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[QUOTE=Joao;3836829]Wel... Not sure how I feel about this one? I can see they could introduce Bana-Mighdall since we possibily won't visit Themyscira this time and the amazons are so appealing. But how will it fit with Pedro Pascal's (whoever he may be) and Cheetah's plot? I hope it doesn't turn out to be a mess. Geoff John is not to be trusted these days.[/QUOTE]
We have hit Washington DC and London already, and the Canary Islands is the next shooting location, so I think we are looking at a movie based on action in exotic locations. Think Indiana Jones or perhaps even more James Bond.
Given that Patty Jenkins wrote the treatment (original plot), and she seems to have very good instincts for Wonder Woman's character, I'm not that worried.
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I mean couldn't it be that Barbara found the god that makes her Cheetah in Egypt
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3838393]I mean couldn't it be that Barbara found the god that makes her Cheetah in Egypt[/QUOTE]
Yes, precisely.
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Or maybe both, Barbara is from BM and becomes Cheetah after a botch sacrifice to their god or won a contest to become "stronger" and now seeks out Wonder Woman to prove how strong she is.
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True. I mean didn’t Barbara go to Egypt in Perez’s book to feel the god? The Banas’s could could to defend or protected the world from it.
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3838393]I mean couldn't it be that Barbara found the god that makes her Cheetah in Egypt[/QUOTE]
Yes, I think the Egyptian stuff has more to do with that than Bana-Mighdall.
Maybe they will allude to another tribe of Amazons for a third film, but that's it.
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I’m kind of curious could this be following a bit of Perez’s run if this is the BM? Then again would this take away with Diana and Cheetah in the film?
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3839001]I’m kind of curious could this be following a bit of Perez’s run if this is the BM ? Than again would this take away with Diana and Cheetah etaj if we do have the Banas ?[/QUOTE]
Pérez is arguably the most influent Wonder Woman writer after Marston and certainly serves as the biggest inspiration for the film (the origin of the amazons, Ares as the villain of the first movie and Cheetah as the second, and the list goes on), so I don't doubt it.
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[url]https://twitter.com/WonderWomanHQ/status/1028446897193795584[/url]
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3838393]I mean couldn't it be that Barbara found the god that makes her Cheetah in Egypt[/QUOTE]
Yep. Mafdet seems like a pretty good fit. And a way to remove some of the more troubling aspects associated with Urzkartaga.
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[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/23jnk5.jpg[/IMG]
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I wonder if JL wouldn't be cannon seeing how Steve is back in the 80s. I wonder how should this be done if we get both BM and Cheetah?
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3843405]I wonder if JL wouldn't be cannon seeing how Steve is back in the 80s. I wonder how should this be done if we get both BM and Cheetah?[/QUOTE]
I'm about 100% sure JL will be canon. They'll have an explanation for Steve... magic, the gods, something. Lynda Carter is reportedly playing an Amazon High Priestess, so maybe she'll be responsible. And he'll die again... and, as others have said, it could help explain her reaction to reviving Superman in JL. Maybe?
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[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;3843405]I wonder if JL wouldn't be cannon seeing how Steve is back in the 80s. I wonder how should this be done if we get both BM and Cheetah?[/QUOTE]
I'm about 100% sure JL will be canon. They'll have an explanation for Steve... magic, the gods, something. Lynda Carter is reportedly playing an Amazon High Priestess, so maybe she'll be responsible. And he'll die again... and, as others have said, it could help explain her reaction to reviving Superman in JL. Maybe?
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So... no sword strap, or sword, or shield. Does this mean we will see how Diana obtains the Sword of Athena and her Aegis Shield, since she has them for BvS and JL?
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[QUOTE=RealWonderman;3844593]So... no sword strap, or sword, or shield. Does this mean we will see how Diana obtains the Sword of Athena and her Aegis Shield, since she has them for BvS and JL?[/QUOTE]
I don’t think so. I think Patty recognises that they’re unnecessary for Diana’s character. If they’re truly needed, then they’ll magically appear during her climatic battle with a villain who warrants a magical sword and shield. Even then, hopefully the Sam Browne belt doesn’t return. Whoever thought blocking / breaking Diana’s chest symbol with an ugly, brown harness was a good idea? They wouldn’t ever do that to Superman’s S or Batman’s Bat-symbol!
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[QUOTE=Agent 86;3845244]I don’t think so. I think Patty recognises that they’re unnecessary for Diana’s character. If they’re truly needed, then they’ll magically appear during her climatic battle with a villain who warrants a magical sword and shield. Even then, hopefully the Sam Browne belt doesn’t return. Whoever thought blocking / breaking Diana’s chest symbol with an ugly, brown harness was a good idea? They wouldn’t ever do that to Superman’s S or Batman’s Bat-symbol![/QUOTE]
I much prefer the look we've seen so far in 1984. No strap, please. But I wonder if the sword could be part of the plot with Barbara, an archaeologist obsessed with the Amazons. And we have the Smithsonian in this too now.
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[QUOTE=RealWonderman;3844033][B]I'm about 100% sure JL will be canon[/B][/QUOTE]
Which, if your right and I think you are because it coincides with my belief, we are still not going to get a version of Wonder Woman flying under her own power.
So what will people say when Shazam can fly? I mean this in terms of Wonder Woman not being able to on the big screen?
And for that matter, what kind of strength feat can Wondy say she has done versus Aquaman lifting a nuclear sub?
Sounds more and more like a street level fighter type for what they want Wondy to be in this universe.
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[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DkyrXyPU0AAMk4S.jpg[/IMG]
[url]https://twitter.com/ppiinnee1/status/1030387896354664448[/url]
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[QUOTE=BiteTheBullet;3846241]Which, if your right and I think you are because it coincides with my belief, we are still not going to get a version of Wonder Woman flying under her own power.
So what will people say when Shazam can fly? I mean this in terms of Wonder Woman not being able to on the big screen?
And for that matter, what kind of strength feat can Wondy say she has done versus Aquaman lifting a nuclear sub?
Sounds more and more like a street level fighter type for what they want Wondy to be in this universe.[/QUOTE]
I am still shocked at how much they nerfed Diana compared to other DC heroes.
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Street fighters don't smile after getting punched by a creature who has beaten Superman to death.
Just sayin'.
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[QUOTE=Geraldofrivia;3850017]I am still shocked at how much they nerfed Diana compared to other DC heroes.[/QUOTE]
Yeah she’s lucky Doomsday didn’t land a single punch on her, even Superman’s headbutt would’ve crushed her skull if not for the tiara
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3850296]Yeah she’s lucky Doomsday didn’t land a single punch on her, even Superman’s headbutt would’ve crushed her skull if not for the tiara[/QUOTE]
Doomsday hit her repeatedly, as a matter of fact. Did nothing to her.
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[QUOTE=Vanguard-01;3850741]Doomsday hit her repeatedly, as a matter of fact. Did nothing to her.[/QUOTE]
She blocked them all with her trusty shield, except for one blast of heat vision
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3850931]She blocked them all with her trusty shield, except for one blast of heat vision[/QUOTE]
Nope. She lost the shield midfight and got hit after it. She also got hit while she was leaping toward Doomsday. A shield is useless if you can't brace your feet against the ground. Even if she blocked the punch, it would be her one arm against Doomsday's entire body.
You don't want to dissect this fight scene with a guy who actually enjoyed it, has watched it multiple times, and has crushed other people in "Wonder Woman was weak" debates.
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3850931]She blocked them all with her trusty shield, except for one blast of heat vision[/QUOTE]
She intercepted one of his punches with a swing of her sword, after the shield had been knocked away from her, overpowered it and then chopped the arm off.
Yeah, what a nerfed weakling she is. You cannot attribute all this to the shield and the sword. Place those weapons in Batman's hand, and he still would have been completely SOL. They are not remotely effective against Doomsday without a top tier metahuman wielding them.
[QUOTE=Vanguard-01;3850030]Street fighters don't smile after getting punched by a creature who has beaten Superman to death.
Just sayin'.[/QUOTE]
Nor do they lift tanks over their heads.
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[QUOTE=Vanguard-01;3850938]Nope. She lost the shield midfight and got hit after it. She also got hit while she was leaping toward Doomsday. A shield is useless if you can't brace your feet against the ground. Even if she blocked the punch, it would be her one arm against Doomsday's entire body.
You don't want to dissect this fight scene with a guy who actually enjoyed it, has watched it multiple times, and has crushed other people in "Wonder Woman was weak" debates.[/QUOTE]
Imagine a Superman or Shazam movie where the character can't fly or Batman movie where he don't have Batmobile, and instead uses Turkish Airlines, an ancient Boat and horses to travel and yet we have a Wonder Woman movie where she can't fly or have an invisible Jet
She was pretty impressive in Doomsday fight but in her own movie she was street level to mid tier. The heaviest thing she lifts is a tank and her fight with Ares felt like a spiderman level than a fight between Gods. Meanwhile in Man of Steel two aliens fight levels an entire city. In Aquaman movie, Aquaman casually lifts a sub and Shazam can fly.
In Justice League she was casually dragged by Superman with one hand and to top it off flies and headbutts her to the ground. Superman and Flash are so fast that WW is a statue. Her head also moves when she get punched in face with a gun by terrorist while if it was Superman he wouldn't have even blinked.
It is unlikely she is going to fly in WW84 since it will break canon.
Why did DC nerfed her so hard compared to other DC heroes. DC declared she was a God, then make a God level character instead of nerfing her in movies.
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[QUOTE=Geraldofrivia;3851171]She was pretty impressive in Doomsday fight but in her own movie she was street level to mid tier. The heaviest thing she lifts is a tank and her fight with Ares felt like a spiderman level than a fight between Gods. Meanwhile in Man of Steel two aliens fight levels an entire city. In Aquaman movie, Aquaman casually lifts a sub and Shazam can fly.[/QUOTE]
The [B]origin[/B] movie focused on her gaining her powers and gradually discovering them, Patty Jenkins has said numerous times in many interviews that the power level displayed there is not what it is going to be what she's always at. It's her trilogy and what she says goes, and she has WB by the balls pretty much because she's the only one who gave them the results they needed so far. Hence her pay raise and increased creative control.
[QUOTE=Geraldofrivia;3851171]It is unlikely she is going to fly in WW84 since it will break canon.[/QUOTE]
Lol what canon are they concerned about exactly? JL, the movie they didn't have any faith in and pretty much sent out into the world to die and rush through Snyder's arc so they can move on? The one that practically nobody in the casual audience went to see? They don't have much of a plan for their canon, they make it up as they go along.
There's not a lot of canon they could contradict if she flies in WW84. Her powers were growing at the end of the first film and she's had some decades to hone them, and her power displays in BvS were too quick and vague that people couldn't tell if she could fly or not. That means WW84 would only contradict JL, and I think you are overestimating how much people care about that movie's continuity being honored beyond the broad strokes. If she flies in WW84, nobody in the casual audience is going to stand up and say "BUT WHY DIDN'T SHE FLY IN JL IF IT TAKES PLACE AFTER?!" because it sucked and nobody cares about it.
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;3851974]The [B]origin[/B] movie focused on her gaining her powers and gradually discovering them, Patty Jenkins has said numerous times in many interviews that the power level displayed there is not what it is going to be what she's always at. It's her trilogy and what she says goes, and she has WB by the balls pretty much because she's the only one who gave them the results they needed so far. Hence her pay raise and increased creative control.
Lol what canon are they concerned about exactly? JL, the movie they didn't have any faith in and pretty much sent out into the world to die and rush through Snyder's arc so they can move on? The one that practically nobody in the casual audience went to see? They don't have much of a plan for their canon, they make it up as they go along.
There's not a lot of canon they could contradict if she flies in WW84. Her powers were growing at the end of the first film and she's had some decades to hone them, and her power displays in BvS were too quick and vague that people couldn't tell if she could fly or not. That means WW84 would only contradict JL, and I think you are overestimating how much people care about that movie's continuity being honored beyond the broad strokes. If she flies in WW84, nobody in the casual audience is going to stand up and say "BUT WHY DIDN'T SHE FLY IN JL IF IT TAKES PLACE AFTER?!" because it sucked and nobody cares about it.[/QUOTE]
So...because Wonder Woman did well, Patty can do anything she damn well pleases? Let me know when she can retcon the entire Justice League movie, or the backwater Amazons that she created.
And who says Justice League isn't canon? Because you didn't like the movie? It still made over $600 million at the box office so there are still alot of folks who saw the movie.
And there was nothing ambiguous about Diana not being able to fly in BvS. That was jumping all the way. The only unambiguous flying/hovering that she did was the bs stuff she was doing at the end of the CGI crapfest of her solo movie. And this comes from someone who liked the movie.
So, unless you are eternally optimistic, she won't fly in WW84. There is nothing to indicate she would and it would indicate her incredible stupidity if she does fly and doesn't in Justice League.
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;3851974]The [B]origin[/B] movie focused on her gaining her powers and gradually discovering them, Patty Jenkins has said numerous times in many interviews that the power level displayed there is not what it is going to be what she's always at. It's her trilogy and what she says goes, and she has WB by the balls pretty much because she's the only one who gave them the results they needed so far. Hence her pay raise and increased creative control.
Lol what canon are they concerned about exactly? JL, the movie they didn't have any faith in and pretty much sent out into the world to die and rush through Snyder's arc so they can move on? The one that practically nobody in the casual audience went to see? They don't have much of a plan for their canon, they make it up as they go along.
There's not a lot of canon they could contradict if she flies in WW84. Her powers were growing at the end of the first film and she's had some decades to hone them, and her power displays in BvS were too quick and vague that people couldn't tell if she could fly or not. That means WW84 would only contradict JL, and I think you are overestimating how much people care about that movie's continuity being honored beyond the broad strokes. If she flies in WW84, nobody in the casual audience is going to stand up and say "BUT WHY DIDN'T SHE FLY IN JL IF IT TAKES PLACE AFTER?!" because it sucked and nobody cares about it.[/QUOTE]
I hope so even though I don't trust DC!
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;3851974]Lol what canon are they concerned about exactly? JL, the movie they didn't have any faith in and pretty much sent out into the world to die and rush through Snyder's arc so they can move on? The one that practically nobody in the casual audience went to see? They don't have much of a plan for their canon, they make it up as they go along.
There's not a lot of canon they could contradict if she flies in WW84. Her powers were growing at the end of the first film and she's had some decades to hone them, and her power displays in BvS were too quick and vague that people couldn't tell if she could fly or not. That means WW84 would only contradict JL, and I think you are overestimating how much people care about that movie's continuity being honored beyond the broad strokes. If she flies in WW84, nobody in the casual audience is going to stand up and say "BUT WHY DIDN'T SHE FLY IN JL IF IT TAKES PLACE AFTER?!" because it sucked and nobody cares about it.[/QUOTE]
That's pretty much what I'm hoping for.
[I]Justice League[/I] was a disaster and I seriously doubt Warner's going to be breathing down filmmakers' necks about upholding its continuity. Hell, for a while there was talk of using Flash's movie to retcon it out entirely.
Filmmakers generally don't care about this sort of thing unless they fear alienating the audience--and even then, they might not care that much. I mean we're getting the second [I]Halloween[/I] movie retcon later this year and I don't see anyone who made it sweating about confusing audiences by bringing Jamie Lee Curtis back.
No one's losing sleep over [I]Justice League[/I]. The only thing that will carry on is Superman not being dead anymore. The end.
Warner seems to be easing up on the shared continuity thing anyway with the whole "Worlds of DC" rebranding.
The last Matt Reeves spoke about his Batman movie, he all but said it's going to be its own thing and he's not worrying about how it fits with the other movies. We got two or three Joker movies which may or may not tie into anything. I guarantee [I]Aquaman[/I] is going to have, at most, a vague reference or throwaway line and nothing more.
So if Patty Jenkins wants Diana to fly, I don't see some exec at Warner crying about how she didn't in [I]Justice League[/I]. They already let her throw aside the "I walked away from mankind 100 years ago" thing.
Warner seems to want everyone to just forget [I]Justice League[/I].
And personally, I'll be happy to oblige them.
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[QUOTE=Geraldofrivia;3852075]I hope so even though I don't trust DC![/QUOTE]
It's wise to never put complete trust in DC/WB:).They've kinda screwed the pooch with this whole thing except her and Harley, and even then there is room for improvement for both.
But even they cannot be so stupid to be concerned with a movie that they don't give much indication they care about.
[QUOTE=Guy_McNichts;3852161]That's pretty much what I'm hoping for.
[I]Justice League[/I] was a disaster and I seriously doubt Warner's going to be breathing down filmmakers' necks about upholding its continuity. Hell, for a while there was talk of using Flash's movie to retcon it out entirely.
Filmmakers generally don't care about this sort of thing unless they fear alienating the audience--and even then, they might not care that much. I mean we're getting the second [I]Halloween[/I] movie retcon later this year and I don't see anyone who made it sweating about confusing audiences by bringing Jamie Lee Curtis back.
[B]No one's losing sleep over [I]Justice League[/I]. The only thing that will carry on is Superman not being dead anymore. The end.[/B]
Warner seems to be easing up on the shared continuity thing anyway with the whole "Worlds of DC" rebranding.
The last Matt Reeves spoke about his Batman movie, he all but said it's going to be its own thing and he's not worrying about how it fits with the other movies. We got two or three Joker movies which may or may not tie into anything. I guarantee [I]Aquaman[/I] is going to have, at most, a vague reference or throwaway line and nothing more.
So if Patty Jenkins wants Diana to fly, I don't see some exec at Warner crying about how she didn't in [I]Justice League[/I]. They already let her throw aside the "I walked away from mankind 100 years ago" thing.
Warner seems to want everyone to just forget [I]Justice League[/I].
And personally, I'll be happy to oblige them.[/QUOTE]
Yes, excellent example with the Halloween films, and the bolded is pretty dead on. Even the new Superman films (if we ever get them) will only do broad strokes to distant themselves.
And yes, Jenkins and Gadot have both voiced that they came to the creative decision that Diana wouldn't walk away from humanity and decided to change it. That line is a bigger deal than not displaying a certain power in a forgettable movie. The latter is an easier fix. If people don't care about the contradiction of the former, they won't give a crap about the latter.
Worst case? She doesn't fly in WW84 but it is still successful that a third film is a given, and we get flight in a modern say sequel. Then we'd get almost everything that matters in a self contained trilogy. The lack of Amazon tech is annoying, but such is the price of Perez's run being so influential. And much like the WW DTV or Rucka's Year One, Themyscira can look ancient at a glance but has highly advanced stuff integrated in that comes out when necessary (the Invisible Plane and a force field in the former, the jet and the Purple Ray in the latter).
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;3851084]She intercepted one of his punches with a swing of her sword, after the shield had been knocked away from her, overpowered it and then chopped the arm off.
Yeah, what a nerfed weakling she is. [B]You cannot attribute all this to the shield[/B] and the sword. Place those weapons in Batman's hand, and he still would have been completely SOL. They are not remotely effective against Doomsday without a top tier metahuman wielding them.
[/QUOTE]
I said no such thing, she's obviously got superhuman strength, however, she's substantially weaker than Superman as Justice League made abundantly clear, and it's only thanks to her shield that Wonder Woman survived the battle in one-piece
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[I][B]Do you know which character Pedro Pascal plays in WW84? Any idea?[/B]
I’ve heard Hades and I’ve heard Apollo but nothing concrete.[/I]
[url]https://twitter.com/TheComixKid/status/1031580155007750144[/url]
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3854045]I said no such thing, she's obviously got superhuman strength, however, she's substantially weaker than Superman as Justice League made abundantly clear, and it's only thanks to her shield that Wonder Woman survived the battle in one-piece[/QUOTE]
But as Vanguard pointed out, she lost the shield during the fight and got knocked around a bit, and still seemed ready to go several rounds. It helped her, but she didn't need it to survive at all. So by saying she survived in one piece thanks to it makes it sound like you're attributing her success in the fight to the shield, which is just flat out not the case.
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;3858617]But as Vanguard pointed out, she lost the shield during the fight and got knocked around a bit, and still seemed ready to go several rounds. It helped her, but she didn't need it to survive at all. So by saying she survived in one piece thanks to it makes it sound like you're attributing her success in the fight to the shield, which is just flat out not the case.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know what cut of Batman v Superman you and Vanguard saw but in the one that they released here in my country, and the rest of the world, that’s not how the scene played out. She didn’t lose her shield “midfight”, the battle was all but lost at that point, the doomy music was already playing in the background, without the shield Wonder Woman was pretty much f@£$%ed. And believe me, had this not been her silver screen debut, the fight would’ve gone the way of Death of Superman with Wonder Woman bludgeoned half to death. Perhaps that's why the superman fans were so bummed, his vast immense superiority wasn't conveyed properly. That mistake was rectified in Justice League. Btw, the smile was ad-libbed and doesn't make any sense in the context of the scene
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3859003]I don’t know what cut of Batman v Superman you and Vanguard saw but in the one that they released here in my country, and the rest of the world, that’s not how the scene played out. She didn’t lose her shield “midfight”, the battle was all but lost at that point, the doomy music was already playing in the background, without the shield Wonder Woman was pretty much screwed. And believe me, had this not been her silver screen debut, the fight would’ve gone the way of Death of Superman with Wonder Woman bludgeoned half to death. Perhaps that's why the Superman fans were so bummed, his vast immense superiority wasn't conveyed properly. That mistake was rectified in Justice League. Btw, the smile was ad-libbed and doesn't make any sense in the context of the scene[/QUOTE]
Sure it did! She's been around for 100 years and hasn't had a challenge in all that time (this is before we knew there would be a 1984 :) )
She went through that fight without getting so much as a scratch, never going down for more than a few seconds, and obviously causing Doomsday pain and damage.
She takes the full blast of his eyebeams without budging and without the shield but with the bracelets.
And the 'doomy music' plays because he grows the spike that will kill Superman (foreshadowy music)...from the arm Diana just lopped off without having the shield in hand.
In BvS Diana kicks serious butt. Likewise in Wonder Woman.
It's not until JLA that she falls short in order to elevate Superman, which is why I hate that movie and can't watch it again. Her opening scene shows superspeed/bullet time reflexes and speed and she's highly competent until Superman comes back. At that point, all of the JL could just pack up and go home since they clearly aren't needed, Diana included.
I should add, for those who haven't seen it, that Diana lays out her issues with BvS quite clearly in her open letter to Bruce ;)
[url]https://www.vox.com/2016/3/29/11323120/batman-v-superman-wonder-woman[/url]
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3859003]I don’t know what cut of Batman v Superman you and Vanguard saw but in the one that they released here in my country, and the rest of the world, that’s not how the scene played out. She didn’t lose her shield “midfight”, the battle was all but lost at that point, the doomy music was already playing in the background, without the shield Wonder Woman was pretty much f@£$%ed. And believe me, had this not been her silver screen debut, the fight would’ve gone the way of Death of Superman with Wonder Woman bludgeoned half to death. Perhaps that's why the superman fans were so bummed, his vast immense superiority wasn't conveyed properly. That mistake was rectified in Justice League. Btw, the smile was ad-libbed and doesn't make any sense in the context of the scene[/QUOTE]
Hi. Here's a video that demonstrates how your summation is incorrect.
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YabwZTXzFVs[/url]
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(Wonder Woman's versus Doomsday in BvS)
[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;3859003]Btw, the smile was ad-libbed and doesn't make any sense in the context of the scene[/QUOTE]
Oh, it makes perfect sense to me, and it is similar to Robin Wright's/Antiope's smile in the opening battle of Wonder Woman the movie: finally a proper fight!
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Do you think they will keep being back Steve ? By that I don’t mean back to life but in someway in the sequels. Maybe a flashback. I mena Pines did sign multiple picture deal