-
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;1908269][B]I feel like we are jumping the gun here. Coates and Stelfreeze have both shown us alot of good things that they want to do for BP. 95% of what Coates has been sayk g has been on point and to switch up over this when he has so far shown to have done alot of research and has thus far seemed to genuinely want to show BP respect infeel it's unfair to jump to conclusions that he is gonna pull a Mayberry or Hickman. It's not really a big deal that he didn't have BP on his list, CJP didn't have T'Challa on his radar yet he provided arguably the best BP run to date. Plus Coates is excited to write Bp and plans to continue to write the series after the first 11 issues. Ontop of that, Bo is about to blow up in the MCU there would be no way Marvel would let Coates to chump T'Challa. That would be extremely counter productive [/B][/QUOTE]
I trusted Hickman to do right by the BP mythos.
I'm not making the same mistake with Hickman 2.0.
-
[QUOTE=MindofShadow;1908105]Dat movie protection is real
Feels good mane
Watxh ur back Beast lol[/QUOTE]
Lmfao. Right!
-
I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL]
-
I don't care about Shuri as a character but that sucks for her fans
-
[B][SIZE=7]NNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOO NOT SHURI!!!!![/SIZE][/B] Don't tell me T'Challa was on some THERE CAN BE NO PRETENDERS TO THE THRONE type ish, for real though how was she not brought back???
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908332]I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL][/QUOTE]
That would sort of imply that she didn't "magically" come back to life like everyone else did post Secret Wars.
That said, I don't think they'd bother mentioning her if there weren't plans for her one way or the other. Why even mention that she died if she's not going to be used. Maybe she'll end up the secret big bad or something like that.
-
[QUOTE=XPac;1908366]That would sort of imply that she didn't "magically" come back to life like everyone else did post Secret Wars.
That said, I don't think they'd bother mentioning her if there weren't plans for her one way or the other. Why even mention that she died if she's not going to be used. Maybe she'll end up the secret big bad or something like that.[/QUOTE]
I hope thats the case!
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908332]I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL][/QUOTE]
I'm STILL having major issues with T'Challa warping space/time and crowning himself King....but leaves his one and only blood sibling not only without the crown but now DEAD!?!?!?!?!?!?
-
[QUOTE=XPac;1908366]That would sort of imply that she didn't "magically" come back to life like everyone else did post Secret Wars.
[B]That said, I don't think they'd bother mentioning her if there weren't plans for her one way or the other. Why even mention that she died if she's not going to be used. Maybe she'll end up the secret big bad or something like that.[/B][/QUOTE]
Possibly, but at the same time, it could be something as simple as her being mentioned or shown in a flashback and avoiding new fans going, "who the hell is Shuri?" They're going to have to explain why she's still dead though since everyone else is back, including the kids who were killed by Black Swan back in NA #1. Maybe she's Queen of the Dead?
-
[QUOTE=Ziggiyy;1908372]I'm STILL having major issues with T'Challa warping space/time and crowning himself King....but leaves his one and only blood sibling not only without the crown but now DEAD!?!?!?!?!?!?[/QUOTE]
If Shuri is dead, that might imply that T'Challa really didn't warp time at least. Shuri died in Time Runs Out. If she's still dead, that would imply all of that still happened in the current timeline.
Really, that whole thing with T'Challa at the end of Secret Wars was confusing.
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908377]Possibly, but at the same time, it could be something as simple as her being mentioned or shown in a flashback and avoiding new fans going, "who the hell is Shuri?" They're going to have to explain why she's still dead though since everyone else is back, including the kids who were killed by Black Swan back in NA #1. Maybe she's Queen of the Dead?[/QUOTE]
While they certainly have to address Shuri one way or the other, this seemed to be a 4 paragraph intro page and they dedicated one purely to address the SHuri situation. I don't think they'd bother doing that if it wasn't important. If it's not important they can mention Shuri inside the book without bothering to mention it on the preview page.
But we'll see... that's just my guess.
-
Only a week away now. I can't wait.
-
[QUOTE=XPac;1908380]If Shuri is dead, that might imply that T'Challa really didn't warp time at least. Shuri died in Time Runs Out. If she's still dead, that would imply all of that still happened in the current timeline.
Really, that whole thing with T'Challa at the end of Secret Wars was confusing.[/QUOTE]
T'Challa went back to BEFORE TRO though, and managed to "save" "reset" or "reboot" the ENTIRE Marvel universe, including Wakanda and those kids and NOT his S-I-S-T-E-R?!?!?! It defies all logic.
Which really bugs me, but it also lets me know that some how some way I believe she WILL factor into this season. Whether as the one who is secretly leading the uprising against T'Challa or in some other surprise capacity. I don't think her involvement in the BP mythos ends with a throwaway sentence in a prologue
-
[QUOTE=Ziggiyy;1908399]T'Challa went back to BEFORE TRO though, and managed to "save" "reset" or "reboot" the ENTIRE Marvel universe, including Wakanda and those kids and NOT his S-I-S-T-E-R?!?!?! It defies all logic.[/QUOTE]
T'Challa when Shuri asks why he ain't go back to resurrect her.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/frPgwRE.jpg[/IMG]
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;1908275]I trusted Hickman to do right by the BP mythos.
I'm not making the same mistake with Hickman 2.0.[/QUOTE]
[B]Eh solos are more important to make sure your writing the character correctly. Even from the get go in Hickman's run he was having T'Challa have blunders from The start. I have doubts that Coates i s gonna pull a Hickman, especially due to all the research he had out into this ontop of the hype. Can you honestlythink that wth all the hype Coates would ruin it by trying to chump T'Challa?[/B]
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;1908275]I trusted Hickman to do right by the BP mythos.
I'm not making the same mistake with Hickman 2.0.[/QUOTE]
I trusted Hickman, or at least, tried to dive into his stuff, more than once. Disappointed every time.
If anything, Coates is a lot more aware than Hickman.
But, how in the world is he "Hickman 2.0"? What similarities do they have at all?
-
I knew something smelled fishy as soon as BP joined the Illuminati, so I just patiently waited for the proper characterization to return.
-
[B]They said she died from thanos army she shouldn't still be dead. I think they were just mentioning it as a recap. The reset brings everyone who died back to life. Unless something prevented her from coming back. I think people are misinterpreting what they are saying[/B]
-
Is it still in-contuity (well, in pre-the-reset-continuity) that once a year any Wakandan can challenge the ruler and, if successful in all the tests, take over?
There's a weird true-prince thing going on there, considering it's stayed in the family so much, but still, that does temper accusations that it's just an old-fashioned unquestionable kingdom setup that needs to get with modern whatever. (Whatever "modern" governments are supposed to be. "Ours," I guess.)
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908332]I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL][/QUOTE]
Looks like I can save my money...
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;1908235]That all depends on what Mr "T'Challa didn't register on my mind" Coates actually does with the BP mythos.
The NYTimes article has more or less revealed Coates to be a writer who wants to leave his mark on the BP mythos by pulling a revisionist Maberry/Hickman like revisionist driveby on said mythos.
He has ZERO respect for what came before and will probably use BP as a stepping stone to go write characters and books he's more attracted to.
To date, post Kirby and Mcgregor, Hudlin remains the only writer who actually wanted to write T'Challa from jump straight no chaser.
It's funny how the writer who actually cares about the BP mythos the most is the one who supposed hotshots like Maberry and Coates barely acknowledge as they go on to give faux praise to Priest's take on the BP mythos just before they water shit down or impose their own revisionist agenda on said mythos.[/QUOTE]
I'm not gonna lie, a big part of my apprehension about this has been that when you follow Coates tweets on twitter he never seemed to be a big Black Panther fan. He always touted his love of the X-Men more than anything.
A lot of the things Coates talked about doing with Black Panther sound very cool and interesting, but many of the other things sounds like he intends to "fix" the character.
I don't doubt that he has the writing talent to tackle this character, I just wonder if his idea of who T'Challa is lines up with with fans idea of who T'Challa is as a character.
I enjoyed Hickman's New Avengers, but it is disconcerting that Coates lavishes nothing but high praise for that series while at the same time giving faint praise Priest and Hudlin's runs (the two most beloved by a fair margin). All the characters that those two created seem to be characters he has not interest in tackling, but he's already planning on using characters and ideas from Maberry's run? WTF
Some of Coates comments remind me of those old CBR threads where unfans would talk about how to "Fix" Black Panther and it's always amounted to changing everything that fans loved about the character and Wakanda.
I'm trying to go into this series with an open mind, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't have a gut feeling that a big change is gonna happen that a lot of fans aren't gonna like.
-
[QUOTE=Kasper Cole;1908597]I'm not gonna lie, a big part of my apprehension about this has been that when you follow Coates tweets on twitter he never seemed to be a big Black Panther fan. He always touted his love of the X-Men more than anything.[/QUOTE]
Was Chris Claremont a hardcore x-fan before he started writing X-Men? Was Priest a big Panther fan? Did Warren Ellis have a deep love for Dr Druid?
I'm not sure being an old school fan really counts for much, when it comes down to making quality comics.
I'm not sure that making T'Challa King of Wakanda, again, is "changing everything." Even Shuri being dead, if she truly is, isn't. Even Hudlin had T'Challa having weird sex/anxiety dreams about the DMs early on. They're his hot kung fu teenage brides in training that he can't touch for political reasons but they're sooooo hot, w'ev. Much of that got "fixed" by later talent, but that is how they were introduced and if Coates was catching up on everything all at once, that would seem fresher than for those who read it back in the day and have seen years and years of other comics since. But, he's not removing them entirely. He's just dealing with things.
So far, we haven't actually seen him "change" anything that's core to the Panther or the world, have we?
-
[QUOTE=t hedge coke;1908529]Is it still in-contuity (well, in pre-the-reset-continuity) that once a year any Wakandan can challenge the ruler and, if successful in all the tests, take over?
There's a weird true-prince thing going on there, considering it's stayed in the family so much, but still, that does temper accusations that it's just an old-fashioned unquestionable kingdom setup that needs to get with modern whatever. (Whatever "modern" governments are supposed to be. "Ours," I guess.)[/QUOTE]
My problem with the once a year challenge thing is that there's a basic stop-gap against that with the heart-herb ritual, which under Priest basically poisoned anybody not of the royal bloodline. Even if you go so far and assume examples like Charlemagne wherein pretty much everyone in Wakanda has an immunity by lieu of claiming descent from Bashenga and his heirs that seems unlikely considering how insular each Wakandan tribe is and considering how Killmonger reacted whereas Spiderman didn't.
-
RE the Dora Milaje... I've always felt they worked best as one quarter hostage, one quarter tribal ambassador, one quarter bodyguard and one quarter possible consort. The percentages would depend on the Black Panther in question perhaps, but those four duties are what would define the position. Under one Black Panther it might be that the Dora Milaje were all hostages while under another they might be bodyguards. For T'Challa they could be tribal ambassadors, while for Shuri it could be consorts. So on and so forth...
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908332]I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL][/QUOTE]
I am still picking it up
One way or the other, she will probably come back. Maybe not now but later on in the year or maybe next season
-
[QUOTE=t hedge coke;1908606]Was Chris Claremont a hardcore x-fan before he started writing X-Men? Was Priest a big Panther fan? Did Warren Ellis have a deep love for Dr Druid?
I'm not sure being an old school fan really counts for much, when it comes down to making quality comics.
I'm not sure that making T'Challa King of Wakanda, again, is "changing everything." Even Shuri being dead, if she truly is, isn't. Even Hudlin had T'Challa having weird sex/anxiety dreams about the DMs early on. They're his hot kung fu teenage brides in training that he can't touch for political reasons but they're sooooo hot, w'ev. Much of that got "fixed" by later talent, but that is how they were introduced and if Coates was catching up on everything all at once, that would seem fresher than for those who read it back in the day and have seen years and years of other comics since. But, he's not removing them entirely. He's just dealing with things.
So far, we haven't actually seen him "change" anything that's core to the Panther or the world, have we?[/QUOTE]
For the record, I honestly don't care about the Dora Milaje thing. I want to see some of the faves come back, but I said years ago that the concept would be changed as the character became more popular. I just think that some of the comments I've seen regarding T'Challa usage of them have been wrong on ill informed. T'Challa never had intentions of marrying or sleeping with either of them. He viewed them as children (Which they were). Priest addressed that part of things numerous times but folks just stuck with the "wives in training" thing.
My biggest concerns about Coates run seems to be that (by his early comments) he's not acknowledging the mystical aspects of Wakanda and the fact that many Wakandans are traditionalists that "cling to the old ways". I don't want to see the tech or the mysticism of Wakanda downplayed. I want to see T'Challa be the bridge between the two.
I've repeatedly said that I wonder how Coates is going to reconcile his question of "Why would an advanced nation have a monarchy) with the fact that Wakanda has multiple gods that have final say over who the chieftains are of each respective tribe. There's also supposed to be the yearly challenge to the throne.
So far we haven't seen him make any changes, but he clearly intends to make changes. I'd be less apprehensive of those changes if he didn't seem to be drawing so heavily from the guys most responsible for tearing Wakanda down and showing T'Challa fail the past 5 years.
-
[QUOTE=MrHashasheen;1908616]My problem with the once a year challenge thing is that there's a basic stop-gap against that with the heart-herb ritual, which under Priest basically poisoned anybody not of the royal bloodline. Even if you go so far and assume examples like Charlemagne wherein pretty much everyone in Wakanda has an immunity by lieu of claiming descent from Bashenga and his heirs that seems unlikely considering how insular each Wakandan tribe is and considering how Killmonger reacted whereas Spiderman didn't.[/QUOTE]
I tend to forget/want to ignore that bit about the heart-herb. I want him to earn it, I guess.
-
[QUOTE=t hedge coke;1908633]I tend to forget/want to ignore that bit about the heart-herb. I want him to earn it, I guess.[/QUOTE]
The HSH being poison to those not of the royal bloodline has basically been reconnected. Priest was the only person to put that little wrinkle in place. Everyone before and after never acknowledge it.
Keep in mind that a lot of things by Priest had to be retconned because he had long term story plans that were dropped because of the series being canceled.
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;1908275]I trusted Hickman to do right by the BP mythos.
I'm not making the same mistake with Hickman 2.0.[/QUOTE]
I warned folks about Hickman. Few listened.
Please note I am not spouting warnings about Coates. :D
Actually, in a way, I'm GLAD he didn't chase after a BP title. Writers who were fans of a character first are often blinded by their own nostalgia, and merely ape great stories.runs of the past. They just HAVE to tell their version of the (for example) BP/Klaw confrontation, causing the book to retread the same ground.
Will the new book be good? Ask me in a week. But nothing Coates has said, and nothing in the brief preview, has led me to believe otherwise.
And trust me, if I believed otherwise, you'd know. :D
-
[QUOTE=Kasper Cole;1908638]The HSH being poison to those not of the royal bloodline has basically been reconnected. Priest was the only person to put that little wrinkle in place. Everyone before and after never acknowledge it.
Keep in mind that a lot of things by Priest had to be retconned because he had long term story plans that were dropped because of the series being canceled.[/QUOTE]
The other aspect is you have to be judged by the Panther god to be worthy. My personal reconciliation of everything is that N'Jadaka being poisoned by the herb was him being rejected by the Panther god.
-
Eh, I'm reserving judgement. I'm optimistic that even if changes the status quo are made, it'll be tasteful enough that it won't come out as "fan-fiction". Because quite often, someone just has a hard-on for a certain plot/character, and that translates in ther work. And, honestly, I'm not getting that from Coates. Yeah, sure, maybe he'll change some things. But as always, it can either good, or awful. Bendis tried to change MK and it was horrid. Ellis reinvented MK and made him ever better. So there's always a possbility for both is what I'm saying. We'll see...
PS: Not really relevant, but Priest is returning to comic books! He'll be writting the new Deathstroke book that's launching September. I have to say, that was the most unexpected reveal in quite a while.
-
Well that is certainly disappointing
Despite last 2 days of meh news, im just gonna go in excited and hope for the best
-
One thing I really liked about Hudgins run is that he let T'Challa have some fun and laugh once in a while. I don't think there will be much laughter in Coates run. I'm excited and hope to enjoy it, but the whole this needs a little levity after years of such dark themes.
-
[QUOTE=Beware Of Geek;1908665]Actually, in a way, I'm GLAD he didn't chase after a BP title. Writers who were fans of a character first are often blinded by their own nostalgia, and merely ape great stories.runs of the past. They just HAVE to tell their version of the (for example) BP/Klaw confrontation, causing the book to retread the same ground.[/QUOTE]
I wasn't gonna say anything, but then I realized I rewrote the Klauw/BP backstory for my continuity and just went "Damn, I did do that!"
-
[QUOTE=MrHashasheen;1908780]I wasn't gonna say anything, but then I realized I rewrote the Klauw/BP backstory for my continuity and just went "Damn, I did do that!"[/QUOTE]
LOL! (10 Chars).
MrHashasheen, check your pm if you can, I reply to something you sent me way back.
-
Re: Coates and who he wanted to write
Isn't he a fan of Storm and Bishop and such over in the X line? Bishop is irredeemable and Storm just bombed hardcore... not really many options in those avenues anyway
-
[QUOTE=robreedwrites;1908332]I'm not sure that this page was included in the initial preview. I don't remember seeing it. Make of that second-to-last paragraph what you will.
[IMG]http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/preview/0/0/1/BLAP2016001-int3-1-6983b.jpg[/IMG]
source: [URL="http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1"]http://www.comicbookresources.com/comic-previews/black-panther-1-marvel-comics-2016-1[/URL][/QUOTE]
Aw man wtf....
[IMG]http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/229/files/2014/02/facepalm.gif[/IMG]
Assuming she's still dead and didn't come back...how does the entire Marvel Universe comes back due to T'Challa's action with the gem, but somehow his own sister doesn't make it?
I'll pick up the first issue and give Coates a chance with later issues...but yea, if she indeed stayed dead, that is wack.
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;1908235]
To date, post Kirby and Mcgregor, Hudlin remains the only writer who actually wanted to write T'Challa from jump straight no chaser.
It's funny how the writer who actually cares about the BP mythos the most is the one who supposed hotshots like Maberry and Coates barely acknowledge as they go on to give faux praise to Priest's take on the BP mythos just before they water shit down or impose their own revisionist agenda on said mythos.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I am "its ok" on Hudlin's run (a distant third behind Priest and Liss although Hudlins peaks were really high for me) but you can't deny that it sold and did well and had a nice long run. But, for whatever reason, the new BP writers and Marvel itself don't look at the damn thing and go, "What did he do right? Why did his run sell?" It just kinda gets ignored, which from a business point of view is stupid as hell.
-
[QUOTE=Realdealholy;1908818]Aw man wtf....
[IMG]http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/229/files/2014/02/facepalm.gif[/IMG]
Assuming she's still dead and didn't come back...how does the entire Marvel Universe comes back due to T'Challa's action with the gem, but somehow his own sister doesn't make it?
I'll pick up the first issue and give Coates a chance with later issues...but yea, if she indeed stayed dead, that is wack.[/QUOTE]
If there isn't more to the story, then it is stupid as hell honestly.
I mean shit, you have a 8 MONTH GAP! since SW ended anyway. Make something up in that 8 month gap that actually makes sense. Hell, if you really wanted to murk Shuri, you coulda done it so it has weight in the story. But, just going "eh, she didn't get brought back because reasons" is weird AF.
Its almost too weird to the point that there must be something more going on. If not, it is some of the laziest writing? editorial decision? that i've ever seen.
-
[QUOTE=MindofShadow;1908825]If there isn't more to the story, then it is stupid as hell honestly.
I mean shit, you have a 8 MONTH GAP! since SW ended anyway. Make something up in that 8 month gap that actually makes sense. Hell, if you really wanted to murk Shuri, you coulda done it so it has weight in the story. But, just going "eh, she didn't get brought back because reasons" is weird AF.
Its almost too weird to the point that there must be something more going on. If not, it is some of the laziest writing? editorial decision? that i've ever seen.[/QUOTE]
I honestly didn't think they would go that route, it would be def a missed opportunity, considering the story arc in particular. Along with the fact that it currently doesn't make much sense at all. I guess we'll find out soon.
Assuming she's still dead, I have a feeling her fate will have something to do with the main conflict.
Also, after reading the preview, I'm getting some deconstruction vibes...