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Man, that thread really starts it up.
IMHO the run started really good and powerful, but with all these titles spread around, most of the authors not following Hickman's creativity for something new and rehashing old stories like Storm killing Callistor example just quite boring. The only titles which keep up with Hickman's creativity are the SWORD, New X-Men, X-Factor, and to some very small extend, X-Force and X-Men. Everything else seems like a huge lacklustre and especially with those monthly releases, which add even more to the annoyance of waiting and having to catch up to some stupid continuity, not okay.
I prefer all those boring titles, which are not as creative as Hickman's run and follow it, to be released every week to end faster and finally move on from all those fillers and lose the main plotline excitement. I really hope that they will denser the outgoing issues and, in exchange, make the stories thicker, more on point with the main plot and weekly coming instead of monthly coming.
Imagine, I had much more fun reading King in Black and Empyre's main issues than the entirety of Hickman's run for DoX phase. I wish they could concentrate on the main storyline they want to tell instead of creating all those side issues that follow their own short storylines, which, honestly, feel like fillers than the actual main storyline they wish to tell.
Please explain to me what the Children of the Atom are? Pure filler arc, which tells for human kids which replicated mutant powers... absolutely pointless, out of the main context and on top of that bringing in Avengers... just... no. Or should I go to the other side, Excalibur? What the hell is Excalibur after the XoS event. It makes zero sense, especially in the last two issues. Absolutely boring. Or what about... Marauders... like seriously, this book has been rather boring from the beginning, one of the reasons I am not that hyped for Galla. Marauders literally had only 5-6 good issues, and everything else was pure filler and a waste of time, resources and a lack of perfect storyline telling. It even had two OLM stuck in that issue (Storm and Iceman) which literally do nothing to expand on their capabilities and show us why they are called OLM and why people fear them. It is all about Kitty's show and Emma's serious lack of importance in that issue. All Emma does in there is shown in one or two panels saying I will fund that, we have lots of money. She doesn't have any progress, she doesn't do anything else more productive, while Kitty, we had like 10 or so issues mysteriously telling us that she can't be resurrected only to end up being something stupid, and even with this book being all about her than the entire team, she still lacks HUGE character progression. Tell me what Kitty did during that entire run but to die once, take a few weeks to get resurrected, and have Emma in a VR conversation through her telepathy? Yeah, she really had some good stuff, like saving those humans from the human trafficking ship, that was good, and her vengeance, but that literally was everything, everything else was a mere filler, and the author completely dried out the story.
I am sorry but so far DoX phase is absolutely boring, filler for 70% of its issues. They need to step up and actually write good stories...
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5479602] Marvel fudged up by buffing telepaths so much, because we've only discussed the mindreading aspect (which is bad enough) without addressing the mind-altering aspect. [/QUOTE]
I don't agree with everything you're saying, but this here is spot on.
Telepathy, at it's core, is meant to be communication without speaking. Being able to send and receive thoughts mind to mind. Nothing inherent to it requires a great range (Spock could only do it by touch!), and it would not be out of line *at all* for most 'telepaths' to have a range not much greater than the human voice (a dozen yards, further if 'shouting' which could put strain on the 'shouter' and even make them 'lose their voice' telepathically speaking, for a time!).
But instead, Marvel based all telepaths on Xavier with his global range (who was supposed to be the best!) and had even nobodies like Mentat / Robert Zephaniah idly boast about reading the minds of people in Hollywood when he was in New York. That was a big mistake, IMO. Xavier was always meant to be the master. Not the template for what every single new telepath could do out of the box!
And then more and more powers got slapped on. Congratulations, you just hit puberty and your X-gene activated and you're a telepath! Tell him what he won, Vanna!
Send and Receive Thoughts.
Astral Projection.
Mind Control.
Language Translation.
Absorbing Skills / Languages from Others.
Instantly teaching Skills/Languages to Others.
Emotion Control.
Affecting the Body of another (stopping someone's heart, for instance).
Projecting Telepathic Shields to protect others from other Telepaths.
Psychic Illusions (messing with sensory impressions).
Psychic Invisibility.
Memory Tampering.
Mental Blasts.
Psychic Knives/Swords/Guns.
Many of these entirely useful sub-powers are capable of sustaining an entire character on their own! Translation - Cypher, Skill Absorption - Prodigy, Illusion - Masterminds, Mirage, Invisibility - Cipher, Astral Projection - Scanner, Trance, Mind Control - Karma, Emotion Control - Empath, Memory Tampering - Beautiful Dreamer, Forget Me Not, etc.
And instead of saying that any of them might be one of the unique expressions of power that some master telepath like Xavier had developed over the decades, every one of them sort of randomly becomes available to Shadow King, Psylocke, Jean, Emma, Quentin, etc. as if they all have some sort of hive mind.
Then we've got Psylocke teaching languages and Quentin making psychic weapons and no telepath has anything distinctive anymore, other than cosmetic stuff like these two (Betsy, Kwannon) make purple butterflies and these other two (Jean, Rachel) do a fiery bird power signature.
(And for that matter, I want more power signatures. Someone needs to make a green snake slithering out to taste the thoughts of their prey! Someone else needs to have a black cat shadow outline rear up and pounce at the target of their mental blasts!)
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[QUOTE=Lucyinthesky;5479655]This would explain why telepaths seek people whou would not have a big issue with their powers for friendship or relationships, Scott had a physic link with Jean that went both ways, in some runs in others it didn´t and that´s why they became a couple and with Emma he often opened his thoughts to her and she did the same with him. Charles became a friend of Erik because he could not read his mind easily so he was curious about him.
I think this power is one that can make the user an outsider with humans and even some mutants unless there´s some previous level of trust but at the same time if it ends badly it can hurt on a deeper level. [/QUOTE]
Yeah, it's one thing for an individual to open themselves up, but in a general sense there are so many pitfalls to telepathy that I really wish Hickman or the comics in general would deal with it. It's nice to see that I'm not the only one who sees these issues.
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[QUOTE=Sutekh;5479827]I don't agree with everything you're saying, but this here is spot on.
Telepathy, at it's core, is meant to be communication without speaking. Being able to send and receive thoughts mind to mind. Nothing inherent to it requires a great range (Spock could only do it by touch!), and it would not be out of line *at all* for most 'telepaths' to have a range not much greater than the human voice (a dozen yards, further if 'shouting' which could put strain on the 'shouter' and even make them 'lose their voice' telepathically speaking, for a time!).
But instead, Marvel based all telepaths on Xavier with his global range (who was supposed to be the best!) and had even nobodies like Mentat / Robert Zephaniah idly boast about reading the minds of people in Hollywood when he was in New York. That was a big mistake, IMO. Xavier was always meant to be the master. Not the template for what every single new telepath could do out of the box!
And then more and more powers got slapped on. Congratulations, you just hit puberty and your X-gene activated and you're a telepath! Tell him what he won, Vanna!
Send and Receive Thoughts.
Astral Projection.
Mind Control.
Language Translation.
Absorbing Skills / Languages from Others.
Instantly teaching Skills/Languages to Others.
Emotion Control.
Affecting the Body of another (stopping someone's heart, for instance).
Projecting Telepathic Shields to protect others from other Telepaths.
Psychic Illusions (messing with sensory impressions).
Psychic Invisibility.
Memory Tampering.
Mental Blasts.
Psychic Knives/Swords/Guns.
Many of these entirely useful sub-powers are capable of sustaining an entire character on their own! Translation - Cypher, Skill Absorption - Prodigy, Illusion - Masterminds, Mirage, Invisibility - Cipher, Astral Projection - Scanner, Trance, Mind Control - Karma, Emotion Control - Empath, Memory Tampering - Beautiful Dreamer, Forget Me Not, etc.
And instead of saying that any of them might be one of the unique expressions of power that some master telepath like Xavier had developed over the decades, every one of them sort of randomly becomes available to Shadow King, Psylocke, Jean, Emma, Quentin, etc. as if they all have some sort of hive mind.
Then we've got Psylocke teaching languages and Quentin making psychic weapons and no telepath has anything distinctive anymore, other than cosmetic stuff like these two (Betsy, Kwannon) make purple butterflies and these other two (Jean, Rachel) do a fiery bird power signature.
(And for that matter, I want more power signatures. Someone needs to make a green snake slithering out to taste the thoughts of their prey! Someone else needs to have a black cat shadow outline rear up and pounce at the target of their mental blasts!)[/QUOTE]
That's fair, we can disagree amicably.
I love your point here, I wish Marvel would specialize their telepaths it would create more narrative and character options.
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5479860]
I love your point here, I wish Marvel would specialize their telepaths it would create more narrative and character options.[/QUOTE]
I agree. I feel like they used to do this more but out of fear of the more specialized mutants like Karma looking underpowered they just add on abilities.
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[QUOTE=Sutekh;5479827]I don't agree with everything you're saying, but this here is spot on.
Telepathy, at it's core, is meant to be communication without speaking. Being able to send and receive thoughts mind to mind. Nothing inherent to it requires a great range (Spock could only do it by touch!), and it would not be out of line *at all* for most 'telepaths' to have a range not much greater than the human voice (a dozen yards, further if 'shouting' which could put strain on the 'shouter' and even make them 'lose their voice' telepathically speaking, for a time!).
But instead, Marvel based all telepaths on Xavier with his global range (who was supposed to be the best!) and had even nobodies like Mentat / Robert Zephaniah idly boast about reading the minds of people in Hollywood when he was in New York. That was a big mistake, IMO. Xavier was always meant to be the master. Not the template for what every single new telepath could do out of the box!
And then more and more powers got slapped on. Congratulations, you just hit puberty and your X-gene activated and you're a telepath! Tell him what he won, Vanna!
Send and Receive Thoughts.
Astral Projection.
Mind Control.
Language Translation.
Absorbing Skills / Languages from Others.
Instantly teaching Skills/Languages to Others.
Emotion Control.
Affecting the Body of another (stopping someone's heart, for instance).
Projecting Telepathic Shields to protect others from other Telepaths.
Psychic Illusions (messing with sensory impressions).
Psychic Invisibility.
Memory Tampering.
Mental Blasts.
Psychic Knives/Swords/Guns.
Many of these entirely useful sub-powers are capable of sustaining an entire character on their own! Translation - Cypher, Skill Absorption - Prodigy, Illusion - Masterminds, Mirage, Invisibility - Cipher, Astral Projection - Scanner, Trance, Mind Control - Karma, Emotion Control - Empath, Memory Tampering - Beautiful Dreamer, Forget Me Not, etc.
And instead of saying that any of them might be one of the unique expressions of power that some master telepath like Xavier had developed over the decades, every one of them sort of randomly becomes available to Shadow King, Psylocke, Jean, Emma, Quentin, etc. as if they all have some sort of hive mind.
Then we've got Psylocke teaching languages and Quentin making psychic weapons and no telepath has anything distinctive anymore, other than cosmetic stuff like these two (Betsy, Kwannon) make purple butterflies and these other two (Jean, Rachel) do a fiery bird power signature.
(And for that matter, I want more power signatures. Someone needs to make a green snake slithering out to taste the thoughts of their prey! Someone else needs to have a black cat shadow outline rear up and pounce at the target of their mental blasts!)[/QUOTE]
Xavier doesnt't has global range without Cerebro
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First thet came for the telepaths and then the Jedis.
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[QUOTE=Rang10;5479974]Xavier doesnt't has global range without Cerebro[/QUOTE]
It depends on the plot:
[IMG]https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11137/111378174/6995314-3113191384-wRZ0MIC73HGp8W2KXa2Qi_wFE8hZ2-BG4fv5ZqEkZzDUaKcoNcJHGV8gnEmSNECDtsJ-tVWN_xk6%3Ds1600[/IMG]
But I agree that it’s like with Magneto, when the author needs something, the character is mysteriously given a new feature… I suppose that not everyone knows Xavier is an expert in martial arts. It ends being impressive, all these abilities…
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I like how unknowable Charles Xavier is in the Hickman pages. & I like the fact that Hickman gave the various lines some ground to work with. It's fairly anti-decimation, without throwing a fit about it. I'd like to see a little more tension in relation to the council -- the sort of willful obliviousness around Sinister feels a tad unforced -- but then the weapon that is Iceman is contained to a boat, so. It'd be interesting to see if someone wants to write a conversation between malice and polaris.
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I apologize for derailing this thread with my telepathy stance nonsense.
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/LKnRBJCzkNems/giphy.gif[/IMG]
On topic, with the recent announcement about Duggan seemingly taking over a relaunched [I]X-Men[/I] and Hickman doing something else (presumably that Moira book or maybe [I]Uncanny[/I]) how will that impact what Hickman has done so far? For me, it's disappointing that Hickman's book has been so much setup and crossover - I understand that there are many who are picking up multiple books, but I have DC and Image comics in my pull also, so I started only with [I]X-Men[/I] and [I]New Mutants[/I]. Eventually I dropped New Mutants, but X-Men really began disappointing with its pacing and setup work on behalf on other books...
Suffice it to say, I'm not enthusiastic about the future of the main book.
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5481196]I apologize for derailing this thread with my telepathy stance nonsense.
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/LKnRBJCzkNems/giphy.gif[/IMG]
On topic, with the recent announcement about Duggan seemingly taking over a relaunched [I]X-Men[/I] and Hickman doing something else (presumably that Moira book or maybe [I]Uncanny[/I]) how will that impact what Hickman has done so far? For me, it's disappointing that Hickman's book has been so much setup and crossover - I understand that there are many who are picking up multiple books, but I have DC and Image comics in my pull also, so I started only with [I]X-Men[/I] and [I]New Mutants[/I]. Eventually I dropped New Mutants, but X-Men really began disappointing with its pacing and setup work on behalf on other books...
Suffice it to say, I'm not enthusiastic about the future of the main book.[/QUOTE]
I’m thinking now is when Hickman will give us the pay off to all the world building that he’s been doing and Duggan will either be complimentary or maybe X-Men+the MU at large. The timing seems about right based on his usual methods.
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[QUOTE=Wolverine12;5481957]I’m thinking now is when Hickman will give us the pay off to all the world building that he’s been doing and Duggan will either be complimentary or maybe X-Men+the MU at large. The timing seems about right based on his usual methods.[/QUOTE]
I'd love to be excited for the X-Books again, HoX/PoX was a great opening act.
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If anything Hickman coming off the main book makes the book feel like its going to be irrelevant. I don't see how standard superhero stuff works under Krakoa, though I will gladly be proven wrong. So far this entire thing has been 80% buildup, and the only plots with payoff have been super disappointing.
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482072]If anything Hickman coming off the main book makes the book feel like its going to be irrelevant. I don't see how standard superhero stuff works under Krakoa, though I will gladly be proven wrong. So far this entire thing has been 80% buildup, and the only plots with payoff have been super disappointing.[/QUOTE]
Really? i love how he is not only redefining the X-men but him, Jordan D. White and their team are redefining how continuity can work in modern comics with Jordan being producer, hickman being directior/writer and then his writers on the books. Hopefully the rest of marvel takes note after this hero's reborn and the change of distributor.
In my mind every last book published hickman has touched in a way. Everyone has, that's powerful, but it's his endgame. It must be exciting.
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482072]If anything Hickman coming off the main book makes the book feel like its going to be irrelevant. I don't see how standard superhero stuff works under Krakoa, though I will gladly be proven wrong. So far this entire thing has been 80% buildup, and the only plots with payoff have been super disappointing.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I agree with you here, that's why I'm skeptical. What I want for the X-Men team is that they start asking of Krakoa and Professor X:
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/4Z9fSEFAuxpnlBVWQx/giphy.gif[/IMG]
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5482084]Yeah, I agree with you here, that's why I'm skeptical. What I want for the X-Men team is that they start asking of Krakoa and Professor X:
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/4Z9fSEFAuxpnlBVWQx/giphy.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I'm still waiting for that from the Avengers to be honest.
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482072]If anything Hickman coming off the main book makes the book feel like its going to be irrelevant. I don't see how standard superhero stuff works under Krakoa, though I will gladly be proven wrong. So far this entire thing has been 80% buildup, and the only plots with payoff have been super disappointing.[/QUOTE]
X-men will be like Hickman's avengers: mostly filler stuff
I think Hickman book will be like New avengers where the meat of the story really is
[QUOTE=jwatson;5482076]Really? i love how he is not only redefining the X-men but him, Jordan D. White and their team are redefining how continuity can work in modern comics with Jordan being producer, hickman being directior/writer and then his writers on the books. Hopefully the rest of marvel takes note after this hero's reborn and the change of distributor.
In my mind every last book published hickman has touched in a way. Everyone has, that's powerful, but it's his endgame. It must be exciting.[/QUOTE]
I hope not, Marvel universe is in better shape thn x-men books
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[QUOTE=jwatson;5482091]I'm still waiting for that from the Avengers to be honest.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, we'll be waiting on that one for a while too.
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[QUOTE=Rang10;5482135]
I hope not, Marvel universe is in better shape thn x-men books[/QUOTE]
lol idk about that. While this era is pretty overrated after the initial HoxPox story, the last numbers we had access to seemed to show the X-books doing better than anything else on the whole.
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As much as a loathe Jason Aaron's Avengers run, its been pretty harmless. It mucks with continuity and there not a lot of depth, but but there hasn't been anybody committing genocide casually. In the solo titles Iron Man is being forced to reckon with his own privilege, and Captain America is taking down a fascist cabal while dissecting why people fall into white supremacy. Its pretty great imo.
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[QUOTE=Kitty&Piotr<3;5482165]lol idk about that. While this era is pretty overrated after the initial HoxPox story, the last numbers we had access to seemed to show the X-books doing better than anything else on the whole.[/QUOTE]
What I saw was A lot of Marvel Universe books doing better than X-men. Marvel priority is promoting Venom/spider-man/avengers because they are getting better sales
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Except Spider-Man, which is apparently doing gangbusters. Last I saw the only X book that sold top 10 was the last main X issue, and it got beat by both Spider-Man titles. But take that with a grain of salt, because we aren't getting good numbers for anything.
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482176]Except Spider-Man, which is apparently doing gangbusters. Last I saw the only X book that sold top 10 was the last main X issue, and it got beat by both Spider-Man titles. But take that with a grain of salt, because we aren't getting good numbers for anything.[/QUOTE]
Aggregately though, top 10 is one thing, but what about top 100? Top 50?
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482170]As much as a loathe Jason Aaron's Avengers run, its been pretty harmless. It mucks with continuity and there not a lot of depth, but but there hasn't been anybody committing genocide casually. In the solo titles Iron Man is being forced to reckon with his own privilege, and Captain America is taking down a fascist cabal while dissecting why people fall into white supremacy. Its pretty great imo.[/QUOTE]
Eh, Aaron trying to marry the Phoenix to the Avengers just proves it should've been put down a long time ago, never mind the ridiculous Avengers BC/Phoenix and Thor nonsense. As for Iron Man and Captain America, good concepts are nothing without good execution. I've said in this thread that I don't even think the X-Books are outright bad - but the Avengers books are IMO.
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[QUOTE=Kitty&Piotr<3;5482178]Aggregately though, top 10 is one thing, but what about top 100? Top 50?[/QUOTE]
It is harder to get specific rankings, if you are looking for the last data it is inflated by XoS. After that they went back to pre-XoS.
[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482170]As much as a loathe Jason Aaron's Avengers run, its been pretty harmless. It mucks with continuity and there not a lot of depth, but but there hasn't been anybody committing genocide casually. In the solo titles Iron Man is being forced to reckon with his own privilege, and Captain America is taking down a fascist cabal while dissecting why people fall into white supremacy. Its pretty great imo.[/QUOTE]
Avengers is very dumb but also kinda of fun. It's good that you get the conclusion fast instead of dragging, in 5 issue they solved Phoenix. Not sure if harmless, Phoenix has been taking hits for a decade
Iron Man and captain America are working fine, Thor is interesting too. They don't need to do like X-books
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482176]Except Spider-Man, which is apparently doing gangbusters. Last I saw the only X book that sold top 10 was the last main X issue, and it got beat by both Spider-Man titles. But take that with a grain of salt, because we aren't getting good numbers for anything.[/QUOTE]
Is spiderman doing that well.I am happy with the run and I know its consistently in the top 5 or 10 but didn't know it was doing that well.Also haven't seen an X-book in top 10 for a while
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482170]As much as a loathe Jason Aaron's Avengers run, its been pretty harmless. It mucks with continuity and there not a lot of depth, but but there hasn't been anybody committing genocide casually. In the solo titles Iron Man is being forced to reckon with his own privilege, and Captain America is taking down a fascist cabal while dissecting why people fall into white supremacy. Its pretty great imo.[/QUOTE]
Its not ruining the Avengers characters but its ruining the X-men mythos which is beyond terrible and should have been shut down
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5482084]Yeah, I agree with you here, that's why I'm skeptical. What I want for the X-Men team is that they start asking of Krakoa and Professor X:
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/4Z9fSEFAuxpnlBVWQx/giphy.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Logan’s been asking that since HoX. It’s been brought up in Percy’s X-Force again by Logan. Cyclops and Jean defied the QC in XoS. It’s there, but it’s not a focus every issue. Also Krakoa in general isn’t doing anything “bad” outside of the Hellions team.
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[QUOTE=pkingdom;5482176]Except Spider-Man, which is apparently doing gangbusters. Last I saw the only X book that sold top 10 was the last main X issue, and it got beat by both Spider-Man titles. But take that with a grain of salt, because we aren't getting good numbers for anything.[/QUOTE]
Top 10/20 can be very misleading because basically every single month Marvel and DC have a number of launches, relaunches and event books filled with variant covers that eschew the numbers significantly. Just because X-Men doesn't appear in the top 10 regularly it doesn't mean it's doing poorly. For the satellite books on the other hand it's more about applying common sense: if you see that say X-Factor has been hanging around the 70th spot for a while and books above it are being cancelled, you know that the same is possibly happening to it. There are other factors to consider, for example how expensive the creative team is and how the trade sales are doing, but there aren't many cases where the floppies sell poorly and the trades sell great and it's definitely not satellite X-books.
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[QUOTE=Spiderfan001;5482312]Is spiderman doing that well.I am happy with the run and I know its consistently in the top 5 or 10 but didn't know it was doing that well.Also haven't seen an X-book in top 10 for a while[/QUOTE]
When you removed the event books and other No.1s, Venom and Spider-Man are Marvel's best-sellers (in that order most of the time). Next would be Immortal Hulk and Thor. X-Men or Wolverine sometimes make it into the top when there's less competition.
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[QUOTE=Havok83;5482315]Its not ruining the Avengers characters but its ruining the X-men mythos which is beyond terrible and should have been shut down[/QUOTE]
Didnt the initial heroes reborn come out of the x-line too via onslaught. It does seem in this era it's a lot harder for the other office to just pull in whatever mutants they want and do whatever they want for insta-sales which is also another thing i love this era. An event is one thing but the X-men shouldn't be brought in just to boost the sales of avenger books when your not a fan of both your getting nothing in return on the x-side and if you are reading both you can't deny the discrepancies when it comes to the stories and which team is actually always helping. So far aside from King in black all the Avenger side x-content has been in minis and stand alone books and the only use of most popular mutants has been severely limited unless they create an AU which this Heroes Reborn i think will be the second one.
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[QUOTE=Wolverine12;5482330]Logan’s been asking that since HoX. It’s been brought up in Percy’s X-Force again by Logan. Cyclops and Jean defied the QC in XoS. It’s there, but it’s not a focus every issue. Also Krakoa in general isn’t doing anything “bad” outside of the Hellions team.[/QUOTE]
Indo think this new X-Men team will be where they start sniffing out the Moira of it all that Xavier's been keeping secret.
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[QUOTE=Wolverine12;5482330]Logan’s been asking that since HoX. It’s been brought up in Percy’s X-Force again by Logan. Cyclops and Jean defied the QC in XoS. It’s there, but it’s not a focus every issue. Also Krakoa in general isn’t doing anything “bad” outside of the Hellions team.[/QUOTE]
The Hellions arent really doing anything bad either. They dealt with Maddie and her demon clones, XOS shenanigans and now Arcade in Murderworld. X-Force has been worse than them
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[QUOTE=Wolverine12;5482330]Logan’s been asking that since HoX. It’s been brought up in Percy’s X-Force again by Logan. Cyclops and Jean defied the QC in XoS. It’s there, but it’s not a focus every issue. Also Krakoa in general isn’t doing anything “bad” outside of the Hellions team.[/QUOTE]
Wasn't what Scott and Jean did just a general disagreement with procedure or something? I don't know, this question should be a bigger concern in my opinion.
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[QUOTE=Hizashi;5482724]Wasn't what Scott and Jean did just a general disagreement with procedure or something? I don't know, this question should be a bigger concern in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
She objected vehemently to what Beast is doing in X-Force and she knows the team is sanctioned and given freedoms by Xavier. I think a big part of why she wants to reform the X-men outside of the QC's control is in opposition to that
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[QUOTE=Havok83;5482721]The Hellions arent really doing anything bad either. They dealt with Maddie and her demon clones, XOS shenanigans and now Arcade in Murderworld. X-Force has been worse than them[/QUOTE]
It is Sinister that is doing wrong things
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[QUOTE=Havok83;5482721]The Hellions arent really doing anything bad either. They dealt with Maddie and her demon clones, XOS shenanigans and now Arcade in Murderworld. X-Force has been worse than them[/QUOTE]
There was the AI genocide they committed on the order of the QC.
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[QUOTE=cranger;5482938]There was the AI genocide they committed on the order of the QC.[/QUOTE]They destroyed a bunch of sentinels. Yeah not that bad
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[QUOTE=Havok83;5483041]They destroyed a bunch of sentinels. Yeah not that bad[/QUOTE]
They were not sentinels. Hellions #8 for reference.
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[QUOTE=cranger;5483055]They were not sentinels. Hellions #8 for reference.[/QUOTE]
They were sentinels infected with the TO virus. They had just tried to kill the Hellions 5 minutes before they were destroyed. The team was justified in what they did
