[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021373][url]https://www.cbr.com/x-men-logan-storm-good-bad-couple/[/url][/QUOTE]
Not great but all decent points. Storm and Wolverine are my second favorite ship after Black Panther and Storm.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021373][url]https://www.cbr.com/x-men-logan-storm-good-bad-couple/[/url][/QUOTE]
Not great but all decent points. Storm and Wolverine are my second favorite ship after Black Panther and Storm.
[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;5021499]Not great but all decent points. Storm and Wolverine are my second favorite ship after Black Panther and Storm.[/QUOTE]
That’s pretty much my take.
Outside the X-Men, I like her with T’Challa, inside the X-Men, I like the respect between Ororo and Logan.
[SIZE=1]and it feeds into my fannish OT3, but that’s my personal little non-canon corner of fandom and I don’t expect it in the comics happy to keep it in my fanfic[/SIZE]
In my headcanon Wolverine asked Storm to part of the throuple/quad situation and she was just like "I'm good..."
[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;5021499]Not great but all decent points. Storm and Wolverine are my second favorite ship after Black Panther and Storm.[/QUOTE]
to bp and storm being your favorite ship I 100% agree but to that first part regarding wolverine:
[img]https://media.tenor.com/images/d4c37b04a61ff91a4e24b7dcca1a8d2e/tenor.gif[/img]
[QUOTE=Kingdom X;5021515]In my headcanon Wolverine asked Storm to part of the throuple/quad situation and she was just like "I'm good..."[/QUOTE]
lmfao right???? my sentiments exactly.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021564]to bp and storm being your favorite ship I 100% agree but to that first part regarding wolverine:
[img]https://media.tenor.com/images/d4c37b04a61ff91a4e24b7dcca1a8d2e/tenor.gif[/img]
lmfao right???? my sentiments exactly.[/QUOTE]
LOL, blame the first X-Men animate series
maybe I need to actually read it on the panels but the idea of Wolverine and Storm together just always felt weird to say the least, to me.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5016854]It's exactly as Wyngarde said, she was confined to the moral cage for her entire life up to that point and wyngarde stripped her from it. just as xavier knew it was wrong to lost for a teenage jean he never acted upon it or told her locking it away deep within his mind. I think the same can be said with her desires to want to fall for a villain or even kill, scott included.
nevertheless, I'm just quoting the facts from canon. jean could simply apologize and recognize as she did in that second panel that the actions she exhibited were her own. is that too hard to do for a woman she calls her best friend?[/QUOTE]
Again with that???
I know you really don't like Jean, but coming up with that story every few months is getting so old...
[QUOTE=LordAllMIghty;5021583]LOL, blame the first X-Men animate series[/QUOTE]
lololol bye.
[QUOTE=franckd;5021656]Again with that???
I know you really don't like Jean, but coming up with that story every few months is getting so old...[/QUOTE]
what does me not liking jean have to do with appreciating storm? if you dont like posts questioning how a white character who is supposed to be a black one's best friends sees her as a slave is a relevant topic (as well as problematic one) in Storms appreciation thread especially in the era of BLM movement you can simply ignore or go to other threads. there are plenty to choose from :)
[img]https://blog.studentlifenetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/giphy-73.gif[/img]
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021798]lololol bye.
what does me not liking jean have to do with appreciating storm? if you dont like posts questioning how a white character who is supposed to be a black one's best friends sees her as a slave is a relevant topic (as well as problematic one) in Storms appreciation thread especially in the era of BLM movement you can simply ignore or go to other threads. there are plenty to choose from :)
[img]https://blog.studentlifenetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/giphy-73.gif[/img][/QUOTE]
It's not about what I like or not. It's that you constantly bring this topic, even if it's been talked to death many time. It's like you enjoy labelling Jean as a racist, and reducing her to that. What's the point? Disliking Jean helps you to appreciate Storm?
[QUOTE=franckd;5021808]It's not about what I like or not. It's that you constantly bring this topic, even if it's been talked to death many time. It's like you enjoy labelling Jean as a racist, and reduced her to that.[/QUOTE]
you dont think there are redundant topics occurring in other threads especially during this shortage of new material? how about dishwasher gloves? how Hickman doesnt like certain characters? I'm sure you've seen these a few times in some of your more frequented threads
at any rate, did jean not view ororo as a slave who was bound and whipped for the color of her skin? it's not about me enjoying it or reducing her to anything. its simply stating the canonical facts which I know is bothersome considering you are a jean fan but again what does any of this have to do with appreciating the one and only true goddess of the xmen?
let's praise her I thought we had moved on from discussing what you brought back up:
[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbN8BmUVAAArkzV?format=jpg&name=large[/img]
[img]https://static0.cbrimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/7-Storm-Bonds-With-Acanti.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=740&h=493[/img]
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021814]you dont think there are redundant topics occurring in other threads especially during this shortage of new material? how about dishwasher gloves? how Hickman doesnt like certain characters? I'm sure you've seen these a few times in some of your more frequented threads
at any rate, did jean not view ororo as a slave who was bound and whipped for the color of her skin? it's not about me enjoying it or reducing her to anything. its simply stating the facts but again what does any of this have to do with appreciating the one and only true goddess of the xmen?[/QUOTE]
It's just that hating a character seems stupid to me. Whoever the character is stupid. Like those Emma haters, who constantly bring her down in favor of their favorites...
Now I'd like to know if you always hated Jean, because of what happened during the Dark Phoenix Saga, or did that event was just an excuse to hate her more?
EDIT : you're actually reducing Jean to that event : for you, their friendship is fake because of that.
Yet, in that space shuttle, Jean was ready to gave her life to save her friends. Jean would give her life to save Orororo, as Ororo would give her to saves Jean's. Not bad for a racist or a fake friend, I suppose. Especially knowing than most non-racist people would surely not sacrifice their lives for some others.
[QUOTE=franckd;5021819]It's just that hating a character seems stupid to me. Whoever the character is stupid. Like those Emma haters, who constantly bring her down in favor of their favorites...
Now I'd like to know if you always hated Jean, because of what happened during the Dark Phoenix Saga, or did that event was just an excuse to hate her more?[/QUOTE]
more appreciation of the power of storm the hadari yao:
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/6/64880/6393591-2869887712-63871.jpg[/img]
[img]https://66.media.tumblr.com/dc0ccabcf8a8ba35181b83433e524e0a/tumblr_plja1b5mPt1sgv6ia_1280.jpg[/img]
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/QdbE5p7dvZKu-kwMqidi0MlBYVuwTuzKuoYhNbYTMFfyTC0qKXBZhEfD65H7qIFgjbvHzjcyAcmntyScL63eIn2eCdWx4OKXoXX0V2AaaJX6cAZLSOSsqWZKkQ7VEDmP4ylHPtr5lA=s1600[/img]
dont you just love this? all powerful no gimmicks, no accessories, or possession necessary to achieve such power!!!
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021814]you dont think there are redundant topics occurring in other threads especially during this shortage of new material? how about dishwasher gloves? [/QUOTE]
Of course, hating a character is exactly the same thing than hating a fashion item... Great logic.
I Mean, I suppose we can hate black or white people like we can hate speedos or hats. Exactly the same thing.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021829]more appreciation of the power of storm the hadari yao:
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/6/64880/6393591-2869887712-63871.jpg[/img]
[img]https://66.media.tumblr.com/dc0ccabcf8a8ba35181b83433e524e0a/tumblr_plja1b5mPt1sgv6ia_1280.jpg[/img]
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/QdbE5p7dvZKu-kwMqidi0MlBYVuwTuzKuoYhNbYTMFfyTC0qKXBZhEfD65H7qIFgjbvHzjcyAcmntyScL63eIn2eCdWx4OKXoXX0V2AaaJX6cAZLSOSsqWZKkQ7VEDmP4ylHPtr5lA=s1600[/img]
dont you just love this? all powerful no gimmicks, no accessories, or possession necessary to achieve such power!!![/QUOTE]
But back to the relationship drama, wasn't there a really big shipper of Ororo and Logan here? I think it was RJALMAAR or something spelled like that, I can't quite remember.
I've grown to like Ororo and Logan together and it wasn't just the TAS that put them together. They were sleeping together in the Outback days, they were a couple (I think) in X-Men: The End, they were a couple in X-Men: Days of Future Past (although apparently their couple scenes were deleted), and then they were a couple again after Ororo's marriage to T'Challa was annulled. I never realized they were together so often. I'm confused about why Claremont seemed to want to make them endgame but then he also wanted Logan/Jean as endgame, unless the plan was always a poly ship between the three lol.
Also wasn't there a big Ororo/Yukio shipper here or was it someone who denied Ororo's bisexuality?
[QUOTE=whitecrown;5021847]But back to the relationship drama, wasn't there a really big shipper of Ororo and Logan here? I think it was RJALMAAR or something spelled like that, I can't quite remember.
I've grown to like Ororo and Logan together and it wasn't just the TAS that put them together. They were sleeping together in the Outback days, they were a couple (I think) in X-Men: The End, they were a couple in X-Men: Days of Future Past (although apparently their couple scenes were deleted), and then they were a couple again after Ororo's marriage to T'Challa was annulled. I never realized they were together so often. I'm confused about why Claremont seemed to want to make them endgame but then he also wanted Logan/Jean as endgame, unless the plan was always a poly ship between the three lol.
Also wasn't there a big Ororo/Yukio shipper here or was it someone who denied Ororo's bisexuality?[/QUOTE]
yea my boo loved him some Logan and storm. I couldnt stand the pairing but hey we all have our opinions lol
yea logan and ororo had a lot of flirtatious moments prior to their relationship by aaron. my biggest problem with the Logan pairing is that he has repeatedly shown that ororo is only a consideration when women he truly love are not in the picture. I think she deserves the best in all aspects including the love life.
as far as yukio, chile dont get me started there. there are some who see her as storms true love but I disagree here as well.
here's some more storm appreciation:
here are some of my favorite feats:
[img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/UMxMVqUZQA_PpMYxuQSs7dYMBSc65kqGGl4PL9rc2xtw3Frt7Ksc-qoZBXzoB8Ljp6RFI7Lnure9=s1600[/img]
[img]https://66.media.tumblr.com/a1ab618c361fb1d8c6d352aa205c0402/tumblr_nqqcwccpgv1sde1x1o5_400.jpg[/img]
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/1mAGjayzxzj_Smc0RyVlwWYbuUnWk2YBPU4-56epikd86ZQqzlFwIMUc_6fJsgVNU4EcCXYJeZ_d=s1600[/img]
and here are some more of my favorite moments which just so happen to include jean:
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/3/30174/680592-10454180oo9.jpg[/img]
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5SEyfY1P5y8/VxSiUTbtwCI/AAAAAAAAEpM/qrcGuVSnd0EX0GcuYvFhdAdR9GGjdO4cQCCo/s1600-Ic42/RCO008.jpg[/img]
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/3/30174/639380-xxm9pg11ab9.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021873]here's some more storm appreciation:
here are some of my favorite feats:
[img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/UMxMVqUZQA_PpMYxuQSs7dYMBSc65kqGGl4PL9rc2xtw3Frt7Ksc-qoZBXzoB8Ljp6RFI7Lnure9=s1600[/img]
[img]https://66.media.tumblr.com/a1ab618c361fb1d8c6d352aa205c0402/tumblr_nqqcwccpgv1sde1x1o5_400.jpg[/img]
[img]https://2.bp.blogspot.com/1mAGjayzxzj_Smc0RyVlwWYbuUnWk2YBPU4-56epikd86ZQqzlFwIMUc_6fJsgVNU4EcCXYJeZ_d=s1600[/img][/QUOTE]
The Arkon storyline with Perez on art (iirc) - love this storyline with Ororo - thanks for posting it!
All those Storm solo moments, and Storm & Jean moments are great indeed.
Anyway, thanks for you love and passion for Storm. I sincerely think it's great to have a passion for a character.
I will just say, if that maters, than I will always love Ororo's arc with the Morlock. Being an X-woman, a Goddess and a Queen is indeed great.
[QUOTE=orionblue;5021893]The Arkon storyline with Perez on art (iirc) - love this storyline with Ororo - thanks for posting it![/QUOTE]
you're very welcome beloved it was indeed a great storyline. I miss Claremont from this era.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021857]yea my boo loved him some Logan and storm. I couldnt stand the pairing but hey we all have our opinions lol
yea logan and ororo had a lot of flirtatious moments prior to their relationship by aaron. my biggest problem with the Logan pairing is that he has repeatedly shown that ororo is only a consideration when women he truly love are not in the picture. I think she deserves the best in all aspects including the love life.
as far as yukio, chile dont get me started there. there are some who see her as storms true love but I disagree here as well.[/QUOTE]
I'm enjoying it and I think it works pretty well so keep on going!
And btw, as you've probably figured out, I'm one of the biggest Jeans fans there is and I don't think you've said anything wrong or unjustified about her.
And yes, my main issue with Logan/Ororo is because other love interests like Jean, Mariko, or even Rose are elevated in his life and I've never seen Ororo treated that way. Even a two-bit character like Silver Fox has gotten more attention with him than Ororo. If a proper writer would elevate her status in his life and treat her like the queen she is, then I would be more for it.
I don't see them as true loves but I'm okay with them being paired together. T'Challa was just a footnote in Ororo's life with that one Claremont issue until they were suddenly married so if a proper writer gave Ororo and Yukio the time to develop as a couple, it would feel more legitimate.
I will always have a soft spot for Paul Smith's Ororo. Maybe because at the time, he was one of the very artist to draw her with real ethnic features. At last, Storm was beautiful, and actually didn't look like an european model with black skin.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]97895[/ATTACH]
And the moment, she caught that knife, battled Callisto, , stabbed her, and went away, walking was such an iconic moment...
[QUOTE=whitecrown;5021906]I'm enjoying it and I think it works pretty well so keep on going!
And btw, as you've probably figured out, I'm one of the biggest Jeans fans there is and I don't think you've said anything wrong or unjustified about her.
And yes, my main issue with Logan/Ororo is because other love interests like Jean, Mariko, or even Rose are elevated in his life and I've never seen Ororo treated that way. Even a two-bit character like Silver Fox has gotten more attention with him than Ororo. If a proper writer would elevate her status in his life and treat her like the queen she is, then I would be more for it.
I don't see them as true loves but I'm okay with them being paired together. T'Challa was just a footnote in Ororo's life with that one Claremont issue until they were suddenly married so if a proper writer gave Ororo and Yukio the time to develop as a couple, it would feel more legitimate.[/QUOTE]
lololol its giving me reasons to share some of my favorite moments of my girl so I dont mind.
I know you love Jean and I love the fact you are able to acknowledge this. I really heart you boo!! Nevertheless, I stay within this thread mainly for a reason because I love storm and appreciate her. Sometimes that appreciation bares stating unfavorable facts about other characters. I dont have problem with anyone loving their faves but let's not act as if what I'm saying isnt canon.
ooh you bring up a great point:
[img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/6TXkRhzyYP20pVJn1pe2XUzRAXbo7K3goKXhJcaDH_0qbdJEwE-7ELQ8nToUUISOheeCioFJHQ3C=s1600[/img]
this was one of the many reasons I cant get on board with him and her being a thing. I love the more as friends
yea I think there are a few yukio/ororo shippers here so you are in good company. I'm not sure you can tell from.my posts but I'm a tchalla/proto shipper for life. lol
As an X-Men fan and a Jean Grey fan, it has always been important to me to see such as strong friendship between Storm and Jean. This is something that at the time was ground breaking and broke down certain perceptions that young readers may have had in 1970s USA. Jean also was roommates with Misty Night during that same time period and was a progressive young white woman.
I agree that it has been a missed opportunity by writers and editors alike to not have Jean and Storm discussed the horrific Mind Rape and physical Rape Jean suffered at the hands of Mastermind, being that they are like sisters, but then again Jean had committed suicide and remained dead for years in the aftermath of the Dark Phoenix Saga. I like to imagine that Storm would have forgiven Jean, considering Jean was systematically coerced and seduced by Mastermind for over a year in Marvel time before she finally succumbed to his manipulations, and despite this they have rein friends over the years through all of JeanÂ’s death. It is unfortunate that Jean has been dead so often and so long that certain plot points have been overlooked by editorial.
Even with the retcons that infers the Jean that was Phoenix was not the really Jean (who was at the bottom of Jamaica Bay) I donÂ’t see why especially at this time with BLM that any fan would label Jean as a racist when she has been clearly always an ally. These are not real people, they are fictional characters, but petty and divisive acts within fandom by real people only divide us more.
There is a enough racism and sexism in comics, even if not overtly intended, that we should be beyond this. Sorry to crash your Thread.
[IMG]https://mlpnk72yciwc.i.optimole.com/w:600/h:595/q:auto/https://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/jean-3.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021885]and here are some more of my favorite moments which just so happen to include jean:
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/3/30174/639380-xxm9pg11ab9.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
You know seeing the wonderful aipt this week and then this moment i thought it's kind of interesting Storm's most close friends are telepaths. I wonder if they find it easier to be around her because they actually have to try to read her mind. It must be so liberating for them to have a friend they actually have to wonder about.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5021885]and here are some more of my favorite moments which just so happen to include jean:
[img]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/3/30174/639380-xxm9pg11ab9.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
I loved this TK power stunt that Jean subtly pulled with Ororo's hair from halfway around the world.
[QUOTE=otipep_90;5021968]As an X-Men fan and a Jean Grey fan, it has always been important to me to see such as strong friendship between Storm and Jean. This is something that at the time was ground breaking and broke down certain perceptions that young readers may have had in 1970s USA. Jean also was roommates with Misty Night during that same time period and was a progressive young white woman.
I agree that it has been a missed opportunity by writers and editors alike to not have Jean and Storm discussed the horrific Mind Rape and physical Rape Jean suffered at the hands of Mastermind, being that they are like sisters, but then again Jean had committed suicide and remained dead for years in the aftermath of the Dark Phoenix Saga. I like to imagine that Storm would have forgiven Jean, considering Jean was systematically coerced and seduced by Mastermind for over a year in Marvel time before she finally succumbed to his manipulations, and despite this they have rein friends over the years through all of JeanÂ’s death. It is unfortunate that Jean has been dead so often and so long that certain plot points have been overlooked by editorial.
Even with the retcons that infers the Jean that was Phoenix was not the really Jean (who was at the bottom of Jamaica Bay) I donÂ’t see why especially at this time with BLM that any fan would label Jean as a racist when she has been clearly always an ally. These are not real people, they are fictional characters, but petty and divisive acts within fandom by real people only divide us more.
There is a enough racism and sexism in comics, even if not overtly intended, that we should be beyond this. Sorry to crash your Thread.
[IMG]https://mlpnk72yciwc.i.optimole.com/w:600/h:595/q:auto/https://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/jean-3.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I've been posting online about x-men off and on since I was 19 years old. I'm 38 now. The one constant I wish we could change is the needless fandom factions fighting each other especially to those die hard fans of popular X-women. When I first began posting on x-men message boards it was Psylocke fans vs Jean fans, Maddie fans vs Jean fans, Storm fans vs Jean fans (and vice versa for each), endless debates about who was more powerful or more important, or fans simply wanting their fav to be featured more than the other female character. It is reductive and absurd. It was almost like you couldn't be a die hard fan of more than one main X-woman. Of course in the early 2000s began the Emma vs Jean (and vice versa).
In the X-men stories, there isn't much drama between X-women (save some with Jean and Emma). Storm and Jean are portrayed as close friends and have a sister like relationship. There is no need to compare them in terms of power because they have different power sets. Both are important to the mythos but in different ways. Storm is an awesomely powerful omega weather manipulator. She's a regal goddess but also a badass street fighter. She is an X-men leader. Storm takes nothing away from Jean and Jean takes nothing away from Storm. I've said this before to some Emma fans who were ticked that Jean is often portrayed as more powerful in terms of telepathy, but Emma is still a badass telepath. Jean being more powerful does not diminish Emma in any significant way. At least with these two I can understand the competitiveness to an extent since both are telepaths.
Again, I agree the Dark Phoenix stuff is problematic and would not fly today. Claremont made a poor choice to convey Jean's corruption. I doubt if they will ever go back to the story and reconcile it in any meaningful way (would prob explain it as others have that it was showing the full effect of Mastermind's manipulation and that Jean/Phoenix had become the character Mastermind was creating for her in his illusion).
[QUOTE=MechaJeanix;5022102]
Again, I agree the Dark Phoenix stuff is problematic and would not fly today. Claremont made a poor choice to convey Jean's corruption. I doubt if they will ever go back to the story and reconcile it in any meaningful way (would prob explain it as others have that it was showing the full effect of Mastermind's manipulation and that Jean/Phoenix had become the character Mastermind was creating for her in his illusion).[/QUOTE]
It would be interesting to have Chris Claremont opinion about that. Did he really intended to write Jean as a closeted racist, or if it was all Mastermind.
As I said, saying that Ororo and Jean are fakes friends because of the DPS is... reductive. A fake friend wouldn't sacrifice his/her life for the other.
[QUOTE=franckd;5022113]It would be interesting to have Chris Claremont opinion about that. Did he really intended to write Jean as a closeted racist, or if it was all Mastermind.
As I said, saying that Ororo and Jean are fakes friends because of the DPS is... reductive. A fake friend wouldn't sacrifice his/her life for the other.[/QUOTE]
At this point I don’t think this storyline is ever going to be addressed, but for all it’s worth Jean can care about Ororo and still have implicit bias towards her. I don’t think that anyone is arguing that Jean is a raging racist but that doesn’t mean that she can’t have preconceived notions about black people (that wouldn’t have been helped by the fact that Charle’s first group of X-Men were all pretty white people).
[QUOTE=Kingdom X;5022434]At this point I don’t think this storyline is ever going to be addressed, but for all it’s worth Jean can care about Ororo and still have implicit bias towards her. I don’t think that anyone is arguing that Jean is a raging racist but that doesn’t mean that she can’t have preconceived notions about black people (that wouldn’t have been helped by the fact that Charle’s first group of X-Men were all pretty white people).[/QUOTE]
Interesting. You know, I am trying to understand the context of the story, and the history context of the time it was written.
Mastermind displaced Jean's mind in a time where black people were only treated and perceived as slaves. Is that time in history was ugly? Of course, there is absolutely no doubt about it.
Now, If Mastermind displaced Jean's mind in Wakanda, would she have seen Ororo as a slave?
[QUOTE=franckd;5022113]It would be interesting to have Chris Claremont opinion about that. Did he really intended to write Jean as a closeted racist, or if it was all Mastermind.
As I said, saying that Ororo and Jean are fakes friends because of the DPS is... reductive. A fake friend wouldn't sacrifice his/her life for the other.[/QUOTE]
There's really no need to explain it. Because...
1: It's decades ago. Storm, Jean have clearly moved way past that fictional moment.
2: It does aptly show Mastermind's reprehensible nature and power and influence. He corrupted Jean's mind and memories to the point where her truest friends were less than nothing to her. As a Black woman living in the era, "less than" meant slave.
3: It's a testimonial to the strength of their friendship...that Storm does not hold that moment against her.
[font=Palatino Linotype][color=navy][size=3]Folks, leave other forum members or disparaging talk about other fans out of your posts. Stay focused on the characters and comics.[/size][/color][/font]
[QUOTE=Devaishwarya;5022475]There's really no need to explain it. Because...
1: It's decades ago. Storm, Jean have clearly moved way past that fictional moment, unfortunately the same cannot be said of some readers.
2: It does aptly show Mastermind's reprehensible nature and power and influence. He corrupted Jean's mind and memories to the point where her truest friends were less than nothing to her. As a Blac woman living in the era, "less than" meant slave.[/QUOTE]
Especially has it's canon that Ororo feels Jean like her sister. As one of her best friends if not best friend. It was something I really loved during the CC era : two strong women, being so close, no rivalry. I actually was a big fan of both characters. Then, with some others writers taking other, It was not quite the same. That's why it was such a nice touch, when Jonathan Hickman acknowledged this inferno moment...
[IMG]https://mlpnk72yciwc.i.optimole.com/cqhiHLc-ytc6VDSj/w:382/h:378/q:75/https://bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/jean-3.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://mlpnk72yciwc.i.optimole.com/cqhiHLc-wWTOgWvz/w:382/h:201/q:75/https://bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/jean-1.jpg[/IMG]
Exactatiously.
Bad shyt happens to the X-Men...all the time...that causes them to turn on each other. DP, Archangel, Onslaught, Wolverine stabbed Rachel through her heart...just to name a few.
Yet still, they are a family and continue to be so to one another. In the grand scheme of X-Lore and especially now with Krakoa, that panel is not at all important.
[QUOTE=Devaishwarya;5022508]Exactatiously.
Bad shyt happens to the X-Men...all the time...that causes them to turn on each other. DP, Archangel, Onslaught, Wolverine stabbed Rachel through her heart...just to name a few.
Yet still, they are a family and continue to be so to one another. In the grand scheme of X-Lore and especially now with Krakoa, that panel is not at all important.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. And what matters at the end of the day, is what Ororo feels. And so far, she never ever brought up that she might or might no see Jean as a closeted racist : the subject never was brought and Ororo never hated Jean, never hold a grudge against her. And never blamed her for her Black Queen or Dark Phoenix days.
[QUOTE=otipep_90;5021968]As an X-Men fan and a Jean Grey fan, it has always been important to me to see such as strong friendship between Storm and Jean. This is something that at the time was ground breaking and broke down certain perceptions that young readers may have had in 1970s USA. Jean also was roommates with Misty Night during that same time period and was a progressive young white woman.
I agree that it has been a missed opportunity by writers and editors alike to not have Jean and Storm discussed the horrific Mind Rape and physical Rape Jean suffered at the hands of Mastermind, being that they are like sisters, but then again Jean had committed suicide and remained dead for years in the aftermath of the Dark Phoenix Saga. I like to imagine that Storm would have forgiven Jean, considering Jean was systematically coerced and seduced by Mastermind for over a year in Marvel time before she finally succumbed to his manipulations, and despite this they have rein friends over the years through all of JeanÂ’s death. It is unfortunate that Jean has been dead so often and so long that certain plot points have been overlooked by editorial.
Even with the retcons that infers the Jean that was Phoenix was not the really Jean (who was at the bottom of Jamaica Bay) I donÂ’t see why especially at this time with BLM that any fan would label Jean as a racist when she has been clearly always an ally. These are not real people, they are fictional characters, but petty and divisive acts within fandom by real people only divide us more.
There is a enough racism and sexism in comics, even if not overtly intended, that we should be beyond this. Sorry to crash your Thread.
[IMG]https://mlpnk72yciwc.i.optimole.com/w:600/h:595/q:auto/https://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/jean-3.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I'm sure Ororo would have forgiven Jean for harboring such ideas but to say she had a black roommate doesnt dissolve her from those thoughts about Ororo, just as saving the lives of people many times over didnt dissolve her of destroying the D'bari home planet.
I dont ever expect it to be addressed as these topics can be a bit too heavy for writers to address in today's world but it would be nice to see such heavy topics addressed. I mean we did see Xavier's attraction for a teenage Jean addressed during the onslaught saga;
[img]https://external-preview.redd.it/ZKoFFv810oAHd-JDPWKn0sTuMNlJsyr5FuOwPkZgeNs.jpg?auto=webp&41a8121c[/img]
As Ororo's friend, I think just as she has addressed other wrongs the Phoenix did it would make sense for her to address this very personal and direct hatred she had towards her.
At any rate some beautiful Storm art:
[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbQnlqYX0AAzceO?format=jpg&name=medium[/img]
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5022816]I'm sure Ororo would have forgiven Jean for harboring such ideas but to say she had a black roommate doesnt dissolve her from those thoughts about Ororo, just as saving the lives of people many times over didnt dissolve her of destroying the D'bari home planet.
I dont ever expect it to be addressed as these topics can be a bit too heavy for writers to address in today's world but it would be nice to see such heavy topics addressed. I mean we did see Xavier's attraction for a teenage Jean addressed during the onslaught saga;
As Ororo's friend, I think just as she has addressed other wrongs the Phoenix did it would make sense for her to address this very personal and direct hatred she had towards her.[/QUOTE]
I also think it's important to note that Storm was not (and rarely has been) written by black writers. Few writers would be able to grasp the unique trauma that comes from racist incidents, especially those that come from loved ones. Again, I'm not in the "Jean is an evil racist boat," but I'm more interested in how Storm internalized those events as a member of multiple oppressed groups.
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5022819]At any rate some beautiful Storm art:
[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbQnlqYX0AAzceO?format=jpg&name=medium[/img][/QUOTE]
Utterly gorgeous. New wall art. I love the fabric.
She really look like an African diety.
And that SKIN!!! Uugghhhh......drool
[QUOTE=butterflykyss;5022819]At any rate some beautiful Storm art:
[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbQnlqYX0AAzceO?format=jpg&name=medium[/img][/QUOTE]
Storm in full goddess mode.