Tom seems to actually like Donna which is more than I can say for his feelings on Diana.
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Tom seems to actually like Donna which is more than I can say for his feelings on Diana.
[QUOTE=Frontier;6448071]Tom seems to actually like Donna which is more than I can say for his feelings on Diana.[/QUOTE]
I feel like Donna being so vaguely associated with the WW mythos might actually be beneficial for a change.
[QUOTE=Frontier;6448071]Tom seems to actually like Donna which is more than I can say for his feelings on Diana.[/QUOTE]
I haven't seen evidence of this "seems to actually like." Thus far, he utilized her the least of all the Titans. Hopefully, Nicola Scott will have a balancing effect on whatever his negative feelings are about the Wonder Woman Family.
I'm reminded, what did he actually do with Cassie in DCeased, especially after making her Wonder Woman?
[QUOTE=HotBoy;6448271]I haven't seen evidence of this "seems to actually like." Thus far, he utilized her the least of all the Titans. Hopefully, Nicola Scott will have a balancing effect on whatever his negative feelings are about the Wonder Woman Family.[/QUOTE]
Well, he seems to think her name alone is a selling point for how awesome she is, so there is that :p.
[QUOTE=Mantis-Ray;6448331]I'm reminded, what did he actually do with Cassie in DCeased, especially after making her Wonder Woman?[/QUOTE]
Have her makeout with Damian. Just normal crowd control and crowd shot hero stuff, nothing that major.
[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/Mcqx93R/Out-43.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/4pTkcvW/Out-44.jpg[/IMG]
Oh my gosh that looks so precious!
That is too cute and it's so funny that Grace Ellis jumped directly from Patricia Highsmith to baby Wonder Woman. Guess she missed Lumberjanes.
[QUOTE=Hypo;6448504][IMG]https://i.ibb.co/Mcqx93R/Out-43.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/4pTkcvW/Out-44.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
This looks very cute :).
When did Diana discover she could fly and in which title and issue can I find that reveal in?
[QUOTE=Micabe;6451220]When did Diana discover she could fly and in which title and issue can I find that reveal in?[/QUOTE]
Lemme think...I know in the silver age it was just casually established to be a thing Wonder Woman could always do which was just never mentioned (the gliding on wind currents thing) with flashbacks showing her learning to master it as Wonder Girl, with no actual discovery story.
I know Perez actually tackled this in one of his annuals. It was a story about her being taught how to dive off of a cliff into the water and learn to swim. I recall it being pretty good.
and I think the Azzarello run made it a power she got in the modern day but im not sure?
[QUOTE=Fuzzy Mittens;6451232]Lemme think...I know in the silver age it was just casually established to be a thing Wonder Woman could always do which was just never mentioned (the gliding on wind currents thing) with flashbacks showing her learning to master it as Wonder Girl, with no actual discovery story.
I know Perez actually tackled this in one of his annuals. It was a story about her being taught how to dive off of a cliff into the water and learn to swim. I recall it being pretty good.
and I think the Azzarello run made it a power she got in the modern day but im not sure?[/QUOTE]
Thanks, I'll work with that :cool:
Probably been discussed elsewhere, but the fact that Tom Taylor ends his Dceaced with just copying and pasting Wonder Woman: Immortal's ending just with Damian instead. Literally dies and created a universe with him in it.
[QUOTE=masterwitcher88;6453411]Probably been discussed elsewhere, but the fact that Tom Taylor ends his Dceaced with just copying and pasting Wonder Woman: Immortal's ending just with Damian instead. Literally dies and created a universe with him in it.[/QUOTE]
Breaking news:
A zombie story written by Tom Taylor doesn't have an original idea.
Just when you think you can escape Injustice....Jon has to travel to their universe
[img]https://64.media.tumblr.com/65592d138bb52b8f48b52b4a8b345ce6/d2d865b315aa1306-e9/s1280x1920/cf2b22d6917207153c2dd1e185784921e943522d.jpg[/img]
EDIT:
You know what...never-mind. Not even worth the snark.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fu7bDn9XwAMX8A4?format=jpg&name=medium[/IMG]
. . .
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EE18LM-VAAYQX77.jpg[/IMG]
Is there a source for that? Because the number of fake news that comes out related to comic book movies is insane.
(I actually heard a similar theory about gods and the Amazons being ancient aliens (including Kryptonians) who settled on earth thousands of years ago and there was some uproar but it was just some dude on Batman-On-Film thinking out loud and not actual news. This was post MoS but before BatvsSup).
[QUOTE=John Venus;6455554]Is there a source for that? Because the number of fake news that comes out related to comic book movies is insane.
(I actually heard a similar theory about gods and the Amazons being ancient aliens (including Kryptonians) who settled on earth thousands of years ago and there was some uproar but it was just some dude on Batman-On-Film thinking out loud and not actual news. This was post MoS but before BatvsSup).[/QUOTE]
[URL="https://twitter.com/siccness4/status/1652495369044127744?s=46&t=tcqjHDbt487sLx_4UoiJsQ"]I guess this is it[/URL]
It is true. In that stupid "Full Circle" event that Snyder organized to self-congratulate about the three failed DCEU films he directed, he touched on the ideas he had about making Wonder Woman's ancestry Kryptonian by virtue of the amazons lineage coming from a Kryptonian woman who escaped that planet's death and "founded" the amazons or whatnot, and he even mentioned an idea for making Zeus also from Kryptonian. Can you imagine that? I did not need another reason to think that Snyder's understanding of superheroes in general was toilet-tier, but to fully show his incel fanboy colors through actually making Wonder Woman a literal Supeman-lite/Superman rip off is hilarious. We definitely dodged a big ole bullet with this. This guy is ful of sh**** ideas: "superheroes" that kill, maim & brand people, Batman & Lois Lane having a son, Batman being ra**d in prison, etc, but Wonder Woman and the amazons being Kryptonian? That takes the motherbleeping cake. Not only does it make her a true blue Superman copy, but it devalues her real origin and the rich (but sadly misused) lore that Marston created, and Perez and many other good writers built on. Thank all the Olympian gods that Snyder will never ever again put his hands on Diana.
[QUOTE=Primal Slayer;6455501]Just when you think you can escape Injustice....Jon has to travel to their universe
[img]https://64.media.tumblr.com/65592d138bb52b8f48b52b4a8b345ce6/d2d865b315aa1306-e9/s1280x1920/cf2b22d6917207153c2dd1e185784921e943522d.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
I'm bothered by remembering how overdesigned the Injustice costumes are.
Like Superman has an extra red line under his already red line v-neck collar. And the under line has a black line going through the red shoulder stuff.
Man that is a mess.
[QUOTE=Mantis-Ray;6455606]I'm bothered by remembering how overdesigned the Injustice costumes are.
Like Superman has an extra red line under his already red line v-neck collar. And the under line has a black line going through the red shoulder stuff.
Man that is a mess.[/QUOTE]
Everything in Injustice is overcooked, overseasoned and overrated.
[QUOTE=HestiasHearth;6455579]It is true. In that stupid "Full Circle" event that Snyder organized to self-congratulate about the three failed DCEU films he directed, he touched on the ideas he had about making Wonder Woman's ancestry Kryptonian by virtue of the amazons lineage coming from a Kryptonian woman who escaped that planet's death and "founded" the amazons or whatnot, and he even mentioned an idea for making Zeus also from Kryptonian. Can you imagine that? I did not need another reason to think that Snyder's understanding of superheroes in general was toilet-tier, but to fully show his incel fanboy colors through actually making Wonder Woman a literal Supeman-lite/Superman rip off is hilarious. We definitely dodged a big ole bullet with this. This guy is ful of sh**** ideas: "superheroes" that kill, maim & brand people, Batman & Lois Lane having a son, Batman being ra**d in prison, etc, but Wonder Woman and the amazons being Kryptonian? That takes the motherbleeping cake. Not only does it make her a true blue Superman copy, but it devalues her real origin and the rich (but sadly misused) lore that Marston created, and Perez and many other good writers built on. Thank all the Olympian gods that Snyder will never ever again put his hands on Diana.[/QUOTE]
Oh man Snyder just has this obsession with Krypton. Keep in mind this is what partly what ruined Superman there. In Man of Steel Clark wasn't even a character because the entire conflict of the film centered on Jor-El's war with Zod, so it meant Clark was simply a cipher to fight on behalf of Jor-El's ideals. Krypton had a stranglehold on the character.
Anyone got a link to this? I would like to spread it to others so they can hear about this.
[QUOTE=HestiasHearth;6455611]Everything in Injustice is overcooked, overseasoned and overrated.[/QUOTE]
Injustice's design philosophy was very much "To show off our hi-def graphical tech lets make the costumes are overtly detailed as possible."
[QUOTE=Mantis-Ray;6455615]Oh man Snyder just has this obsession with Krypton. Keep in mind this is what partly what ruined Superman there. In Man of Steel Clark wasn't even a character because the entire conflict of the film centered on Jor-El's war with Zod, so it meant Clark was simply a cipher to fight on behalf of Jor-El's ideals. Krypton had a stranglehold on the character.
Anyone got a link to this? I would like to spread it to others so they can hear about this.
Injustice's design philosophy was very much "To show off our hi-def graphical tech lets make the costumes are overtly detailed as possible."[/QUOTE]
Here's a part of it: [url]https://twitter.com/Siccness4/status/1652495369044127744[/url]
Every time he says something about WW he just shows that he made 0 research about the character's background. That story credit for the first movie was definitely all Heinberg.
Lmao. I completely forgot about this.
Guess this a “break glass in case of emergency” because no one cared about the adventures of Superman’s son not doing anything.
[QUOTE=Mantis-Ray;6455606]I'm bothered by remembering how overdesigned the Injustice costumes are.
Like Superman has an extra red line under his already red line v-neck collar. And the under line has a black line going through the red shoulder stuff.
Man that is a mess.[/QUOTE]
Tell me about it. Show me a character’s costume designed by NRS and I’ll show the worst costume that character’s ever had.
This is the worst example of “WW but now with pants!” because of the usual too much blue but the she still has the traditional briefs laying over them which in the game look like she’s wearing an armored diaper.
I can't really wrap my head around seeing all these classic, iconic and simple designs and thinking "we need to just make them busier and ugly as sin."
[QUOTE=Mantis-Ray;6455615]Oh man Snyder just has this obsession with Krypton. Keep in mind this is what partly what ruined Superman there. In Man of Steel Clark wasn't even a character because the entire conflict of the film centered on Jor-El's war with Zod, so it meant Clark was simply a cipher to fight on behalf of Jor-El's ideals. Krypton had a stranglehold on the character.
[/QUOTE]
[url]https://twitter.com/Siccness4/status/1652495369044127744[/url]
In the video Snyder himself makes it clear that it all goes back to the same ole BS that so many fanboys have fallen for as of late: the idea that gods and magic in comics have to be "explained" in a pseudo-scientific way. I mean, so many decades enjoying all these fantasy stories about gods, monsters, wizards & witches, and suddenly magic has to be "explained"? Seems like the whole "Amazons/Greek Gods are of Kryptonian descent" idea was some half-assed attempt at explaining DC gods in a similar manner to how the MCU explained Nordic deities.
I remember that horrific rumor and so glad WB stepped in to say no.
It wouldn't even make sense since Gods have powers the Kryptonians never did not to mention that they could easily be made their own alien race that crashed on Earth and took on the titles of the Greek Gods.
[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;6455658]I can't really wrap my head around seeing all these classic, iconic and simple designs and thinking "we need to just make them busier and ugly as sin."[/QUOTE]
Supe's my favorite to point to because this was right around the era when there was the push to get rid of the red trunks and the solution to compensate for too much blue is look even more stupid looking than the red undies ever did.
[url]https://twitter.com/i/status/1652494783439306753[/url]
Zack talks about *that photo* and the general story in his head surrounding it. Basically Diana is hunting down Ares and goes to these hot spots where war is being waged and asks these "warriors" to join in her quest to search and defeat him
[QUOTE=Primal Slayer;6455750][url]https://twitter.com/i/status/1652494783439306753[/url]
Zack talks about *that photo* and the general story in his head surrounding it. Basically Diana is hunting down Ares and goes to these hot spots where war is being waged and asks these "warriors" to join in her quest to search and defeat him[/QUOTE]
I actually think Zack's general "idea" is really great, and I would love to see it explored in a graphic novel. From the clip shown, I can't tell if Diana is staying in one time period, 1854, or if she's going to various wars throughout time. However, I think the latter seems like a rich idea and a way to incorporate various Wonder Woman villains throughout time and cast members culminating in an epic showdown with Team Diana versus Team Ares.
This is not an endorsement that I want Diana severing heads, but the idea is something I would love to see under an "Immortal Wonder Woman" type banner series of stories.
It would be nice if the Civil War could be included in such a story.
[QUOTE=Primal Slayer;6455678]I remember that horrific rumor and so glad WB stepped in to say no.
It wouldn't even make sense since Gods have powers the Kryptonians never did not to mention that they could easily be made their own alien race that crashed on Earth and took on the titles of the Greek Gods.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. At the risk of the DCEU being accused of "copying" the MCU's Thor premise, I would much rather have Diana's gods be retconned as an advanced alien race of their own than as Kryptonians. Not everything in the DC Universe has to be connected to Kal-El. Plus... The tropes of gods, magic, sorcery and things beyond human comprehension are established enough in fiction that audiences are not gonna reject a film for not having "realistic' explanations for deities. The first WW film itself is proof of this: nobody saw that film and thought, "gods? magic? What the **** is this? This sucks!"
[QUOTE=HestiasHearth;6455799]Exactly. At the risk of the DCEU being accused of "copying" the MCU's Thor premise, I would much rather have Diana's gods be retconned as an advanced alien race of their own than as Kryptonians. Not everything in the DC Universe has to be connected to Kal-El. Plus... The tropes of gods, magic, sorcery and things beyond human comprehension are established enough in fiction that audiences are not gonna reject a film for not having "realistic' explanations for deities. The first WW film itself is proof of this: nobody saw that film and thought, "gods? magic? What the **** is this? This sucks!"[/QUOTE]
I expect a more tradational comic accurate Wonder Woman for the DCU after this.
[QUOTE=Maestro 216;6456104]I expect a more tradational comic accurate Wonder Woman for the DCU after this.[/QUOTE]
Oh, definitely. The main problem with the entire "Snyderverse" failure was that the foundational, traditional essence of who the Trinity (and superheroes in general) are was completely obfuscated by Snyder under a whirlwind of tone-deaf ideas, unnecessary grimdark flourishes and fanboy-wank pseudo badassery. The DCU Gunn & Safran-steered Wonder Woman will most certainly be closer to the fierce-yet-compassionate warrior that we all love. Fingers crossed.
[QUOTE=Maestro 216;6456104]I expect a more tradational comic accurate Wonder Woman for the DCU after this.[/QUOTE]
I have no doubt that the DCU's WW is gonna be more Perez-y, and not just because Paradise Lost was a giveaway. Obviously WW84 had TONS of problems, but audiences clearly dug the lore and scale of the first film. Plus sincere epic fantasy would be unique to her in the superhero genre - the MCU went goofy sci-fi with their only fantasy/myth hero and all of the other DCU projects planned are either big sci-fi, street level, or classic "secret identity/patrolling a city" (i.e. Superman).
I don't particularly care for Bruce hooking up with Lois or the Amazons being descended from the Kryptonians. Then again, I can't really bring myself to be all that angry about it given the ideas for Superman and Wonder Woman that have gotten the okay in the comics. Many of which are much more damaging than something Snyder thought of but never ended up doing anyway.
If anything, Synder's idea is more an indictment of a shared universe than anything else because this is the kind of thing to be expected when you take a bunch of characters and stories that were created to exist independent of each other and try to force them into the same setting. It wouldn't surprise me if someone else has at least considered using a concept like this and I know at least one person on this site who argued for this kind of weaving connections between DC's separate corners and that person still hated Snyder's work.
[QUOTE=bardkeep;6456148]I have no doubt that the DCU's WW is gonna be more Perez-y, and not just because Paradise Lost was a giveaway. Obviously WW84 had TONS of problems, but audiences clearly dug the lore and scale of the first film. Plus sincere epic fantasy would be unique to her in the superhero genre - the MCU went goofy sci-fi with their only fantasy/myth hero and all of the other DCU projects planned are either big sci-fi, street level, or classic "secret identity/patrolling a city" (i.e. Superman).[/QUOTE]
I'd temper my expectations for a Wonder Woman movie in the spirit of Perez or Jiminez under Gunn. The guy says all the right things for fans but his own work with both Marvel and DC shows that he will make his own changes that diverge a great deal from the comics, for better or worse. He's kind of similar to Bruce Timm in that regard.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;6456439]I don't particularly care for Bruce hooking up with Lois or the Amazons being descended from the Kryptonians. Then again, I can't really bring myself to be all that angry about it given the ideas for Superman and Wonder Woman that have gotten the okay in the comics. Many of which are much more damaging than something Snyder thought of but never ended up doing anyway.
If anything, Synder's idea is more an indictment of a shared universe than anything else because this is the kind of thing to be expected when you take a bunch of characters and stories that were created to exist independent of each other and try to force them into the same setting. It wouldn't surprise me if someone else has at least considered using a concept like this and I know at least one person on this site who argued for this kind of weaving connections between DC's separate corners and that person still hated Snyder's work.
I'd temper my expectations for a Wonder Woman movie in the spirit of Perez or Jiminez under Gunn. The guy says all the right things for fans but his own work with both Marvel and DC shows that he will make his own changes that diverge a great deal from the comics, for better or worse. He's kind of similar to Bruce Timm in that regard.[/QUOTE]
The most damaging thing to come out of the WW comics is Zeus being her dad. Which ended up incorporated into the DCEU. So the idea Snyder almost put in would have been an example of his doing a "hold my beer" and somehow taking an already bad idea and making it worse. Then we just got the default idea, in a story where she didn't have an impressive role
I can't think of any ideas in the comics that were more damaging than the apathy his Superman elicited from the audience, or the mess he was building towards
And I'd say that isn't really an indictment on shared universes so much as an indicator that people aren't creative/imaginative enough to just accept a fantasy kitchen sink setting and have fun with it.
[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;6456458]The most damaging thing to come out of the WW comics is Zeus being her dad. Which ended up incorporated into the DCEU. So the idea Snyder almost put in would have been an example of his doing a "hold my beer" and somehow taking an already bad idea and making it worse. Then we just got the default idea, in a story where she didn't have an impressive role
I can't think of any ideas in the comics that were more damaging than the apathy his Superman elicited from the audience, or the mess he was building towards
And I'd say that isn't really an indictment on shared universes so much as an indicator that people aren't creative/imaginative enough to just accept a fantasy kitchen sink setting and have fun with it.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, making the Amazons related/decedents of Kryptonians reminds me of how in the Ultimate Universe stuff like Spider-Man's powers, Hulk, and mutants are all derived from the super-soldier serum. Eventually just saps out whatever makes individual characters unique.
[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;6456458]The most damaging thing to come out of the WW comics is Zeus being her dad. Which ended up incorporated into the DCEU. So the idea Snyder almost put in would have been an example of his doing a "hold my beer" and somehow taking an already bad idea and making it worse. Then we just got the default idea, in a story where she didn't have an impressive role
I can't think of any ideas in the comics that were more damaging than the apathy his Superman elicited from the audience, or the mess he was building towards
And I'd say that isn't really an indictment on shared universes so much as an indicator that people aren't creative/imaginative enough to just accept a fantasy kitchen sink setting and have fun with it.[/QUOTE]
Of all the things I can say about Snyder's Superman, claiming he elicited apathy from the audience isn't one of them.
How Zack Snyder’s Superman Saved My Life.
[url]https://***********/@AmandaKP/how-zack-snyder-henry-cavill-and-hans-zimmer-saved-my-life-45ecfe806373[/url]
Zack Snyder's DC Films Helped People Overcome Depression & Suicidal Thoughts
[url]https://cinemacure.wordpress.com/2017/09/30/zack-snyders-dc-films-helped-people-overcome-depression-suicidal-thoughts-read-their-stories-here/[/url]
I won't even get into all the hate filled video essays, some of which are longer than the damn movies themselves.
Point is, Snyder didn't come up with the idea to make Zeus her father. And even then I'd say it's the second worse idea after how Azzarello wrote the Amazons, which the DCEU (thankfully) did not incorporate. Is making the Amazons descended from Kryptonians a good thing? God, no. But all movies are the culmination of a thousand different ideas and conversations and a lot of that doesn't end up making the cut anyway. I see no point in getting mad at this idea, bad as it is, when so much worse has been allowed to happen and the DCEU isn't even close to being Superman or Wonder Woman at their worst. And it isn't like there aren't fans and creators who think the DCU should revolve around Batman and/or Superman anyway. At least Snyder might have given a justification for it, infuriating as it would be. Hell, this concept is basically the premise of Wild Storm's WildCATS.
As for "fun", that's going to vary from person to person and I'll just leave it at that. I'm sure this idea was something that was discussed for "fun" as well.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;6456478]Of all the things I can say about Snyder's Superman, claiming he elicited apathy from the audience isn't one of them.
[url]https://***********/@AmandaKP/how-zack-snyder-henry-cavill-and-hans-zimmer-saved-my-life-45ecfe806373[/url]
[url]https://cinemacure.wordpress.com/2017/09/30/zack-snyders-dc-films-helped-people-overcome-depression-suicidal-thoughts-read-their-stories-here/[/url]
I won't even get into all the hate filled video essays, some of which are longer than the damn movies themselves.
Point is, Snyder didn't come up with the idea to make Zeus her father. And even then I'd say it's the second worse idea after how Azzarello wrote the Amazons, which the DCEU (thankfully) did not incorporate. Is making the Amazons descended from Kryptonians a good thing? God, no. But all movies are the culmination of a thousand different ideas and conversations and a lot of that doesn't end up making the cut anyway. I see no point in getting mad at this idea, bad as it is, when so much worse has been allowed to happen and the DCEU isn't even close to being Superman or Wonder Woman at their worst. And it isn't like there aren't fans and creators who think the DCU should revolve around Batman and/or Superman anyway. At least Snyder might have given a justification for it, infuriating as it would be. Hell, this concept is basically the premise of Wild Storm's WildCATS.
As for "fun", that's going to vary from person to person and I'll just leave it at that. I'm sure this idea was something that was discussed for "fun" as well.[/QUOTE]
The opposite extremes of online discourse is one thing. The steep box office drop during BvS's second weekend tells us another (though that's not limited to just Superman). As is the studio moving on from Cavill despite him wanting to come back. They don't see any profit in keeping him around, so that tells us the studio is not seeing that the wider general audience is overly attached to this version.
Just because we have fans who think it should revolve around Superman to this extreme doesn't make it any better of an idea, and I doubt Snyders justifications would be any more convincing than theirs. Bad ideas being floated around by some other people is flimsy justification for doing it yourself. Especially as we know Snyder having it revolve around Clark just equals out to him being a plot device rather than a fleshed out character.
Fun is subjective, but that's why the shared universe being so big allows for people to focus on different parts of it to cater to their interests. Are you defending Snyder's decisions of a shared universe, or indicting the whole concept? Because there is nothing about them as a concept that means they HAVE to go the route of tying them together more rigidly