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[QUOTE=thjan;4880751]If we were talking fine tune control, finesse, or understanding weather itself I would probably go with Storm for sure, but in terms of pure power Thor definitely trumps her. Storm has said herself that while she has to work with the elements themselves with effort and work to calm a storm, Thor could stop it with a thought. Thor does not have to manipulate or work with what is there like Storm. He can just create or stop incredible weather phenomenon without any effort and can create or stop them immediately through purely mystical means. Given enough time and effort I am sure Storm could match most of what Thor can do on a whim, but that still means Thor is on another level in terms of directly controlling the weather since he doesn't have to mess with all that work. The main reason you don't see a lot of weather feats from Thor is because he is so powerful outside of his weather control powers and usually doesn't need them. Why would he need to whip up a wide spread and destructive storm, tornado, or hurricane when a targeted super lightning bolt, Mjolnir, or even his bare fist can hit just as hard.[/QUOTE]
the difference ororo made mention to as you described above was explained by her well before her goddess/omega level reveal. I think, at least if we are to go off Hickman's definition for omega, if thor could trump her even in terms of power alone I dont think she would fit his definition of what an omega mutant is. as it currently stands ororos upper limit in regards to weather manipulation is not surmountable by any other.
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/7/75182/7016622-8388114827-39.jp.jpg[/img]
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Hhhmmm Giant size X-Men age.
For the 05ers had to be 18 or 19 seeing how when they left ,they were all off to college or gradschool or of to the work place.
And I do believe there's a panel saying the 05ers where teens who became Younger Adults. And the New X-Men were older and experience and Didn't need to learn how to control their power but hone them.
So i'd say Pete was probably 19. Ororo freash 21.(remember she's younger but very mature.) Kurt is probably between her and Scott.
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[QUOTE=BlkGldBlu;4880938]Hhhmmm Giant size X-Men age.
For the 05ers had to be 18 or 19 seeing how when they left ,they were all off to college or gradschool or of to the work place.
And I do believe there's a panel saying the 05ers where teens who became Younger Adults. And the New X-Men were older and experience and Didn't need to learn how to control their power but hone them.
So i'd say Pete was probably 19. Ororo freash 21.(remember she's younger but very mature.) Kurt is probably between her and Scott.[/QUOTE]
Oddly in my mind Storm is currently 28.
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What Len and Dave thought and what Chris thought, about their ages, was different. Len and Dave thought Peter should be the leader, and he and Ororo would date(Dave wanted Kurt to date her though), and be about the same age. Roy thought Wolverine was a teenager. Dave thought Nightcrawler was a real demon cast out from Hell. They had different ideas that didn't actually make it to the page. Also, you have to consider that comics were moving in almost realtime back then. Jean references 1969 during the Sentinel attack in NYC. When she dies at the end of the DPS, she was aged 24. But Scott was still 25 in the mid 90's, so unless the entire decade and a half from 1980-1995 only covers one year, Jean is retroactively younger during the DPS. Even now they are still about 27/28. It's a sliding timeline. It needs adjustments here and there.
Kurt turns 21 fairly early on in one of the annuals. Piotr is aged at 18 all the way in 1982 or so, when Deathbird and the Brood appear, so he could have been as young as 16 in Giant Size #1. Ororo is aged about 25 in the Cassidy Keep vs. Juggernaut story, which makes her about Scott/Jean/Warren's age. Sean is about the same age as Charles, maybe 40(old enough to have teenaged children).
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[QUOTE=BlkGldBlu;4880938]Hhhmmm Giant size X-Men age.
For the 05ers had to be 18 or 19 seeing how when they left ,they were all off to college or gradschool or of to the work place.
And I do believe there's a panel saying the 05ers where teens who became Younger Adults. And the New X-Men were older and experience and Didn't need to learn how to control their power but hone them.
So i'd say Pete was probably 19. Ororo freash 21.(remember she's younger but very mature.) Kurt is probably between her and Scott.[/QUOTE]
The O5 were early 20s by the end of the original 60s run. Havok graduated college in his first appearance (making him 20/21). Bobby was the same age as him and the rest were older
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;4880846]the difference ororo made mention to as you described above was explained by her well before her goddess/omega level reveal. I think, at least if we are to go off Hickman's definition for omega, if thor could trump her even in terms of power alone I dont think she would fit his definition of what an omega mutant is. as it currently stands ororos upper limit in regards to weather manipulation is not surmountable by any other.
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/7/75182/7016622-8388114827-39.jp.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Interesting topic. Its like based on feats I do consider Thor more powerful than Storm, but not as skilled and their power base is so different. To me it’s basically Thor achieving weather effects (almost like Meruda) through either magical/the mother storm, which isn’t true weather manipulation/atmokinesis. Its more like following the laws of of a specialized type of magic vs managing the complex collaboration of natural forces that follow the rules of the natural universe. When I think of the omega level designation for others who are more comparable based on actually manipulating the fundamental elements (i.e. Iceman, Crystal, Meggan, Electro, etc) I think Storm is the strongest in this elemental category. The sledgehammer vs scalpel comparison is very fitting between her and Thor but I think she fills both in comparison to nearly all others.
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[QUOTE=Havok83;4881183]The O5 were early 20s by the end of the original 60s run. Havok graduated college in his first appearance (making him 20/21). Bobby was the same age as him and the rest were older[/QUOTE]
I was looking for the scan I think you posted a while back that said storm was older than iceman (or colossus/kurt) but I couldnt find it. do you recall this? if so can you post it? p
[QUOTE=Wind Rider;4881218]Interesting topic. Its like based on feats I do consider Thor more powerful than Storm, but not as skilled and their power base is so different. To me it’s basically Thor achieving weather effects (almost like Meruda) through either magical/the mother storm, which isn’t true weather manipulation/atmokinesis. Its more like following the laws of of a specialized type of magic vs managing the complex collaboration of natural forces that follow the rules of the natural universe. When I think of the omega level designation for others who are more comparable based on actually manipulating the fundamental elements (i.e. Iceman, Crystal, Meggan, Electro, etc) I think Storm is the strongest in this elemental category. The sledgehammer vs scalpel comparison is very fitting between her and Thor but I think she fills both in comparison to nearly all others.[/QUOTE]
very good point and detailed observation rider!! I would agree with your latter point especially. I see her being able to use her abilities in a skillful manner, as well as destructive.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;4880843]ok... only weather related feats:
1. manipulate Earth's EM field
2. create tornado, hurricanes, wind including fly using wind currents
3. create snow storms/blizzards/hail/flash freeze
4. heat area to create fires
5. manipulate ocean mediums, water manipulation
6. sense temperature shifts
7. detect unnatural storms, weather phenomenon
8. manipulate jet stream, air pressure
9. create flash floods out of thin air
10. manipulate relative humidity to dehydrate opponents
11. manipulate air to prevent sound from permeating area.
12. condense water vapor to create fog in large areas
13. thunderstorms/lightning/thunderclap
that's all I can think of off the top of my head lol[/QUOTE]
Good List. OK.
With or Without the Hammer Thor has NEVER shown to be able to do Numbers:
1
3
4
5
8
9
10
11
12
This Speaks for itself.
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[QUOTE=Wind Rider;4881218]Interesting topic. Its like based on feats I do consider Thor more powerful than Storm, but not as skilled and their power base is so different. [B]To me it’s basically Thor achieving weather effects (almost like Meruda) through either magical/the mother storm, which isn’t true weather manipulation/atmokinesis. [/B]Its more like following the laws of of a specialized type of magic vs managing the complex collaboration of natural forces that follow the rules of the natural universe. When I think of the omega level designation for others who are more comparable based on actually manipulating the fundamental elements (i.e. Iceman, Crystal, Meggan, Electro, etc) I think Storm is the strongest in this elemental category. The sledgehammer vs scalpel comparison is very fitting between her and Thor but I think she fills both in comparison to nearly all others.[/QUOTE]
To the BOLD:
EXACTLY. You hit the Nail on the Head.
To the Rest of the Comment:
Well, said and good point. Never really looked at it that way, but cool.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;4881377]I was looking for the scan I think you posted a while back that said storm was older than iceman (or colossus/kurt) but I couldnt find it. do you recall this? if so can you post it? p
[/QUOTE]
I didnt post a scan but I have this which is the earliest indication of her age
[img]https://i.imgur.com/EzzqiQi.jpg[/img]
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[QUOTE=Wind Rider;4881218]Interesting topic. Its like based on feats I do consider Thor more powerful than Storm, but not as skilled and their power base is so different. To me it’s basically Thor achieving weather effects (almost like Meruda) through either magical/the mother storm, which isn’t true weather manipulation/atmokinesis. Its more like following the laws of of a specialized type of magic vs managing the complex collaboration of natural forces that follow the rules of the natural universe. When I think of the omega level designation for others who are more comparable based on actually manipulating the fundamental elements (i.e. Iceman, Crystal, Meggan, Electro, etc) I think Storm is the strongest in this elemental category. The sledgehammer vs scalpel comparison is very fitting between her and Thor but I think she fills both in comparison to nearly all others.[/QUOTE]
To me, Storm's powers go deeper as she can manipulate subatomic particles to create weather affects. Whereas Thor just cheats and use [B]Magic[/B] ([I][U]the universal cheat code[/U][/I]) to accomplish similar feats.
This is the main reason why I never really considered him an elemental...he doesn't have a connection to his element. The weather just does what he say because of the Mother of Thunder/Storm.
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[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;4881807]To me, Storm's powers go deeper as she can manipulate subatomic particles to create weather affects. Whereas Thor just cheats and use [B]Magic[/B] ([I][U]the universal cheat code[/U][/I]) to accomplish similar feats.
This is the main reason why I never really considered him an elemental...he doesn't have a connection to his element. The weather just does what he say because of the Mother of Thunder/Storm.[/QUOTE]
Exactly.
Which Begs the question is he even manipulating weather at all? I mean the Mother Storm seems to be doing everything. I think this point can be made when you look at the feats he's done without the Hammer.
And quite frankly..............he can't do anything but make Lightning and rain.
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[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;4881807]To me, Storm's powers go deeper as she can manipulate subatomic particles to create weather affects. Whereas Thor just cheats and use [B]Magic[/B] ([I][U]the universal cheat code[/U][/I]) to accomplish similar feats.
This is the main reason why I never really considered him an elemental...he doesn't have a connection to his element. The weather just does what he say because of the Mother of Thunder/Storm.[/QUOTE]
Exactatiously.
Which is why that poorly written and contrived 'list' is so much rubbish.
You have a selection of Elementals and Crystal is not even numbered?
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[QUOTE=stormphoenix;4881425]Good List. OK.
With or Without the Hammer Thor has NEVER shown to be able to do Numbers:
1
3
4
5
8
9
10
11
12
This Speaks for itself.[/QUOTE]
are you certain of this?? how can anyone argue that he is stronger when he hasn't done some of the basic aspects of her power set?
[QUOTE=Havok83;4881669]I didnt post a scan but I have this which is the earliest indication of her age
[img]https://i.imgur.com/EzzqiQi.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
I had a scan from when she got bit by Dracula that placed her in her mids to eaky 20s. I would imagine she was in her 20s based upon this when she was recruited but
[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;4881807]To me, Storm's powers go deeper as she can manipulate subatomic particles to create weather affects. Whereas Thor just cheats and use [B]Magic[/B] ([I][U]the universal cheat code[/U][/I]) to accomplish similar feats.
This is the main reason why I never really considered him an elemental...he doesn't have a connection to his element. The weather just does what he say because of the Mother of Thunder/Storm.[/QUOTE]
interesting point. take his powers with the mother storm (via his hammer) away. doesnt he still have the ability to control the weather? wouldnt this mean he has a deeper connection to the weather?
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;4881911]are you certain of this?? how can anyone argue that he is stronger when he hasn't done some of the basic aspects of her power set?
[/QUOTE]
Do your research like I have.
I'll wait.....because I can guarantee he hasn't.
