What do you think of Hickmans X-Men so far, still Interested or Not ??

[QUOTE=Kingdom X;5540157]Yeah I agree with those statements. It's just weird to me that fans are so quick to call all of Krakoa a supremacist nation (and have been actively been against their new segregationist views), but then they want mutants to give humans the benefit of the doubt and not generalize them based on the actions of some few governments and particularly hateful individuals. I figured the thought of reintegrating would make fans who hate this era happy, but I guess not.

[B]Also want to note that this could not be the case at all and we're really just speculating off of one poster's amazing theory.[/B][/QUOTE]

Oh yeah, definitely rolling with the conjecture because it's incredibly rich soil from which to grow several stories. I don't understand that point of view either. We haven't really seen enough to state, without a doubt, that Krakoa is a supremacist state. That would require lots of official statements on the part of the council, as well as reinforcement from multiple cases of the Krakoan population demonstrating said behavior. It's like some want to speak it into existence, rather than what is actually going on.

I can't wait for the Gala and Planet Sized X-Men! It's material like this that gets me excited in the absence of powerful, compelling villains and challenges they create. It just reinforces, in my mind, that the worldbuilding is the best part of the Hickman Era thus far.

My own opinion, and not dependent on anyone else's view of Krakoa, humans, mutants, integration, Mars, butts, or anything else, is this: Krakoa is setting up a world where humans feel they need to become mutant. If that means acting a certain way, leaving themselves vulnerable to certain things, or exposing certain advancements, then that is all part of the plan.

[QUOTE=Metal Sphere;5540163]Oh yeah, definitely rolling with the conjecture because it's incredibly rich soil from which to grow several stories. I don't understand that point of view either. We haven't really seen enough to state, without a doubt, that Krakoa is a supremacist state. That would require lots of official statements on the part of the council, as well as reinforcement from multiple cases of the Krakoan population demonstrating said behavior. [B]It's like some want to speak it into existence, rather than what is actually going on.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Right! I swear I must live in a different universe cause I didn't realize supremacists rescued refugees and provided people with life-saving drugs.

[QUOTE=Metal Sphere;5540163]I can't wait for the Gala and Planet Sized X-Men! It's material like this that gets me excited in the absence of powerful, compelling villains and challenges they create. It just reinforces, in my mind, that the worldbuilding is the best part of the Hickman Era thus far.[/QUOTE]

Same! Even if I don't like/ agree with everything I like the unpredictability of it because in a couple years we can easily go back to traditional stories with traditional heroes and villains.

[QUOTE=cranger;5540168]My own opinion, and not dependent on anyone else's view of Krakoa, humans, mutants, integration, Mars, butts, or anything else, is this: Krakoa is setting up a world where humans feel they need to become mutant. If that means acting a certain way, leaving themselves vulnerable to certain things, or exposing certain advancements, then that is all part of the plan.[/QUOTE]

Seems a bad plan, because this way they become the homo novissima

[QUOTE=Rang10;5540180]Seems a bad plan, because this way they become the homo novissima[/QUOTE]
Forget terms like that. The problem is not humans evolving, as that is the goal and is what humans are doing by giving birth to 'mutants', but humans evolving based on AI which is where the conflicts in Moira's lives come from.

[QUOTE=cranger;5540191]Forget terms like that. The problem is not humans evolving, as that is the goal and is what humans are doing by giving birth to 'mutants', but humans evolving based on AI which is where the conflicts in Moira's lives come from.[/QUOTE]

This is Moira perspective, doesnt mean she is right. Mutants doesn't mean evolving, is just one random mutation. Evolving doesn't mean to get better, it mean fully adapted to situations.
Evolve is about adaptation.

HUmans probably will go their own way intead of submitting to mutants. I mean some will, but a huge powerful prt wont.

[QUOTE=Rang10;5540201]This is Moira perspective, doesnt mean she is right. Mutants doesn't mean evolving, is just one random mutation. Evolving doesn't mean to get better, it mean fully adapted to situations.
Evolve is about adaptation.

HUmans probably will go their own way intead of submitting to mutants. I mean some will, but a huge powerful prt wont.[/QUOTE]

I am just talking about explaining some things like the 'supremacist' attitude given off by Krakoa and the QC.

[QUOTE=Zelena;5540082]You care if a character dies… If the character resurrects, you feel cheated… “Oh, the author played with my feelings…”

Now with this resurrection machinery… it’s: “oh, they died, what’s the point?” The characters feel less real. Why would you feel anything?[/QUOTE]

This as been my whole point all along.................. I don't feel anything anymore and haven't since DPS.
Comic book characters died before resurrection and I knew they would come back.
Comic book characters died after resurrection and I know they come back.
For me, the only difference is i'm not subjected to a stupid retcon with resurrection.

If nothing else this version made me wonder again what comes next. And that did not happen for quite some time for me in an X-Men comic. The last years it was just one looming Extinction after the other. If the current run would be just putting an end to that idea it would be enough.

[QUOTE=Houseofhick;5540224]This as been my whole point all along.................. I don't feel anything anymore and haven't since DPS.
Comic book characters died before resurrection and I knew they would come back.
Comic book characters died after resurrection and I know they come back.
For me, the only difference is i'm not subjected to a stupid retcon with resurrection.[/QUOTE]

True it is not like comics did not use a lot of stuff to bring someone back^^

[QUOTE=Dunkelzahn;5540264]If nothing else this version made me wonder again what comes next. And that did not happen for quite some time for me in an X-Men comic. The last years it was just one looming Extinction after the other. If the current run would be just putting an end to that idea it would be enough.[/QUOTE]

Not to argue, as I have the same hope that Marvel gets past the extinction gimmick, but there are two problems: nothing Hickman does is going to stop someone else from writing another extinction arc, and technically this is an extinction arc (although only a handful of characters are aware).

[QUOTE=cranger;5539874]It is a one shot. My expectation is that this will be the introduction to bringing Cable back into SWORD with the new status quo.[/QUOTE]

ah, I missed that. I guess I've developed a provolone response to tie-in books.

[QUOTE=Houseofhick;5540068]I don't know how they become more meaningless but everyone will have their own opinion on this.[/QUOTE]

Because now there's even less tension to any deaths. There isn't even the illusion of permanence.

[QUOTE=sunofdarkchild;5540128]I think it's more a case of 'we already don't care since death has been meaningless for years.' If a character stayed dead it was an exceptional case and likely a very specific editorial edict that would end when a new editor took over. When Nightcrawler died, when Wolverine died, when Xavier died, there was no reason to care since we knew they'd all be back sooner rather than later. With Scott's death they seemed to be poking fun at this by making it off-panel and having everyone hate him for a year before they even showed what happened. Occasionally there will be a story where the emotional fallout is handled well enough that we may feel something, like with Damian's death in Batman Inc and the Human Torch's death and the silent issues that followed those - even if everyone knew that they wouldn't last long. It's impossible to care when the very concept has been a joke for decades.

The Rosenberg run and this current run seem like them acknowledging that the emperor has no clothes and that the audience can't be manipulated by killing off characters anymore. Now the issue is about whether the characters will come back wrong, which has always been one of my preferred options for bringing back a dead character partly because of its rarity and partly because it doesn't detract from the tragedy of the original death in the same way bringing them back as they were does. It also creates new ethical issues that are being addressed in Way of X and New Mutants. The question of who gets to be resurrected and who doesn't is very meta as well.[/QUOTE]

What they did with Scott wasn't poking fun at anything.

And as I've said before this isn't the answer, deaths should become rarer and more permanent not commonplace and immediately taken back.

[QUOTE=Hizashi;5540321]Because now there's even less tension to any deaths. There isn't even the illusion of permanence.[/QUOTE]

Basically. This is mainstream superhero comics, we all know how things are going to work out in the long run and it is not just 'death' that never sticks. The job of the story is to make us fail the saving throw vs illusion for a period of time.