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[QUOTE=Jeramas;4213817]Litle alita is going to be beloved. Please watch more awesome videos to see how the media are trying to kill this movie becaise it is a threat to their captain bored.
[video=youtube;jdp8tKCSb7I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdp8tKCSb7I[/video]
It’s a tragic sign of the times that Captain Marvel will blow away Alita at the box office and reviews. In addition to being such a great movie, Rosa Salazar has more charm in her pinky finger than Brie Larson will have as carol.[/QUOTE]
Conspirqcy theories aside, You ahvent even seen captain Marvel. And Brie Larson is a Oscar caliber actor and even the most die hard MCU haters would have stuck to calling her character Carol charmless not Brie Larson who's highly regarded. I do like Rosa though, she adorable in everything
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I don't really get this animosity towards the Captain Marvel movie. I mean, I'm a Mar-Vell fan, I've never been very happy with the way Carol has tended to take from Mar-Vell's mythology, I'm not terribly happy with the fact that they're pushing Carol as this big feminist statement movie whilst quietly sweeping Mar-Vell under the rug seemingly without mention. But I think the film looks cool, I think Larson is good, I think Marvel have a track record when it comes to making enjoyable hit movies that you'd be stupid to bet against. And I don't see what this has to do with Alita.
Alita was good, but it wasn't perfect. The lead actress and the cgi department seem to have worked together very smoothly to make the lead character very appealing (which is a big win for the film), and the action scenes totally kill (seriously some of the best fight scenes I've seen for a while); on the other hand the love interest and all the other characters, save for Waltz, are kind of just there. So you've got a film that, imo, has enough going for it to work, a film that I would definitely watch again, but one with a number of weak spots that the critics have seized upon. I think Alita deserves to do well, maybe better than it's doing at the moment, but I don't get why Alita supporters seem to be so aggressive towards other films.
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...shame there is already so much hate in this world and a medium who's only purpose is to entertain is filled with NPC and Nazi's who can't do anything but suck the joy right out of it.
[QUOTE=Jeramas;4213817]Litle alita is going to be beloved. Please watch more awesome videos to see how the media are trying to kill this movie becaise it is a threat to their captain bored.
[video=youtube;jdp8tKCSb7I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdp8tKCSb7I[/video]
It’s a tragic sign of the times that Captain Marvel will blow away Alita at the box office and reviews. In addition to being such a great movie, Rosa Salazar has more charm in her pinky finger than Brie Larson will have as carol.[/QUOTE]
It is a little weird how the media was so hypocritical about Alita. Especially, the points they tired to land on that they thought were "bad". This is a large example of the reasons why people should be more aware of who owns what media outlets or who is "friendly" with who. Can be a little difficult but in the end it shows what agenda is trying to be pushed and who is really pushing it.
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[QUOTE=Jeramas;4213817]Litle alita is going to be beloved. [B]Please watch more awesome videos to see how the media are trying to kill this movie becaise it is a threat to their captain bored.[/B]
[video=youtube;jdp8tKCSb7I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdp8tKCSb7I[/video]
It’s a tragic sign of the times that Captain Marvel will blow away Alita at the box office and reviews. In addition to being such a great movie, Rosa Salazar has more charm in her pinky finger than Brie Larson will have as carol.[/QUOTE]
How Alita a "threat" to anyone or anything? Let's say for the sake of argument Alita becomes the biggest movie of the year...who's "hurt" by this? Why would there be a need to "kill" this movie?
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[QUOTE=Panic;4214026]I don't really get this animosity towards the Captain Marvel movie. I mean, I'm a Mar-Vell fan, I've never been very happy with the way Carol has tended to take from Mar-Vell's mythology, I'm not terribly happy with the fact that they're pushing Carol as this big feminist statement movie whilst quietly sweeping Mar-Vell under the rug seemingly without mention. But I think the film looks cool, I think Larson is good, I think Marvel have a track record when it comes to making enjoyable hit movies that you'd be stupid to bet against. And I don't see what this has to do with Alita.
Alita was good, but it wasn't perfect. The lead actress and the cgi department seem to have worked together very smoothly to make the lead character very appealing (which is a big win for the film), and the action scenes totally kill (seriously some of the best fight scenes I've seen for a while); on the other hand the love interest and all the other characters, save for Waltz, are kind of just there. So you've got a film that, imo, has enough going for it to work, a film that I would definitely watch again, but one with a number of weak spots that the critics have seized upon. I think Alita deserves to do well, maybe better than it's doing at the moment, but I don't get why Alita supporters seem to be so aggressive towards other films.[/QUOTE]
The animosity is coming from a segment of fandom that is anti-feminist. They have been told that Carol is a "feminist" character so they think it's their duty to attack the character. They're praising Alita the same way someone who says something messed up about race will quickly point out that they have a friend of a different race/ethnicity so they can't be racist.
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I'm not sure labelling everyone who's hating on the move anti-feminist is accurate or acceptable. I'm sure there are some anti-feminists in there, but I can't believe they all are. For starters I know that some of Shazam's fan-base have their collective nose out of joint because of the name.
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[QUOTE=Panic;4214087]I'm not sure labelling everyone who's hating on the move anti-feminist is accurate or acceptable. I'm sure there are some anti-feminists in there, but I can't believe they all are. For starters I know that some of Shazam's fan-base have their collective nose out of joint because of the name.[/QUOTE]
Just to be clear, I don't think that everyone who dislikes the movie is anti-feminist. I think there's lots of people to simply think Carol Danvers is boring or who saw the trailer and were underwhelmed or who feel the Marvel movies aren't that great to begin with and I think those are legit opinions to have. But there's other people who follow the lead of "SJW Marvel" youtubers and convinced themselves that the mere existence of this movie is part of some sort of communist plot, but don't want to use any critical thinking skills, so they'll just make up silly things and act outraged.
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[QUOTE=ed2962;4214124]But there's other people who follow the lead of "SJW Marvel" youtubers and convinced themselves that the mere existence of this movie is part of some sort of communist plot, but don't want to use any critical thinking skills, so they'll just make up silly things and act outraged.[/QUOTE]
That is happening on both sides of the table. To me both groups are just idiots. The main for these movies is that we are entertained and that we enjoy them. If the movie is bad then we as fans should let them know why we didn't enjoy them. If they are good we should be more eager to let them know.
The whole me verse's you aspect of movies/comics has become toxic and unproductive. Especially in comics. Because while we are so busy fighting each other more and more stores are closing shop and comics sales are decreasing while the prices are going up. Which is unsustainable in any industry.
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4214174][B]That is happening on both sides of the table[/B]. To me both groups are just idiots. The main for these movies is that we are entertained and that we enjoy them. If the movie is bad then we as fans should let them know why we didn't enjoy them. If they are good we should be more eager to let them know.
The whole me verse's you aspect of movies/comics has become toxic and unproductive. Especially in comics. Because while we are so busy fighting each other more and more stores are closing shop and comics sales are decreasing while the prices are going up. Which is unsustainable in any industry.[/QUOTE]
It used to be like this but in recent months, the "conservative complainers" are getting louder. I mean, these are the guys that set up stupid (and quickly shut down) groups on facebook to downvote on Black Panther and other minority led movies. It's pretty idiotic (and somewhat pathetic) to actively attack a movie that's probably not for you and you might probably never even watch.
The crazy thing is, a lot of people like me were against some of the "outrage" culture that came up some time back but the noise makers on youtube and other social media forums are really outdoing them.
I didn't even know what Brie Larson said until one of the other posters quoted what she said but somehow this has been translated into another attack on "white men". Like, seriously??
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[QUOTE=ed2962;4214124]Just to be clear, I don't think that everyone who dislikes the movie is anti-feminist. I think there's lots of people to simply think Carol Danvers is boring or who saw the trailer and were underwhelmed or who feel the Marvel movies aren't that great to begin with and I think those are legit opinions to have. But there's other people who follow the lead of "SJW Marvel" youtubers and convinced themselves that the mere existence of this movie is part of some sort of communist plot, but don't want to use any critical thinking skills, so they'll just make up silly things and act outraged.[/QUOTE]
Exactly.
We all have brains, instead of leaning into conspiracy things, why not just do your own investigation, gather evidence and simply make up your own mind about issues? Why parrot guys on the internet without using your own critical thinking? The whole "everyone I disagree with has an agenda" way of thinking is making a lot of people look foolish and because their reaction is based entirely on emotion, they tend to cite information wrong (Pro boxoffice tracking still has the movie opening at $140 million plus, lots of the youtube guys are citing other sources tracking and mixing everything together).
The movie has the highest preales on fandango for a Marvel movie after Black Panther and Avengers Infinity War, the movie is going to open huge which will probably melt the brains of the folks that are so vehemently opposed to it. [url]https://pro.boxoffice.com/trailer-impact-2-21-19/[/url]
I've long said that I'm not really so hyped for Captain Marvel but the folks hating have actually turned my attention towards the movie. That plus I've only heard very good things about it and my interest in it is going up.
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[QUOTE=Username taken;4214188]It used to be like this but in recent months, the "conservative complainers" are getting louder. I mean, these are the guys that set up stupid (and quickly shut down) groups on facebook to downvote on Black Panther and other minority led movies. It's pretty idiotic (and somewhat pathetic) to actively attack a movie [B]that's probably not for you [/B]and you might probably never even watch.
The crazy thing is, a lot of people like me were against some of the "outrage" culture that came up some time back but the noise makers on youtube and other social media forums are really outdoing them.
I didn't even know what Brie Larson said until one of the other posters quoted what she said but somehow this has been translated into another attack on "white men". Like, seriously??[/QUOTE]
I find that if you try to understand your adversary not only will you learn something but you can find a way to meet in the middle. Take the bold for instance... Marvel movies should be for EVERYONE! These characters have always been for EVERYONE. You do not need to be the same color, sex, or hold the same views as the characters but there was something in each of them that EVERYONE can admire or relate to.
Now I could have taken your bold statement and shut you off called you a NPC/Nazi and go on about how you and those like you are the cause of everything that is wrong in the world but what would it have solved? Nothing. Instead I pointed out that Marvel Comics should be written and produced for everyone.
Like it or not but how Brie Larson said what she said hurt a portion of the fanbase. It wasn't even one instance of it but instead she did a few times. Is her message bad? No not at all in the slightest. But how she is going about it is wrong and for that like everything else in life it has it's repercussions. The situation could be handled waaay better than it has. Love it. Hate it. It is what it is.
Where at the point now where media outlets are insulting fans. How does that help anyone? More importantly how does that help the comic industry? Does anyone actually think that a industry almost on it's last leg will benefit or gain more readership when it's primary fanbase feels alienated or attacked? So yeah, while the NPC and Nazi's flail at each other like a bunch of baby monkeys fighting for dominances, theres rational group of us looking to the left where more nails are being hammered into the coffin of the comic industry.
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4214226]I find that if you try to understand your adversary not only will you learn something but you can find a way to meet in the middle. Take the bold for instance... Marvel movies [B]should[/B] be for EVERYONE! These characters have always been for EVERYONE. You do not need to be the same color, sex, or hold the same views as the characters but there was something in each of them that you can admire or relate to.
Now I could have taken your bold statement and shut you off called you a NPC/Nazi and go on about how you and those like you are the cause of everything that is wrong in the world but what would it have solved? Nothing. Instead I pointed out that Marvel Comics should be written and produced for everyone.
Like it or not but how Brie Larson said what she said hurt a portion of the fanbase. It wasn't even one instance of she did it a few times. Is her message bad? No not at all in the slightest. But how she is going about it is wrong and for that like everything else in life it has it's repercussions. The situation could be handled waaay better than it has.
Where at the point now where media outlets are insulting fans. How does that help anyone? More importantly how does that help the comic industry? Does anyone actually think that a industry almost on it's last leg will benefit or gain more readership when it's primary fanbase feels alienated or attacked? So yeah, while the NPC and Nazi's flail at each other like a bunch of baby monkeys fighting for dominances, theres rational group of us looking to the left where more nails are being hammered into the coffin of the comic industry.[/QUOTE]
Can I get an example of media outlets actually insulting fans? Outside of the film makers that made Ghostbusters and the Battlefield V debacle, I keep seeing this and I haven't actually seen any example of this. Folks talk about people like Kathleen Kennedy insulting the fans, that literally never happened, in fact, KKs silence on the entire thing has been pretty crazy. I've heard people talk about Marvel studios calling people that hate Black Panther racist..never happened!
The whole NPC/ coded work discussion is a non-starter to me, it's not something I have any interest in.
However, I don't agree that every Marvel movie/comic is for everyone. Marvel probably put out stuff [I]they think[/I] is for everyone but not everyone will accept it. Quite a lot of people don't like their movies for various reasons and that's fine. Some are the hard core DC fan, some don't like their humor, some don't like their politics, some don't like their character e.t.c and all this is fine. Same with the comics, we all can't like the same things.
It's one thing to not like a movie but to try to actively sabotage a movie that you haven't even seen because you [I]might not[/I] agree with its politics isn't something I can even begin to understand. Like, how does one even have a discussion with folks that are already trying to reduce the IMDB scores of Captain Marvel because of the politics of the lead actress?" Same happened with Black Panther until the film opened and the score steadily rose. Now, people are trying to create a false "confrontation" between Alita and Captain Marvel for reasons that don't even make sense! Like saying Alita is already better than Captain Marvel when CM hasn't even been released? Like, that's the definition of click bait!
Sure a lot of the fan base "claim" they are offended by Brie's stance (because I genuinely don't believe anyone that actually read her statement is genuinely offended by what she said but is just piggy backing what other people said), but I simply come back to a point a made in another post I made earlier, why not make up your mind yourself? People have seen that's their money to be made from outrage and they sell their bullshit to people that buy it hook, line and sinker! Once again, one shouldn't define him/herself by the media they consume, it's not a healthy way to live.
Regarding comics, the current format of the industry (which is built on the back of the direct market) is a complete joke. Comics aren't really readily available in a lot of places (when I was in Cardiff, Wales, there was only one (1) single comic store), the direct market is designed to be gamed and is tailored to only sell the most popular heroes, the sooner it collapses and something else replaces it the better.
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4214031]...shame there is already so much hate in this world and a medium who's only purpose is to entertain is filled with NPC and Nazi's who can't do anything but suck the joy right out of it.
It is a little weird how the media was so hypocritical about Alita. Especially, the points they tired to land on that they thought were "bad". This is a large example of the reasons why people should be more aware of who owns what media outlets or who is "friendly" with who. Can be a little difficult but in the end it shows what agenda is trying to be pushed and who is really pushing it.[/QUOTE]
Were you around during Twilight? the media outlets and critics were so resentful of Kristen Stewart and her bored facial expressions. these are now the same people defending captain marvel?
My eyes keeps going back to that video and look at alita's face to carol face's. Carol looks like the robot as she evokes zero emotions. she is not just bored to look at, she is bland.
Media outlets used to be only pathetic when it was about politics,look at the jussie smollett situation. I have more anger towards the media than him. now they are twice as pathetic when it comes to what movies they choose to like.
If it was down to artistic merit as it should be, Alita is the supreme winner. We want to celebrate and talk about that but at the same time call out another movie we know will likely not be as good but will get a better deal from critics and media outlets.
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[QUOTE=Username taken;4214266][B]Can I get an example of media outlets actually insulting fans?[/B] Outside of the film makers that made Ghostbusters and the Battlefield V debacle, I keep seeing this and I haven't actually seen any example of this. Folks talk about people like Kathleen Kennedy insulting the fans, that literally never happened, in fact, KKs silence on the entire thing has been pretty crazy. I've heard people talk about Marvel studios calling people that hate Black Panther racist..never happened!
The whole NPC/ coded work discussion is a non-starter to me, it's not something I have any interest in.
However, I don't agree that every Marvel movie/comic is for everyone. Marvel probably put out stuff [I]they think[/I] is for everyone but not everyone will accept it. Quite a lot of people don't like their movies for various reasons and that's fine. Some are the hard core DC fan, some don't like their humor, some don't like their politics, some don't like their character e.t.c and all this is fine. Same with the comics, we all can't like the same things.
It's one thing to not like a movie but to[B] try to actively sabotage a movie that you haven't even seen because you [I]might not[/I] agree with its politics isn't something I can even begin to understand.[/B] Like, how does one even have a discussion with folks that are already trying to reduce the IMDB scores of Captain Marvel because of the politics of the lead actress?" Same happened with Black Panther until the film opened and the score steadily rose. Now, people are trying to create a false "confrontation" between Alita and Captain Marvel for reasons that don't even make sense! Like saying Alita is already better than Captain Marvel when CM hasn't even been released? Like, that's the definition of click bait!
Sure a lot of the fan base "claim" they are offended by Brie's stance (because I genuinely don't believe anyone that actually read her statement is genuinely offended by what she said but is just piggy backing what other people said), but I simply come back to a point a made in another post I made earlier, why not make up your mind yourself? People have seen that's their money to be made from outrage and they sell their bullshit to people that buy it hook, line and sinker! Once again, one shouldn't define him/herself by the media they consume, it's not a healthy way to live.
Regarding comics, the current format of the industry (which is built on the back of the direct market) is a complete joke. Comics aren't really readily available in a lot of places (when I was in Cardiff, Wales, there was only one (1) single comic store), the direct market is designed to be gamed and is tailored to only sell the most popular heroes, the sooner it collapses and something else replaces it the better.[/QUOTE]
Just to answer the bold. Not to one up or come at you:
"[B]Sexist Trolls[/B] Are Already Waging War Against Captain Marvel With Negative Reviews":
[url]https://www.esquire.com/entertainment/music/a26405919/captain-marvel-sexist-reviews-rotten-tomatoes/[/url]
"Captain Marvel is already under attack by [B]sexist trolls[/B] on Rotten Tomatoes":
[url]https://www.digitalspy.com/movies/a26421505/captain-marvel-under-attack-sexist-trolls-rotten-tomatoes/[/url]
But if you go to Rotten Tomatoes: [url]https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/captain_marvel#audience_reviews[/url]
Their are only about 30-40 something comments and most of them are quoting exactly what Brie Larson said. Again Right or Wrong Brie handled the situation the wrong way and this is the fallout of it. She singled out a group of people so they are saying they are no longer interested in seeing her movie, in the place made for them to give their opinion. That does not make them Trolls or Sexist.
There are a lot more articles on the web like this calling them names. These where just the first that popped up when I googled it.
Personally, I didn't see any attack on Black Panther. I don't doubt that they where being a Black Male. However, at the same time I'm pretty confident Chadwick never said anything that would make anyone one group feel as if they where excluded from his movie because he never at anytime singled anyone out. He did interviews with all kinds of people for all kinds of creeds and backgrounds and do not recall one time where he flat out said or implied a group was not welcomed. Brie, whether she meant to or not, did that. If you look on the Rotten Tomatoes comments, most of them are responding in the tune she projected to them.
Which is : "I'm a white male and I'm not welcome to your movie so I will not go see it"
As a Black Male...I have a hard time faulting them. If I had even a slight sniff of someone not appreciating or wanting me at something because of my race or sex, I too would be happy to keep my money in my pocket.
But I do agree with you about the media. People should use critical thinking and come to their own conclusion instead of being led like sheep.
AS to your point on comics...I would rather it not die at all. I enjoy them and it bugs the hell out of me watching fans go at each other when Comics was one of the few places where people just got along. Talked about the heroes and stories they liked to see. Laugh and joke about the characters and so on. Now everyone is offended about the dumbest crap and the industry is dying. It be better the NPC's and Nazi's moved on to something else instead.(Including those in the industry itself.)
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4214325]Just to answer the bold. Not to one up or come at you:
"[B]Sexist Trolls[/B] Are Already Waging War Against Captain Marvel With Negative Reviews":
[url]https://www.esquire.com/entertainment/music/a26405919/captain-marvel-sexist-reviews-rotten-tomatoes/[/url]
"Captain Marvel is already under attack by [B]sexist trolls[/B] on Rotten Tomatoes":
[url]https://www.digitalspy.com/movies/a26421505/captain-marvel-under-attack-sexist-trolls-rotten-tomatoes/[/url]
But if you go to Rotten Tomatoes: [url]https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/captain_marvel#audience_reviews[/url]
Their are only about 30-40 something comments and most of them are quoting exactly what Brie Larson said. Again Right or Wrong Brie handled the situation the wrong way and this is the fallout of it. She singled out a group of people so they are saying they are no longer interested in seeing her movie, in the place made for them to give their opinion. That does not make them Trolls or Sexist.
There are a lot more articles on the web like this calling them names. These where just the first that popped up when I googled it.
Personally, I didn't see any attack on Black Panther. I don't doubt that they where being a Black Male. However, at the same time I'm pretty confident Chadwick never said anything that would make anyone one group feel as if they where excluded from his movie because he never at anytime singled anyone out. He did interviews with all kinds of people for all kinds of creeds and backgrounds and do not recall one time where he flat out said or implied a group was not welcomed. Brie, whether she meant to or not, did that. If you look on the Rotten Tomatoes comments, most of them are responding in the tune she projected to them.
Which is : "I'm a white male and I'm not welcome to your movie so I will not go see it"
As a Black Male...I have a hard time faulting them. If I had even a slight sniff of someone not appreciating or wanting me at something because of my race or sex, I too would be happy to keep my money in my pocket.
But I do agree with you about the media. People should use critical thinking and come to their own conclusion instead of being led like sheep.
AS to your point on comics...I would rather it not die at all. I enjoy them and it bugs the hell out of me watching fans go at each other when Comics was one of the few places where people just got along. Talked about the heroes and stories they liked to see. Laugh and joke about the characters and so on. Now everyone is offended about the dumbest crap and the industry is dying. It be better the NPC's and Nazi's moved on to something else instead.(Including those in the industry itself.)[/QUOTE]
I understand where you’re coming from and I agree with you on some part.
Although we will have to disagree on the fan attacking part because I can’t believe that people pre-emptively attacking CM are actually comic fans or fans of the character at all. I also don’t believe that Larson’s comments should draw that sort of reaction from anyone. I’m also of African descent and I know how sensitive this stuff is but at the same time I just don’t believe nor subscribe to outrage culture regardless of the context. Larson was making a valid point that to me should be discussed and not simply lead to her being attacked. So far people aren’t being insulted directly (although I feel that people have started to take everything as an insult these days), I feel dialogue and polite disagreement is always the best option but people these days prefer outrage. Just like the Milos Manara controversy, Batgirl cover controversy, Riri Williams “sexualised cover controversy”t.c, I just don’t buy into the “pearl clutching” people are so quick to do these days. The outrage thing has seeped into comic buying audience hence the constant disagreement over..minute stuff. Like we both agreed upon, people need to open their minds and make decisions for themselves.
Getting outraged by everything means that one is being played by the folks trying to control the argument.
About the direct market, the problem I have is the format of the direct market, it’s just darn too insular. People like to jump up and down and claim comics are dying but they really aren’t, it’s just that we’ve reached the limit of the direct market. Lots of excellent smaller titles get crushed because retailers literally want to push the same superheroes over and over again. I got into comics reading titles like Firestorm, Ghost Rider and Defenders and these titles managed to get hundreds of issues, this just doesn’t happen anymore. Nowadays, the focus is only on the bigger and more popular characters because retailers find them easier to sell. I feel there’s a better way to sell comics to people but we haven’t just figured it out.
