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I dunno. I can see an argument for either Jon or Conner to keep the Superboy name. But I can also see an argument for both changing it.
Jon has spent the last few years on his own, doing his own thing on his own terms, or whatever it is he's been up to. He might very well feel that he's aged beyond SuperBOY. Plus that line from Lobo about "you're a man when you decide you are" feels pretty telling. But at the same time he's Clark's son and the heir apparent to the Super-legacy. And if the Legion rumors are true it'd be stronger marketing to put a Superboy on that roster. Of course, SuperLAD works just as well within the context of the Legion and their naming practices.
Conner has always been a black sheep in the Super herd, and after being AWOL for so long he might feel that he too has grown beyond the Superboy name. But if Bendis is keeping the "doesnt grow older" plot device then it makes a lot of sense for Conner to keep Superboy as his moniker. Plus there's the larger media stuff out there, and while DC doesn't chase synergy like Marvel does they still like to line a few things up when they can.
I wouldn't be surprised if the YJ generation all went to new names. Bart is back as Impulse, Damian is well established and successful as Robin, and Jon's the new hotness as Superboy. Tim Drake had already left "Robin" partially behind him (not that Red Robin was a big step, or even a good name). And just like the NTT generation took up their own names, it'd be fitting for the YJ generation to do so as well. But if Bendis was going to change Tim from Robin, then why make him Robin again in the first place? And if Bart and Conner aren't going to keep Kid Flash and Superboy, why have Tim keep Robin?
I dunno. We'll see how it goes. I'm just happy the YJ kids are back, and while I'm still hesitant about Jon becoming a teenager, I'm interested in his "space prince" direction. Cosmic Superman is my jam and this is leaning really heavily into that sensibility, which pleases me. :D
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I wish ppl would read my damn posts, cause the mantle issue you guys have went on about now is not about SB or Jon taking superman as a hero name, but Val zod coming in and doing it, Mark my damn words folks.
I personally want Jon at 10,but bendis and DC want it both ways, so we have young and older Jon, and for the forseable future.
Names for jon
Superson
Superlad
Names for SB
Scion
Sentinel
Agent S
And yes I would rather have SB be a few years older, Atleast low end 18,high end would be 21.
Jon is all about sticking close to his dad's noir, while SB is all about getting away from it.
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[QUOTE=Prime;4209909]Speaking of...where is Kenan?[/QUOTE]Appearing in the World Journal, apparently. Teen Titan Roundhouse's Mom has heard of him.
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/lt6xZBkNVE-FRe8X-p7YAn46Ju9Cr1Iv4N7fFSrLQJATiva1sJ0apIqLhuKi1na1nezYyIJFxOh4iedzHKD_-Fti68ClYFh9jem5SUkWRwVwyvmyyC6WPLLSwDup3rEGxL7C-MTpIw=s1600[/img]
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[QUOTE=Ascended;4211210]I dunno. I can see an argument for either Jon or Conner to keep the Superboy name. But I can also see an argument for both changing it.
Jon has spent the last few years on his own, doing his own thing on his own terms, or whatever it is he's been up to. He might very well feel that he's aged beyond SuperBOY. Plus that line from Lobo about "you're a man when you decide you are" feels pretty telling. But at the same time he's Clark's son and the heir apparent to the Super-legacy. And if the Legion rumors are true it'd be stronger marketing to put a Superboy on that roster. Of course, SuperLAD works just as well within the context of the Legion and their naming practices.
Conner has always been a black sheep in the Super herd, and after being AWOL for so long he might feel that he too has grown beyond the Superboy name. But if Bendis is keeping the "doesnt grow older" plot device then it makes a lot of sense for Conner to keep Superboy as his moniker. Plus there's the larger media stuff out there, and while DC doesn't chase synergy like Marvel does they still like to line a few things up when they can.
I wouldn't be surprised if the YJ generation all went to new names. Bart is back as Impulse, Damian is well established and successful as Robin, and Jon's the new hotness as Superboy. Tim Drake had already left "Robin" partially behind him (not that Red Robin was a big step, or even a good name). And just like the NTT generation took up their own names, it'd be fitting for the YJ generation to do so as well. But if Bendis was going to change Tim from Robin, then why make him Robin again in the first place? And if Bart and Conner aren't going to keep Kid Flash and Superboy, why have Tim keep Robin?
I dunno. We'll see how it goes. I'm just happy the YJ kids are back, and while I'm still hesitant about Jon becoming a teenager, I'm interested in his "space prince" direction. Cosmic Superman is my jam and this is leaning really heavily into that sensibility, which pleases me. :D[/QUOTE]
I think Bendis is actually starting them out at 1 point and will write them moving into another.
So I see Tim moving from Robin to something like Redbird or whatever, and SB moving from superboy to something else with a S.
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[QUOTE=Flash Gordon;4210590]Jon is a child.
Nothing says he's going to become Superman. I think that is, thankfully, the point of the current stuff. Superman is the experience of Kal-El, a refugee from a doomed world. Jon isn't his father, he might not be the same stock either. He doesn't need to be shoehorned into the LoSH mythology, which would only disservice the Legion. He doesn't have to become Superman.
I'm sure he isn't going to grow up to be some tyrant, he was raised by Lois and Clark. Maybe he'll lean more towards science. Maybe philosophy. Maybe space exploration. Who knows?
Now Kon-El is a clone of Superman, so there will be some overlap. He will have the desire to be a hero, but also to do it in his own way.
So, "SUPERBOY" suits them both.[/QUOTE]
Yeah! 17 or 18 is not regarded as a child in my parts of the world. Did i say Jon was like Clark? No. That doesn't disqualify him. Jon is a second generation immigrant. He is embodiment of American dream of Clark. The sign of his Success.As long as Jon represents Clark's ideals. He can be a superman. That is just me.
Legion thing isn't me. Bendis is planning to send a Jon or Kon to legion. And even the superman thing isn't me. Bendis had been foreshadowing it in the books and interview. And i like the direction. As long as jon is given enough importance and some cool/great characterization. If it isn't a red hierring.
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[QUOTE=Naruto1996;4211024]
[IMG]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/superman/images/2/25/Superman-Secundus.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110905022908[/IMG]
[IMG]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/superman/images/0/0a/Secundus.png/revision/latest?cb=20150119194532&path-prefix=es[/IMG]
[IMG]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marvel_dc/images/3/31/Superman_Dynasty_001.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140126021544[/IMG][/QUOTE]
This what i would like to see from bendis. Him laying the ground works for "The superman dynasty" with Jon or even Kon.Jon could be "Superman the Second".
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[QUOTE=Sacred Knight;4209614]I'm more concerned with any more potential costume changes. I don't want him to go back to anything like the lazy Johns era look again.
What I would do personally is make it a thing where he's consistently changing jackets.[/QUOTE]
I just want a mix of the John's look and the 90s look.
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[QUOTE=Sacred Knight;4211036]Wouldn't Jon fit more as his heir? I mean, its all potential futures so in the end I'm not that invested, it just seems more likely it would be a biological heir. But with that said, the very fact we are talking about potential futures, I would hope such a thing would just be subtly implied either way. I wouldn't want them to actually go there beyond all shadow of a doubt.[/QUOTE]
How's Jon any more his biological heir than Conner? Half his genes come from Clark the only difference is that Conner's mom is Lex.
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[QUOTE=Midnighter;4211546]How's Jon any more his biological heir than Conner? Half his genes come from Clark the only difference is that Conner's mom is Lex.[/QUOTE]
Hey now!
Lex could be the dad and Clark could be the mom!
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I think Jon is more a heir and should push the dynasty idea forward. He came from a loving relationship Clark and Lois have and was raised by him. Course that isn't always a sure fire reason to make Jon the heir apparent, but him feeling a lot more like his dad than SB is should be.
SB has never been into capes, neither the jackets nor the t-shirts make you think he is just gonna one day throw 1 on someday. A mix of looks would be nice, kinda like the pics I posted above, making sure both have fingerless gloves and a jacket with them.
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I think Conner will be re-named, and Jon will be the new Superboy.
What superhero name would you like for Conner?
I like Kon-El. And he should wear jackets and be really cool like he is.
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As I've said elsewhere, I think Jon's gonna forego hero naming all together and go by [B]Jon Kent The Son of Superman[/B].
I won't get too in the weeds of how I think Bendis' story will make it possible for Jon to essentially make his identity public while his father maintains a secret identity. If you'd like to read the theory just let me know.
The narrative seems to be overtly pulling/progressing Jon away from the title of Superboy. Lobo's words in issue 7 (Superman), Jor-El's words in issue 6 (Man of Steel), Jon introducing himself to the Green Lanterns simply as Jon, and the apparent natural inclination all the characters so far have to avoiding the name Superboy around him out of what seems to be respect and reverence for his status.
And once the Earth joins the galactic conversation via Superman's choices and actions, they will be part of the established idea that Superman is regraded as galactic royalty. That's gonna spill over, and the very clear knowledge one of the "Superboys" is Superman's honest-to-goodness, natural born son, will be very important. I think that's part of the angle Bendis is working.
I honestly think Conner will remain Superboy. I imagine the two boys hashing out who's gonna go by what will likely have a bit of Conner wanting to hand over the name, but Jon saying it doesn't really suit him these days, and that "Jon" will do just fine.
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But Jon Kent is so young. He deserves to have a private life too like his dad. I just hope his civilian job isn't reporter as well.. Maybe a firefighter or a teacher. Or a social worker..
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[QUOTE=Superlad93;4212576]i'The narrative seems to be overtly pulling/progressing Jon away from the title of Superboy. Lobo's words in issue 7 (Superman), Jor-El's words in issue 6 (Man of Steel), Jon introducing himself to the Green Lanterns simply as Jon, and the apparent natural inclination all the characters so far have to avoiding the name Superboy around him out of what seems to be respect and reverence for his status. [/QUOTE]
I'm not so sure if the narrative really tries to imply that Jon would stop to be Superboy.
We could be reading too much into that scenes.
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[QUOTE=stargazer01;4212608]But Jon Kent is so young. He deserves to have a private life too like his dad.[/QUOTE]
But he may not even want a private life that includes a secret identity for himself. While he remains a very good and moral person who maintains a sense of humor and responsibility just as he did when he was 10, we don't know where his sensibilities who fall when it comes to secret identities.
There are also dozen of examples of superhero characters who do not maintain a secret identity, yet are well fine. Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Franklin Richards, Val Richards, the whole Fantastic Four, and Luke Cage and Jessica Jones' daughter daughter (Danielle) will grow up as simply as Danielle Cage aka Luke and Jessica's daughter.
There's also no reason why Jon will likely want a conventional job now. Ever since he was around 8, he's been shown to be basically obsessed with space. Now he's 17 and has spent 7 years out in space, and he's taken to it so well that he even uses space slang out of habit. Whatever career he picks will likely take him to the stars while keeping people safe.
[QUOTE=Konja7;4212655]I'm not so sure if the narrative really tries to imply that Jon would stop to be Superboy.
We could be reading too much in that scenes.[/QUOTE]
I'd say Lobo flat out telling him that he's a man when he decides it, and Jon very, very clearly taking the remark to heart is a pretty good indicator that it's not just guess work.
Had Jon not reacted as he did in such an overt manner, the trend of others insisting on showing respect to him a "young Superman" or "son of Superman", or Jon opting to introduce himself as Jon rather than "Superboy" while no one in space has called his dad anything but Superman, then I'd say I don't see a continued trend. But since all of those things did happen, I do see a very clear trend.
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1 Attachment(s)
Jamal Igle had a interesting idea for Conner to go by Valor:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]78820[/ATTACH]
[url]https://twitter.com/JAMALIGLE/status/1098050137446928384[/url]
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[QUOTE=Superlad93;4212656]But he may not even want a private life that includes a secret identity for himself. While he remains a very good and moral person who maintains a sense of humor and responsibility just as he did when he was 10, we don't know where his sensibilities who fall when it comes to secret identities.
There are also dozen of examples of superhero characters who do not maintain a secret identity, yet are well fine. Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Franklin Richards, Val Richards, the whole Fantastic Four, and Luke Cage and Jessica Jones' daughter daughter (Danielle) will grow up as simply as Danielle Cage aka Luke and Jessica's daughter.
There's also no reason why Jon will likely want a conventional job now. Ever since he was around 8, he's been shown to be basically obsessed with space. Now he's 17 and has spent 7 years out in space, and he's taken to it so well that he even uses space slang out of habit. Whatever career he picks will likely take him to the stars while keeping people safe.[/QUOTE]
The thing is that Conner could be in a similar situation for what we know.
At this point, it's difficult conclude what character would let Superboy mantle.
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[QUOTE=Konja7;4212671]The thing is that Conner could be in a similar situation for what we know.
At this point, it's difficult conclude what character would let Superboy mantle.[/QUOTE]
He could in theory, but I genuinely doubt it. I'd argue that Conner's name is more synonymous with the name Superboy than Jon's is, and Jon's name and status as Superman's son alone seems to be the main and only needed identifiers for the character in and out of universe.
From a storytelling perspective, so much of Jon's story is rooted in the idea of growing up. Clark and Lois' issues with the situation are rooted in that. And Jon's pride in making it through those 7 years is rooted in the idea that he had to, well, do some growing up. Jon even literally grows out of his Superboy outfit in Man of Steel issue 1, and Lois jokes about how he has to take care of himself because he's old enough now. Even Bendis' analogies for what the Kents are going through right now is rooted in the idea of a kid leaving childhood behind. I don't think Bendis would hammer home that idea so thoroughly on all sides and then say "and the world will continue to know me as Superboy."
Nah. Regardless of whatever Conner has going on, we know two things 1) someone is keeping the Superboy name and 2) Jon's story's main thrust is the idea of growing up past what you used to be. At this point of pretty comfortable saying that Conner's gonna keep the name. It's fine if you disagree. I don't mind or take it personal. It's all speculation.
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I feel like Conner will assume a new name in the tradition of Wally growing up to be Flash, Dick graduating to Nightwing, Roy graduating to Arsenal, etc.
Holding onto the Superboy name holds Conner back more than it moves him forward. Jon hasn't been around long enough to be "done" with being Superboy IMO.
But similarly, hope Conner doesn't get a clunky code name like "Troia" did. Needs to be something meaningful, not nonsensical.
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[QUOTE=Ascended;4211210]I dunno. I can see an argument for either Jon or Conner to keep the Superboy name. But I can also see an argument for both changing it.
Jon has spent the last few years on his own, doing his own thing on his own terms, or whatever it is he's been up to. He might very well feel that he's aged beyond SuperBOY. Plus that line from Lobo about "you're a man when you decide you are" feels pretty telling. But at the same time he's Clark's son and the heir apparent to the Super-legacy. And if the Legion rumors are true it'd be stronger marketing to put a Superboy on that roster. Of course, SuperLAD works just as well within the context of the Legion and their naming practices.
Conner has always been a black sheep in the Super herd, and after being AWOL for so long he might feel that he too has grown beyond the Superboy name. But if Bendis is keeping the "doesnt grow older" plot device then it makes a lot of sense for Conner to keep Superboy as his moniker. Plus there's the larger media stuff out there, and while DC doesn't chase synergy like Marvel does they still like to line a few things up when they can.
I wouldn't be surprised if the YJ generation all went to new names. Bart is back as Impulse, Damian is well established and successful as Robin, and Jon's the new hotness as Superboy. Tim Drake had already left "Robin" partially behind him (not that Red Robin was a big step, or even a good name). And just like the NTT generation took up their own names, it'd be fitting for the YJ generation to do so as well. But if Bendis was going to change Tim from Robin, then why make him Robin again in the first place? And if Bart and Conner aren't going to keep Kid Flash and Superboy, why have Tim keep Robin?
I dunno. We'll see how it goes. I'm just happy the YJ kids are back, and while I'm still hesitant about Jon becoming a teenager, I'm interested in his "space prince" direction. Cosmic Superman is my jam and this is leaning really heavily into that sensibility, which pleases me. :D[/QUOTE]
Wouldn't the black sheep of the Superman here be Cir El?
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Cir-El doesn't exist "right now" so she isnt.
I think all of you are right and wrong all at the same time,even Jamals idea could be switched up to have Jon take the Valor name when he goes into the future with the Legion, which 1 of them will be mon-el.
I think SB needs his "nightwing" graduation, and jon needs to fill the spaces present day superman can't fill, but have in past versions.
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[QUOTE=king81992;4212946]Wouldn't the black sheep of the Superman here be Cir El?[/QUOTE]
No. Because she's not a member of the Super family. She's a construct created by villains that lasted for one short run.
Power Girl is the blackest sheep of the family, but Conner's not too awfully far behind.
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[QUOTE=Ascended;4213209]No. Because she's not a member of the Super family. She's a construct created by villains that lasted for one short run.
Power Girl is the blackest sheep of the family, but Conner's not too awfully far behind.[/QUOTE]
Frankly, I'm surprised that Power Girl hasn't received a serious push yet. Her backstory is convoluted but if DC ever bothered to simplify things and push her, she would become mainstream quickly.
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I have my fingers crossed that the new name will be [B]Guardian[/B].
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4213240]I have my fingers crossed that the new name will be [B]Guardian[/B].[/QUOTE]
Scion or sentinel, that way he can keep the S. I know its probably not important to some, but I like that S shield on his chest
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[QUOTE=DragonsChi;4213240]I have my fingers crossed that the new name will be [B]Guardian[/B].[/QUOTE]Can't trademark it. It's the name of a member of Alpha Flight over at Marvel.
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I don’t know why they had to bring Connor back.
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[QUOTE=Kon93;4213481]Scion or sentinel, that way he can keep the S. I know its probably not important to some, but I like that S shield on his chest[/QUOTE]
I like sentinel, but i’m Not sure who should get the name.
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[QUOTE=protege;4213528]I don’t know why they had to bring Connor back.[/QUOTE]
Because he is immensely popular for one,just look how they are using him all over the place. He opens stories in the SUPERverse that wouldn't be opened otherwise. He is connected to pretty much ever teen team in the DCU. He is a cool guy
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[QUOTE=protege;4213528]I don’t know why they had to bring Connor back.[/QUOTE]
I'm the opposite, I don't know why they had to take him away in the first place. Damian didn't need Tim to be temporarily outright written out of continuity to take over as Robin, so doing that for Jon never made sense, and I'll never buy that anything about the New 52 Superboy was so toxic that it necessitated a break instead of just immediately restoring the old continuity/origin like they did with so many other characters. None of it has ever made a lick of sense. But I'm glad its over.
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[QUOTE=Superlad93;4212656]But he may not even want a private life that includes a secret identity for himself. While he remains a very good and moral person who maintains a sense of humor and responsibility just as he did when he was 10, we don't know where his sensibilities who fall when it comes to secret identities.
There are also dozen of examples of superhero characters who do not maintain a secret identity, yet are well fine. Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Franklin Richards, Val Richards, the whole Fantastic Four, and Luke Cage and Jessica Jones' daughter daughter (Danielle) will grow up as simply as Danielle Cage aka Luke and Jessica's daughter.
.[/QUOTE]
Actually, jon seem to love and like his personal life in school.. Etc. He was pretty much wearing the glasses and was very much a comfortable person . He loved going to school.
He was a goody two shoes, geeky and a nerd. Reading comics and mangas is one of his things. He didn't have an act like Clark though. He was just genuinely interested in things.
But, after the space travel. I could see him letting secret identity go. His attitude might even be like wonder woman is in the animated movies towards it.
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[QUOTE=Sacred Knight;4213698]I'm the opposite, I don't know why they had to take him away in the first place. Damian didn't need Tim to be temporarily outright written out of continuity to take over as Robin, so doing that for Jon never made sense, and I'll never buy that anything about the New 52 Superboy was so toxic that it necessitated a break instead of just immediately restoring the old continuity/origin like they did with so many other characters. None of it has ever made a lick of sense. But I'm glad its over.[/QUOTE]
New52 superboy sucked though. I couldn't get into him no matter what. And I tend to get into superboys wether it be clark, jon or conner pretty easily.
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New 52 superboy just needed to keep the lex as donor and creator that was looking to be a thing, until the swerve we got.
Also changed the handwaving TK for tactile TK, which we could have had when he was stuck in supermans armor
His outlook on life and personality had moments where we could almost believe he could get that old SB feel back, but they wanted a Match like guy, so we lost that also.
There was plenty of times we could have gotten back to a new 52 Kon that was what the fans wanted, but they didn't want it, so they moved on with their son of Superman idea, 1st older with JLK, then younger with JSK, now back to older with space heir.
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I’ve always maintained that Jon should have been renamed [B]Kid Superman[/B].
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[QUOTE=Rod G;4213944]I’ve always maintained that Jon should have been renamed [B]Kid Superman[/B].[/QUOTE]
Is it weird that has ring to it? It is also feels like an oxymoron. I like it.
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[QUOTE=Rod G;4213944]I’ve always maintained that Jon should have been renamed [B]Kid Superman[/B].[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=manwhohaseverything;4213959]Is it weird that has ring to it? It is also feels like an oxymoron. I like it.[/QUOTE]
I like it 2 lol
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I also like Kid Superman. I started thinking of Superman Child. :p:D
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[QUOTE=Rod G;4213944]I’ve always maintained that Jon should have been renamed [B]Kid Superman[/B].[/QUOTE]
What about Superkid?
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Maybe worth mentioning that in his Den of Geek interview regarding Jon's return in issue 7, Bendis never once calls him Superboy. Calls him Jon almost exclusively, and he specifically says [I]"he's (Jon) immensely proud of himself for getting home. [B]He kind of shows you what kind of Superman he is[/B], and then he's going to describe that in the flashbacks."[/I]
And also [I]"you're going to find out what kind of [B]man[/B] Jon is becoming"[/I]
That's not to say that he's totally independent or not in need of a guiding hand from his parents (he says as much during the interview), but, in no uncertain terms, Bendis seems to make it clear that a very real threshold has been crossed, and Jon is no longer a Superboy/child. This is why I think him electing to continue to call himself Superboy (or any child-like identifier) would be wildly inappropriate.
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In a sense I see some parallels between this and most versions of Spider-Man (be it Peter or Miles). The idea that even though the characters start their journeys as children who sidestep the greater responsibility that comes with being an adult, some inciting incident occurs that makes them rise to the occasion of manhood regardless of age.
Or as the Main Man (HA! I see what you did there Bendis) put it: [I]"yer a man when [B]you decide[/B] ta be. Ain't no one handin' out certificates or nothin'. [B]Decide[/B] to"[/I]
For classic Peter in particular, he had to decide to be a man the day his uncle died. His aunt was always sick, bills needed to be payed, and they were all they had. He couldn't just continue in the blissful ignorance of being an awkward teen.
The similarities are there with Jon. He was lost, in an awful place, separated from his last authority figure, and alone. At that moment he was made to decide if he wanted to get back to what was important to him, and what he had to become to do it.
That's why Peter and Miles were never Spider-Boy, and that's I honestly think Jon is no longer Superboy. He decided not to be.