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Voted GL but now think Vixen or BL also.
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[quote]but DC is gonna have to commit to pushing him as a universal hero with a diverse rogues gallery so he can have a street-level mythos on par with Green Arrow[/quote]Huh. I like Ollie, at least the bronze-age version (not the jerk he was all too often later), but I'd never associate him with a strong rogues' gallery. Or any rogues' gallery. Count Vertigo, Merlyn, and maybe Onomatopoeia are the only three I could name off the top of my head that were strongly Ollie's, and I can't think of that many stories with each. And I'm not sure they didn't farm out Onomatopoeia to Batman late post-COIE. Very definitely associate him with street-level, though.
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[QUOTE=SecretWarrior;4625930]The anti-heroing of characters like Harley, Captain Cold, and Slade has to do with them being able to play the edgy wish-fulfillment role in ways that characters like the Ventriloquist and Riddler can't.[/QUOTE]
Slade and Harley are villains who writers pretend have redeeming qualities.Thankfully, Priest acknowledges that Slade is human trash and doesn't try to justify him like Wolfman did.
Cyborg should be this, but promoting him to the JL actually hurt his character. JLO was supposed to be Cyborg's book but he got shafted in favor of Jess. Cyborg needs to lead a team on Earth where he is undisputedly the man.
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[QUOTE=king81992;4625744]Black Lightning or Cyborg[/QUOTE]
Presently, they are indeed the top two. If I have to pick one, it's Cyborg.
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[QUOTE=The Darknight Detective;4626217]Presently, they are indeed the top two. If I have to pick one, it's Cyborg.[/QUOTE]
Not according to the poll. And both are problematic for reasons already mentioned.
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[QUOTE=SecretWarrior;4626239]Not according to the poll. And both are problematic for reasons already mentioned.[/QUOTE]
I wasn't referring to the poll, but where those two place within the group, IMO. As for any problems regarding Vic and Jefferson, I don't subscribe to them.
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Cyborg is way "problematic". He may be fine for white people, but black males in general are never going to be totally okay with the hero representing them as being some quasimodo type. It's just ridiculous to even put Cyborg in that position.
Realistically, though, [B]all[/B] of these characters are severely handicapped in way or another. And often in multiple ways. I don't think I need to go down the list, because others already have, and everybody knows their weaknesses. John Stewart fans may think Hal Jordan can just be set aside, or that he can give up his spot as main character of his franchise so it can be an ensemble, but these people conveniently ignore the gigantic blue whale in the room, which is Hal Jordan's fans. Go ask Hal Jordan fans what they think of those ideas and see what results you get.
Cyborg is an utter joke. I don't even think I need to talk about him.
Black Lightning...eh. He's just not all that good, in my view, and his name is extremely dated and corny.
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[QUOTE=Vampire Savior;4626289]Cyborg is way "problematic". He may be fine for white people, but black males in general are never going to be totally okay with the hero representing them as being some quasimodo type. It's just ridiculous to even put Cyborg in that position.
Realistically, though, [B]all[/B] of these characters are severely handicapped in way or another. And often in multiple ways. I don't think I need to go down the list, because others already have, and everybody knows their weaknesses. John Stewart fans may think Hal Jordan can just be set aside, or that he can give up his spot as main character of his franchise so it can be an ensemble, but these people conveniently ignore the gigantic blue whale in the room, which is Hal Jordan's fans. Go ask Hal Jordan fans what they think of those ideas and see what results you get.
Cyborg is an utter joke. I don't even think I need to talk about him.
Black Lightning...eh. He's just not all that good, in my view, and his name is extremely dated and corny.[/QUOTE]
Hal Jordan is a really generic super hero who was better off being dead. Every other Green Lantern is more interesting and has a better character arc than Hal.
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[video=youtube;pWdKf3MneyI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdKf3MneyI[/video]
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[QUOTE=RobinFan4880;4626304]Hal Jordan is a really generic super hero who was better off being dead. Every other Green Lantern is more interesting and has a better character arc than Hal.[/QUOTE]
Um. Are you a Hal Jordan fan?
What we will have to do is go ask [B]Hal Jordan fans[/B] what they think of the idea of him being pushed down.
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[QUOTE=RobinFan4880;4626304]Hal Jordan is a really generic super hero who was better off being dead. Every other Green Lantern is more interesting and has a better character arc than Hal.[/QUOTE]
And how's that been working out for you. Seems like that guy can't be kept down no matter what. They character-assassinated him, killed him off, replaced him numerous times, even gave him a crappy movie, and he came back from all of that. You think 5G would be any different? What do you think it would take to keep him down if you really believe that's the only way your favorites can be given a chance to shine.
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the idea that there is something wrong with the name Black Lightning is such nitpicky nonsense to me. it's cheesy and problematic because he's black and his name has black in it? please, it's as cheesy as Batman or Wonder Woman, if the race aspect bothers people that much make his lightning black and say that's why. let's not pretend it's committing some cheesiness sin that the likes of the Green Lantern are exempt from or that it's remotely as "problematic" as the idea of DC making Cyborg (the perpetual Justice League ragdoll) their headlining black hero; or problematic at all. I have never once heard of a black person upset that their black hero has black in his name and if that's the biggest problem with the character then we should counting that as a blessing considering how much DC's mangled the handle of many of their heroes of color over the years. if people can get over Roy's heroin addiction I'm sure they can (and have) gotten over a black character who's comfortable putting his race or lightning color up front. smh, glad to see that the hyper-rationalization of the existence of the black hero is alive and well. /s
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I wish it were otherwise but the only black superhero I can see achieving Trinity status is Luke Fox when he takes over as Batman. In every way but equity/inclusion/diversity, I love that DC (and Marvel) have such storied histories. It's not so much a reflection on comics as society as a whole that 99% of leading characters in fiction are white. I appreciate all the efforts to address this in comics but the only way it's really going to happen is by giving a hero of color an incredible creative team. That's one thing no black DC hero has had yet. Maybe it will finally happen when we have a black Batman.
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Vixen, BL, and Cyborg but it would take several decades with outside media support to back it up.
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[QUOTE=Johnny;4626335]And how's that been working out for you. Seems like that guy can't be kept down no matter what. They character-assassinated him, killed him off, replaced him numerous times, even gave him a crappy movie, and he came back from all of that. You think 5G would be any different? What do you think it would take to keep him down if you really believe that's the only way your favorites can be given a chance to shine.[/QUOTE]
Do you think fans and the WB would be falling over themselves for Hal if Geoff Johns had chosen to push any other Green Lantern for his big run? Heck no! Whomever Geoff Johns chose would have become *the* Green Lantern of this generation. John's run was lighting in a bottle - it was a great story written by a great writer, which was being penned at the exact moment that DC needed a big win. If that run had not happened, I guarantee you Jon Stewart would be the Green Lantern of this generation thanks to the Justice League/Unlimited show. But, alas, Johns loves the Silver Age, so Hal was his man, and therefore he once more became the face of the Lantern family.
