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[QUOTE=Scott Taylor;1358064]RYV had a ton of variant covers, which really mixes up the sales arguments. And sales of Slott's ASM #1 blew it completely out of the water. So did Rocket Raccoon #1 and Princess Lea #1, by the way. But not SSM #1.
The obvious conclusion is that they need to turn Spider-Man into a female raccoon.[/QUOTE]
You joke, buuuuuuuut...
[QUOTE=Kevinroc;1357935]I guess I'm just trying to wrap my head on why this needs to be framed as an "either or" situation. And if Marvel is leaving money on the table by framing it as such instead of just going "Why Not Both?"
(Of course this same type of argument could also be used to ask why isn't there a Superior Spider-Man comic as well.).[/QUOTE]
Because at the end of the day it comes from the preferences of the people in charge.
The Reality of the Situation: The current CCO, EIC, and Executive Editor of Marvel don't want a married Spider-Man.
Like they just don't, each one of them had their own reasons and it got to the point for them to "write" a story of OMD to get where they wanted to be.
Think about it, they rather have a situation where Doc Ock becomes Spider-Man for a full year over mentioning the relationship/marriage past a 5 issue mini-series. That's not about an "either or" situation, that's about a preference that they have.
I think for the last 8 years, Marvel must've known they had money in the bank if they ever told a married Spider-Man story again, or if Peter and MJ got together.
They just don't want to tell that story for whatever reasons.
[QUOTE=Aruran.;1358517]Because at the end of the day it comes from the preferences of the people in charge.
The Reality of the Situation: The current CCO, EIC, and Executive Editor of Marvel don't want a married Spider-Man.
Like they just don't, each one of them had their own reasons and it got to the point for them to "write" a story of OMD to get where they wanted to be.
Think about it, they rather have a situation where Doc Ock becomes Spider-Man for a full year over mentioning the relationship/marriage past a 5 issue mini-series. That's not about an "either or" situation, that's about a preference that they have.
I think for the last 8 years, Marvel must've known they had money in the bank if they ever told a married Spider-Man story again, or if Peter and MJ got together.
They just don't want to tell that story for whatever reasons.[/QUOTE]
The main problem seems to be that they don't think it works in the long term.
Doc Ock becoming Spider-Man for a full year is a different type of situation because Peter Parker's back at the end.
It's tough to have a single Peter Parker if you bring back the marriage.
Looking at the first two issues of Renew Your Vows some kind of spinoff in that world would be difficult given what happened to the rest of the Marvel Universe, and how a world taken over by a supervillain isn't exactly the world outside your window.
[QUOTE=Mister Mets;1359290]The main problem seems to be that they don't think it works in the long term.
Doc Ock becoming Spider-Man for a full year is a different type of situation because Peter Parker's back at the end.
It's tough to have a single Peter Parker if you bring back the marriage.
Looking at the first two issues of Renew Your Vows some kind of spinoff in that world would be difficult given what happened to the rest of the Marvel Universe, and how a world taken over by a supervillain isn't exactly the world outside your window.[/QUOTE]
I suppose you could have Peter acting as a sort of recruiting officer, helping replace the dead heroes with new ones. Not sure how interesting that'd be, though.
But given seemingly popular opinion, I'm curious how long before fans of the marriage rumbled their dislike of the fact that this isn't the main Spider-Man and isn't connected to the mainstream universe. It's just a comic off to the side about an alternate universe Peter Parker promising every issue that he's totally gonna retire this time for his family, then abruptly having to don the suit again because evil is afoot.
[QUOTE=cyberhubbs;1359310]I suppose you could have Peter acting as a sort of recruiting officer, helping replace the dead heroes with new ones. Not sure how interesting that'd be, though. ***
But given seemingly popular opinion, I'm curious how long before fans of the marriage rumbled their dislike of the fact that [B][U]this isn't the main Spider-Man[/U][/B] and isn't connected to the mainstream universe. It's just a comic off to the side about an alternate universe Peter Parker promising every issue that he's totally gonna retire this time for his family, then abruptly having to don the suit again because evil is afoot.[/QUOTE]
The "Ben" problem.....except it isn't valid anymore. Miles. Miguel. Silk. Spider-UK. Each was gifted as a "real" Spidey in spider-verse.
Ben did not work because Marvel insisted "Peter" wasnt a real Spidey. That those issues featuring the clone did not count. And fans revolted. Slott wrote spider-verse in a way that removed that problem.
RYV Pete is just as valid as any other. And given the choice between Miles or a Pete/MJ book, I'd take Pete/MJ. It is $$, and Marvel knows it. So, like others have said its because Marvel is stubborn and wants to leave that $ on the table rather than find some way, which has been handed to them on a silver platter by secret wars, to feature a married spidey.
***Oh you mean Peter as a mentor? Hmm.....
O [QUOTE=Mister Mets;1359290]The main problem seems to be that they don't think it works in the long term.
Doc Ock becoming Spider-Man for a full year is a different type of situation because Peter Parker's back at the end.
It's tough to have a single Peter Parker if you bring back the marriage.
Looking at the first two issues of Renew Your Vows some kind of spinoff in that world would be difficult given what happened to the rest of the Marvel Universe, and how a world taken over by a supervillain isn't exactly the world outside your window.[/QUOTE]
Was 20 years not enough to show the longevity of a married Spider-Man? I'm not sure about the percentage of readers who only come back over the question of who Peter will date and then break up with next.
[QUOTE=cyberhubbs;1359310]I suppose you could have Peter acting as a sort of recruiting officer, helping replace the dead heroes with new ones. Not sure how interesting that'd be, though.
But given seemingly popular opinion, I'm curious how long before fans of the marriage rumbled their dislike of the fact that this isn't the main Spider-Man and isn't connected to the mainstream universe. It's just a comic off to the side about an alternate universe Peter Parker promising every issue that he's totally gonna retire this time for his family, then abruptly having to don the suit again because evil is afoot.[/QUOTE]
Peter's getting too old for this ****. :p
(I wonder if being tied into the main Marvel Universe is as big a deal as it used to be.)
[QUOTE=Kevinroc;1359841]Peter's getting too old for this ****. :p
(I wonder if being tied into the main Marvel Universe is as big a deal as it used to be.)[/QUOTE]
I think it's still a thing for some people. I dig alternate universes, personally. Not saying it can't start strong and whatnot, but it's the same thing that may hurt Spider-Gwen in the long run, a lack of extended world-building beyond a single title. And they could very well do that, using Peter to launch a new universe born from the decimation of its heroic population, heralding a new Age. Or somethin'.
[QUOTE=squirecam;1359475]The "Ben" problem.....except it isn't valid anymore. Miles. Miguel. Silk. Spider-UK. Each was gifted as a "real" Spidey in spider-verse.
Ben did not work because Marvel insisted "Peter" wasnt a real Spidey. That those issues featuring the clone did not count. And fans revolted. Slott wrote spider-verse in a way that removed that problem.
RYV Pete is just as valid as any other. And given the choice between Miles or a Pete/MJ book, I'd take Pete/MJ. It is $$, and Marvel knows it. So, like others have said its because Marvel is stubborn and wants to leave that $ on the table rather than find some way, which has been handed to them on a silver platter by secret wars, to feature a married spidey.
***Oh you mean Peter as a mentor? Hmm.....[/QUOTE]
Ehh. Miles and Gwen and Silk are not Peter. Not even variations of Peter. RYV Peter is. And a lot closer than other variations, at that. You're gonna need a bigger gimmick than Married Spider-Man With A Kid if you want it to last, I think.
[QUOTE=Vortex85;1359495]O
Was 20 years not enough to show the longevity of a married Spider-Man? I'm not sure about the percentage of readers who only come back over the question of who Peter will date and then break up with next.[/QUOTE]
They kept trying to change the status quo.
It took about seven years before the Clone Saga shook things up.
Then there was a brief respite before MJ was seemingly killed off.
And they seemed to be running out of stuff to do. They already had a pregnancy. MJ was believed dead. They had a seperation. There was even a time when Peter tried to keep his identity a secret from MJ.
[QUOTE=Mister Mets;1360182]They kept trying to change the status quo.
It took about seven years before the Clone Saga shoot things up.
Then there was a brief respite before MJ was seemingly killed off.
And they seemed to be running out of stuff to do. They already had a pregnancy. MJ was believed dead. They had a seperation. There was even a time when Peter tried to keep his identity a secret from MJ.[/QUOTE]
There are infinite things that can be done with any status quo. I just enjoy the book more when Peter is in his best relationship more than when he is in filler relationships or none at all. I would never trade in the former status quo for either of the latter, and i think it has been a complete waste over the last eight years that this has been the case. Most every story and event could have happened with the marriage intact. Little worthwhile can happen otherwise since it is no mystery who Peter belongs with. The whole single and looking for potential future love is a charade. Its no fun. Its fake.
[QUOTE=Vortex85;1359495]O
Was 20 years not enough to show the longevity of a married Spider-Man? I'm not sure about the percentage of readers who only come back over the question of who Peter will date and then break up with next.[/QUOTE]
the issue here is assuming that because something worked for 20 years that it would work for 50 or 100.
[QUOTE=boots;1360629]the issue here is assuming that because something worked for 20 years that it would work for 50 or 100.[/QUOTE]
DC doesn't seem to have a problem publishing a book with a married Superman and Lois raising their kid. ;)
[QUOTE=Kevinroc;1360657]DC doesn't seem to have a problem publishing a book with a married Superman and Lois raising their kid. ;)[/QUOTE]
yeah, i see this has been brought up a few times as proof, but i’m not sold. it might be proof that an alt title can be supported but not much else. up until now dc has been more comfortable with iterations of characters too.
superman and spider-man are very different properties. what works for one does not necessarily work for another. killing everyone at weddings works for “game of thrones” but not “lord of the rings”.
it’s the same reasoning problem as the 20 years = infinity; that because “a” works for “x” it must therefore work for “y”.
still, if marvel move towards a more dc approach with reboots and iterations it might not be a problem.
[QUOTE=boots;1360629]the issue here is assuming that because something worked for 20 years that it would work for 50 or 100.[/QUOTE]
The same could be said about a single Spider-Man. Or the comic book format in general.
Though I'd postulate that the decision to have Spider-Man single or not has much more to do with editorial preference and very little to do with what would actually affect the longetivty of the title. If anything, history shows sales have little to do with the relationship status of the main character, married or single, and more to do with the current creative team, big ideas and events, and the hype those storylines can generate.
Big ideas like Superior Spider-Man, Spider-Verse, and CEO Parker can all be done with a single or married Peter. And I would bet anything that sales would go up and down the exact same way in either scenario.