give that much in terms of a story, let alone basically per Spencer that you're gonna need to be strapped in for another 50 issues for the things here to come to fruition which, in a better story sounds hype, but it really did not win me over as far as buying issues go to continue to make this a regular pull.