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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396064]We are not saying change every single thing about Diana. The people who are fine with or prefer her with olive skin or brown (or grey) eyes aren't calling for the lasso, her Amazon origins, powers, etc to be removed.[/QUOTE]
Arguably the most important thing about her has changed, her status as a wholly female creation. So her origin has changed, her costume has changed, her height has changed, along with when she came to Man's World and who she met when she got there. Her indestructable bracelets have been shattered, all manner of beings have escaped the lasso recently, but that's not enough, we need a new eye color too.
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[QUOTE=HotBoy;6395752]It breaks my heart that fans of Wonder Woman--a character whose express purpose is to help end things like xenophobia and sexist beauty standards and racism, etc.--could hold these sorts of perspectives and deny/not see the irony/hypocrisy/contradiction.
Have mercy. :([/QUOTE]
That's what happens when people start not just gatekeeping fictional characters but filtering their own personal views about life and society through those fictional characters. I remember seeing tweets back in 2017 from people claiming that they would NOT watch the first Wonder Woman film because Gal Gadot was "too skinny," "too foreign-looking," and "too flat chested," and because the producers "ruined" an "American icon" by giving her a "foreign accent." LOL
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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;6396103]Arguably the most important thing about her has changed, her status as a wholly female creation. So her origin has changed, her costume has changed, her height has changed, along with when she came to Man's World and who she met when she got there. Her indestructable bracelets have been shattered, all manner of beings have escaped the lasso recently, but that's not enough, we need a new eye color too.[/QUOTE]
These changes were all made before this game was even conceived as an idea.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396122]These changes were all made before this game was even conceived as an idea.[/QUOTE]
Yes, and what about it?
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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;6396132]Yes, and what about it?[/QUOTE]
Suggesting that Diana be depicted as something other than a pale-skinned, blue-eyed woman is not the same thing as demanding every single thing about her be changed. The people who are fine with Diana's depiction in the Suicide Squad game are not okay with the lasso and bracelets being rendered useless or her being Zeus's creation. People can be fine with some deviation from what is expected of Diana (just as they are with Superman and Batman) and put their foot down in regards to other aspects. It's not a binary.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396142]Suggesting that Diana be depicted as something other than a pale-skinned, blue-eyed woman is not the same thing as demanding every single thing about her be changed. The people who are fine with Diana's depiction in the Suicide Squad game are not okay with the lasso and bracelets being rendered useless or her being Zeus's creation. People can be fine with some deviation from what is expected of Diana (just as they are with Superman and Batman) and put their foot down in regards to other aspects. It's not a binary.[/QUOTE]
You're missing my entire point. Multiple changes have a cumulative effect.
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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;6396147]You're missing my entire point. Multiple changes have a cumulative effect.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, multiple changes. Not a single change that has little to no impact and comes after several other changes have been made.
You're bashing Diana's physical appearance in this game because of numerous other past alterations that were far more controversial and for much better reasons.
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I continue with the rereading of Willow Wilsons run
Maaaan, I forgot how much of a fucking asshole was Steve Trevor in this run. Wonder Woman is going to bring Cheetah to justice just seconds after Afrodita's funeral and this fucking dude is like "BUT WHAT ABOUT ME????". Literally. after. afrodita's. funeral.
Douchebag.
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[QUOTE=Garrac;6396175]I continue with the rereading of Willow Wilsons run
Maaaan, I forgot how much of a fucking asshole was Steve Trevor in this run. Wonder Woman is going to bring Cheetah to justice just seconds after Afrodita's funeral and this fucking dude is like "BUT WHAT ABOUT ME????". Literally. after. afrodita's. funeral.
Douchebag.[/QUOTE]
In fairness to Steve, I believe he was meant to be influenced by the death of Aphrodite and love as a whole.
Still not a great story, execution wise, though
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Yeah, Wilson's run was as much frustrating for stuff like that where it seemed like that there was a great story idea but the execution was so lacking, the Ares trying to be a hero story is probably the poster child for that.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396155]Yeah, multiple changes. Not a single change that has little to no impact and comes after several other changes have been made.
You're bashing Diana's physical appearance in this game because of numerous other past alterations that were far more controversial and for much better reasons.[/QUOTE]
Either you can't hear yourself or you can't hear me.
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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;6396275]Either you can't hear yourself or you can't hear me.[/QUOTE]
Well, we're communicating through writing so it would be weird if I could hear you.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396283]Well, we're communicating through writing so it would be weird if I could hear you.[/QUOTE]
Okay see, in your mythic quest to have the last word you're not making any sense. I suggest you regroup, rethink and relax.
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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;6396299]Okay see, in your mythic quest to have the last word you're not making any sense. I suggest you regroup, rethink and relax.[/QUOTE]
I'd suggest following your own advice. Particularly the "relax" part. Anyway, I've said my piece and am done with conversation.
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[QUOTE=Agent Z;6396304]I'd suggest following your own advice. Particularly the "relax" part. Anyway, I've said my piece and am done with conversation.[/QUOTE]
You didn't "say" anything, but okay, thank you.
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;6396262]In fairness to Steve, I believe he was meant to be influenced by the death of Aphrodite and love as a whole.
Still not a great story, execution wise, though[/QUOTE]
Yeah, here I guess we can return to the "this run didn't get favored by the artists" because the drawing doesnt reflect how the death of Afrodita is afecting everyone. It's just another tuesday with Trevor acting weird again, depending on a writing that isnt also doing a lot of effort to express it.
Other idea weirdly executed as example: Cheetah tells us her plan was to kill Afrodita all along, but the art and writing really make an effort to express the killing was the fruit of great improvisation.
... um, now I wonder if Cloonrad are going to bring that up, having a great arc about fighting the gods with Cheetah around there...
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I saw a storyboard animation for the lightning riding scene in WW84 and it’s a thousand times better than what we ended up with. Wonder Woman lassos the lightening and propels herself into the Earth’s orbit, and as she flies around the globe with her glowing, golden lariat, people look up and see a shooting star streaking across the night sky. I love that so much
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6397550]I saw a storyboard animation for the lightning riding scene in WW84 and it’s a thousand times better than what we ended up with. Wonder Woman lassos the lightening and propels herself into the Earth’s orbit, and as she flies around the globe with her glowing, golden lariat, people look up and see a shooting star streaking across the night sky. I love that so much[/QUOTE]
Wow. That sounds super cool!!!
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[QUOTE=HestiasHearth;6397902]Wow. That sounds super cool!!![/QUOTE]
[video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)
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[QUOTE=HotBoy;6395752]It breaks my heart that fans of Wonder Woman--a character whose express purpose is to help end things like xenophobia and sexist beauty standards and racism, etc.--could hold these sorts of perspectives and deny/not see the irony/hypocrisy/contradiction.
Have mercy. :([/QUOTE]
My point exactly.
Consider that one poster who claimed that Greek women with fair skin and blue eyes aren't "real Greek women." Or that poster who claimed that Diana being depicted as blue-eyed and white skinned made her a "Barbie."
The hypocrisy here is in how Caucasians (or at least people with a lighter skin tone) are being belittled and put down.
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[QUOTE=hareluyafan1;6398391]My point exactly.
Consider that one poster who claimed that Greek women with fair skin and blue eyes aren't "real Greek women." Or that poster who claimed that Diana being depicted as blue-eyed and white skinned made her a "Barbie."
The hypocrisy here is in how Caucasians (or at least people with a lighter skin tone) are being belittled and put down.[/QUOTE]
That's not what was being said. People expressed a liking of her authentically looking like other types of white women from the region, because these characters can have varied looks. And criticized Barbie proportions being accepted because all that matters is she's a certain type of white, nothing else.
That transitioned to gatekeeping and accusations of virtue signaling because....idk, the culture war crap is out of control or something
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[QUOTE=SiegePerilous02;6398413]That's not what was being said. People expressed a liking of her authentically looking like other types of white women from the region, because these characters can have varied looks. And criticized Barbie proportions being accepted because all that matters is she's a certain type of white, nothing else.
That transitioned to gatekeeping and accusations of virtue signaling because....idk, the culture war crap is out of control or something[/QUOTE]
The real problem is people trying to pass off the video game model as "Greek" when she really looks Guatemalan. lol
They're a beautiful people but Diana doesn't look like them.
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6398382][video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)[/QUOTE]
Now that would've been epic. Also would've been better with a stronger villain.
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6398382][video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)[/QUOTE]
Wow, that not even 1 full minute concept animation is far more impressive than the entire 145 minutes of Wonder Woman 1984.
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6398382][video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)[/QUOTE]
Wow that was wondrous outwardly! I love seeing her super speed flight
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6398382][video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)[/QUOTE]
Thanks for sharing! That was great.
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[QUOTE=VonHammersmark;6398382][video=youtube;mh9ebdKHVds]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh9ebdKHVds[/video]
Here's the video in case you're interested :)[/QUOTE]
OH.
MY.
GOD.
Are you fricking kidding me? Of all the things that they could've edited out or decided not to fully render in WW84, THIS gorgeous, amazing scene is the one that they chose not to include in the movie????
I mean, I know that WW84 had a lot of problems, but this one scene would have looked amazing if rendered fully.
Thank you so much for sharing this!!!
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Btw am i the only fuckin weirdo that likes Earth One? (If you dislike it you dont need to quote me or explain to me why, Ive been reading people hating it for years)
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[QUOTE=Garrac;6399384]Btw am i the only fuckin weirdo that likes Earth One? (If you dislike it you dont need to quote me or explain to me why, Ive been reading people hating it for years)[/QUOTE]
No?
Their reception was mixed but there's clearly people who liked them.
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[QUOTE=Gaius;6399560]No?
Their reception was mixed but there's clearly people who liked them.[/QUOTE]
Oh, godness, thank you very much, I totally felt alone on my own since it started. I was even called out for defending Morrison while suposedly the entire fandom hated it or something like that.
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Yea, I think the first book in particular had a very mixed reception but each subsequent volume the reception was a bit more positive.
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[QUOTE=Garrac;6399665]Oh, godness, thank you very much, I totally felt alone on my own since it started. I was even called out for defending Morrison while suposedly the entire fandom hated it or something like that.[/QUOTE]
There's never consensus in any fandom, just a matter of where one goes to look. DCAU Wondy is pretty fairly overall liked but it's really only here where you'll find people who flat out dislike that version.
I don't care for them myself and I find Paquette's art totally unappealing but I give Morrison credit for thinking they did WW wrong in their previous work and wanting to take a genuine crack at her.
Which I'll take over people like Waid trying to blame the character for their own writing failures or Taylor hiding behind alternate universe excuses.
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I thing the first volume is the only one that's bad. I used to go to bat for it when it just came out, especially compared to Azzarello and Finch being it's contemporaries. But it has some fundamentally bad ideas in it that I've soured more on.
The other two volumes are still messes, but are overall more enjoyable with some legit good/fun stuff in them. I'm happy overall that it exists. It's off in it's own corner not bothering anything.
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Hmm, nice little beat but guess per Tom King in an interview at George Perez's funeral, Perez in pre-recorded message said he considered his WW run to be his proudest achievement in comics.
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[QUOTE=Gaius;6400075]Hmm, nice little beat but guess per Tom King in an interview at George Perez's funeral, Perez in pre-recorded message said he considered his WW run to be his proudest achievement in comics.[/QUOTE]
That's sweet :).
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Unrelated, but hey guys, guys, GUYS, Gail Simone just tweeted this and im goin fuckin bonkers
[url]https://twitter.com/GailSimone/status/1634279493379723264?s=20[/url]
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[QUOTE=Garrac;6400192]Unrelated, but hey guys, guys, GUYS, Gail Simone just tweeted this and im goin fuckin bonkers
[url]https://twitter.com/GailSimone/status/1634279493379723264?s=20[/url][/QUOTE]
I assume it's something on the smaller side - feel the same way about her returning as I do on Waid writing Superman, it'll be solid but I'm more interested in new voices.
Anyways not to poke the hornets nest but we did discuss Diana now canonically being 6'2 and 175 lbs and I missed it? Feels kind of small?
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[QUOTE=Garrac;6399384]Btw am i the only fuckin weirdo that likes Earth One? (If you dislike it you dont need to quote me or explain to me why, Ive been reading people hating it for years)[/QUOTE]
Nope I like it, I also like the New 52 Azz run, I just don’t really talk about WW stuff that is unpopular here. We’re around!
[QUOTE=Garrac;6400192]Unrelated, but hey guys, guys, GUYS, Gail Simone just tweeted this and im goin fuckin bonkers
[url]https://twitter.com/GailSimone/status/1634279493379723264?s=20[/url][/QUOTE]
I would not be surprised if she’s involved with the WW video game. But if DC could get her to do a BL WW mini that would be cool too.
[QUOTE=Hypo;6400232]I assume it's something on the smaller side - feel the same way about her returning as I do on Waid writing Superman, it'll be solid but I'm more interested in new voices.
Anyways not to poke the hornets nest but we did discuss Diana now canonically being 6'2 and 175 lbs and I missed it? Feels kind of small?[/QUOTE]
Hah, Conrad actually put out a tweet about that! Says it wasn’t his ideal but it was a compromise with editorial between what he wanted and what they thought was accurate. At least Diana is over 6 feet, that still makes her a tall woman.
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Being 6'2 is pretty good to me. Amazons should be tall, not super tall.
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[QUOTE=Primal Slayer;6401135]Being 6'2 is pretty good to me. Amazons should be tall, not super tall.[/QUOTE]
As far as I'm concerned, they should not be as tall as Giganta (lol), but yes, they should be taller than pretty much the average male. In other words, Diana should be the tallest member of the Trinity (there's a reason many dictionaries have "tall woman" as one of the definitions of "amazon" and "amazonian.")
I just hate whenever I see Superman and Batman (and pretty much every male not named Dr Psycho in comics) drawn as taller than WW.
