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[QUOTE=Robanker;4201947]DC gets this mad idea every so often that "you're only as good as your villain," to which I'm eternally perplexed. One of the most celebrated moments in Superman's 80 year history is hugging a distraught teen and reassuring her not to commit suicide. Where's the villain?
I don't know. I like to think superhero comics haven't just devolved into a mess where it's just two armies of super characters in silly costumes thinking about how to bedevil one another, but it really has. I'm glad that Snyder's Legion of Doom actually has a goal in mind, and if that's the focus of this initiative, well alright... But I am sick to death of villains existing solely to mess with their counterpart (looking at you, Joker). Moreover, elevating villains to the forefront kind of makes your heroes look like chumps if it gets harder and harder for them to stop their criminal opposites.
tl;dr
Never cared for villain spotlights and this hasn't sweetened it.[/QUOTE]
I have to agree.
I call it the WWF mentality:
Heroes are 'power ranked', interactions with non-costumed characters is very limited, relationships are only with other costumed characters, relatives are often costumed characters also, private lives are downplayed, and there's been a push to ignore secret identities and regular jobs.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;4202035]And repeatedly calling something trash doesn't make it trash.
We get it. You've never liked Superman and Wonder Woman outside of the New 52. You've made it clear you barely read any of their comics outside the New 52 (yet seem to feel that makes you an expert on what they were like and whether or not they were interesting).
However, it doesn't mean those characters were badly written. Sometimes, something just isn't for other people. If you liked the New 52 versions of Wonder Woman and Superman, great. Live in your own bliss. But don't think it makes you special or that it makes any other version that you dislike inferior because they aren't those versions.[/QUOTE]
Theres also the fact (not opinion) that N52 tanked sales wise after the initial wave.
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D C was tanking well before New 52
The rise and fall of New 52 just
ushered in the current D C and Marvel way
of launching new series and cancelling them
just as quickly so they can solicit the next
wave of new series.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;4202035]And repeatedly calling something trash doesn't make it trash.
We get it. You've never liked Superman and Wonder Woman outside of the New 52. You've made it clear you barely read any of their comics outside the New 52 (yet seem to feel that makes you an expert on what they were like and whether or not they were interesting).
However, it doesn't mean those characters were badly written. Sometimes, something just isn't for other people. If you liked the New 52 versions of Wonder Woman and Superman, great. Live in your own bliss. [B]But don't think it makes you special or that it makes any other version that you dislike inferior because they aren't those versions[/B].[/QUOTE]
I've tried, several times, to read their older comics.
I find them atrociously bad, either in style or stories. I don't see why I couldn't call them for what they are : boring stories, with boring characters.
I also find hilarious that you would say the part in bold, when Rebirther are always shat on New 52's versions, and push the bullshit that it tanked sales wise when Rebirth would do so great. Which is hardly the case, after what, two years and a half ?
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DC dropped the Rebirth branding months ago. So whatever their gains or losses in the last several months are they have nothing to do with Rebirth.
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And New 52 is dead, lets get over it now.
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[QUOTE=MajorHoy;4201095]Why did you use my comment about preferring Jurgens' pre-Bendis story as your excuse to continue to rant and rave about how terrible Bendis has been?
I dropped the [I][FONT=Century Gothic][COLOR="#0000CD"][B]Superman[/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/I] books right after [U][COLOR="#FF0000"][B]Action[/B][/COLOR][/U] [U][COLOR="#FF0000"][B]Comics[/B][/COLOR][/U] #[U][COLOR="#FF0000"][B]1000[/B][/COLOR][/U]![/QUOTE]
I wasn't ranting & raving. An unfair comment. Was explaining why I feel that Bendis Isn't handling the characters as good as Jurgen's & others and to refute that it isn't't just the nostalgia factor. I used the phrase 'beg to differ' as your opinion is just as valid as mine. It makes for an interesting discussion I thought. However with your confrontational attitude with that provocative phrase, I no longer wish to discuss with you. Goodbye.
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More rumoured details. There may be two-page prologues to the event co-written by Scott Snyder and Brian Micheal Bendis that will appear in the books
[url]https://www.bleedingcool.com/2019/02/16/how-the-year-of-the-villain-will-infect-the-dc-universe/[/url]
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[QUOTE=Korath;4202032]And you liking them does, perhaps ?
No, it doesn't. It's not because more people like utter trash, that it isn't trash.[/QUOTE]
There was plenty of trash with the New 52 Superman and Wonder Woman. I think Morrison's Action run is far better than anything that was coming out immediately prior or since, but it still lines up pretty well with All-Star (a story I know you hate) because it's written by the same author about the same character. And other things in the New 52 Superman era were hardly stellar. I think the way they moved away from it was stupid as shit and don't much like what came after, but aside from Morrison, there's not a lot to write home about.
Azzarello's WW is pretty much the only thing good related to WW in that era. And even then, it's down to Diana herself and the art. Everything surrounding her was either under developed or embarrassingly bad and misses the entire point of Wonder Woman and reinforces the cliches her story was meant to subvert. If many people think it smells like trash, they're gonna call it trash.
Rebirth also did well sales wise. Moving away from the stuff they set up with Rebirth seems to have resulted in issues, not the agenda behind Rebirth itself. Setting up Wally West as a major player and then sidelining him and killing him is, unsurprisingly, not going well.
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[QUOTE=MajorHoy;4196179]Is this some sort of [B][I][FONT=Comic Sans MS]Son of Forever Evil[/FONT][/I][/B] deal? :confused:[/QUOTE]
Lmao. xD
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Didn't DC already do this only a few years ago, during the 'Forever Evil' arc? That year was spent highlighting villains each month. At the time, I found it was very bad. It looks like they are out of ideas and are returning to the trough again. Focusing on villains because of a tie in event (Forever Evil / Legion of Doom) is not my cup of tea.
I've never read comics for the villains; I've always wanted to see what situations our heroes find them in and how to overcome it.
Comics (DC and Marvel) both seem to be trending towards making the villains much more in the forefront, and making everything seem dark and dire. I get that its difficult to generate stories for heroes that have been around for decades, but surely there are better stories than making the villains 'more evil' and more of a threat?
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My only question is that how much is the year of the villain instead of year of the Bat villain. The primary antagonists seem to be Batman Who Laughs, Talia/Leviathan, Bane and Legion of Doom led by Lex but will likely focus on Joker as well given that its Snyder doing the writing for the JL.
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[QUOTE=Robanker;4201947]DC gets this mad idea every so often that "you're only as good as your villain," to which I'm eternally perplexed. One of the most celebrated moments in Superman's 80 year history is hugging a distraught teen and reassuring her not to commit suicide. Where's the villain?
I don't know. I like to think superhero comics haven't just devolved into a mess where it's just two armies of super characters in silly costumes thinking about how to bedevil one another, but it really has. I'm glad that Snyder's Legion of Doom actually has a goal in mind, and if that's the focus of this initiative, well alright... But I am sick to death of villains existing solely to mess with their counterpart (looking at you, Joker). Moreover, elevating villains to the forefront kind of makes your heroes look like chumps if it gets harder and harder for them to stop their criminal opposites.
tl;dr
Never cared for villain spotlights and this hasn't sweetened it.[/QUOTE]
This.
Plus, I am sick of events. I hate them. You will have great books that are in the middle of great stories, but those will have to be interrupted for the event.
I miss super heroes who were doing heroic things and helping people. Now all we have are reactionary super-chumps who are always on the run from their enemies. It's stupid and boring.
DC editors and writers should read Astro City's G-Dog storyline to get an idea of what a super hero should be. Or just read Astro City in general to see how a good comic book writer tells a story.
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[QUOTE=Armor of God;4202103]And New 52 is dead, lets get over it now.[/QUOTE]I don't know if they have / are going to just erase everything from the [I][B][FONT=Comic Sans MS]New52[/FONT][/B][/I]. Are they just suddenly going to re-age all of the characters that were de-aged for the [I][B][FONT=Comic Sans MS]New52[/FONT][/B][/I]? Are all the new characters introduced during the [I][B][FONT=Comic Sans MS]New52[/FONT][/B][/I] just suddenly going to disappear from stories (both future and past)? :confused:
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I'm disappointed that Batman Who Laughs will apparently survive his miniseries; I really don't want him to stick around and be cheapened even more than he already is. Especially with how Last Knight on Earth is coming out this year, it won't feel right to have a Snyder creation running around and not have that loose end be tied. But I guess DC can't kill their new golden goose now. I also hope that Bane's already-convoluted master plan doesn't engulf the rest of the superheroes, as foreshadowed at the end of the recent Batman/Flash crossover; he's not on that threat level. Looking forward to the Leviathan, Cheetah, and Luthor stories though.
