What do you think of Hickmans X-Men so far, still Interested or Not ??

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542909]Yes definitely that´s why I think the rule of kill no man is not only important to keep mutants with bad intentions in check it also gives humanity an olive branch from which they have room to talk out their issues instead of going overboard with it. Imo that´s probably why Magneto made such a show when Cortez tried to put a stop to it, it´s not only a matter of internal politics for Krakoa, it´s also what keeps a fragile balance between the rest of humanity and mutants hence why Magneto said not even he would be given a excuse if he broke it, not only because of the law itself but because he has a group of loyal mutants that would feel justified in following in his footsteps.[/QUOTE]

Excellent point, I've got nothing else on this front.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542909]Definitely that would be another new ground to explore, outside of the traditional super hero groups like the FF4 or the Avengers.[/QUOTE]

If it needed marquee value you could always add an Avenger or something. And it could really work through multiple genres.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542909]That would be interesting, I would like to see something like that as well. In the Magneto´s solo title by Bunn there were some agents from Shield who were ok in stopping him when he went to far but also sometimes helped him get information about captured mutants because they agreed it was unfair, that kind of nuance would be nice to see.[/QUOTE]

Yes, absolutely, I could definitely get behind more of that.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542938]Exactly and that´s why it´s better for Orchis to remain a secret group, they don´t want to be seen attacking a country outnowhere for not reason and in the journey or helping out humanity in a genuine way you end with better human and mutant relationships than it was before that´s why I think Krakoa is a interesting compromise for all involved, mutants(X-men or otherwise) and humans.[/QUOTE]

Orchis is just waiting for a chink in Krakoa's armor so that they can justify their extreme response and I think the leadership has created the environment for that to happen.

I think I'm enjoying discussing these topics with y'all more than I did reading the actual book.

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5543034]Orchis is just waiting for a chink in Krakoa's armor so that they can justify their extreme response and I think the leadership has created the environment for that to happen.

[B]I think I'm enjoying discussing these topics with y'all more than I did reading the actual book.[/B][/QUOTE]

I don't think that's an uncommon feeling for the flagship title. A lot of the ideas presented are ripe for discussion and analysis even if the execution isn't everyone's cup of tea.

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5543030]Excellent point, I've got nothing else on this front.[/QUOTE]

Thank you :)

[QUOTE]If it needed marquee value you could always add an Avenger or something. And it could really work through multiple genres.[/QUOTE]

Yes I would love to see a new version of the Uncanny Avengers, this is a good time for a team like that.

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5543034]Orchis is just waiting for a chink in Krakoa's armor so that they can justify their extreme response and I think the leadership has created the environment for that to happen.[/QUOTE]

Yes so far they had to use indirect attacks so if something happens the balance is quite fragile, I think the leadership has keep a thinly veiled balance but after the Gala and Magneto´s trial who knows what will happen, I expect conflict but I hope they keep part of that tension going on for more time.

[QUOTE]I think I'm enjoying discussing these topics with y'all more than I did reading the actual book.[/QUOTE]

Discussion is a big part of the fun, and you raise good points as well. There´s so much left to know about how Krakoa came to be that there´s much left to debate.

Can’t end soon enough. Let’s hope Nightcrawler destroys Krakoa.

[QUOTE=Slicknickshady;5543092]Can’t end soon enough. Let’s hope Nightcrawler destroys Krakoa.[/QUOTE]
Dang! Tell us how you really feel. LoL!

Do you feel they seem a little too villainous these days, hanging out with Apocalypse, Sinister and those sort of characters? What’s your issues with the books? Please, expand upon your view.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5543088]Thank you :)[/QUOTE]

You're welcome ;)

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5543088]Yes I would love to see a new version of the Uncanny Avengers, this is a good time for a team like that.[/QUOTE]

That could work too, show a united front with the other premier super-team. Plus, aren't the Avengers trying to deal with an explosion of rival super-teams? Better to have Krakoa on your side.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5543088]Yes so far they had to use indirect attacks so if something happens the balance is quite fragile, I think the leadership has keep a thinly veiled balance but after the Gala and Magneto´s trial who knows what will happen, I expect conflict but I hope they keep part of that tension going on for more time.[/QUOTE]

I'm admittedly impatient, maybe just a little more forward momentum would be good.

[QUOTE=Kingdom X;5543082]I don't think that's an uncommon feeling for the flagship title. A lot of the ideas presented are ripe for discussion and analysis even if the execution isn't everyone's cup of tea.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5543088]Discussion is a big part of the fun, and you raise good points as well. There´s so much left to know about how Krakoa came to be that there´s much left to debate.[/QUOTE]

I wish it [I]was[/I] my cup of tea.

I appreciate y'all humoring me.

Still very interested.

The weakest links so far are Excalibur, X-Factor, and X-Force (mostly because of the coarse art and parade of "monster of the week" plant stuff). Children of the Atom is only three issues in, and X-Corp just started, but they're not very promising for me.

Fallen Angels was a huge misfire and X-Men/Fantastic Four was rendered pointless because of Dan Slott's poopy pants.

Future looks promising.

[QUOTE=Brian B;5542577]
Apocalypse, Magneto, Shaw and Sinister are running the same country, or they were until recently. Apocalypse brought over his half-demon-mutant kids and grandkids over to Earth, and they view themselves as the folks who ought to be in charge of Earth, not humans.[/QUOTE]

Acccctually Saturnye brought them over. ONly the Summoner subset are half demon I think not that it matters. There's plenty of half demon heroes in the 616. And they did Save the Earth only to be sent to a hellish reality....Id be a lil salty

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542829]
And that's true from the perspective mutants, I'm just looking at it from the perspective of the average person who woke up one day and there was suddenly an entire new world power chaired by [B]some of the worst criminals in human history.[/B] There's definitely some great potential narrative payoff, maybe I'll be singing praises for this run by the end[/QUOTE]
huh? like who? for what? and people wake up, eat, work, and continue to live in countries that has laws preventing or taking away their full agency every day. Is it scarier because its 'new' Why would the average person care about 'super criminals in a foreign country thousands of miles away when they don't even trust their own government to not poison vaccines? lol

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542829]Krakoa is the first time mutantkind has largely gathered in this way, I think Orchis as a [I]preventive or protective measure[/I] could arguably be justified. [B]The use of a Mother Mold is indefensible, that's true.[/B][/QUOTE]
And Yet...
[QUOTE=Brian B;5542577]In the face of that, are Orchis really the baddies? Or are they just humanity’s protectors?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542589]They certainly seem more like the latter in that context.[/QUOTE]
No guys...racism is wrong. is the KKK the protectors of Southern whites? Nazis of Aryan blood?
[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542587]Are any of us defending human government's for doing that?[/QUOTE]
If its 'problematic' to not say anything to Magneto for his comments why not the same standard for the human hero's who are cool with their governments owning and using Sentinels....Did nothing about the TCloud... MDay etc. Hell America's last president, said far worse about whole countries


[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542762]I see what you mean, but what I'm saying is to [B]Brian B[/B]'s point that it's that wiggle room that allows Orchis and others like them the leeway they need to push further and further. [B]The average layman will see that Krakoan leadership includes Apocalypse [/B]and won't push back as much when Orchis goes too far.[/QUOTE]
Errr What has Apocalypse done to the average layman?? As an Average layman I can say without question I wouldn't be okay with a racist hate group attacking a nation of people because of their leadership
Geeez
[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542844]I don´t think the average person knows who Apocalypse, Selene, Sinister, et all even are as all of them had their hidden identities [/QUOTE]
But if they Did it would justify Genocide.... which I guess has been the theme past few pages

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542844]Yes it would be a nice way to include a third faction that makes sense because at the end of the day most mutants are born from human families who loved them or love them. In fact it was never explained why they would allow their child to be taken to camps. Old Genosha had the story of a couple, one a mutant and one a human who was the Son of the one in charge to the mutates concentration camps so he used his father influence to save his girlfriend and later became a rebel in favor of mutants so yes, there´s room for more stories like that one.
[/QUOTE] Errrr going from being cool with ur dad running concentration camps to "rebel" cause ur gf got put in one doesnt really give me that heartwarming feeling.

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542884]Certainly most people wouldn't know but with modern technology and the numerous conflicts that there have been (thanks Marvel) there should be plenty of people and even conspiracy websites spreading this information.[/QUOTE]
WOuld the people with this modern technology just Forget who Hitler...Stalin...Pol Pot..THe Pretender are? Which mutants are worse?

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542884]And I think that point of view is explored so little, there's so much ground to explore.[/QUOTE]
buuut what is the point of view so ripe for exploration?

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5542884]I'd like to see possible deserters of Orchis, individuals who believe that there should be a response but disagree with the extreme direction that Orchis eventually went.[/QUOTE]
Nice Family Friendly racists?
[QUOTE=Hizashi;5543034]
I think I'm enjoying discussing these topics with y'all more than I did reading the actual book.[/QUOTE]
I didn't think you did

[QUOTE=Slicknickshady;5543092]Can’t end soon enough. Let’s hope Nightcrawler destroys Krakoa.[/QUOTE]

LOL, if lil' ol' Kurt destroyed Krakoa I will throw all the moneys at Marvel

My excitement going forward will be based on how much I like the whole Gala event plus how X-Men turns out and, especially, what Hickman decides to do with the new title.

Can't say anything met the hype and quality of HoX/PoX ever since the final issue and I am in this constant push-pull whether to read it all (as intended) or just drop most due to mediocrity and read Hickman stuff only.

Unfortunately, Hickman was purely 'the head of X' so far and a short story writer. Nothing ever led to anything except for a couple of ace issues.

*Way of X #1 was incredible!

[QUOTE=BroHomo;5543641]Acccctually Saturnye brought them over. ONly the Summoner subset are half demon I think not that it matters. There's plenty of half demon heroes in the 616. And they did Save the Earth only to be sent to a hellish reality....Id be a lil salty
huh? like who? for what? and people wake up, eat, work, and continue to live in countries that has laws preventing or taking away their full agency every day. Is it scarier because its 'new' Why would the average person care about 'super criminals in a foreign country thousands of miles away when they don't even trust their own government to not poison vaccines? lol
And Yet...
No guys...racism is wrong. is the KKK the protectors of Southern whites? Nazis of Aryan blood?[/QUOTE]

Agreed

[QUOTE]If its 'problematic' to not say anything to Magneto for his comments why not the same standard for the human hero's who are cool with their governments owning and using Sentinels....Did nothing about the TCloud... MDay etc. Hell America's last president, said far worse about whole countries[/QUOTE]

Ugh don´t make me remember that one, he was more talk than substance but he was way annoying. I stand that Magneto said that because he was talking to a bunch of ambassadors whose goverments in the past have not tought much about using sentinels to hunt down mutants and one agent send to kill Xavier. This doesn´t mean he´s going to go around telling every human he sees how they are gods now. Especially since he has had good relationships with humans in the past.


[QUOTE]Errr What has Apocalypse done to the average layman?? As an Average layman I can say without question I wouldn't be okay with a racist hate group attacking a nation of people because of their leadership
Geeez[/QUOTE]

Apocalypse is unknown but his presence on Krakoa can be used to tell how much they need to stop Krakoa, it´s part of dyplomacy that they need to take care of now.

[QUOTE]But if they Did it would justify Genocide.... which I guess has been the theme past few pages[/QUOTE]

Can´t argue with you on this one, you are totally right but the problem is that it doesn´t justify it at all but it´s exactly what they are going to do and that´s why they are not "good guys" on any category.

[QUOTE]Errrr going from being cool with ur dad running concentration camps to "rebel" cause ur gf got put in one doesnt really give me that heartwarming feeling.[/QUOTE]

Well I mostly made that point to show there are stories that could tackle a middle ground without being fully right or wrong, I liked he at least started to care enough to join the civil war on Genosha even if he did it for not quite a virtous reason at the beggining.

[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5542909]Yes definitely that´s why I think the rule of kill no man is not only important to keep mutants with bad intentions in check it also gives humanity an olive branch from which they have room to talk out their issues instead of going overboard with it[/QUOTE]

I doubt this rule is known by every human on Earth neither the humans trust the mutants if, by chance, they know it. Krakoa is a close society with few contacts with the rest of the world. The exchanges are discouraged.

[QUOTE=Brian B;5543106]Dang! Tell us how you really feel. LoL!

Do you feel they seem a little too villainous these days, hanging out with Apocalypse, Sinister and those sort of characters? What’s your issues with the books? Please, expand upon your view.[/QUOTE]

For me it's they don't seem like themselves. I had high hopes after HOX/POX but since then lost interest. I now Hickman likes to move things slowly but for me it's going to slow. With his Avengers run (which I loved) although the story took time to progress it seemed to move things along. Every few months I pick up a book or two to see if things are any better (really enjoyed X-Force and Marauders initially) but for me not so much. I appreciate Hickman trying to change things up but for me it's to much of a change. My favorite era was the Outback times through X-Men 1-3 (when CC left), I guess I'm just old. lol

[QUOTE=Zelena;5543716]I doubt this rule is known by every human on Earth neither the humans trust the mutants if, by chance, they know it. Krakoa is a close society with few contacts with the rest of the world. The exchanges are discouraged.[/QUOTE]

If I remember correctly random humans in Hellions and New Mutants knew about it, so it seems like common knowledge.