Dick Grayson: Robin / Nightwing Appreciation 2020

[QUOTE=Ascended;4952204]I'm definitely going to check out whatever this ends up being.

Yeah,[B] I'm concerned that this will just be more Bat-lite crap[/B]. The last things I wanted to see in Nightwing is the Bat cowl and Gotham. But Snyder writes a good Dick Grayson, and if this story is hitting all the major eras of Dick's career then there's gonna be something here for all of us. That's pretty great, and after putting up with Ric for two years all of us deserve at least a taste of our favorite Grayson. I really don't want more DickBats; after Ric all I want is quality Nightwing. But Snyder writes a good Grayson and anything is better than what we've had lately.[/QUOTE]

Snyder talked about it in the interview and it's something that he'll probably make sure it won't happen.

"There are mysteries Bruce wouldn’t do as well on as Dick and he [Dick] sometimes gets shortchanged in terms of people thinking of him as Batman-light."

[QUOTE=Drako;4952212]Snyder talked about it in the interview and it's something that he'll probably make sure it won't happen.

"There are mysteries Bruce wouldn’t do as well on as Dick and he [Dick] sometimes gets shortchanged in terms of people thinking of him as Batman-light."[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I caught that. And to the extent that Dick handles problems differently than Bruce I'm confident that Snyder will do well. He'll write Dick Grayson, not Bruce Wayne.

But Dick solving mysteries in Gotham is still just doing Batman things, even if Dick's methodology is slightly different.

We'll see what Snyder's story is. I mean, it'll be good either way. But I'm hoping this is a story built on Dick, that could only be told with him, not just a Batman mystery where Dick finds the answers in a slightly different way.

Time will tell. It'll be worth reading regardless. All I'm saying is I want to see investment and effort put into Nightwing, not Batman with someone else under the cowl.

I'm just being picky, I know. But we've put up with Ric for two years, I think we're allowed to be a little demanding. :p

[QUOTE=Ascended;4952287]Yeah, I caught that. And to the extent that Dick handles problems differently than Bruce I'm confident that Snyder will do well. He'll write Dick Grayson, not Bruce Wayne.

But Dick solving mysteries in Gotham is still just doing Batman things, even if Dick's methodology is slightly different.

We'll see what Snyder's story is. I mean, it'll be good either way. But I'm hoping this is a story built on Dick, that could only be told with him, not just a Batman mystery where Dick finds the answers in a slightly different way.

Time will tell. It'll be worth reading regardless. All [B]I'm saying is I want to see investment and effort put into Nightwing, not Batman with someone else under the cowl[/B].

I'm just being picky, I know. But we've put up with Ric for two years, I think we're allowed to be a little demanding. :p[/QUOTE]

This. I would be even more excited if this were an actual Nightwing story and not just a different version of Batman.

[QUOTE=OBrianTallent;4952623]This. I would be even more excited if this were an actual Nightwing story and not just a different version of Batman.[/QUOTE]

Well, we don't really know what this is yet. It might be the kind of Nightwing we miss and want back. In Gotham, apparently, but that's not the end of the world. And it sounds like we'll all get a bit of our favorite version, somehow (flashbacks? Old villains or supporting cast revisiting? Years-spanning story?).

But I think we have reason to be cautiously optimistic, and dare I say even happy. :) Snyder's a big name and this will put eyes on the character. We know Snyder can write a quality Dick Grayson and the story should be good, even if it's not the story we want it to be. We're getting some of the effort from DC that we've wanted. That's cool.

I mean, I'm not going to forget the last few years of bullsh*t just because DC offers me a treat. DC has broken my trust completely here and I'm not rewarding any empty effort. So these sons of bitches are gonna have to earn their redemption and more importantly, my money. But Snyder doing a Grayson story where there's a conscious effort to avoid Bat-lite, that touches on all the eras of the character....that could be a good start.

Snyder's high profile to relaunch Nightwing in the public eye may be the kick in the pants the IP needs. I miss reading Nightwing stories. A lot.

But DC has burned me many a time before, so I'll wait and see. Tentatively going to pick this up if only because it seems like Snyder has pull and actually likes Dick Grayson, so at the very least he won't do him dirty for fun. Moreover, we've lost the devil we know in Didio, so who knows what's in store for Nightwing?

I can only hope he gets a good artist on the book. I'm interested, to say the least.

I have to ask. In terms of Nightwing. What is the most hated thing about him? I don't mean him has a character rather about his lore

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4953328]I have to ask. In terms of Nightwing. What is the most hated thing about him? I don't mean him has a character rather about his lore[/QUOTE]

Well... current condition comes to mind

[QUOTE=Ascended;4952287]Yeah, I caught that. And to the extent that Dick handles problems differently than Bruce I'm confident that Snyder will do well. He'll write Dick Grayson, not Bruce Wayne.

But Dick solving mysteries in Gotham is still just doing Batman things, even if Dick's methodology is slightly different.
[/QUOTE]

You're saying that despite Snyder's intention, it will come off as Batman lite to readers right? If not now, then years later once DC takes over the story and wraps it to fit their vision.

well i have a lot to catch up one. Pohzee, all of those designs are great. I'm woth everyone who liked the initial bottom right, though I might replace the black with a much darker blue than in the other suits!

I'll have to check out Snyder's pitch soon!

[QUOTE=Restingvoice;4953397]Well... current condition comes to mind

You're saying that despite Snyder's intention, it will come off as Batman lite to readers right? If not now, then years later once DC takes over the story and wraps it to fit their vision.[/QUOTE]

I'm saying it *might* come off as Bat-lite despite Snyder's intention. Even with Dick using a different methodology and doing things his own way, solving mysteries in Gotham means it's gonna be awfully hard to avoid Bat-isms.

But we know basically nothing about this story, so I'm just voicing fears that might turn out to be virtually baseless when all is said and done.

Okay, we have Babs. But do you guys think Dick will not show? If anything the Harley Quinn show could have done Batman and Robin storyline.

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4953826]Okay, we have Babs. But do you guys think Dick will not show? If anything the Harley Quinn show could have done Batman and Robin storyline.[/QUOTE]

If he did batman would be chill

While I don't want this to be shown. If Dick were to go to college what would he even do? I mean, we have seen a few Batfam do it.

I think he studied business at Hudson, but I actually like the idea that college isn't for him. It's something I'd like explored a bit more actually if he's going to continue have civilian jobs (which I would prefer he didn't).

If I recall Earth 2 Dick Grayson graduated college and worked for the US government as a lawyer or something, I remember he was the attorney against the JSA in in United States vs JSA but he also traveled to other countries as an emissary/ambassador(I don't remember the name for it).

I mean no one seems to know what job he should have, A job that would take him around the country. What about a musician or working at the casino? Then again he does want to work with people. What would be a good job for him to help people that aren't college-based ones?

I mean he's friends with Barbara and basically a son to Bruce, you telling me he couldn't just be independently financed/owns investment in companies. He wouldn't have to work and he'd be free to travel so long as someone keeps track of his investments and financials which I assume most of the batfamily could handle.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Bruce didn't set up Robin trust accounts for Dick, Jason, Tim, and Damian. He suspects that they will need funds for when they travel on personal business/heroics so he makes sure to allocate funds to them for their hero needs.

[QUOTE=sifighter;4954805]I mean he's friends with Barbara and basically a son to Bruce, you telling me he couldn't just be independently financed/owns investment in companies. He wouldn't have to work and he'd be free to travel so long as someone keeps track of his investments and financials which I assume most of the bat family could handle.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Bruce didn't set up Robin trust accounts for Dick, Jason, Tim, and Damian. He suspects that they will need funds for when they travel on personal business/heroics so he makes sure to allocate funds to them for their hero needs.[/QUOTE]

He does, but Dick usually refuses being paid for personal expenses unless it's The Grayson's money that got invested. He also hates asking Bruce for money.

Crimefighting equipment is not personal stuff so he doesn't refuse it. Unless he's angry with Bruce.

[QUOTE=sifighter;4954805]I mean he's friends with Barbara and basically a son to Bruce, you telling me he couldn't just be independently financed/owns investment in companies. He wouldn't have to work and he'd be free to travel so long as someone keeps track of his investments and financials which I assume most of the batfamily could handle.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if Bruce didn't set up Robin trust accounts for Dick, Jason, Tim, and Damian. He suspects that they will need funds for when they travel on personal business/heroics so he makes sure to allocate funds to them for their hero needs.[/QUOTE]

I agree. He should just be a detective for some type of PD for example Gotham. It’s a natural fit like in the Titans show. It’s not rocket science. It’s a good cover and doesn’t permit him from traveling and being a superhero.

[QUOTE=Restingvoice;4954835]He does, but Dick usually refuses being paid for personal expenses unless it's The Grayson's money that got invested. He also hates asking Bruce for money.

Crimefighting equipment is not personal stuff so he doesn't refuse it. Unless he's angry with Bruce.[/QUOTE]
He takes it without asking somtimes

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4954792]I mean no one seems to know what job he should have, A job that would take him around the country. What about a musician or working at the casino? Then again he does want to work with people. What would be a good job for him to help people that aren't college-based ones?[/QUOTE]

I don't want him to have a job. And I don't want him using handouts from Bruce.

Being Nightwing is his job. It's far more fitting the character's themes and history. Like Wally, Dick is a professional hero.

He can acquire funding either by playing with stocks or by owning (but not operating full time) a business or organization. Dick owning Haly's but letting Haly handle the day-to-day, for example.

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4954689]While I don't want this to be shown. If Dick were to go to college what would he even do? I mean, we have seen a few Batfam do it.[/QUOTE]

I think in post-Crisis he studied law for a few semesters before dropping out. Not sure about New52/Rebirth continuity.

Dick's a smart guy but I don't want him to have a college degree. I mean, consider everything he had to learn as Robin and the heir of Bruce Wayne; psychology, chemistry, history, business, law, all kinds of crap. Is Dick the kind of guy who'd spend four years re-learning knowledge he mostly already knows, just for a piece of paper? I don't see it.

[QUOTE=Ascended;4955225]
I think in post-Crisis he studied law for a few semesters before dropping out. Not sure about New52/Rebirth continuity.

Dick's a smart guy but I don't want him to have a college degree. I mean, consider everything he had to learn as Robin and the heir of Bruce Wayne; psychology, chemistry, history, business, law, all kinds of crap. Is Dick the kind of guy who'd spend four years re-learning knowledge he mostly already knows, just for a piece of paper? I don't see it.[/QUOTE]

He took law for a semester in Bludhaven Law College where he met The Judge. I don't know his main degree.

I don't see it either because... wasn't his decision to drop out is because he feels it's not really useful for crimefighting?

By the way what's the name of Nightwing's bike? In any version

Earth 2 Dick i think was a lawyer i believe, but main Dick has too many parallels with Dare Devil as it is.

[QUOTE=Godlike13;4955831]Earth 2 Dick i think was a lawyer i believe, but main Dick has too many parallels with Dare Devil as it is.[/QUOTE]

Pretty sure you're right about E-2 Dick being a lawyer. Not sure though, I haven't read too much with that version of him. It seemed fitting though. Regular/main continuity Dick is a totally different matter though; he's blazed his own trail more than his E-2 counterpart has and doesn't strike me as the "regular job" kinda guy at all.

Wait. The more I think about it. Diana use to get her money from copyrights. So Maybe if we don't want him to get a job he gets it from items sold of Nightwing? I mean the fact there is Nightwing items can't be too hard to do.

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4955926]Wait. The more I think about it. Diana use to get her money from copyrights. So Maybe if we don't want him to get a job he gets it from items sold of Nightwing? I mean the fact there is Nightwing items can't be too hard to do.[/QUOTE]

The problem with superheroes, they never trademark. Batman isn't seeing any funds from Batburger and we all know it.

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4955926]Wait. The more I think about it. Diana use to get her money from copyrights. So Maybe if we don't want him to get a job he gets it from items sold of Nightwing? I mean the fact there is Nightwing items can't be too hard to do.[/QUOTE]

Diana doesn't really have a secret identity. Nightwing though, does. So, copyrights would be quite a problem for Dick.

[QUOTE=Jackalope89;4956125]Diana doesn't really have a secret identity. Nightwing though, does. So, copyrights would be quite a problem for Dick.[/QUOTE]

I mean if he were to be a professional hero that would be hard. Unless he did book signs or other things that can help him make money. Maybe he could make a deal with the people. That would be interesting to see him making money from being a hero


[QUOTE=sifighter;4956076]The problem with superheroes, they never trademark. Batman isn't seeing any funds from Batburger and we all know it.[/QUOTE]


Diana is the only one who has. So I thought it would be interesting if Dick got some money.

double post

[QUOTE=Godlike13;4955831]Earth 2 Dick i think was a lawyer i believe, but main Dick has too many parallels with Dare Devil as it is.[/QUOTE]

Yes, the Earth 2 Dick Grayson was a lawyer. He also served as ambassador to South Africa for a while. He and Helena Wayne were part of a consumer research firm (Cranston, Grayson and Wayne, if I'm not mistaken).

The Pre-COIE Dick was taking economics at Hudson U before he dropped out. I personally always thought he should have gotten a joint degree in that and international relations. Then he could have acted as a Wayne Industries trouble shooter around the globe, travelling to hot spots to deal with problems. It would have acted as a cover for his globe-trotting as Nightwing (because I want him as far away as possible from Gotham and Bludhaven, but maintaining ties to Bruce and the family (without having to be in their pockets)).

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4955926]Wait. The more I think about it. Diana use to get her money from copyrights. So Maybe if we don't want him to get a job he gets it from items sold of Nightwing? I mean the fact there is Nightwing items can't be too hard to do.[/QUOTE]

Well, there'd be legal problems with that, since Dick has a secret identity.

But that's assuming the law in DC is the same as the real world. And I don't think it can be, otherwise villains would be able to dance out of a court room thanks to unlawful arrests or unlawfully gained evidence or whatever. Vigilantes still might be, at least technically, unlawful, but the law would have had to change to take their actions into account so I don't see any reason why the copyright law wouldn't be changed too.

So, sure, I don't really see why this couldn't be a viable option. I kinda like it actually; it makes Nightwing more of a public figure.

[QUOTE=Ascended;4956612]Well, there'd be legal problems with that, since Dick has a secret identity.

But that's assuming the law in DC is the same as the real world. And I don't think it can be, otherwise villains would be able to dance out of a court room thanks to unlawful arrests or unlawfully gained evidence or whatever. Vigilantes still might be, at least technically, unlawful, but the law would have had to change to take their actions into account so I don't see any reason why the copyright law wouldn't be changed too.

So, sure, I don't really see why this couldn't be a viable option. I kinda like it actually; it makes Nightwing more of a public figure.[/QUOTE]

I believe to mitigate unlawful arrest is why Batman leaves the evidence alongside the perpetrator and leave before the authorities arrive, so Gordon can say it's the police who's making the arrest, and the evidence just happens to be there shrug.

Sometimes Batman also intimidates goons or right-hand men to confess, so they do the court job for him. The rest he left to Gordon, Dent, Dawes, or whoever the current good lawyers and judge available. That's pretty much what they do in Year One and Begins, and I'm sure they continue to do now.

By now Batman helping the police is common knowledge, they just need a good enough case in court to counter that defense, and after most of Gotham's corruption is cleaned a lot of officials are willing to help anyway.

That's true, but it doesn't apply to other heroes. I mean Flash and Superman will sometimes drop the criminals off at the police station directly. Can't legally call that the police's collar when witnesses are there to see the crook dropped off like a present. Under real law that would likely result in the crook walking away unless they had an active warrant out for their arrest, but we see it work for criminals without priors too.

DCU law has to be different than real law. My wife is the one who's in law, not me, but I've seen how fragile the system is and how easily a defense lawyer can cast doubt on the evidence chain. DC has to have made laws to take vigilantes into account, probably dating back to when the JSA was drafted into WWII. So perhaps there's also copyright laws Dick could take advantage of, even if most other heroes allow their likeness to be used at no profit to themselves. Actually, I know at least a few heroes have "signed off" on their likeness being used for merchandise, with the profits they should receive going to charity instead. That implies there's legal grounds for a hero to profit from their likeness.

Agreed. I mean if anything due to the fact Heroes have been in Dc for a while. There must be laws that can help him get some profit. I mean if we don't want him to be a hero for hire. I guess him doing public events?

Also, How do you feel about the actor playing Nightwing?

Hello. I'm new. I like Nightwing from Titans. But the animated movie version suck hard. Even the annoying brat Damian beat him. If the little punk tried that in Titans, he will end up in a hospital.

[QUOTE=qwazer07;4958361]Hello. I'm new. I like Nightwing from Titans. But the animated movie version suck hard. Even the annoying brat Damian beat him. If the little punk tried that in Titans, he will end up in a hospital.[/QUOTE]

They were just sparing, it’s not a big deal, they have Ben training for the same amount of time

I mean even after that Dick never wins. He always needed someone to save him in animated movies. Dick is supposed to be a top-notch fighter.

[QUOTE=AmiMizuno;4958781]I mean even after that Dick never wins. He always needed someone to save him in animated movies. Dick is supposed to be a top-notch fighter.[/QUOTE] True! But nightwing is always playing the support role, he's never the lead. His job in the movie the movies is to put over the lead villains and heros.

You what nightwing to be more competent? Than he needs to not always play the role of "background dancer" all the time.

[QUOTE=Rac7d*;4958773]They were just sparing, it’s not a big deal, they have Ben training for the same amount of time[/QUOTE]

Nightwing just loses in the movies while the Scrappy-Doo of the Bat family gets the spotlight everytime. The writers obviously loves to wank BlOoD sOn "Robin". I hope Damian never returns.

[center]The team-up between Dick & Helena was most enjoyable.
Too bad things didn't work out in the end, though.

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-coGi_9vnlRA/UjMLeZiTqMI/AAAAAAAABEk/9Dsy1cOpTpo/s1600/Nightwing26-27.jpg[/img] [img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SQ6vQghFt3M/UjMLlNGrNKI/AAAAAAAABEs/PKINE_qQsLA/s1600/Nightwing28-29.jpg[/img]



The Evolution of...

[SIZE=3][B]Dick Grayson[/B][/SIZE]

[img]https://i.pinimg.com/originals/4f/b5/41/4fb541c43820da927bfaa41c54e0da23.jpg[/img]

[B]Artist[/B]: Rick Leonardi[/center]

Helena was a better pairing than Babs. Bat writers destroying every other pairing to promote their DickBabs ship is an abomination.