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[QUOTE=PCN24454;5129441]I'm happy to that getting a job as a teacher is the most basic qualification for being a "nice guy".[/QUOTE]
It is the fact that he became a genuine mentor and role model to his students. The same couldn't have been said about the other teachers at his school.
JMS Spider-Man reminds me a lot of my social-work coach while I was struggling in school.
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[QUOTE=PCN24454;5129441]I'm happy to that getting a job as a teacher is the most basic qualification for being a "nice guy".[/QUOTE]
Come on, you knew what he meant. What's the hangup with this run? Why is it making you so abrasive?
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[QUOTE=WebSlingWonder;5129478]Come on, you knew what he meant. What's the hangup with this run? Why is it making you so abrasive?[/QUOTE]
It's just an overrated and over-romanticized trait. It feels like people only really cared about it when he lost it.
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[QUOTE=PCN24454;5129481]It's just an overrated and over-romanticized trait. It feels like people only really cared about it when he lost it.[/QUOTE]
Peter being a science teacher was the best of both worlds; he was using his science and was able to mentor and teach kids to apply themselves. What is wrong with that? I believe it was the natural evolution of his character.
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I didn't bash him at all or trying to be cool, I just wanted to share my thoughts on a controversial author (as you admitted). I even said he is a talented writer and I appreciate both Coming Home and Back in Black! I actually forgot about The Conversation, that is a great story definitely. I don't rate the 9/11 story because I don't like it that much and I think it's very different from any other story. About The Book of Ezekiel, I think that mystic things and spider-demons are not what Spider-Man is USUALLY about. Everyone loves Spidey because he is a normal guy with a normal life dealing with superheroes problems, so introducing other worlds and the idea of him being a chosen one is off to me.
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OMD and Sins Past are obviously shameful stories and I've never seen anyone defending them because they are not redeemable. The ideas behind these pieces of trash are so out of character and focus that whoever had them is clearly not a fan of Spider-Man and/or doesn't know a single thing about Peter Parker, Gwen Stacy and Mary Jane Watson.
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[QUOTE=TheCape;5129245]Is a solid run, i like the focus in Peter, MJ and May and althougth the Spider-Totem stuff was weird, i did enjoy it, mostly because the book really needed something different at the time and the way that it was handled during the JRJ era was fine for me, until The Other anyway. Still has some weird stuff that make me raise my eyebrows, but it is a solid expirience.[/QUOTE]
I agree. JMS went in to some different territory with his issues. The Daily Bugle cast and past villains (except for Doc Ock) weren't there with more of a focus on Pete, MJ, Aunt May and JMS' mysterious and out there characters (Aside from Morlun and Shathra, I don't think we've seen much of Digger, Charlie Wiederman Molten Man, the other Doctor Octopus, or that thief that could enter the astral plane or be intangible or whatever). There was a good focus on the core characters and I'm appreciative that JMS brought Pete and MJ back together as a loving couple. Plus, damn, the art on those issues were (no pun intended) amazing. After those lackluster years during Bryne/Mackie when Spidey wouldn't have a good fight scene, you suddenly had Spider-Man being flippy, punchy, kicking, and spider-webby against all these villains. It felt action packed, in both JRJr AND Deodato's runs.
As for the stories, they were solid. They were punctuated with some really emotional and poignant moments. There were emotional reckonings b/w Pete and MJ and Pete and Aunt May. There were mentor moments with Pete as the teacher (I remember that one scene where the world is going crazy and Pete runs out to fight it. However, a student stops him on the street and asks for help with homework. And Pete takes the time to help with that homework. Because that's Peter Parker. And as a teacher myself, I can relate.)
But a lot of them were just solid. What i mean is, they were entertaining, be kinda predictable. Reading part one of the story, I could tell where part three was going to end up. If you watch an episode of JMS's run on Ghostbusters, or some episodes of Babylon 5, you can catch this pattern. Same thing with JMS jokes. Yes, he was quippy, but kinda eye-rolling. I think back to one scene where there's a news broadcast that shows past footage of Spider-Man trying to stop Galactus. And Spidey is just comically hanging on to Galactus' boot and screaming for dear life. I felt that was cliche.
So ultimately, JMS' run was a good, solid, satisfying run. Good solid stories and action. Some occasions of surprise.
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Oh yeah, forgot one thing. Now, JMS and Romita's works could be great. Like the fight scenes where Pete is REALLY struggling (like the one featuring Morlun or during Spider-Man #498 - 500) those are really good moments. You could see Spidey's unending spirit in those stories. I often quote "Great power. Great responsibility. And a great left hook," because that is a pretty badass line.
My only complaint with the Morlun fight was when Pete and Ezekiel tag team. There's a narration there that states how Pete fighting with someone who fights just like him is a totally different experience. Uhhhhh, really? All those times Pete and Ben Reilly teamed up don't count? As a Ben Reilly fan, yeah, miffed with that.
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[QUOTE=Laufeyson;5129283]To me it feels like he really writing Peter and MJ kind like they aged them too old and write them in a very weird 'sophisticated' way.[/quote]
So according to you anyone writing in a sophisticated way makes those characters sound old? Isn't it just the case that JMS writes that way?
And in any case...Peter Parker's a science student who came to college on scholarship and is quite brilliant. Mary Jane Watson is an artistic woman who studied psychology and loves theater and film. So of course both of them would sound sophisticated.
[quote] Like I think it's the best shown in the first issues that he ever wrote which is his The Amazing Spider-Man Vol. 2 issue number 30 with how he destroyed a building just to vent his anger. That's a very weird moment for Spidey. I mean the guy just vent all out without caring because he wanted to pound a bad guy. Wow.[/quote]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]100352[/ATTACH]
Wow, indeed. You totally misread the scene and moment.
In that scene, Spider-Man goes out to vent a building that is revealed in the following panel to be a "condemned" abandoned building scheduled for a controlled demolition. In the scene right after on the next day, a construction foreman calls out the boys for a hard day only for the building to fall down thanks to Spidey...and he says jubilantly, "lunch". Spider-Man vented his frustrations and also provided help to construction workers at the same time.
[quote]To me, that is not how Spider-Man deals with that kind of thing, he will deal it in a more silly way. [/quote]
Yes we all know how in "The Kid Who Collected Spider-Man", Peter Parker dealt with a kid in a cancer ward with trademark silliness. No siree, he just came and did silly stuff to some kid dying before his time, cruelly having his life shortened with nothing in Peter's, or anyone's, power to help him. Absolutely no precedent for this in 616 Spider-Man at all.
Nothing JMS did in his run with his characterization and portrayal is at all inconsistent with what came before.
[QUOTE=federicodettofred;5129531]About The Book of Ezekiel, I think that mystic things and spider-demons are not what Spider-Man is USUALLY about.[/quote]
Well there aren't actually spider-demons in that story. Just a giant spider.
[quote]Everyone loves Spidey because he is a normal guy with a normal life dealing with superheroes problems, so introducing other worlds and the idea of him being a chosen one is off to me.[/QUOTE]
Being a chosen of the Spider-Totem doesn't mean that Peter Parker has some destiny or anything, it merely emphasizes that Peter is the character who will always be persecuted by powerful people and he has the spider will escape, defy, and beguile them. Nothing fundamental was subtracted from Spider-Man by JMS, he just added to stuff that's already there.
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[B][U]Is JMS run actually THAT good? [/U][/B]
Not for me. Not even close.
Sins Past has to be the worst comic book story I ever had the misfortune of reading.
The rest of the run wasn't all that good either.
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[QUOTE=Tien Long;5129539]I agree. JMS went in to some different territory with his issues. The Daily Bugle cast and past villains (except for Doc Ock) weren't there with more of a focus on Pete, MJ, Aunt May and JMS' mysterious and out there characters (Aside from Morlun and Shathra, I don't think we've seen much of Digger, Charlie Wiederman Molten Man, the other Doctor Octopus, or that thief that could enter the astral plane or be intangible or whatever). There was a good focus on the core characters and I'm appreciative that JMS brought Pete and MJ back together as a loving couple. Plus, damn, the art on those issues were (no pun intended) amazing. After those lackluster years during Bryne/Mackie when Spidey wouldn't have a good fight scene, you suddenly had Spider-Man being flippy, punchy, kicking, and spider-webby against all these villains. It felt action packed, in both JRJr AND Deodato's runs.
As for the stories, they were solid. They were punctuated with some really emotional and poignant moments. There were emotional reckonings b/w Pete and MJ and Pete and Aunt May. There were mentor moments with Pete as the teacher (I remember that one scene where the world is going crazy and Pete runs out to fight it. However, a student stops him on the street and asks for help with homework. And Pete takes the time to help with that homework. Because that's Peter Parker. And as a teacher myself, I can relate.)
But a lot of them were just solid. What i mean is, they were entertaining, be kinda predictable. Reading part one of the story, I could tell where part three was going to end up. If you watch an episode of JMS's run on Ghostbusters, or some episodes of Babylon 5, you can catch this pattern. Same thing with JMS jokes. Yes, he was quippy, but kinda eye-rolling. I think back to one scene where there's a news broadcast that shows past footage of Spider-Man trying to stop Galactus. And Spidey is just comically hanging on to Galactus' boot and screaming for dear life. I felt that was cliche.
So ultimately, JMS' run was a good, solid, satisfying run. Good solid stories and action. Some occasions of surprise.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Tien Long;5129544]Oh yeah, forgot one thing. Now, JMS and Romita's works could be great. Like the fight scenes where Pete is REALLY struggling (like the one featuring Morlun or during Spider-Man #498 - 500) those are really good moments. You could see Spidey's unending spirit in those stories. I often quote "Great power. Great responsibility. And a great left hook," because that is a pretty badass line.
My only complaint with the Morlun fight was when Pete and Ezekiel tag team. There's a narration there that states how Pete fighting with someone who fights just like him is a totally different experience. Uhhhhh, really? All those times Pete and Ben Reilly teamed up don't count? As a Ben Reilly fan, yeah, miffed with that.[/QUOTE]
Agreed, except I didn't see those cliché moments you were talking about. And yeah, the Spidey/Ezekiel/Morlun fight was interesting with Peter's narration; I basically took it as the series getting away from "Clone Saga".
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[QUOTE=WebSlingWonder;5129568]Agreed, except I didn't see those cliché moments you were talking about. And yeah, the Spidey/Ezekiel/Morlun fight was interesting with Peter's narration; I basically took it as the series getting away from "Clone Saga".[/QUOTE]
It wouldn't be surprised if "get away from the Clone Saga" was an editorial mandate back then :D
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[QUOTE=Tien Long;5129539] Plus, damn, the art on those issues were (no pun intended) amazing. After those lackluster years during Bryne/Mackie when Spidey wouldn't have a good fight scene, you suddenly had Spider-Man being flippy, punchy, kicking, and spider-webby against all these villains. It felt action packed, in both JRJr AND Deodato's runs.[/quote]
The art of the JRJR run is in my opinion the most beautiful the titles have ever looked. The coloring is richer and JRJR gets so much right in that. It's not as radical as MacFarlane or as elegant and weird as Ditko's, or have the lush city-landscapes of Ross Andru but it's great.
[quote]
So ultimately, JMS' run was a good, solid, satisfying run. Good solid stories and action. Some occasions of surprise.[/QUOTE]
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[QUOTE=TheCape;5129571]It wouldn't be surprised if "get away from the Clone Saga" was an editorial mandate back then :D[/QUOTE]
Ha! Very, very true.
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[QUOTE=Revolutionary_Jack;5129573]The art of the JRJR run is in my opinion the most beautiful the titles have ever looked. The coloring is richer and JRJR gets so much right in that. It's not as radical as MacFarlane or as elegant and weird as Ditko's, or have the lush city-landscapes of Ross Andru but it's great.[/QUOTE]
Co-signed! Romita Jr. was, for a long time, my favorite Spider-Man artist because of this run.