Harsh reviews have not slowed "Batman v Superman" in the early returns at the box office.
[I]Full article [URL=http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/batman-v-superman-hauls-in-82-million-friday]here[/URL].[/I]
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Harsh reviews have not slowed "Batman v Superman" in the early returns at the box office.
[I]Full article [URL=http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/batman-v-superman-hauls-in-82-million-friday]here[/URL].[/I]
Well looks like it's gonna pass that 160 expectation.
I'm not sure calling it a success with fans is accurate, so much as people were going to go see this regardless of what reviews said beforehand. It is a very big movie after all.
I don't think anyone expected a disappointing opening box office weekend, given the amount of hype and expectation. The negative critical response can only curtail the curiosity and novelty factor of BvS so much. However, it could be an indication of how well it will be in the 2nd week and beyond, as negative reviewed films tend to have less repeat viewers and a larger week-to-week box office drop. We'll see next week if BvS can defy that trend.
[QUOTE=EmrysM;1892883]I'm not sure calling it a success with fans is accurate, so much as people were going to go see this regardless of what reviews said beforehand. It is a very big movie after all.[/QUOTE]
Which is why DC could make mediocre movies every year and still make plenty of money. Movie audience's have been trained for years to accept whatever bland mush Big Hollywood pushes. I can't count how many people literally say "It looks like it's going to suck but I'm going anyway because I'm such a huge [insert character name] fan." Which is great for the characters themselves. Not so great for the fans though, imo.
I saw it this morning & thought it was awesome. The 151 running time just flew by. This isn't a Marvel Studios flick & I think that's where the negativity comes in. Thankfully BvS doesn't ride the coat tales of a marvel flick & instead follows its own tone & revisits some elements from Watchmen, & is an excellent sequel to MOS. Haters are gonna hate.
[QUOTE=Iluvitloud1976;1893095]I saw it this morning & thought it was awesome. The 151 running time just flew by. This isn't a Marvel Studios flick & I think that's where the negativity comes in. Thankfully BvS doesn't ride the coat tales of a marvel flick & instead follows its own tone & revisits some elements from Watchmen, & is an excellent sequel to MOS. Haters are gonna hate.[/QUOTE]
I think the negativity comes in not because it isn't a marvel studios flick but because the information being released seems to show that this film doesn't show respect for the comics that spawned the characters, whereas the Marvel films have been very respectful with a few notable exceptions (Mandarin being the biggest one).
I have the exact same sentiments and have said the exact same thing. This movie was never meant to be a light-hearted romp, and if thats what it turned out to be, then everyone would be hating on it saying it was too campy, too corny, etc. It made me think, and thats more than I can say about any Marvel movie that came out in the past few years. And dont get me wrong, I love those movies too. My friend saw it with me and he aint no comic book fan like me, and he loved it. He actually said he would go see it again.
[QUOTE=Iluvitloud1976;1893095]I saw it this morning & thought it was awesome. The 151 running time just flew by. This isn't a Marvel Studios flick & I think that's where the negativity comes in. Thankfully BvS doesn't ride the coat tales of a marvel flick & instead follows its own tone & revisits some elements from Watchmen, & is an excellent sequel to MOS. Haters are gonna hate.[/QUOTE]
Liked the movie but do see the problems. Ideally this would edge out IM3(because didn't like that at all) but the pounding it has taken review wise would cause the WB to get a better director.
Even if this movie has a decay rate of say-Transformers, it will hit the Billion mark. If it follows Man of Steel week to week, I calculated the movie making close to 1.1 Billion. Good news all in all.
Absolutely. One devisive movie should not destroy the industry. It seems to me that people wanted this movie to fail no matter what it was about.
[QUOTE=gbshabo;1893169]Even if this movie has a decay rate of say-Transformers, it will hit the Billion mark. If it follows Man of Steel week to week, I calculated the movie making close to 1.1 Billion. Good news all in all.[/QUOTE]
The problem is, if it does make a billion, then we may see more of this kind of dreck from Snyder directing more DC movies. And that is the last thing I want to see, because I want to see good movies, not just movies people see because they are the first time three characters got together on film.
One weekend isn't going to make this movie a success though, it has to have legs. 180 million opening followed by drops of 50 percent each subsequent weekend would not be good. that would mean it would reach 335 million after four weeks. Not good.
[QUOTE=Phil Clark;1893134]I think the negativity comes in not because it isn't a marvel studios flick but because the information being released seems to show that this film doesn't show respect for the comics that spawned the characters, whereas the Marvel films have been very respectful with a few notable exceptions (Mandarin being the biggest one).[/QUOTE]
Phil, why the crusade? Anything positive where this film is concerned, you come out with guns blazing. If you think Marvel has been "very" respectful, why is Hank Pym not Ant-Man? Why does Marvel neuter their villains? Why are they not interested in pushing a female character?
[QUOTE=Jaylarue;1893177]Absolutely. One decisive movie should not destroy the industry. It seems to me that people wanted this movie to fail no matter what it was about.[/QUOTE]
I think one decision could make a huge difference to the future trajectory of the DC Movie Universe and that is to replace Zack Snyder at the helm with someone who knows about story-telling and character. From David Blaustein at ABC News
"Zack Snyder, to me, is one of the world’s most frustrating directors. He always brings an eye-popping aesthetic to his films, then attempts to force his story to fit that aesthetic, rather than the other way around, which is to let the story drive things. Because of this, what tends to happen in Snyder’s movies is the characters become one-dimensional. They feel more like props than human beings -- or in this case, humanoid aliens. Sure, there are words and feelings but Snyder’s style renders them meaningless. I’m sure, one day, he’ll find a way to marry the two but until he does, his movies will continue to make you feel nothing."
Exactly, Watchmen, Man of Steel Sucker Punch all suffered from this approach. 300 worked because it was never about anything other than US vs Them in battle scenes but beyond the visuals he offers nothing to connect too.
[QUOTE=Phil Clark;1893134]I think the negativity comes in not because it isn't a marvel studios flick but because the information being released seems to show that this film doesn't show respect for the comics that spawned the characters, whereas the Marvel films have been very respectful with a few notable exceptions (Mandarin being the biggest one).[/QUOTE]
It's actually the opposite. Nobody could watch this film and have knowledge of the comics and not be able to pick out literally every comic every scene in this film was inspired by.
Marvel is a lot more willing to let go of the comics and even reinvent if it works. Iron Man being the big one, because I can tell you that RDJ's Iron Man and the comics Iron Man never had the same temperament.
[QUOTE=Calighoula;1893300]Phil, why the crusade? Anything positive where this film is concerned, you come out with guns blazing. If you think Marvel has been "very" respectful, why is Hank Pym not Ant-Man? Why does Marvel neuter their villains? Why are they not interested in pushing a female character?[/QUOTE] Hank Pym hasn't been Ant- Man for a long long time
[QUOTE=shamus;1893307]Hank Pym hasn't been Ant- Man for a long long time[/QUOTE]
That wasn't my point.
Phil, listen
The movie is going to make a shitload of money no matter what happens and the DCU is is going to go ahead.
Those are the facts. Suicide Squad is not going to be pulled. Wonder Woman's already filming and JL films on April 11.
This is going ahead whether you like it or not.
Just saw it.....the film isn't great and its not terrible. I'd give it between a #6-#7 outta a #10 (If 10 was the best). What hurts it is the slow parts with Superman and what is wonky there. Its better than what the critics were busy harping over.
[QUOTE=Calighoula;1893308]That wasn't my point.[/QUOTE]
You asked why Hank Pym was not Ant-man in the Marvel movie. I was speaking to this as not a good example to use to make your point about Marvel movies.
A lot of people are going on line to say that they liked "BvS." I for one, love it, and I've already seen it twice. "BvS" threw the critics a curve ball, because it does not adhere to the Marvel formula of what a superhero film should be like in terms of tone. "BvS" takes itself seriously, and has only subtle humor. It is very tightly plotted, with Lex Luthor as a cunning, criminally insane mastermind who drives the action. I loved Luthor's monologuing on the nature of god. I enjoyed all of the instances of dramatic irony, such as when Luthor tells Bruce Wayne and Clark Kent that he loves "bringing people together," without realizing (perhaps) that he is introducing the men who are Superman and Batman. I thought the conflict between Batman and Superman was cleverly resolved, using a fact that they have in common. I enjoyed the use of music. The use of the line from a Cole Porter song, "Every time we say goodbye I die a little," presages the death of a character (for at least a little while). Wonder Woman's musical theme echoes Led Zepplin's "Immigrant Song," a fitting choice because of the song's aggressive tone and the fact that Wonder Woman is an immigrant to man's world.
[QUOTE=Phil Clark;1893134]I think the negativity comes in not because it isn't a marvel studios flick but because the information being released seems to show that this film doesn't show respect for the comics that spawned the characters, whereas the Marvel films have been very respectful with a few notable exceptions (Mandarin being the biggest one).[/QUOTE]
i just dont agree with any of that.
the movie takes from Superman and Batmans history. throughout. not just regular canon but even elseworlds & the multi-verse. why isn't anyone dwelling on that?
I haven't heard anyone in the comic community saying they are offended by Snyder & Goyer's take on this.
I am stunned by what I read & hear with those who feel offended by this movie. I either hear professional critics who are not part of the comics community or those of the comics community that put up with so many changes in other comics films but not this one. Marvel has a bunch of changes. and i still go to them 2x or 3x. Same with BvS.
I mean there are many changes in the marvel movie universe but so what. They still make for very enjoyable movies.
I was entranced by this flick and didn't feel offended or like I wasted my time. I felt Snyder really appreciated the universe he has been given a chance to oversee.
Honestly , the comic book films have taken liberties with the source material and will continue to do it.
[QUOTE=invasionforce;1893344]A lot of people are going on line to say that they liked "BvS." I for one, love it, and I've already seen it twice. [B]"BvS" threw the critics a curve ball, because it does not adhere to the Marvel formula of what a superhero film should be like in terms of tone. "BvS" takes itself seriously, and has only subtle humor. It is very tightly plotted, with Lex Luthor as a cunning, criminally insane mastermind who drives the action.[/B] I loved Luthor's monologuing on the nature of god. I enjoyed all of the instances of dramatic irony, such as when Luthor tells Bruce Wayne and Clark Kent that he loves "bringing people together," without realizing (perhaps) that he is introducing the men who are Superman and Batman. I thought the conflict between Batman and Superman was cleverly resolved, using a fact that they have in common. I enjoyed the use of music. The use of the line from a Cole Porter song, "Every time we say goodbye I die a little," presages the death of a character (for at least a little while). Wonder Woman's musical theme echoes Led Zepplin's "Immigrant Song," a fitting choice because of the song's aggressive tone and the fact that Wonder Woman is an immigrant to man's world.[/QUOTE]
Word. I appreciate the fact that WB isn't afraid to make their villains irredeemable. Enough with guys with daddy issues like in [I]IM2, Ant-Man, Thor, AoU[/I], etc.!
[QUOTE=Iluvitloud1976;1893095]I saw it this morning & thought it was awesome. The 151 running time just flew by. [B]This isn't a Marvel Studios flick & I think that's where the negativity comes in.[/B] Thankfully BvS doesn't ride the coat tales of a marvel flick & instead follows its own tone & revisits some elements from Watchmen, & is an excellent sequel to MOS. Haters are gonna hate.[/QUOTE]
Then how do we explain the higher RT score for Nolan's Batman trilogy?
[QUOTE=Charlie Rock;1893459]Then how do we explain the higher RT score for Nolan's Batman trilogy?[/QUOTE]
Because those are better movies. No one is saying that BvS is a masterpiece
[QUOTE=SUPERECWFAN1;1893314]Just saw it.....the film isn't great and its not terrible. I'd give it between a #6-#7 outta a #10 (If 10 was the best). What hurts it is the slow parts with Superman and what is wonky there. Its better than what the critics were busy harping over.[/QUOTE]
Also the lighting was too dark when they fought + the fact they were moving fast.
Edit:When they fought Doomsday.
[QUOTE=eckesg1;1893501][B]Because those are better movies. [/B]No one is saying that BvS is a masterpiece[/QUOTE]
No one said Nolan's were either. A Fresh rating merely is indicative that the movie was at least 'average'. And my response was concerning the issue of Marvel vs DC. I applied that logic to earlier Batman movies and now feel given the evidence that this is not the case.
Edit: Highlighted the cause of the problem. Everything else is just measuring by degrees.
[QUOTE=invasionforce;1893344]A lot of people are going on line to say that they liked "BvS." I for one, love it, and I've already seen it twice. "BvS" threw the critics a curve ball, because it does not adhere to the Marvel formula of what a superhero film should be like in terms of tone. "BvS" takes itself seriously, and has only subtle humor. It is very tightly plotted, with Lex Luthor as a cunning, criminally insane mastermind who drives the action. I loved Luthor's monologuing on the nature of god. I enjoyed all of the instances of dramatic irony, such as when Luthor tells Bruce Wayne and Clark Kent that he loves "bringing people together," without realizing (perhaps) that he is introducing the men who are Superman and Batman. I thought the conflict between Batman and Superman was cleverly resolved, using a fact that they have in common. I enjoyed the use of music. The use of the line from a Cole Porter song, "Every time we say goodbye I die a little," presages the death of a character (for at least a little while). Wonder Woman's musical theme echoes Led Zepplin's "Immigrant Song," a fitting choice because of the song's aggressive tone and the fact that Wonder Woman is an immigrant to man's world.[/QUOTE]
Co-sign. I haven't read any reviews and I stayed spoiler free so I walked into BvS on Thursday night not knowing the details of the "professional" critics' opinions (though I did see headlines like the one here in CBR indicating critics not just disliking but seemingly despising the movie). But I saw it for the third time today, and I really love BvS. It has a great operatic feel to it and the bigger than life qualities that make DC so great came across the screen very well. I enjoy the Marvel flicks too but I don't read their books and find their characters on a whole pedestrian compared to DC's properties. All I know is my childhood dreams of seeing the Trinity in live action on the big screen, which I thought would never come true, are now a reality.
Now, if only WONDER WOMAN were being released sooner!
[QUOTE=invasionforce;1893344]A lot of people are going on line to say that they liked "BvS." I for one, love it, and I've already seen it twice. "BvS" threw the critics a curve ball, because it does not adhere to the Marvel formula of what a superhero film should be like in terms of tone. [/QUOTE]
And again we can look at Nolan's Batman trilogy with their much higher RT ratings and see that there is not some Marvel standard that critics are using for Superhero movies. That is just illogical.
Who gives a flip about Rotten Tomatoes?
Swear to god it's like some comic fans need external validation about their likes and dislikes. It's a good, good film, just like some (but not all) of the Marvel films are good, good films. Both companies take liberties with the source material, and both are entertaining.
So sick of this DC vs. Marvel bs at this point. And even sicker of Rotten Tomatoes.
I thoroughly enjoyed the film. My wife went along, and she is no comic book fan, and she thought it was great popcorn flick - that's pretty high praise from a person who thinks that most superhero movies are just awful. Anyways, I think the characters were written pretty well, and I thought Ben Affleck killed it as Batman and Bruce Wayne. Way better than Christian Bale's throat cancer take on the Batman, IMHO. I was worried going in that the movie might disappoint, but I was very pleased to see that this was not to be the case. Favorite sequence - Batman taking out the goons holding Martha Kent hostage. Now THAT is what Batman should look like in a fight! Looking forward to the next DCU films - I liked this better than most of the Marvel Films.
[QUOTE=Phil Clark;1893280]The problem is, if it does make a billion, then we may see more of this kind of dreck from Snyder directing more DC movies. And that is the last thing I want to see, because I want to see good movies, not just movies people see because they are the first time three characters got together on film.
One weekend isn't going to make this movie a success though, it has to have legs. 180 million opening followed by drops of 50 percent each subsequent weekend would not be good. that would mean it would reach 335 million after four weeks. Not good.[/QUOTE]
Actually, no. your math doesn't factor in daily box office- Monday-thursday
I hope it dominates the box office. Just cause.
[QUOTE=Iluvitloud1976;1893095]I saw it this morning & thought it was awesome. The 151 running time just flew by. This isn't a Marvel Studios flick & I think that's where the negativity comes in. Thankfully BvS doesn't ride the coat tales of a marvel flick & instead follows its own tone & revisits some elements from Watchmen, & is an excellent sequel to MOS. Haters are gonna hate.[/QUOTE]
No, the negativity comes from the fact that this is a grimdark movie about one of the brightest, optimistic characters in comics. No one cares that it isn't a Marvel flick. The same people who loved the upbeat, fun Iron Man [I]also[/I] loved the much darker The Dark Knight. And the reason people love both is because both were coherent stories about characters with clear motivations and it stayed true to the spirit of the source material. That can't be said about BvS.
You cited the problem here—it revisits some elements from Watchmen. Superman is not Dr. Manhattan and Batman is not Rorschach. By taking cues from those characters in portraying Superman and Batman, Snyder is betraying the source material. More than that, it's not "following its own tone." If it were, then you'd see a Batman who is a grim vigilante but still has one rule he won't violate and you'd see a Superman who is the epitome of heroism. You'd see a clear contrast between the two characters. But BvS doesn't follow its own tone—instead, it just apes the tired, old grimdark formula that most of us outgrew along with adolescence.
[QUOTE=Calighoula;1893300]Phil, why the crusade? Anything positive where this film is concerned, you come out with guns blazing. If you think Marvel has been "very" respectful, why is Hank Pym not Ant-Man? Why does Marvel neuter their villains? Why are they not interested in pushing a female character?[/QUOTE]
A) In the movies, Hank Pym [I]was[/I] Ant-Man early in his career, then he passed on the identity to Scott Lang. How is that not respectful to what happened in the comics?
B) I don't see any neutering going on. But if you think a bizarre motivation about "daddy beat me and God never helped so now I want to kill Superman" makes a good villain, then we're never going to see eye to eye on this.
C) Jessica Jones has gotten a second season. Captain Marvel is getting her own movie. Black Widow continues to be one of the most central Avengers. Mockingbird is going to be at the center of a new TV show. The next Ant-Man movie is titled Ant-Man and the Wasp, which means Wasp is going to be sharing the spotlight. DC's got the Supergirl TV show and a Wonder Woman movie. So how is DC doing better than Marvel?
[QUOTE=Jack Lantern;1893409]i just dont agree with any of that.
the movie takes from Superman and Batmans history. throughout. not just regular canon but even elseworlds & the multi-verse. why isn't anyone dwelling on that?
I haven't heard anyone in the comic community saying they are offended by Snyder & Goyer's take on this.
I am stunned by what I read & hear with those who feel offended by this movie. I either hear professional critics who are not part of the comics community or those of the comics community that put up with so many changes in other comics films but not this one. Marvel has a bunch of changes. and i still go to them 2x or 3x. Same with BvS.
I mean there are many changes in the marvel movie universe but so what. They still make for very enjoyable movies.
I was entranced by this flick and didn't feel offended or like I wasted my time. I felt Snyder really appreciated the universe he has been given a chance to oversee.[/QUOTE]
It throws random elements from Superman and Batman's history, yes. But it ignores the core essence of both characters and just throws all these moments at the screen even though they do not work together in the least.
Second, if you haven't heard anyone in the comic community criticizing this movie, then you haven't even been paying attention to this very forum.
We put up with changes in the movies, but there's a world of difference between making superficial changes like Wolverine not being short or Nick Fury being black and completely reversing the character's personalities and ethics. When the comic book Superman has a history of being inspiring and working within the system and not killing and then the movie Superman spends his time being a dark, brooding vigilante who has no problems with casual murder, then that's not a superficial change.
[QUOTE=SUPERECWFAN1;1893418]Honestly , the comic book films have taken liberties with the source material and will continue to do it.[/QUOTE]
Not like this. Taking liberties are fine, as long as the core of the character is still intact. That's why the Marvel films work. It didn't matter that Tony Stark was captured in Afghanistan instead of Vietnam. It didn't matter that Bucky was a fellow soldier and not Cap's costumed sidekick. It didn't matter that Banner transformed into the Hulk because he was trying to recreate the Super Soldier Serum instead of being caught in a gamma bomb explosion. It didn't matter that Thor and Donald Blake didn't share a body. It didn't matter that Hawkeye has a family or that Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch were experiments instead of mutants or that Black Widow didn't have a Russian accent.
What matters is that the core of the characters is there.
BvS completely spits on the core of the characters. Snyder is so enamored of the grimdark aesthetic of Watchmen (to the point that he completely missed the meaning of that damn book) that he just slaps that on every single hero. So he turns these two classic heroes into violent sociopaths just because. Batman and Superman are heroic. Sadistman and Mopeman are not.
[QUOTE=Ishmael;1893764]Who gives a flip about Rotten Tomatoes?
Swear to god it's like some comic fans need external validation about their likes and dislikes. It's a good, good film, just like some (but not all) of the Marvel films are good, good films. Both companies take liberties with the source material, and both are entertaining.
So sick of this DC vs. Marvel bs at this point. And even sicker of Rotten Tomatoes.[/QUOTE]
RT keeps being brought up because people like you keep pushing nonsense like, "oh, the only people hating this are people who hate any comic movies that aren't Marvel!" This isn't a Marvel vs DC thing. This is about quality vs crap.
[QUOTE=Phil Clark;1893280]The problem is, if it does make a billion, then we may see more of this kind of dreck from Snyder directing more DC movies. And that is the last thing I want to see, because I want to see good movies, not just movies people see because they are the first time three characters got together on film.
One weekend isn't going to make this movie a success though, it has to have legs. 180 million opening followed by drops of 50 percent each subsequent weekend would not be good. that would mean it would reach 335 million after four weeks. Not good.[/QUOTE] I dont know Phil. You are looking at well over 200 million before even next weekend hits. Lets say a 50 percent drop. You are talking probably 300 million by next sunday. Its already made 200 million worldwide. In one day.
[QUOTE=eckesg1;1893501]Because those are better movies. No one is saying that BvS is a masterpiece[/QUOTE]
I'll say it. BvS is a goddamn masterpiece!
[QUOTE=Charlie Rock;1893564]No one said Nolan's were either. A Fresh rating merely is indicative that the movie was at least 'average'.[/QUOTE]
The Dark Knight is the highest rated superhero movie in recent memory.
[QUOTE=Perry;1894039]RT keeps being brought up because people like you keep pushing nonsense like, "oh, the only people hating this are people who hate any comic movies that aren't Marvel!" This isn't a Marvel vs DC thing. This is about quality vs crap.[/QUOTE]
No, this is exactly a Marvel vs DC thing. Whenever a critic says the movie's "Not fun" I roll my eyes.
Dance off bro ... you and me. Or is that we need to go have falafels? Or do we need to minimize the destruction of three helicarriers in downtown Washington by telling elected officials that they won't prosecute us because they "need" us, right before we swagger out of the room? I can't figure out which is more appropriate in the wake of the threat of world wide destruction.
BvS takes seriously what it would be like to have these characters in our midst. And they STILL act heroically, even if they're not making smart-assed jokes. So I disagree with the whole thing that Snyder spits on the characters. He's actually given us a story that takes seriously what would happened if individuals like this existed.
People loved Kingdom Come. Yet they won't accept this. Whatever.
[QUOTE=Calighoula;1893445]Word. I appreciate the fact that WB isn't afraid to make their villains irredeemable. [B]Enough with guys with daddy issues [/B]like in [I]IM2, Ant-Man, Thor, AoU[/I], etc.![/QUOTE]
Um, Luthor's like that in BvS, too.