Suicide Squad #5 Discussion/Spoilers

This chapter offered some revelations and I still don't know what to think of them.

Tom Taylor continues his story about the old members of the Squad trying to work alongside with the new ones for the sake of everyone. The first half concerning the hunt for Boomerang is solidly handled with good action and character moments here and there, at first I thought that Taylor was still giving his recently-created characters the spotlight once again but then BAM! Deadshot actually gets a good moment as well.

Then the big surprise comes towards the end when we see Lok's actual boss and this is... shocking. The thing is that while is indeed a typical Taylor shock value moment, it makes you scratch your head once you start thinking about it since after all, this is one of the purest superheroes there is, a hero who prefered to die before being corrupted in the previous continuity and thus, makes me think that this is another instance of Taylor not understanding a character.

Bruno Redondo's artwork continues to impress with beautiful and expressive characters along with strong action scenes.

Mixed thoughts, not sure if I'm into what's happening next.

I honestly wasn’t sure about writing this but I just had to get this off my chest. This was a big issue with a pretty big surprise, probably the most shocking one I’ve seen in a while, and sets up a story that I genuinely want to follow along for what will happen next. In fact I will say this, I’m gonna put this entire thing in a spoiler box and ask that you don’t read the spoilers, I want you to read the issue and then come back. People should read this cold. All I will say is that from now on I don’t think this should be a series to ignore, that there is some story to be told.

Edit: Mod’s someone beat me to it, please remove this thread or something so not to confuse people.

[spoil] Alright so surprisingly after the end of last issue the team catches Captain Boomerang without a lot of problems. Jog gets burnt but that’s it, but it’s what happens after that when things take a turn.

Boomerang is brought to Lok and Lok orders Deadshot to kill him. He wants to set an example of what happens when you out the Suicide Squad or mess with the mission. It’s honestly very tense, when the revolutionaries and the squad pull off the unthinkable....they take down Lok’s forcefield and kill him along with his guards. They secure their freedom though Jog ends up dying.

It’s then that the biggest shock of all happens, they call the new person in charge of the Suicide Squad. Who is on the line is none other then Ted Kord, the Blue Beetle. I repeat, the person who is now controlling the Suicide Squad behind the scenes since issue 1, the big shadowy figure who is controlling Lok, turns out to be Ted Kord of the Justice League. I don’t know what this means honestly, it’s a bit shocking to see Ted Kord in the situation and I’m not sure what else there is to this story. No idea what to make of a character I like and read about in what looks like a shady situation sending out criminals with bombs in their necks.

But the issue doesn’t give us any answers, all we know is the Suicide Squad is free, on the run, and coming for Ted Kord.

Normally I think something like this would upset people, and I’m sure that people are already upset with the idea that Ted Kord could possibly be the villain. However for me if this wasn’t Tom Taylor I would write this off. However I feel like Taylor has some bigger story that he just hasn’t told us yet. I mean, how could Ted Kord of all people take control of Task Force X from Amanda Waller and the government, and then as of next issue send Batman after them. I think there is something else at play and we need to stay patient for what is next. Either way I’m invested.[/spoil]

Oh crud...I guess I’m a slow writer. Sorry about that and anyone looking to talk about this issue should do this here.

If I had anything to say towards the surprise hero appearance at the end, I think Taylor likely has a bigger plan then what we are seeing. I mean we are talking about Task Force X which was run by the United States government and Amanda Waller, so the fact that this particular hero is somehow in charge of it makes me think there is more to this then we know.

Well if he was in charge of Lok the whole time, he shares blame for all those deaths. I don’t see that getting wiped clean (without a DC reboot).

[QUOTE=Robotman;4986037]Well if he was in charge of Lok the whole time, he shares blame for all those deaths. I don’t see that getting wiped clean (without a DC reboot).[/QUOTE]

I mean if it’s exactly as it looks, then yes he is very much culpable in the deaths of various members (not king shark, that was revenge). Again, I feel as though something is off with this character being involved.

I'll admit when I saw who it was, I thought "hold on isnt that ...?" and for a split second thought I'd got my characters/identities mixed up.

What I have learnt over the years however is to wait till the story plays out before any judgments/ assumptions are made. Sometimes writers [B]are[/B] able to stick to landing...

Interest definitely piqued though.

I suspect theres some scooby doo bullshit coming up

Here's my crazy theory: It's the Dark Multiverse Ted from the Infinite Crisis oneshot having stolen the Prime Ted's identity.

[QUOTE=Jody Garland;4987489]Here's my crazy theory: It's the Dark Multiverse Ted from the Infinite Crisis oneshot having stolen the Prime Ted's identity.[/QUOTE]

That makes sense. Was that the last time we've seen Ted? I can't recall.

[QUOTE=Power Torch;4987637]That makes sense. Was that the last time we've seen Ted? I can't recall.[/QUOTE]

An issue of Batman/Superman when he learns that Jaime Reyes was infected by Batman who laughs.

[QUOTE=Power Torch;4987637]That makes sense. Was that the last time we've seen Ted? I can't recall.[/QUOTE]

He appeared in this week's issue of The Terrifics.

[QUOTE=Jody Garland;4987489]Here's my crazy theory: It's the Dark Multiverse Ted from the Infinite Crisis oneshot having stolen the Prime Ted's identity.[/QUOTE]

I really hope not. I don’t want to see even more Dark Multiverse stuff start leaking into the main DC earth. Already so freaking tired of The Batman Who Laughs and the Dark versions of heroes. I’m fine with it as a stand alone comic as it’s kind of like DC’s “What If”.

I haven't enjoyed a Suicide Squad book in years. This book has changed that. This has been a lot of fun and I love that cliffhanger, even though I hope it's a fakeout.

I hope it is some kind of fake out or twist.

I know DC loves their 'heroes get corrupted' stories but it would be nice for them to spare another hero that old trope again.

Lok was a dumb ass to keep pushing a bunch of violent killers buttons. Lok pulled a Snoke.

[QUOTE=jetengine;4987310]I suspect theres some scooby doo bullshit coming up[/QUOTE]

This made me chuckle. Especially as I read this in Sam' Jackson's voice...

[QUOTE=Mr. White;4988121]This made me chuckle. Especially as I read this in Sam' Jackson's voice...[/QUOTE]

*Pulls off Ted Kord mask*

"DAN DIDIO!"

"I'd of gotten away with it too if it wasnt for you meddling D listers !"

Another good issue from Taylor honestly I was waiting for the other shoe to drop and see the series take a turn for the worse but the new characters are surprisingly well written and bring a lot of tragedy towards them being the redshirts of the series.
I mean Harley Boomer and Floyd are not dying. They can get hurt and be out of commission for a few missions but over the last 9 years none of the times these characters have died have stuck.

As far as Ted Kord being the secret big bad controlling the Squad and responsible for all the deaths so far. Well that's why you want a character like Lok or Waller in charge they are morally just in their missions but can survive the mud that gets thrown onto their characters. Ted cannot survive something like that with the same goofy gimmick.
I'll wait for the twist

[QUOTE=Nite-Wing;4988768]Another good issue from Taylor honestly I was waiting for the other shoe to drop and see the series take a turn for the worse but the new characters are surprisingly well written and bring a lot of tragedy towards them being the redshirts of the series.
I mean Harley Boomer and Floyd are not dying. They can get hurt and be out of commission for a few missions but over the last 9 years none of the times these characters have died have stuck.

As far as Ted Kord being the secret big bad controlling the Squad and responsible for all the deaths so far. Well that's why you want a character like Lok or Waller in charge they are morally just in their missions but can survive the mud that gets thrown onto their characters. Ted cannot survive something like that with the same goofy gimmick.
I'll wait for the twist[/QUOTE]

For some reason you made me think of a funny scene where Ted takes off a mask and Waller is underneath. Lol

[QUOTE=Bored at 3:00AM;4987867]I haven't enjoyed a Suicide Squad book in years. This book has changed that. This has been a lot of fun and I love that cliffhanger, even though I hope it's a fakeout.[/QUOTE]

I could have written this myself--word for word. Thanks for saving me the time! :)

I hope I'm dead wrong, but I'm very, VERY afraid that there's absolutely no larger conspiracy behind the Ted Kord of Tom Taylor's [I]Suicide Squad[/I] being completely out of character in his first appearance in the book. I must admit that I know very little about the author's work before the Squad's relaunch (the [I]Injustice[/I] franchise holds zero appeal to me and I read only the first two issues of [I]DCeased[/I] before total disinterest settled in) but the undertones of these past five issues make me unable to shake the feeling that villainizing Mr. Kord was seen as A-OK by the writer and editor (if those are still a thing) because of factors like his skin color, his age and the amount of money in his bank accounts. Again, I hope I'm wrong and that this apparent character assassination is actually the prelude to an exciting mystery being unraveled-- because the alternative would be an implicit declaration that it's now become fair game to throw consolidated characterizations in the scrap heap for the sake of heavy-handed political commentary.

Anyway, leaving that aside, I think I've finally understood the huge issue that is preventing me from actually liking this comic:

All of the new characters introduced in Suicide Squad #1 as the Revolutionaries have been awfully one-note in each issue. Here and there you might find some hints that there could be more bubbling under the surface, but nothing ever really develops in an interesting way, as if the writer is convinced that there's no need to do anything to make his original creations appealing.

Even if they were all one-note it wouldn't be a huge problem early in the story, as their lack of depth doesn't prevent their personalities, despite not being multi-faceted, from creating interactions with the rest of the cast. You don't need a deep character early, but at least make it fun to watch them interact with others-- and none of Revolutionaries quite achieves that. And filling the cast with so many single-minded or one-note characters while also failing to give their interactions anything meaningful, compelling or fun IS a big issue for me.

[QUOTE=Powertool;4993637]I hope I'm dead wrong, but I'm very, VERY afraid that there's absolutely no larger conspiracy behind the Ted Kord of Tom Taylor's [I]Suicide Squad[/I] being completely out of character in his first appearance in the book. I must admit that I know very little about the author's work before the Squad's relaunch (the [I]Injustice[/I] franchise holds zero appeal to me and I read only the first two issues of [I]DCeased[/I] before total disinterest settled in) but the undertones of these past five issues make me unable to shake the feeling that villainizing Mr. Kord was seen as A-OK by the writer and editor (if those are still a thing) because of factors like his skin color, his age and the amount of money in his bank accounts. Again, I hope I'm wrong and that this apparent character assassination is actually the prelude to an exciting mystery being unraveled-- because the alternative would be an implicit declaration that it's now become fair game to throw consolidated characterizations in the scrap heap for the sake of heavy-handed political commentary.

Anyway, leaving that aside, I think I've finally understood the huge issue that is preventing me from actually liking this comic:

All of the new characters introduced in Suicide Squad #1 as the Revolutionaries have been awfully one-note in each issue. Here and there you might find some hints that there could be more bubbling under the surface, but nothing ever really develops in an interesting way, as if the writer is convinced that there's no need to do anything to make his original creations appealing.

Even if they were all one-note it wouldn't be a huge problem early in the story, as their lack of depth doesn't prevent their personalities, despite not being multi-faceted, from creating interactions with the rest of the cast. You don't need a deep character early, but at least make it fun to watch them interact with others-- and none of Revolutionaries quite achieves that. And filling the cast with so many single-minded or one-note characters while also failing to give their interactions anything meaningful, compelling or fun IS a big issue for me.[/QUOTE]

Are you saying Ted Kord could be made a villain because of reverse racism and anti-capitalism views of the writer?!?

[QUOTE=Robotman;4993754]Are you saying Ted Kord could be made a villain because of reverse racism and anti-capitalism views of the writer?!?[/QUOTE]

Lol no, of course! I'm not a red-pilled Youtube reviewer who sees woke "ideology" lurking behind every corner.

The way I see it, ever since the industry started its downward spiral in terms of actual sales, marketing has dictated the content of the vast majority of comic books. The personal ideas of the author are unimportant in the end, the only crucial thing is getting people's attention and these people are both new, potential (and I cannot stress that "potential" enough) readers and old fans. Now, by apparently villainizing Blue Beetle you hit two birds with one stone: the old fans are suddenly interested because they want to know why a beloved hero is now acting so OOC while the Twitterati suddenly have a reason to care about your book (and therefore spread the word) since it features a group of plucky underdogs (plus Harley Quinn, which never hurts) trying to take The Man down.

In my humble opinion, I think this kind of marketing strategy is an insult to the very essence of serialized comics and that it leaves only ruins in its wake, but that's the way things are done nowadays so perhaps this is the new normal.

My memory may be faulty but didn't Everyman impersonate Ted awhile back? Easy way to back out of this once it implodes.

[QUOTE=Montressor;4997804]My memory may be faulty but didn't Everyman impersonate Ted awhile back? Easy way to back out of this once it implodes.[/QUOTE]

In Andreyko's Manhunter, during the trial of Wonder Woman story.

"Ted Kord" = Max Lord. Just my guess. He's got history with trying to control governmental agencies for his own agenda (Checkmate). And he might harbor an irrational grudge against Ted, so impersonating him to smear his rep is a logical possibility.

Yeah I wouldn’t worry about anything happening to Ted because it’s pretty clear DC is done with Jaime Reyes.

[QUOTE=Robotman;4998784]Yeah I wouldn’t worry about anything happening to Ted because it’s pretty clear DC is done with Jaime Reyes.[/QUOTE]

your not giving enough credit, they'll hollowly drag out Jaime every once in a while to make a cameo or a quick supporting role. is representation, yes?

[QUOTE=lemonpeace;4998906]your not giving enough credit, they'll hollowly drag out Jaime every once in a while to make a cameo or a quick supporting role. is representation, yes?[/QUOTE]

Nah, they don’t need him anymore. They can just have Jessica Cruz float behind the other Lanterns and point to that as diversity. Jaime will take his spot next to Vibe, Bunker, and El Diablo on the shelf.

I think Ted is pretty safe. He appeared in around 4 different books in the past month. Wouldn’t be surprised if it was Max Lord who is behind this. The Wonder Woman movie was supposed to be coming out (then of course COVID changed all that) so DC was probably planning to feature Max a lot more as a way to build up his role in the flick.

I don’t think Jaime is forgotten, I think he’s just unavailable after what’s going on with Death Metal and Batman who laughs much like Shazam and Supergirl. I believe we will definitely see more of Jaime when all that is sorted out.

[QUOTE=sbp1972;4997863]"Ted Kord" = Max Lord. Just my guess. He's got history with trying to control governmental agencies for his own agenda (Checkmate). And he might harbor an irrational grudge against Ted, so impersonating him to smear his rep is a logical possibility.[/QUOTE]

I definitly got a Max Lord vibe off the artwork. Maybe Max is using his power to control Ted?

[QUOTE=Midnighter;4999572]I definitly got a Max Lord vibe off the artwork. Maybe Max is using his power to control Ted?[/QUOTE]

Good point. Hadn't thought of just straight-up mind control. I also think the death of -you-know-who referenced in the solicits for September is a fake out. He'll be going undercover is my best guess. And that will tie in to the resolution of the Max/Ted storyline.

I wanted to come in and say this, Flash Annual #3 is basically just Suicide Squad #5.5. Like its really only tangentially a Flash story, although he is in it and plays a big part in the story, it’s really a Captain Boomerang and Suicide Squad issue.

However it does bring up some thoughts about the main Suicide Squad story

[spoil] Flash straight up helps the Suicide Squad escape time safety because he feels bad for them for what they’ve been through, not specifically Ted Kord just the whole bomb in necks forced to work for government thing. It’s this and the bounty on them that has me believe at this time that for whatever reason Ted hasn’t used his hero community connections, either because he really doesn’t want them involved or perhaps it’s not really Ted Kord. Have to wait and see as it’s just conjecture. [/spoil]