That Bagley pic is one of the few arts where her gloves actually look good and not like dishwashers... But the lack of cleavage made the dress 10x uglier.
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That Bagley pic is one of the few arts where her gloves actually look good and not like dishwashers... But the lack of cleavage made the dress 10x uglier.
[QUOTE=Lukmendes;5848305]I mean, Sinister probably had their DNA before they lost their powers, so a clone with the powers would make sense... Unless "No More Mutants" is supposed to make even those inert but I don't think that's the case.[/QUOTE]
Well, Wanda’s spell made it so no more mutants can even be born. So I doubt the clones would be born with their abilities.
[QUOTE=The Agent of Chaos;5848404]Well, Wanda’s spell made it so no more mutants can even be born. So I doubt the clones would be born with their abilities.[/QUOTE]
That was undone in AvX:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/q9iTwMb.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/rdQ472x.png[/img]
(AvX#12).
[QUOTE=Lukmendes;5848305]I mean, Sinister probably had their DNA before they lost their powers, so a clone with the powers would make sense... Unless "No More Mutants" is supposed to make even those inert but I don't think that's the case.[/QUOTE]
The whole Decimation thing was a mess; Beast and the X-Men were very worried that mutants were going extinct because there were too few of them to make a sustainable population... without taking into account that all of them could make mutant babies with normal humans... they somehow forgot that mutants and baseline humans can reproduce normally...
Decimation just doesn't make sense... it's better to not think too deeply about it...
[QUOTE=Lukmendes;5848407]That was undone in AvX:
(AvX#12).[/QUOTE]
But none of those people were born with an active X-gene the Phoenix gave them one and many were still left de-powered like Jubilee. So the spell wasn’t exactly undone. The Phoenix just made more mutants.
[QUOTE=Habis;5848422]The whole Decimation thing was a mess; Beast and the X-Men were very worried that mutants were going extinct because there were too few of them to make a sustainable population... without taking into account that all of them could make mutant babies with normal humans... they somehow forgot that mutants and baseline humans can reproduce normally...
Decimation just doesn't make sense... it's better to not think too deeply about it...[/QUOTE]
It was suggested that people weren’t being born with an active X-gene. That is why Hope’s birth was such a big deal.
[QUOTE=The Agent of Chaos;5848477]
It was suggested that people weren’t being born with an active X-gene. That is why Hope’s birth was such a big deal.[/QUOTE]
When Beast was asked he said the problem was how little was the gene pool of the surviving mutant population.
And I think it was never confirmed that mutants were unable to produce mutant babies.
Was looking through Marvel Database and found this plot hole:
[quote] The X-Gene was erased from the Depowered Mutants, without any trace.[39] Depowered mutants were detected as Humans.[40][41]
[B]The Decimation effected the DNA of every mutant, even when separated from its source: Mutant Growth Hormone (MGH) provided by depowered mutants was rendered useless.[42][/B]
[B]Astra managed to create a seemingly powered clone of the Blob despite the fact that the original had been de-powered.[43][/B][/quote]
Going to go check out the sources.
[QUOTE=Habis;5848422]The whole Decimation thing was a mess; Beast and the X-Men were very worried that mutants were going extinct because there were too few of them to make a sustainable population... without taking into account that all of them could make mutant babies with normal humans... they somehow forgot that mutants and baseline humans can reproduce normally...
Decimation just doesn't make sense... it's better to not think too deeply about it...[/QUOTE]
The best justification for that is the characters fearing that no more mutants can be born no matter what, but, if that's the case, no matter how many mutants there were, they would die out eventually anyways lol.
[QUOTE=The Agent of Chaos;5848477]But none of those people were born with an active X-gene the Phoenix gave them one and many were still left de-powered like Jubilee. So the spell wasn’t exactly undone. The Phoenix just made more mutants.[/quote]
Huh, was thinking it repowered mutants at random... Guess it's a plot hole then, or maybe The Five's cloning method is superior enough that it re-activates the X-gene, or could be the Phoenix thing you suggested.
I'll go for plot hole, don't really trust Marvel to explain stuff lol.
[QUOTE=The Agent of Chaos;5848574]Was looking through Marvel Database and found this plot hole:
Going to go check out the sources.[/QUOTE]
For Uncanny X-Men#490, they mention mutant DNA went inert:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/fILe9qk.png[/img]
For Magneto: Not a Hero#3, Astra made a clones with adjustments, but doesn't explain much else:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/zZEYB9q.png[/img]
It's possible the "adjustments" allowed him to and whoever else to be repowered, but that's not pointed out, and the clone's killed in issue#4, so it's a pretty forgettable plot hole.
Claremont on how he would adapt the Phoenix and Dark Phoenix sagas:
[QUOTE]“If I were doing Dark Phoenix, I would do it as Game of Thrones, and start with Jean arriving at the school: Spend the first season with everybody falling in love with her; Scott [Summers, aka Cyclops] falling in love with her. And then maybe at the end of the first season, we’d go up and she would become Phoenix. And then in the second season, she’d [go on to] do great things as Phoenix.”[/QUOTE]
[url]https://www.syfy.com/syfy-wire/c2e2-chris-claremont-wants-game-of-thrones-style-x-men-series?amp[/url]
Slicknickshady was nice enough to share a link to the video of the entire panel:
[url]https://www.findthemetaverse.com/comics/c2e2-2021-chris-claremont-spotlight[/url]
[QUOTE=Mercury;5848970]Claremont on how he would adapt the Phoenix and Dark Phoenix sagas:
“If I were doing Dark Phoenix, I would do it as Game of Thrones, and start with Jean arriving at the school: [b]Spend the first season with everybody falling in love with her[/b]; Scott [Summers, aka Cyclops] falling in love with her. And then maybe at the end of the first season, we’d go up and she would become Phoenix. And then in the second season, she’d [go on to] do great things as Phoenix.”[/quote]
Including Xavier? :p.
But yeah, I agree with his mentality about stories like this needing time, and super-heroes in particular benefit far more from other medium when compared to movies, specifically because movies generally have to tell a big story to be worth it, while a series can have smaller stories that can introduce more characters who start as nobodies, but can grow to become much bigger.
Honestly though? I think cartoons are the best possible medium, since tv series with actors and whatnot have all of those budget issues that limit how fights can be shown, and while you don't need awesome fights to develop characters, they're still super-heroes, and awesome fights are better to be there, and not to mention that tv series doesn't have to worry as much about younger characters aging.
Speak of the Dark Phoenix Saga in live-action…I got this reply on YouTube not too long ago that tried to argue that one of the merits of The Last Stand was that it tackled mental health issues. That the Phoenix plot was a good descent into madness story…
Do people still believe that dissociative identity disorder makes people inherently violent after the controversy surrounding M. Night Shyamalan’s Split/Glass? Yikes.
1.) I’m all for a slow burn lead up to Phoenix. To be honest, if it were just me, I’d see the dark Phoenix be the end of a 10 year plan, kinda like avengers infinity war/endgame was the wrap up of everything that came before it. That way everything didn’t have to be Phoenix centric, but it was all leading up to it. Whether it’s movies or a tv show, dark Phoenix would be my “endgame” in the background.
2.) “everyone falling in love with jean.” I don’t think he means romantically; but either way, I don’t like this idea at all. I never took it as everyone falling in love with her. Learning to love her, yes. She grows close to many people. I get that. But I think he seems to take the concept a bit too far… even if he created it. Like in retrospect I think he may put jean on too high a pedestal.
Just let her be herself and develop her relationship with others. No need for everyone to “fall in love with her”.
[QUOTE=The Agent of Chaos;5849367]Speak of the Dark Phoenix Saga in live-action…I got this reply on YouTube not too long ago that tried to argue that one of the merits of The Last Stand was that it tackled mental health issues. That the Phoenix plot was a good descent into madness story…
Do people still believe that dissociative identity disorder makes people inherently violent after the controversy surrounding M. Night Shyamalan’s Split/Glass? Yikes.[/QUOTE]
I never saw the m knight movie. But I think your question actually highlights a bigger question: was dark Phoenix a clone, or was she possessed, or was she mentally ill? I’m not actually asking people here. I’d be dying to do a poll to see what people think of as “the” definitive dark Phoenix edition. You have the original idea, the retcon, and everything in between. I bet a lot of people have different ideas of the “one true actual story” especially among non comic fans.
I think the Dark Phoenix Story has been done at this point (not only by the X-Men movies but also by literally EVERY other genre fantasy/science fiction movie and series ever).
WHAT WE NEED IS THE PHOENIX STORY! Jean flying into space saving the universe. the end.
[QUOTE=Exodus;5849433]I think the Dark Phoenix Story has been done at this point (not only by the X-Men movies but also by literally EVERY other genre fantasy/science fiction movie and series ever).
WHAT WE NEED IS THE PHOENIX STORY! Jean flying into space saving the universe. the end.[/QUOTE]
Ha, true. When I say dark Phoenix saga, I really just mean the Phoenix in general. That’s why I have it being such a long slow burn plan in my head.
Yes, let’s see the heroic Phoenix story.