2018 brought MJ back into Peter's orbit and back as a prominent love interest. What has 2019 got in store for her?
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2018 brought MJ back into Peter's orbit and back as a prominent love interest. What has 2019 got in store for her?
We're already off and running...MJ showed up in the daily strip today, looks like she'll be partnered with Luke Cage to help free Peter from the grip of the Purple Man
[QUOTE=Miles To Go;4112539]2018 brought MJ back into Peter's orbit and back as a prominent love interest. What has 2019 got in store for her?[/QUOTE]
Hopefully great things! Like...marriage! ;) (Okay, that is almost certainly not happening, but I can dream! And at least Newspaper MJ is still married to Peter!)
I think MJ's fortunes will depend on
1) Chip Zdarsky's LIFE STORY, the story of what-if Peter Aged. What is going to be the story's attitude to the Peter/MJ love story?
2) Tom Taylor's run on FNSB. Taylor is a fan of Mary Jane and he wrote Clark and Lois well in Injustice comics flashback issues, and other couples.
3) Wherever Spencer's run goes with them back together.
2018 confirmed that Mary Jane is the most profitable supporting character and most prominent love interest. She was the playable character in Spider-Man PS4 and that was the fastest selling PS4 game, and there's a new generation of Peter/MJ shippers thanks to that game, since a lot of people loved that version of MJ and that romance with Peter. ITSV also showed the Adult Spider-Man for the first time in any movie and both Peters are married to Mary Jane and that movie last I checked did 200 million dollars on a 90million dollar budget.
I first saw Mary Jane in Web of Spider-Man. Out of all redhead childhood crush, she's the hottest, often drawn in a mini dress while hanging out in their apartment.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]75931[/ATTACH]
Later on, during the McFarlane era, they also like to write and draw a glimpse of their sex life, and her dress gets racier, which as a kid/preteen I was surprised that's it's included in a comic. Just like most parents, mine thought comics are just for kids.
[QUOTE=Restingvoice;4112897]I first saw Mary Jane in Web of Spider-Man. Out of all redhead childhood crush, she's the hottest, often drawn in a mini dress while hanging out in their apartment.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]75931[/ATTACH]
Later on, during the McFarlane era, they also like to write and draw a glimpse of their sex life, and her dress gets racier, which as a kid/preteen I was surprised that's it's included in a comic. Just like most parents, mine thought comics are just for kids.[/QUOTE]
Peter and MJ getting married was often an excuse used by writers and artists to make MJ this sex object and so on, since they can use marriage to deal with all kinds of sexy stuff and fairly believable reasons why she would be in nighties and so on around Peter (since you know they're married and it's in the Bible that a married man can have sex with his wife so it passed the moral test). On one hand that's pretty male gazey, but on the other hand it did make married life look great and awesome (albeit idealized), and that's something that no superhero comic ever did before.
Compare that to Superman and Lois, where even after they got married you never got a sense of sexiness in their home life, whereas that was always part of Peter and MJ's love story. I mean canonically, MJ is the woman who deflowered Peter at the end of ASM#149. Even Post-OMD, in Spider-Island, the real reason why MJ got Spider powers and lasted so long was the fact that as Slott had Reed said, she and Peter "shared a toothbrush" since during their (long live-in relationship Post-omit, which sounds stupid every time I see it and makes no sense), they had so much sex that she acquired immunity from...contact with him (which seems to be a joke at [I]Spider-Man:Reign[/I]).
Ta-Nehisi Coates said it best ([url]https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2015/01/spider-man-in-love/384860/):[/url]
[I]His marriage was a rejection of the macho ideal of romance—which reigns even among nerds—and it mirrored and confirmed my own budding sense of what love was at a very young age.
I wouldn't argue that the Parker-Watson marriage was always well-written and well-drawn. The "super-model" angle felt unnecessary, as did some of the porno-lite art. (It's good to see Kubert, here, depicting Watson the way women actually tend to look.) I won't defend the '90s, which were not a good period for the writing in the Spider-Man books. But in a genre aimed at young males, it is very hard for me to come up with a more mature, and I would say healthy, vision of what a marriage should look like.[/I]
Interesting read, but... what is the macho ideal of romance?
Although MJ was very clearly an object to the male gaze, reading it back as an adult, or even back then as a teen, I never really feel she's objectified in the way that is offensive, maybe because it makes sense in context of their marriage as you said, and also because I find Peter Parker sexy.
He has a great body and often drawn shirtless or in his underwear in their home, and he also suffer from clothing damage while in battle. So I guess they really did make an ideal fanservice that's not random.
The idea that marriage is some ball and chain. That single life is more adventurous than marriage. You know that cliche of married dudes getting together and complaining about their wives. Peter Parker never once complained about marriage or did that wife jokes thing. He loved his marriage and was worried about it because of being a superhero but for the most part he saw it as the best thing that ever happened to him (and it really was).
Even before his marriage, Peter was always the guy who was closer to his girlfriends emotionally than he ever was to his male friends. Harry Osborn was never as close to him as Gwen and MJ were or are. That is actually one of his most unique qualities which separated him from Superman (who in the Silver Age had a girls=cooties attitude) and Batman (who is emotionally closer to male figures, surrogate Dads like Gordon and Alfred, or the robins, or you know the Joker...than he is to girls). It also brought a notable female readership to Spider-Man. None of this was conscious or intentional on the part of the writers, but it just accidentally worked out that way.
Peter's a complicated man and nobody understands him but his woman.
It's been great reading as Peter's love interest again this past year, just makes me care about Peter and his world all the more knowing a stable love interest is there backing him up and wanting him home.
MJ is more than that. She's his best friend, the one person who knows him better than anyone...his oldest confidant (the first member of his long-time supporting cast to know his secret and decipher it) and the love of his life.
More than that, Mary Jane Watson is the emotional and optimistic center of the comics. She represents the bright future and hope for one in the comics. The major reason BND was terrible and huge chunks of Slott's run is that it lost sight of that, and made the books depressing as a result.
2018 ended on a bit of a high with MJ being in ASM more, as well as getting back with Peter in the comics. Also with her being a playable character in the game I'd say she had a good end to 2018. Here's hoping that her 2019 features her just as strongly as the second half of 2018 did :)
Newspaper MJ actually ended 2018 with her big movie proving a critical bomb, but rather than be down over it, she shakes off the setback and makes plans to go on holiday to Australia.
[QUOTE=Revolutionary_Jack;4112956]The idea that marriage is some ball and chain. That single life is more adventurous than marriage. You know that cliche of married dudes getting together and complaining about their wives. Peter Parker never once complained about marriage or did that wife jokes thing. He loved his marriage and was worried about it because of being a superhero but for the most part he saw it as the best thing that ever happened to him (and it really was).[/QUOTE]
Oooh, that. Yeah yeah. That marriage means you have to be loyal for one partner so it's a sign he can't be a stud and sleep around anymore. That having kids mean you have to take care of them and you're not free to have fun anymore.
I haven't heard that kinda view since the early 2000s.
[QUOTE=Restingvoice;4113365]Oooh, that. Yeah yeah. That marriage means you have to be loyal for one partner so it's a sign he can't be a stud and sleep around anymore. That having kids mean you have to take care of them and you're not free to have fun anymore.
I haven't heard that kinda view since the early 2000s.[/QUOTE]
It's a very baby boomer attitude, and it's an attitude that Quesada and others projected on to Marvel when they read and discovered the comics then. And it underpins Slott's run.
That's why millennials largely liked the Spider-Marriage and it was part of our childhood growing up.
I linked to the studio version of this (over on Bandcamp) over in the old thread, but here is a live take of "Unmasked" by Leslie Hudson, with backup by S.J (S00j) Tucker (bass) and Betsy Tinney (cello), complete with Leslie's thoughts on Mary Jane Watson and why she's awesome.
[video=youtube;ho1Wn_HPku8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ho1Wn_HPku8[/video]
[URL="https://lesliehudson.bandcamp.com/track/unmasked"]Lyrics and studio version[/URL].
Face it Tiger...you just hit a new Appreciation Thread for a New Year ;).
Hoping 2019 continues the current positive momentum for Mary Jane on all fronts :).
The big thing is ''Spider-Man: Far From Home" and Mary Jane isn't in that, so this year will be comics alone.
Something that's been occupying me is the Peter/MJ love story and the volume of content it generated.
What I mean is how many issues have Peter and Mary Jane in a relationship and across all titles, all continuities. What I mean by relationship, is dating/seeing one another/sleeping with one another, married to one another or "going steady" and being exclusive and so on.
[B][I][U]616[/U][/I][/B]
Amazing Spider-Man
1) Peter and MJ are a couple from Issues #142-#192 when they broke up the first time. (50 issues)
2) Peter and MJ get engaged and married from #292 to #545. (253 issues)
3) Peter and MJ are a couple again from #802 onwards but as of now issue #12 is out (12 issues).
Total:315 Issues
Spectacular Spider-Man
1) Peter and MJ are a couple until Issue #27 during their first relationship (27 issues)
2) Peter and MJ are married between #131 to #263 (End of Vol. 1), (132 issues)
3) Peter and MJ are married for Paul Jenkins entire 27 issue run in Vol. 2 (27 issues)
Total: 186 Issues
Marvel Team-Up
1) Peter and MJ are a couple in the Post-Conway era and she appears in 12 Issues.
2) Peter and MJ are married in Vol. 2 which goes for 11 issues.
3) Peter and MJ are married for 25 issues.
Total: 48 Issues
Annuals and One Shots and Miniseries
Amazing: 14 Annuals (Vol. 1 from 1987-2007), 3 Annuals (Vol. 2 from 1999-2004): (17)
Spectacular: 7 Annuals (From #7-#14), (7)
Sensational Spider-Man Annual #1 (To Have and to Hold) (1)
Total: 25 Issues
Miniseries and One-Shots: Parallel Lives, Hobgoblin Lives, Soul of the Hunter, Spider-Man: Blue, Revenge of the Green Goblin, The Final Adventure, Web of Romance, Spider-Man/Human Torch Issue #5,
Total: 8 Issues
Web of Spider-Man: Peter and MJ are married from #32-129 when it ended and go rebranded as Web of Scarlet Spider (97 Issues)
Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man: Peter and MJ are married for entire 24 Issue Run of Vol. 1 (24 Issues)
Marvel Knights: Spider Man/Sensational Spider-Man: Peter and MJ are married for 41 Issues (41 Issues)
Peter Parker Spider-Man: Vol.1 (98 Issues) and Vol. 2 (57) both showed a married Peter and MJ (155 Issues).
Spider-Man Unlimited (12 Issues, multiple volumes showing the marriage)
So that's totally 911 Issues across all Spider-Man titles in the core 616 Canon Continuity showing Peter and Mary Jane Watson in a relationship (dating/marriage). Which has to be crazy because that's the biggest most documented relationship and romance not only in Spider-Man but across all comics. Superman and Lois for instance are only in a relationship in a regular sense in the Post-Crisis era and that hasn't generated the same amount of content by any means. I am sure that there's stuff I am missing.
[B][I][U]Alternate Continuities
[/U][/I][/B]
Superman Vs. The Amazing Spider-Man (First AU title) : 1 issue
Spider-Girl: 130 Issues
Renew Your Vows: 23 Issues
Ultimate Spider-Man
- Peter and MJ are dating from Issue #13- Issue #32 (First Breakup), 20 Issues
- Peter and MJ are dating from Issue #42- Issue #77 (Second Breakup), 35 Issues
- Peter and MJ are dating from Issue #105- Issue #133 Ultimatum, end of Volume 1 (they break-up in time-skip between two volumes) - 28 Issues
- Annual #3 (broke up between Annuals 1 and 2)
- Peter an MJ are dating from Issue #155 to end of Vol. 3, Death of Spider-Man in 160 - 6 Issues
- Peter and MJ reunited some time before the opening arc of the Return of Ultimate Peter - 7 Issues
- Spider-Men II, final issue, shows Peter and MJ sitll together:
TOTAL: 97 Issues showing them in a relationship.
So 251 issues of AU versions showing Peter and MJ together.
There's also the Spider-Man Newspaper Strip where Peter and MJ were dating for a while before their marriage in 1987, which is 30 Plus Years...published daily 365 days a year...not including leap years...which makes it huge.
A roundabout way of saying...Peter and Mary Jane is the greatest love story in comics, with simply more content dedicated to showing them in a relationship, with most of it showing them married. Far more so than Lois and Clark...
[img]https://i2.wp.com/www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/FRNDSM-3.jpeg?w=756[/img]
[QUOTE=Revolutionary_Jack;4114870]So that's totally 911 Issues across all Spider-Man titles in the core 616 Canon Continuity showing Peter and Mary Jane Watson in a relationship (dating/marriage). Which has to be crazy because that's the biggest most documented relationship and romance not only in Spider-Man but across all comics. Superman and Lois for instance are only in a relationship in a regular sense in the Post-Crisis era and that hasn't generated the same amount of content by any means. I am sure that there's stuff I am missing.[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure about pages of content, but there is another candidate: Diana Palmer and Kit Walker ([URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_(comics)"]The Phantom[/URL]). Diana was introduced in the very first daily strip in 1936, before even The Phantom himself, and they've been depicted as a couple since then. They were engaged and married in 1977, and their twin children were born in 1979. For the Nordic market over 1,600 issues has been published (part American material, part own production).
[QUOTE=Revolutionary_Jack;4114870]The big thing is ''Spider-Man: Far From Home" and Mary Jane isn't in that, so this year will be comics alone.
[/QUOTE]
Nan desu ka?
[QUOTE=Revolutionary_Jack;4114870]The big thing is ''Spider-Man: Far From Home" and Mary Jane isn't in that[/QUOTE]
Michelle is a tsundre version of MJ and has her initials. Likely she'll have a journey with Peter that will gradually make her more in synch with the one we're used to in Far From Home
[QUOTE=Miles To Go;4114899][img]https://i2.wp.com/www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/FRNDSM-3.jpeg?w=756[/img][/QUOTE]
Pretty - where's that from?
[QUOTE=millernumber1;4115189]Pretty - where's that from?[/QUOTE]
Friendly Neighbourhood Spider-Man#1, out next week
[QUOTE=Miles To Go;4115194]Friendly Neighbourhood Spider-Man#1, out next week[/QUOTE]
Oh, cool - variant, I assume.
I'd just like to tip my hat to the "MJ just wants some bread" meme from the Into the Spider-Verse movie.
[IMG]https://66.media.tumblr.com/190ca1bcb849850be37dbc9f0a577ed7/tumblr_pkggj3sNCq1w55pubo1_r1_1280.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=millernumber1;4115197]Oh, cool - variant, I assume.[/QUOTE]
No, it's from the interior pages.
Love that bread one. Funny and heartwarming at the same time (but with no context MJ might think Peter is having some sort of bread issues) "I forgot to pick up bread one time in the supermarket..."
Also I saw a black and white version of that full splash page posted. I enjoy seeing the art process including the rough sketch, ink, coloring, extra details, and then words. To see the art in process can help others learn how the artist works plus take them for references and tips in learning how to make art as well.
[IMG]https://whateveraspidercan.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/315/files/2018/10/002s.jpg[/IMG]
When looking only at the half of the color picture to me it appears like a cover with Peter swinging away and a white line separating some windows of his life and people around him. The open spaces for the title and other such as barcodes. Seeing the full picture I now see he is swinging forward towards and the white line is really his web line. That one white line cutting in is the only part I think that could of had some small tiny lines in it to represented a webline vs a pure white line in a otherwise extremely detailed and beautifully made artwork and well made and done for all characters presented in Peter's life and time periods in his memories.
[QUOTE=Miles To Go;4115060]Michelle is a tsundre version of MJ and has her initials. Likely she'll have a journey with Peter that will gradually make her more in synch with the one we're used to in Far From Home[/QUOTE]
Would certainly be weird to have tom holland's spidey starts dating another mj in a few years, instead of just making the Zendaya one more like the comics.
[QUOTE=DragonPiece;4115468]Would certainly be weird to have tom holland's spidey starts dating another mj in a few years, instead of just making the Zendaya one more like the comics.[/QUOTE]
Which one? 616, 1610, 65, PS4 . . ?
[QUOTE=Miles To Go;4115060]Michelle is a tsundre version of MJ and has her initials. Likely she'll have a journey with Peter that will gradually make her more in synch with the one we're used to in Far From Home[/QUOTE]
I like how the [I]Spidey: School's Out [/I]just made her an updated version of Glory. Was a lot more believable for me :p.
[QUOTE=Tuck;4115559]Which one? 616, 1610, 65, PS4 . . ?[/QUOTE]
I just mean a red head in general
[QUOTE=DragonPiece;4116088]I just mean a red head in general[/QUOTE]
I remember this being an issue and a topic and heated debate when the movie came out.
We seen many different versions of many characters in the Multiverse. The factors and 'Spirituality' I guess that links characters in the united Multiverse plane to 'their' versions and those close to them that somehow odds in to their versions possibly meeting and being in the bonds and so forth is wide yet we look for something that we can factor in. Many times we look only for the simplest and basic: physical appearance. Something in particular that we associate and feel has to be some sort of rule. In this case 'redhead'.
Enjoying Spider-Gwen and the characters of Earth-65 as one of my first comic series I read when entering the world of comics while also reading some series that takes place on 616 I have seen different takes on various characters. From appearance to personality, to developments some yet have or didn't have, some with one going another direction and the other the other road, ect. That said I guess thanks to Earth-65 I use to vastly different takes on characters. Earth-65 versions compared to 616: Jessica Drew is a man, Reed is a African American 13 years old I think boy who can build transporters and World jumpers with legos and then play the latest game console games (cause he's 13), Samantha Wilson/Captain America, Felicia, the age ranges of characters, the moral spectrums of characters with Matt 'Murder'dock/Kingpin and Cindy moon (we on 616 we also know as Silk) lacks any care about her family and is a evil genius scientist and fighter and head of a scientific terrorist organization S.I.L.K., ect.
Me looking at Zendaya and being told she is 'MJ' I thinking. 'Ok'.
For me it how characters can be apart of people's worlds (and visa versa) and other elements more important. Will the character Zendaya is playing and presented to us grow as a person and develop but also help Peter either as a person also plus how bonding and close will she and Peter become (friends to girlfriend or even not that then a person who is still apart of his world and his hers and also maybe has a elements of love and a world linking Peter and her).
The one element to has me a bit off is usually For various alternate world Gwens, Feleticas, Peters, Miles, ect. a constant is a person's name. What is a name? A 'name' can be more than just a identifier like a filename and given to use usually by parents but who we see ourselves and a self-identity. Her name we first learn is Michelle but then we hear the nickname that we find a identity with 'MJ'.
What she I think is her friends call her 'MJ'. How did she get this nickname? Did she give that to herself? If so then that is part a self-identity and a huge part to a part of how the character can see herself. She see's a MJ in her. Furthermore 'only her friends' call her MJ. Those that she let's in can call her and have her be apart of their internal world as 'MJ'. For Peter who been allow access for a connection she can be viewed and identity as MJ by her right and desire for. Peter earned the right to have 'MJ' in his life cycle. In some sense we normally see Peter opening the door to MJ as a first meeting. In this case 'MJ' opens it instead to those she wants in her cycle and have the right to call her by her self-identity.
If she looks in the mirror and see's herself a MJ. Then that is who she is and in the grand Multiverse spiritually she is linked to the grand esseses and tokens 'MJs' and also for me hits a crucial aspect of the Spider Multiverse consistency found in most Multiverses is the cast that heads to each other and bonds (this case a 'MJ' and a 'Peter' has unlock and entered the early level 1 stages of spiritual connections we see in many Multiverses cast that come together).
As I wrote that matters she first says her name was 'Michelle' had me first thinking the writers were going to try to make a new character found only or at least first seen in this Multiverse for this Peter and the cast. If that was the case I would be fine with that (one of my all time favorite 'love interests' for a Peter and overall a very likeable character as a individual for me was a gal named 'Chat' and in the end in that Multiverse it was her and Peter who were lovers not Gwen or MJ or other and I'm fine with that).
That matter they first had her showcased as Michelle but then she states she also can be called and identity as MJ to her friends threw me for a bit. Thus the writers can openly claim to their liking: 'She is not found as a version in any other Mutiverves spiritually wise or other (till Spidey: School's Out had a version show up) and brand new character', 'She is their MCU MJ version', or 'She is a composite character version being apart and also is MJ PLUS another(s)'.
Now do I feel she NEEDS red hair? Not really. However I don't think Zendaya will look bad at all with red hair based on some photoshop images I saw but in the end that should be up to the writers and very importantly her. As a working actress I don't want her losing a big role she might be fantastic for and would of wanted due to 'hair reasons' plus other matters.
I do hope she will be a 'MJ' I will love and in my personal likes and dislikes of Multiverse MJs listing I always want every new 'MJ' written or shown to rise. Plus in the movies like 616 MJ version has done in the long history she has this 'MJ' will also develop stronger as a independent character and bonds. I find myself loving the videos Zendaya and Tom are having fun and interviews together with which has those positive vibes of 'Peter and MJ' connections that I want to feel in the movies itself. The actors are capable I feel but it's up to the writers and directors and more to bring that magic in.
The first Mary Jane appearance I saw in a video game was in an Amazing Spider-Man DOS game. This is the intro comic based on McFarlane art.
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Somehow I remember the art being better than this, as in, really look like McFarlane art.
I didn't know what to do in this game. You go to Mysterio's base, you can see where Mary Jane was held and Mysterio walking around in a different room, but I didn't know how to get there.
One memorable feature is a big Spider-Man art at the side of the playable area that acts as your life bar. When you take damage, the Spider-Man costume slowly disappeared from the bottom up to reveal his skeleton.
[QUOTE=Restingvoice;4117129]The first Mary Jane appearance I saw in a video game was in an Amazing Spider-Man DOS game. This is the intro comic based on McFarlane art.
[/QUOTE]
To be honest, I don't think I would have become a fan of Spider-Man and Peter without MJ. The first Spider-Man story I read was the newspaper comic strip. In that one Peter and MJ were married...and the idea of a superhero as a married man, with his wife knowing his double life, it was so far above Superman and Batman...and I liked MJ. She was funny, she was smart, and she's this amazing charismatic presence, and she brought this amazing comedy, charm, and heart to the story.
Newspaper MJ really was a bright spark in the five years in between the end of MC2 and Renew Your Vows.
Mary Jane is one of the most charismatic characters in comics. I mean her, J. Jonah Jameson, Spider-Man, The Joker, Doctor Doom, Wolverine, all are these instantly charismatic figures who no matter the story always command attention, never wear out welcome and offer so many possibilities and dimensions.
I want there to be a sequel to Arachknight just so we can see more Marley Jane Watson.
[IMG]https://readcomicsonline.ru/uploads/manga/infinity-wars-arachknight-2018/chapters/2/12.jpg[/IMG]
I am here for short hair MJ, surprisingly enough.
[QUOTE=LordUltimus;4117797]I want there to be a sequel to Arachknight just so we can see more Marley Jane Watson.
[IMG]https://readcomicsonline.ru/uploads/manga/infinity-wars-arachknight-2018/chapters/2/12.jpg[/IMG]
I am here for short hair MJ, surprisingly enough.[/QUOTE]
MJ with short hair looks so weird to me :p.
It makes her look more like Pepper Potts (which I guess she is the equivalent of in this universe?).
Big fan of those MJ Variant cover a while back:
[IMG]https://comicbooksandcats.files.wordpress.com/2017/06/18-the-mighty-captain-marvel-6-by-chris-samnee.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://fsmedia.imgix.net/c5/f4/7b/e7/3e02/4955/a93f/0b89e6f14750/all-newwolverine21maryjanevariantjpg.jpeg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://pastramination.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Iron_Fist_4_Mary_Jane_Variant.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Frontier;4115659]I like how the [I]Spidey: School's Out [/I]just made her an updated version of Glory. Was a lot more believable for me :p.[/QUOTE]
What does that mean?