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It’s almost comical how they try to shoehorn Batman into everything. But the jokes on them I feel that Batman is in danger of being over exposed. I think it’s because WB has always positioned itself as the edgy alternative to Disney (even going back to the old Looney toons days) Batman fits better into how WB views itself. It’s why WB keep trying to recast it’s heroes into Batman’s mold with mixed results.
Starting to think that every non-Batverse character would be be so much better off at almost any other company.
Marvel, at this point, could do so much more with Superman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, The Flash, Green Lantern, Shazam, and Green Arrow.
DC wouldn't care, because they'd still have Batman.
What bothers me is they have no problem experimenting with Batman but nobody else. Almost all of the [I]Black Label[/I] stuff is Batman. What little isn't isn't all that interesting. And don't get me wrong, a lot of the stuff they do with Batman over there is good. But why just him? I loved [I]Joker/Harley Criminal Sanity [/I]and [I]The Imposter[/I] but could you see them trying that with any other character? No. Batman was barely even in the first one. They could have literally taken him out and it would be the same story. Where is the hyper-realistic Superman story? Or WW story? Or even someone like Vixen? Batman gets yet another movie reboot while Superman gets replaced with Supergirl. If you're going to hard reboot your movie franchise, then just do it with all of them. DC has the ability to do better stories, they've proven it with Batman. They just won't do it with anyone else.
[QUOTE=mathew101281;5884980]It’s almost comical how they try to shoehorn Batman into everything. But the jokes on them I feel that Batman is in danger of being over exposed. [/QUOTE]
Just about every popular character is supposedly in danger of being "overexposed" and yet they're that way for a reason: there's reliable data on how they sell. Wolverine, Spider-Man, Iron Man the last decade... fans constantly complain about these characters being shoved down their throats, and while I get it, at the end of the day it happens because audiences have consistently proven they will watch their movies, buy their toys, and so on.
And I say this as someone who does agree with the notion that DC is obsessed with Batman.
I've never really thought about that with regards to Looney Toons lol. It makes sense though
I wish both the Batman overexposure and MCU fatigue become real, as in, people actually stop buying them, but honestly Batman's been running as DCWB's number one since the 90s (with the possible exception is the period between Batman and Robin and Batman Begins) and it's not stopping
I'm kind of done with the MCU just because I don't want to have to watch every movie that comes out just to follow some larger narrative. If the next Thor sequel doesn't interest me, I shouldn't have to watch it just to know what's going on in the next movie that's not about him. I don't have any interest in watching five super-hero movies a year.
With the internet clamoring to to boycott everything DC aside from the upcoming Batman film
I can see why.
[QUOTE=mathew101281;5884980]It’s almost comical how they try to shoehorn Batman into everything. But the jokes on them I feel that Batman is in danger of being over exposed. I think it’s because WB has always positioned itself as the edgy alternative to Disney (even going back to the old Looney toons days) Batman fits better into how WB views itself. It’s why WB keep trying to recast it’s heroes into Batman’s mold with mixed results.[/QUOTE]
It is called comfort zone, batman is that comfort zone for DC.
They have no idea how to exploit other characters, not just in comics. No attempt, no ideas, I suspect they don't even have interest in doing it. A company run by incompetents.
Have you seen any attempt to exploit the few successes they get at box office? except doing a sequel? have you seen any promoting, merchandise etc in few words milking the success?
Marvel would have milked every inch from Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam.
Problems will start when Batman starts to slow down, it will happen as in everything in the life there is a peak and a decline.
[QUOTE=Rac7d*;5885546]With the internet clamoring to to boycott everything DC aside from the upcoming Batman film
I can see why.[/QUOTE]
Those are the snyderstans, well after seeing the latest WW84 video sales it seems they are failing, it did extremely well in those sales for a movie they ridiculed from the very beginning.
[QUOTE=Goldrake;5885551]It is called comfort zone, batman is that comfort zone for DC.
They have no idea how to exploit other characters, not just in comics. No attempt, no ideas, I suspect they don't even have interest in doing it. A company run by incompetents.
[B]Have you seen any attempt to exploit the few successes they get at box office? except doing a sequel? have you seen any promoting, merchandise etc in few words milking the success?[/B]
[/QUOTE]
The moment they try that here comes the "fans" screaming " HOW DARE YOU!" With the usual "movies and tv shows and trades don't matter" and "we need to BOYCOTT this (bleep)" and "those writers are wasting their time" and "BLANK is trying to replace BLANK" nonsense.
Hello New Age Heroes and Duke Thomas.
Meanwhile those SAME folks were PRAISING DC for doing books for guys who did GUEST spots on CW shows like Deathstroke or Peacemaker.
Because they were ranting on Marvel for doing it with Black Panther, Carol Danvers and Dr Strange.
[QUOTE]Just about every popular character is supposedly in danger of being "overexposed" and yet they're that way for a reason: there's reliable data on how they sell. Wolverine, Spider-Man, Iron Man the last decade... fans constantly complain about these characters being shoved down their throats, and while I get it, at the end of the day it happens because audiences have consistently proven they will watch their movies, buy their toys, and so on.[/QUOTE]
It's not about Batman selling.
If they are looking at this data-why are they choosing to CHERRY PICK?
This is what folks have an issue with. We got characters that are selling and yet get scraps or nothing.
Why is it so hard to sell Cyborg??? Who is on two hit shows with versions that folks LOVE. How hard is it to adapt Doom Patrol Cyborg to mainstream DC? David Walker tried and Harvey Richards (Editor) screwed it up.
If they can find pitches for Batman they can for everyone else.
We're getting a Superman cartoon, a Green Lantern show, a Wonder Woman game, a Static movie, a Blue Beetle movie, Superman and Lois has a second season and Young Justice is in it's fourth season (and isn't just focused on Batman).
[QUOTE=Goldrake;5885551]It is called comfort zone, batman is that comfort zone for DC.
They have no idea how to exploit other characters, not just in comics. No attempt, no ideas, I suspect they don't even have interest in doing it. A company run by incompetents.
Have you seen any attempt to exploit the few successes they get at box office? except doing a sequel? have you seen any promoting, merchandise etc in few words milking the success?
Marvel would have milked every inch from Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam.
Problems will start when Batman starts to slow down, it will happen as in everything in the life there is a peak and a decline.
Those are the snyderstans, well after seeing the latest WW84 video sales it seems they are failing, it did extremely well in those sales for a movie they ridiculed from the very beginning.[/QUOTE]
That's people hating DC in general, not just Snyder fans. WW84's biggest critics were far from Snyder supporters.
As mentioned in other threads, its because the Bat Family has a greater degree of consistency than other franchises both within the comics and adaptations, said adaptations also scoop up new fans and in general, the franchise is very well maintained. Most of Batman's supporting characters have long running ongoings, everybody has unique identifying features (Bruce is the stoic one, Dick is the first son, Jason is the bad boy, Damian is the brat) and the fanbase is very satiated. Whether you like '66 Batman or '89 Batman, DC has content for you. Even if you hate the whole 'billionaire crime fighter' concept, DC has still something for you; Telltale Batman and Batman: White Knight and possibly even the upcoming 'The Batman' movie. Creators get long descent run on the titles and DC always puts their best talent on the Bat Books.
In contrast to that:
-Every other character at DC has become almost interchangeable and what makes them unique and even their history gets muddier every day.
-Every WW character has 2-3 origin stories. Writer's can't come to an agreement on basic stuff like whether if Diana is the daughter of Zeus or the born from clay, whether she is thousands of years old or 20 something but can live for thousands or even a consistent supporting cast as every writer comes up with a new one for each run. Lack of adaptations doesn't help either and the ones she is in are usually ensemble stuff.
-The Flash fanbase has been deeply fractured since Flash: Rebirth and Nu52. It used to be so straightforward: Jay > Barry > Wally > Bart. Adaptation wise both Barry and Wally's personalities have become very interchangeable. Let's not even get into Barry's dumb 'dead mom' origin story or the infighting between Barry vs Wally vs Wallace fanbases.
-Green Lantern. The one franchise that reached Batman levels of success by having multiple titles under it's belt. Yet as soon as Johns left they seem to have dismantled everything he built. Yes, I wasn't a fan of every decision he made and I agree that the cosmic side needed more than just Lanterns but that doesn't mean razing everything to the ground. Now we are down to one GL title, multiple characters vying for spot light, oh and the Corps got blow up again. I'm glad that John Stewart is the lead now but I really wish the GL franchise could still sustain multiple ongoings so he can have a book all to himself without having to share the spotlight.
-The JSA is in an eternal back and forth between creators who want the classic JSA around vs the people who think they are redundant and should be killed off/revamped into younger versions. The fact that nobody has come up with a viable explanation for why these guys are still active till the present day doesn't help matters.
-Vixen, Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Zatanna all either under used or not used well at all.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;5886331]We're getting a Superman cartoon, a Green Lantern show, a Wonder Woman game, a Static movie, a Blue Beetle movie, Superman and Lois has a second season and Young Justice is in it's fourth season (and isn't just focused on Batman).
That's people hating DC in general, not just Snyder fans. WW84's biggest critics were far from Snyder supporters.[/QUOTE]
What you mention is the least, tell me how they exploited Aquaman's movie success? with a 3 episode cartoons for toddlers? and what else? he is nowhere to be seen.
How did they exploited WW2017? what did they do special from the usual stuff?
Having just a new cartoon or game about Character X or Z is nothing extraordinary, normal administration. Following a movie hit, you just don't do only a cartoon, or a game(did Aquaman get one? how long WW waited to get one?), but flood the market with graphic novels, toys, books etc....
What I mean the merchandise is totally lacking, look at little kids with their small backpacks of spiderman, CA, Avengers, Iron Man while DC just batman nothing else. Ask fans overseas if shops are full of Marvel stuff and hardly any DC.
Really snyderfans had nothing to do with bashing WW84? just until yesterday on twitter they kept doing that, because sales data came out in which WW84 did extremely well at video sales and ZSJL does not even make the list. It wasn't people who hate DC but people with hastag restoresnyderverse.
Same happened when HBO released data about viewers and WW84 outperformed ZSJL. They keep dismissing any DCEU movies that aren't snyder, the few that succeed they claim it is because he had a hand in them, those that not do well is because he didn't. They harass fans who don't share their views, they are currently promoting a boycott on DCEU, they have set up gofundme initiatives to promote these boycotts.
[QUOTE=Goldrake;5886411]What you mention is the least, tell me how they exploited Aquaman's movie success? with a 3 episode cartoons for toddlers? and what else? he is nowhere to be seen.
How did they exploited WW2017? what did they do special from the usual stuff?
Having just a new cartoon or game about Character X or Z is nothing extraordinary, normal administration. Following a movie hit, you just don't do only a cartoon, or a game(did Aquaman get one? how long WW waited to get one?), but flood the market with graphic novels, toys, books etc....
What I mean the merchandise is totally lacking, look at little kids with their small backpacks of spiderman, CA, Avengers, Iron Man while DC just batman nothing else. Ask fans overseas if shops are full of Marvel stuff and hardly any DC. [/QUOTE]
It isn't nothing. Also, there is such a thing as quality control. Flooding the market is not always a good idea, especially when you're just trying to get new properties over with mainstream audiences. You're also ignoring the numerous graphic novels and spinoff titles WW has gotten recently.
Flooding the market with multiple titles is not always smart business. Marvel does this often with the X-line even when a large number of them are pointless or stupid, and they've been trying it with the Avengers with inconsistent success. And you really want a bunch of soulless media adaptations that just serve as promotion for the movies the way the Avengers cartoons and recent Avengers game turned out?
The issue is more that DC is doing too much with Batman. They're technically doing enough with their other properties or at least starting to.
[QUOTE]
Really snyderfans had nothing to do with bashing WW84? just until yesterday on twitter they kept doing that, because sales data came out in which WW84 did extremely well at video sales and ZSJL does not even make the list. It wasn't people who hate DC but people with hastag restoresnyderverse.
Same happened when HBO released data about viewers and WW84 outperformed ZSJL. They keep dismissing any DCEU movies that aren't snyder, the few that succeed they claim it is because he had a hand in them, those that not do well is because he didn't. They harass fans who don't share their views, they are currently promoting a boycott on DCEU, they have set up gofundme initiatives to promote these boycotts.[/QUOTE]
Every DCEU movie gets dismissed and bashed. Even ones that have nothing to do with Snyder.
I could also point out that this type of stuff have been happening to the DCEU ever since it began with sexist comments directed at Gadot and Addams, the petition sent to the White House to have Snyder removed from BvS before the movie was even released, the insulting comments made after his daughter's suicide, people trying to downplay WW's success (and no, this isn't a Snyder fan thing. I've seen people do this who aren't fans of Snyder either way. Recent examples were made when Patty Jenkins made disparaging comments about streaming movies), just how anyone brings the guy or previous movies up in conversations that have nothing to do with them, bashing Ray Fisher etc.
Anti-DCEU toxicity wasn't invented by Snyder fans and isn't just coming from them. And once more, criticism of WW1984 was not solely a Snyder fan thing. Unless all professional critics suddenly turned out to be Snyder fans over night.
Aquaman doesn't even have an ongoing despite getting a hit movie. We currently have one starring Jackson Hyde and another with Black Manta and that's about it. How does that compute? None of that sounds like a smart business move to me. Plus, it's not like DC doesn't exploit the success of movie franchises, after TDK made a billion and the Bat Embargo got lifted we got endless amounts of Batman focused DTV movies, two animated shows and video games. So why isn't there a bigger follow up for Wonder Woman and Aquaman's success?
As for Snyder fans and toxic fandom in general, without hard numbers it's hard to say how many of the people who criticize WW84 are Snyder fans and wants to restore his universe and how many of them are just regular fans. Though I will note that I don't see other factions of the DCU fandom invade comment sections of projects that have nothing to do with the DCU (i.e Sandman and Sweet Tooth) with the #restorethesnyderverse. Currently, they're the only ones with a clear agenda and organizational ability.