The only character I see woke feminists being happy about is Arya. Because she's independent with no kids, and she's basically belong in the Assassin's Creed world now.
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The only character I see woke feminists being happy about is Arya. Because she's independent with no kids, and she's basically belong in the Assassin's Creed world now.
[QUOTE=Madam-Shogun-Assassin;4342984]The only character I see woke feminists being happy about is Arya. Because she's independent with no kids, and she's basically belong in the Assassin's Creed world now.[/QUOTE]
It's weird that anyone ever tried to claim that this show had a feminist angle to it. While it does do a better job of showing women as nuanced and three dimensional than most fantasy productions, at the end of the day they are still living in a male-dominated society and must adapt to survive, which often means stifling their ambitions and relying on treachery and deception to get their way. Even with Arya, the show gave us plenty of reminders that little girls trying to engage in sword play usually get smacked down pretty quickly, it's only with these cheat code superpowers and plenty of plot contrivances that she has been able to pull off her recent feats.
[QUOTE=PwrdOn;4343019]It's weird that anyone ever tried to claim that this show had a feminist angle to it. While it does do a better job of showing women as nuanced and three dimensional than most fantasy productions, at the end of the day they are still living in a male-dominated society and must adapt to survive, which often means stifling their ambitions and relying on treachery and deception to get their way. Even with Arya, the show gave us plenty of reminders that little girls trying to engage in sword play usually get smacked down pretty quickly, it's only with these cheat code superpowers and plenty of plot contrivances that she has been able to pull off her recent feats.[/QUOTE]
It's complicated, progress in terms of good quality female representation has only recently started to get better. So shows like GoT stick out like a sore thumb. Nature of the beast and all that.
[QUOTE=PwrdOn;4343019]It's weird that anyone ever tried to claim that this show had a feminist angle to it. While it does do a better job of showing women as nuanced and three dimensional than most fantasy productions, at the end of the day they are still living in a male-dominated society and must adapt to survive, which often means stifling their ambitions and relying on treachery and deception to get their way. Even with Arya, the show gave us plenty of reminders that little girls trying to engage in sword play usually get smacked down pretty quickly, it's only with these cheat code superpowers and plenty of plot contrivances that she has been able to pull off her recent feats.[/QUOTE]
In the least, you can argue that the two primary people vying for control of Westeros, Cersi and Dany, are female. They're the two power players in the game right now. That whole perspective might be severely undercut if Jon sort of swoops in from behind to take the throne but we'll see.
[QUOTE=MindofShadow;4342726]Actors get sick of doing the same thing after awhile. Expecially huge projects that prevent other projects.
Ditto with directors. DD have star wars stuff coming out sooner or later for instance.
It is obvious it isn't purely HBO's doing. Considering they have prequels in various stages right now. l[/QUOTE]
I agree, I'm just curious what the impetus was. I think it's doing damage to the show's legacy that it can't nail the landing.
[QUOTE=Emperor-of-Dragons;4342888]It still rubbed alot of female viewers the wrong way. Added to the fact they think GoT just fridged it's sole black female character, and turned Brienne into a blubbering mess over Jamie, and made Dani into a cliched trope about mad queens. I'm not saying I agree with the criticisms, but the optics don't look good.[/QUOTE]
Ned got fridged, Robb and Catelyn got fridged, Barristan got fridged, Theon/Beric/Jorah all got fridged last episode. Missendai is probably the least important character to get fridged. Brienne loving Jamie is something that's been teased since season 3/4 and she's someone whose never been accepted or had affection. It makes sense character wise. And I don't even want to get into Dany. This is something most people saw a mile away
[QUOTE=Madam-Shogun-Assassin;4343027]It's complicated, progress in terms of good quality female representation has only recently started to get better. So shows like GoT stick out like a sore thumb. Nature of the beast and all that.[/QUOTE]
It's just odd that fans conflated a show trying to depict women somewhat realistically with it having some kind of pro-woman message, when that couldn't be farther from the truth. The thing that these fans seem to miss is that most of the women in the show, just like most influential women in real life, only care about increasing their own power and social status and couldn't care less about improving the condition of women generally. Indeed most of them seem to bemoan the fact that they were born female, since they could have accomplished their goals much more easily had they been men, and show nothing but disdain for the silly birds who don't care about seizing power or kicking ass and just want to play dress up and dream about knights in shining armor all day.
Wondering if The Hound and Arya are gonna double team the Mountain. Arya isnt also gonna take out Cersie after the night king. So either she dies trying on Cersie or maybe her and the Hound tag team his brother. Feel like it will very poetic for The Hound to die by sacraficing himself to take out his brother by Fire. Could be just holding him still while the Dragon burns the both or some Oil get involved and he tells Arya to shoot them with a burning arrow. But yea just think that's the most poetic way for the Hound to go out by fire taking his brother with him.
D&D are just not good as good at writing female characters as GRRM is, and most of the first seasons was originally GRRM's writing.
"Oh it's because it's a medieval world so it's just.." Yeah yeah. Except that the Sansa rape storyline wasn't in the books, the showrunners created it themselves. They also got a completely consensual sex scene from the books(Cersei and Jamie in Joffrey's funeral) and made it look like rape. Same for Dany/Drogo's first time all the way back to the pilot. And now, they think that writing all women as super petty and bitchy is writing ~strong female characters~ and that "rape made me stronger" is a good narrative.
[QUOTE=Wiccan;4343359]D&D are just not good as good at writing female characters as GRRM is, and most of the first seasons was originally GRRM's writing.
"Oh it's because it's a medieval world so it's just.." Yeah yeah. Except that the Sansa rape storyline wasn't in the books, the showrunners created it themselves. They also got a completely consensual sex scene from the books(Cersei and Jamie in Joffrey's funeral) and made it look like rape. Same for Dany/Drogo's first time all the way back to the pilot. And now, they think that writing all women as super petty and bitchy is writing ~strong female characters~ and that "rape made me stronger" is a good narrative.[/QUOTE]
D&D sucks at characterization in general. Most of the main cast are either morons or useless or both. And Euron is a goddamm villain sue.
Been a while since I read the first book, but I'm pretty sure Dany got raped there, too.
[QUOTE=SpiderClops;4343390]D&D sucks at characterization in general. Most of the main cast are either morons or useless or both. And Euron is a goddamm villain sue.
Been a while since I read the first book, but I'm pretty sure Dany got raped there, too.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, they butchered most characters really. Euron is ridiculous, and Tyrion is painful to watch now. Even Jon who I think they're trying to set up as the biggest hero and one true king, feels like an idiot to me.
She gets raped later, but their first time it's somewhat consensual. Drogo is careful, he asks "No?" and she answers "Yes". At the end of the day you could say it's not like she really had that much of a choice, but in the show they made it this super dramatized scene where she's crying helplessly while he undresses her. The whole tone is competely different.
[QUOTE=XPac;4342414]It was actually a gamble on Eurons part to a degree. They obviously had no way of knowing when or even IF Dany was going to return to Dragonstone. It wasn't an unreasoable assumption by anymeans... but Cersi easily could have wasted valuable resources for nothing had they simply decided to head straight to kings landing, or if they even decided to postpone things and wait in the north while their forces rested.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, also Dany and her dragons are freaking airborne. Are they blind or something? There are a fleet on the open sea for crying loud.
Also where did the killing shot came from, that's like a completely different angle! Are Euron's ships firing missiles now?
[QUOTE=MindofShadow;4342450]If only the good guy team had a person who could warg into birds to scout out enemy strategy
oh... lol[/QUOTE]
They don't even need warg, basic intelligence operations by Varys, scouts, even Dany herself would do. But still can't defeat an invisible teleporter like Euron.
[QUOTE=Wiccan;4343359]D&D are just not good as good at writing female characters as GRRM is, and most of the first seasons was originally GRRM's writing.
"Oh it's because it's a medieval world so it's just.." Yeah yeah. Except that the Sansa rape storyline wasn't in the books, the showrunners created it themselves. They also got a completely consensual sex scene from the books(Cersei and Jamie in Joffrey's funeral) and made it look like rape. Same for Dany/Drogo's first time all the way back to the pilot. And now, they think that writing all women as super petty and bitchy is writing ~strong female characters~ and that "rape made me stronger" is a good narrative.[/QUOTE]
Sansa specifically didn’t get raped. Jeyne Poole who was in Sansa’s role in the books got it far worse including implied forced bestiality.. Then there’s all the random **** of the mountain being a serial rapist who rapes underage 13 year olds in front of their father.
Dany and Drogo was pretty similar in the books she was in tears and upset about it.
[QUOTE=KNIGHT OF THE LAKE;4343581]Sansa specifically didn’t get raped. Jeyne Poole who was in Sansa’s role in the books got it far worse including implied forced bestiality.. Then there’s all the random **** of the mountain being a serial rapist who rapes underage 13 year olds in front of their father.
Dany and Drogo was pretty similar in the books she was in tears and upset about it.[/QUOTE]
She's upset and scared because of course. But as the scene goes on and Drogo treats her carefuly, she gets more calm and into it, she's wet and gets his finger inside her herself after answering yes to his "No?".
I've read the books. Putting Sansa into Jeyne's place made no sense. That was the time where she was supposed to learn about the game with Littlefinger, like she is on AFFC and what we know of TWOW. They keep talking about how she's super smart because she learned things from him, except she never really learned much on the show. They decided to scratch that, give her to Ramsay, and then pretend like that helped make her "The smartest person Arya has met" somehow. And of course she got raped. Maybe you don't count their wedding night, but even then, a while after that on the next episode she's devasting, crying to Theon about how Ramsay hurts her every night.
[QUOTE=Wiccan;4343658]She's upset and scared because of course. But as the scene goes on and Drogo treats her carefuly, she gets more calm and into it, she's wet and gets his finger inside her herself after answering yes to his "No?".
I've read the books. Putting Sansa into Jeyne's place made no sense. That was the time where she was supposed to learn about the game with Littlefinger, like she is on AFFC and what we know of TWOW. They keep talking about how she's super smart because she learned things from him, except she never really learned much on the show. They decided to scratch that, give her to Ramsay, and then pretend like that helped make her "The smartest person Arya has met" somehow. And of course she got raped. Maybe you don't count their wedding night, but even then, a while after that on the next episode she's devasting, crying to Theon about how Ramsay hurts her every night.[/QUOTE]
And again Jeyne Poole was literally getting raped and tortured and forced to screw Ramsay’s dogs (heavily implied) among other things. There’s no way to say D&D were worse than GRRM in their treatment on women in that scenario.
Also let’s be real, GRRM has a lot worse happen to women and even female children in his books than in the show.
And again the Dany scene in the book was still a reluctant crying Dany being made to have sex with Drogo. Yeah she ultimately said yes in a situation she had no say in. Oh and she was younger in the book.
We can also discuss how the showrunners made Cersei far more measured and competent than her book counterpart who is basically a caricature of bitchy hateful women who lashes out at men.