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[QUOTE=Koriand'r;5584385][ATTACH=CONFIG]110503[/ATTACH]
Agreed, you don't have to be born in the United States to respect American ideals. In fact I'd suspect someone who had to strive to get here and studied our history for an American citizenship test would be more patriotic than many natives.
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Also this was my first issue of Wonder Woman so it probably influenced my feelings on the subject.[/QUOTE]
That dialogue hasn't aged well.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;5585092]That dialogue hasn't aged well.[/QUOTE]
Well, she [I][B]is[/B][/I] talking about the ideals and [I][B]not[/B][/I] the reality. :p
I think there's been some stories/continuities (Bombshells if I recall) where the explanation is the colors are just things Themysciran culture also prominently uses, so it's more just a coincidence. Which works for me and works with the current costume.
Wrong thread.
[QUOTE=Gaius;5585253]I think there's been some stories/continuities (Bombshells if I recall) where the explanation is the colors are just things Themysciran culture also prominently uses, so it's more just a coincidence. Which works for me and works with the current costume.[/QUOTE]
Can't recall if it's been explicitly stated but if the Amazons had been influenced by Mycenean Greeks then that would also explain the red and blue since that was already a part of their culture.
[IMG]https://sites.google.com/site/thegreatancientgreektemples/_/rsrc/1516735830755/-haute-couture-in-ancient-greece---the-spectacular-costumes-of-ariadne-and-helen-of-troy/HAUTE%20COUTURE%20IN%20ANCIENT%20GREECE%20-%20THE%20SPECTACULAR%20COSTUMES%20OF%20ARIADNE%20AND%20HELEN%20OF%20TROY.png[/IMG]
[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/obidWfEsnSmBAX9w-DG8qiLD7FSseqUFJ7oqmpQzB6V4LweC7a9UZmgI91moJFNs49DISEnkGhoHowMg8jcvL80C6_F2-NJmtkfCa_W9eVyY[/IMG]
I think Nicola Scott may have taken inspiration from this for Rebirth because her depiction of Themyscira was a lot more colourful than what we usually see.
[QUOTE=John Venus;5585764]Can't recall if it's been explicitly stated but if the Amazons had been influenced by Mycenean Greeks then that would also explain the red and blue since that was already a part of their culture.
[IMG]https://sites.google.com/site/thegreatancientgreektemples/_/rsrc/1516735830755/-haute-couture-in-ancient-greece---the-spectacular-costumes-of-ariadne-and-helen-of-troy/HAUTE%20COUTURE%20IN%20ANCIENT%20GREECE%20-%20THE%20SPECTACULAR%20COSTUMES%20OF%20ARIADNE%20AND%20HELEN%20OF%20TROY.png[/IMG]
[IMG]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/obidWfEsnSmBAX9w-DG8qiLD7FSseqUFJ7oqmpQzB6V4LweC7a9UZmgI91moJFNs49DISEnkGhoHowMg8jcvL80C6_F2-NJmtkfCa_W9eVyY[/IMG]
I think Nicola Scott may have taken inspiration from this for Rebirth because her depiction of Themyscira was a lot more colourful than what we usually see.[/QUOTE]
Even the red and blue palette is more accurate based on those images.
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[url]https://twitter.com/docshaner/status/1404625797772726278?s=21[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/1404452504549605382?s=21[/url]
Both King and Shaner reading/drawing WW? Pretty sure there’s a King WW project coming down the line. He’s already finished the script for Supergirl so he’s already working on his next projects, which he said would be much lighter in tone.
[QUOTE=Vordan;5586985][url]https://twitter.com/docshaner/status/1404625797772726278?s=21[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/1404452504549605382?s=21[/url]
Both King and Shaner reading/drawing WW? Pretty sure there’s a King WW project coming down the line. He’s already finished the script for Supergirl so he’s already working on his next projects, which he said would be much lighter in tone.[/QUOTE]
Nowhere to go but up from that Batman issue he did that she guest-starred in. :p
[QUOTE=Gaius;5586997]Nowhere to go but up from that Batman issue he did that she guest-starred in. :p[/QUOTE]
The Horde is Endless.
[QUOTE=Vordan;5586985][url]https://twitter.com/docshaner/status/1404625797772726278?s=21[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/1404452504549605382?s=21[/url]
Both King and Shaner reading/drawing WW? Pretty sure there’s a King WW project coming down the line. He’s already finished the script for Supergirl so he’s already working on his next projects, which he said would be much lighter in tone.[/QUOTE]
Had that thought as well. More Diana is always good and I am morbidly curious how he'd write a Wonder Woman title. I do have enjoyed some of his books. Been a few years, though.
... What's the chances that he might write a story about Diana set in WWII? Seems right up his alley...
Well at least Doc Shaner does good art......
Tom King...Isn't he basically defined by having ever story hes written being about superheroes wanting or attempting to commit suicide?
[QUOTE=Fuzzy Mittens;5587085]Well at least Doc Shaner does good art......
Tom King...Isn't he basically defined by having ever story hes written being about superheroes wanting or attempting to commit suicide?[/QUOTE]
I haven't read Superman Up in the Sky, but it was well received by fans and it didn't seem to be a dark tale at all.
I would be curious to see him write Wonder Woman. In Batman Rebirth he had that one story where Bruce and Diana spent 1000 years I think, in another dimension. I didn't like the romance aspect, but I loved the other parts where they were being friends. Look at this moment:
[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/myrQGdS_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium[/IMG]
[QUOTE=masterwitcher88;5587004]The Horde is Endless.[/QUOTE]
[IMG]https://cirsova.files.wordpress.com/2018/01/batman-wonder-woman-almost-kiss-2-1075472.jpeg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://www.dccomics.com/sites/default/files/imce/2017/05-MAY/Hik_4_592dcd274de0e0.53858731.jpg[/IMG]
King can actually write really touching sentimental/ funny stories, which could be a good combination for Wonder Woman.
[QUOTE=Avi;5587055]Had that thought as well. More Diana is always good and I am morbidly curious how he'd write a Wonder Woman title. I do have enjoyed some of his books. Been a few years, though.
... What's the chances that he might write a story about Diana set in WWII? Seems right up his alley...[/QUOTE]
If he’s reading O’Neil for research then I think there’s a good chance he’s planning a WW book that references all her eras of publication, like he’s doing with Supergirl. It would likely be set in the modern day and I’m guessing they might put it out in the back half of this year as a sort of 80th celebration book. Or it’s a story in Black and Gold or some other WW anthology.
[QUOTE=Fuzzy Mittens;5587085]Well at least Doc Shaner does good art......
Tom King...Isn't he basically defined by having ever story hes written being about superheroes wanting or attempting to commit suicide?[/QUOTE]
Batman, Heroes in Crisis, and Mister Miracle were about that in part but otherwise no. Vision wasn’t that, Omega Man wasn’t that, his Superman story wasn’t that, Grayson wasn’t that, and Supergirl doesn’t seem to be that either.
It's probably just a story for the 80th Anniversary special. He did one for Superman and I'd assume also one for the Batman ones.
[QUOTE=Vordan;5586985][url]https://twitter.com/docshaner/status/1404625797772726278?s=21[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/1404452504549605382?s=21[/url]
Both King and Shaner reading/drawing WW? Pretty sure there’s a King WW project coming down the line. He’s already finished the script for Supergirl so he’s already working on his next projects, which he said would be much lighter in tone.[/QUOTE]
I've never been particularly fond of how King has written Diana before, so not really sure how to feel about this.
[QUOTE=Frontier;5587195]I've never been particularly fond of how King has written Diana before, so not really sure how to feel about this.[/QUOTE]
Being a sexy seductress to test Batman's loyalty to Selina isn't good writing? :p
He’s probably doing a [I]Black and Gold[/I] story.
Only so many writers/artists and you got 4 stories an issue. Gotta dig deep since it’s 6 issues, 24 teams total.
[QUOTE=Fuzzy Mittens;5587085]Well at least Doc Shaner does good art......
Tom King...Isn't he basically defined by having ever story hes written being about superheroes wanting or attempting to commit suicide?[/QUOTE]
I guess if someone wants to do a jaded Diana story, give him a call. :p
Love Shaner. I'd love him on Diana, but King seems mismatched for her. Real monkey's paw.
[QUOTE=Gaius;5587278]Being a sexy seductress to test Batman's loyalty to Selina isn't good writing? :p[/QUOTE]
That's not how he wrote her. Again, I still disliked the romantic aspect of it, but neither of them was throwing themselves at the other.
Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?
[QUOTE=Stanlos;5587464]Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?[/QUOTE]
I prefer Diana to be the only one who really has powers though I tend to view the average Amazon would be around comic book "peak human"/Captain American-levels.
[QUOTE=Stanlos;5587464]Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?[/QUOTE]
I think Nubia should be as powerful as Diana.
[QUOTE=I'm a Fish;5587477]I think Nubia should be as powerful as Diana.[/QUOTE]
Pretty much..... Diana=Nubia>>>Donna>>>Hippolyta and her sisters>>Yara=Cassie=(My head cannon Wonderboy)>>Important Named Amazons>Other Amazons
Edit: switched the sidekicks with Hippolyta and her sisters
[QUOTE=Stanlos;5587464]Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?[/QUOTE]
I lean more towards the 'all the Amazons have incredible power' approach. Makes Wonder Woman winning the contest to become Wonder Woman and proving herself to be the greatest of all the Amazons into an actual achievement and not a farce. Also lends more weight to the notion that she would be well trained and skilled since she would be learning to combat people in her weight class.
Actually, I've reached the point where I believe Diana should totally outscale the other amazons, and the contest shouldn't be about Diana masking herself and competing to prove she is the best, it should be about the amazons determining if she is ready. So the whole contest is made around testing Diana.
Diana should be trained at full strength when she is growing up, because that's what allows her to know how to take advantage of her powers in the most efficient ways. The amazons should design training equipment for her super strength and challenges where she has to fight multiple amazons with weapons at the same time, while she only uses a lasso (by her own choice)
I ask because I was reading some clippings of Lynda Carter discussing her approach to the mythology. I liked a lot of what she said.
[QUOTE=Stanlos;5587464]Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?[/QUOTE]
I think they at least should have the potential to be.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;5588359]I think they at least should have the potential to be.[/QUOTE]
To somewhat quote the Incredibles, if everyone can be Super, than no one is. Diana should be in a class of her own!
I remember in the 90's when I was still purchasing Superman comics when the New Krypton storyline came in. If I remember right, there were now 100,000 kryptonians around Earth. So what makes the Last son of Krypton super anymore? First of all, he is not the last son anymore, and second of all, if Superman by himself gives Darkseid a run for his money, what suspense does a 100,000 more give. I gave up on Superman comics after that!
[QUOTE=BiteTheBullet;5588560]To somewhat quote the Incredibles, if everyone can be Super, than no one is. [/QUOTE]
You do remember that the person who said that was the villain? The person we should [I]not[/I] be agreeing with?
[QUOTE]I remember in the 90's when I was still purchasing Superman comics when the New Krypton storyline came in. If I remember right, there were now 100,000 kryptonians around Earth. So what makes the Last son of Krypton super anymore? First of all, he is not the last son anymore, and second of all, if Superman by himself gives Darkseid a run for his money, what suspense does a 100,000 more give. I gave up on Superman comics after that![/QUOTE]
Superman hasn't been the last son of Krypton ever since Supergirl and Zod showed. Superman losing his powers is what makes him less super not the number of Kryptonians running around.
[QUOTE=Agent Z;5588585]You do remember that the person who said that was the villain? The person we should [I]not[/I] be agreeing with?
Superman hasn't been the last son of Krypton ever since Supergirl and Zod showed. Superman losing his powers is what makes him less super not the number of Kryptonians running around.[/QUOTE]
I still think the quote stands up from the villain. What makes Diana special if anyone on Themyscria can be as powerful as Diana? Did everyone on the island get blessed by gods like Diana?
If it is about the tournament that Diana wins, why not go the William Messner Loebs route and magically have Diana be the same as the others just for the tournament?
And yes I realize that Superman isn't the only person that survived Krypton, but when another 100,000 show up, that was when I gave up on him. If there were only 2 or 3 left, fine, but 100,000?!? Come on now! It sounds like the writers couldn't think of any good storylines, so they came up with the New Krypton crap.
Im just not a fan of that 'special one of a kind' approach since it takes away any sense that Diana had to work for what she has and just had it served up to her on a silver platter. A nice part of what made the whole concept so interesting in the beginning is how on an island of Amazons with incredible abilities who were all capable of feats beyond the normal man, Diana was able to stand out and prove herself and persevere.
The 'only one of the Amazons' logics the sort of thing that led to DC trying to retcon away all the other Kryptonians and killing off Supergirl to try making Superman special. Which is pointless when a dozen other flying bricks with the exact same powerset already exist without that specific origin.
The thing is, I've come to realize that the best thing about Diana is that she is totally privileged, which means that she has to challenge herself far beyond the standards of the other amazons.
And that's what she preaches to the world, be your best self, go beyond your own limits. So Diana doesn't have to be a normal woman that earned everything she has, she has to be a blessed being that made the best out of the amazing gifts she was given.
That's why I want to see the amazons use catapults to throw huge boulders at Diana for her to catch and throw at targets in the distance, and have her be chased by those giant sharks while juggling. Or more serious stuff, as long as her training equipment is specifically designed to challenge her superhuman powers.
[QUOTE]Do you all think the Amazons should all be as powerful as Diana? With Philippus and the Queen being more powerful/skilled?
[/QUOTE]
I prefer the origin of The Legend of Wonder Woman, she initially had no powers, the powers came from the arms and artifacts of the Amazons but in the end she "received" the powers of Gaia
[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/6hNDYqV.jpg[/IMG]
I really loved this comic, because the sequel was never made?
[QUOTE=Gaius;5587476]I prefer Diana to be the only one who really has powers though I tend to view the average Amazon would be around comic book "peak human"/Captain American-levels.[/QUOTE]
Diana being the only superpowered amazon with the amazons being essentially humans with superior conditioning is how I always interpreted the status quo. I hate the idea of all amazons being as powerful as WW; let's hope they never go there.
I like the amazons to have the strength of 10 men but WW obviously being superior due to her blessings by the gods.
I think Amazons should all have varying power levels. While none should be close to Diana's level apart from maybe an adult Donna, Nubia and Artemis, Diana's mother, her sisters and Philippus should at least be close to that level. They should be the comic version of mid-tier while Diana is a high-tier. As for the other Amazons, they should all have the "strength of 10 men" or slightly above. The weakest Amazons (non-combatants) should be peak human like DC street levelers.
Has there been a reason stated for why Artemis is so much stronger than almost all the other amazons? Or at least she seems to be...
[QUOTE=Standish;5589852]Has there been a reason stated for why Artemis is so much stronger than almost all the other amazons? Or at least she seems to be...[/QUOTE]
Not since her come back in Rebirth. I think. Lobdell is really the only writer to have used her in significantly since Rebirth, barring a team up two parter with Diana in the main book under Orlando. I think.
I know Hippolyta has built in reasons for her strength but she also used the girdle which amplified her strength.
In fact, I think Artemis was also granted some magical objects that boosted her strength when she became WW in the 90s.