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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3332082][B]why can't BP get that same treatment in the comics. I mean he is a well received Character from the general population and he has unique and vastly rich mythos, get fools are trying to reduce his phone instead of embracing it and letting him shine in all outlet's. Which HELPS Marvel as well[/B][/QUOTE]
your guess is as good as mine. I have hope for BP because of positive multimedia portrayals and the MCU films. BP has some really good iconic runs in his the bank along with these multimedia portrayals. It's not all perfect as we are well aware, but I feel he's in a good place. Also I'm not reading the current comics so......my opinions probably different from you current readers.
[QUOTE=Frontier;3332211]Not a day goes by I don't miss this show :(.
At least Panther on [I]Assemble[/I] is good, especially since he's probably one of the few character's who's portrayal on that show is actually consistently on par with their portrayal on EMH (right down to the same VA).
Although he definitely doesn't have quite the style and cool Vibranium action that he had on this show...[/QUOTE]
I loved EMH all the characterizations were so spot on. I don't like the character models or fight choreography on Assembled so I stopped watching a while back.
[QUOTE=Ekie;3332344]This show, plus Captain America Civil War, combined with Hickman having T'challa at the forefront of the biggest Marvel event ever is the true reason for Bp #1's sales.
not Coats[/QUOTE]
ugh Hickman. I'm not saying he wrote a bad T'challa, but that story arc....I was not a fan. What's Coats doing now anyway? T'challa still looking below average in combat? Has he done anything impressive recently?
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[QUOTE=Jabare;3333138]
[B]I loved EMH all the characterizations were so spot on[/B]. I don't like the character models or fight choreography on Assembled so I stopped watching a while back.[/QUOTE]
Agreed :).
I would say [I]Assemble[/I] has definitely improved from the earlier seasons, and their take on T'Challa is pretty good, but I wouldn't say you're missing much by not checking it out.
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[QUOTE=Frontier;3333212]Agreed :).
I would say [I]Assemble[/I] has definitely improved from the earlier seasons, and their take on T'Challa is pretty good, but I wouldn't say you're missing much by not checking it out.[/QUOTE]
I bailed on Assembled after catching a couple episodes of the first season. It was so far below the bar EMH set, I just couldn't stick with it. If EMH had never existed, I probably would have stuck around longer. But the knowledge that Assembled replaced it was too much for me.
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[QUOTE=Frontier;3333111]Steph as Batgirl was basically a modern reconstruction of the classic Batgirl after Cass deconstructed it or just made it her own thing.
It's not surprising that when they brought the original back they took some influence from Steph's run, though not as much as they should have in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
Cass' book wasn't a deconstruction at all, but her own creature entirely. There was no confusing her with any other member of the Bat clan
I think the people in charge don' understand that diversity goes beyond just race (not to say it's not important, but it shouldn't be a stopping point).
I think the movies capitalize this best. Prior to MCU, all action stars were burned out cops/burned out military special forces guys with nothing left to lose with partners one day from retirement, etc.
By in large, regardless of their race, they were all the same guy, because they had the same background.
Marvel comes along, and now we have a snarky CEO in super armor, a 98 pound weakling who's given a chance to fight, an African kin, an ex-con trying to be a good father, etc.
We've gained character diversity with action movies, and it's a formula that's hard to beat.
DC and Marvel simply don't want to experiment, IMO, in a time where they all but have to.
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[QUOTE=The Cool Thatguy;3333563]Cass' book wasn't a deconstruction at all, but her own creature entirely. There was no confusing her with any other member of the Bat clan
I think the people in charge don' understand that diversity goes beyond just race (not to say it's not important, but it shouldn't be a stopping point).
I think the movies capitalize this best. Prior to MCU, all action stars were burned out cops/burned out military special forces guys with nothing left to lose with partners one day from retirement, etc.
By in large, regardless of their race, they were all the same guy, because they had the same background.
Marvel comes along, and now we have a snarky CEO in super armor, a 98 pound weakling who's given a chance to fight, an African kin, an ex-con trying to be a good father, etc.
We've gained character diversity with action movies, and it's a formula that's hard to beat.
DC and Marvel simply don't want to experiment, IMO, in a time where they all but have to.[/QUOTE]
For real, that's why superhero films are on their way to becoming a permanent fixture in action films. They can be so diverse and eclectic, pulling from so many different genres to make products that have mainstream appeal. For example, Logan is one of the best action movies in a decade all because it mixed conventional superheroics with western and sci fi.
I just wish the comic side of things were more open to diverse characters that don't reflect the typical mold. That's why it's important to patron independent creators who are pushing boundaries as well as comics from the Big 2 that are unique. If Marvel and DC wanna "push" characters they gotta understand the need of making them distinct and finding that unexplored niche.
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[QUOTE=Marvell2100;3332993][COLOR="#000080"]Coates? I wouldn't want him to name a rock in Wakanda much less create any heroes. He can't do anything with the one he's supposed o be writing.
The less he does the better as far as I'm concerned.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]
Speaking of young Wakandans, at what point should T'Challa have kids? He is a king after all, so at what point should he start priming someone to replace him? From a meta perspective we know he'll never be fully replaced as BP, but I definitely think after a strong run (not necessarily this one), writers could explore the possibility of him having children to look after. Hell, I wouldn't be too opposed to Shuri having kids soon to give her something to do.
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[QUOTE=The Cool Thatguy;3333563]Cass' book wasn't a deconstruction at all, but her own creature entirely. There was no confusing her with any other member of the Bat clan
I think the people in charge don' understand that diversity goes beyond just race (not to say it's not important, but it shouldn't be a stopping point).
I think the movies capitalize this best. Prior to MCU, all action stars were burned out cops/burned out military special forces guys with nothing left to lose with partners one day from retirement, etc.
By in large, regardless of their race, they were all the same guy, because they had the same background.
Marvel comes along, and now we have a snarky CEO in super armor, a 98 pound weakling who's given a chance to fight, an African kin, an ex-con trying to be a good father, etc.
We've gained character diversity with action movies, and it's a formula that's hard to beat.
DC and Marvel simply don't want to experiment, IMO, in a time where they all but have to.[/QUOTE]
I think you can argue marvel did a descent job trying to diversify their line after Secret Wars. Stuff line Moon Girl and Vision and Nighthawk and Squire Girl were attempts at being experimrntal. Results varied of course. But I do think they are trying to do a few different things, knowing going in that the odds most of those attempts will be cancelled within a year. But a few things stuck.
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[QUOTE=chief12d;3333686]Speaking of young Wakandans, at what point should T'Challa have kids? He is a king after all, so at what point should he start priming someone to replace him? From a meta perspective we know he'll never be fully replaced as BP, but I definitely think after a strong run (not necessarily this one), writers could explore the possibility of him having children to look after. Hell, I wouldn't be too opposed to Shuri having kids soon to give her something to do.[/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#000080"]Ideally T'Challa should be married with children by now.
Comics-wise, that won't happen. They'd more than likely have some adult child from the future arrive and claim that T'Challa is their father.[/COLOR]
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[QUOTE=chief12d;3333676]For real, that's why superhero films are on their way to becoming a permanent fixture in action films. They can be so diverse and eclectic, pulling from so many different genres to make products that have mainstream appeal. For example, Logan is one of the best action movies in a decade all because it mixed conventional superheroics with western and sci fi.
I just wish the comic side of things were more open to diverse characters that don't reflect the typical mold. That's why it's important to patron independent creators who are pushing boundaries as well as comics from the Big 2 that are unique. If Marvel and DC wanna "push" characters they gotta understand the need of making them distinct and finding that unexplored niche.[/QUOTE]
MCU is in a nice position creatively. Because every movie thus far has been a sucess, in large part pretty much any movie they put out will likely do well. They could put out a D Man movie, and it would probably turn a bigger profit than Justice League. So they can afford to experiment.
On the flip side, most comics not tied to an established franchise will probably be off the shelf in 6 months. It's a tough environment try and experiment with though it's obviously something they know they need to do. Marvel knows they're not just selling comics, they are creating IP's. Even a book which doesn't necessarily sell well can become a TV show or movie (ie Jessica Jones or Big Hero 6 or Runaways). So in recent years I do believe they are more willing to try.
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[QUOTE=chief12d;3333686]Speaking of young Wakandans, at what point should T'Challa have kids? He is a king after all, so at what point should he start priming someone to replace him? From a meta perspective we know he'll never be fully replaced as BP, but I definitely think after a strong run (not necessarily this one), writers could explore the possibility of him having children to look after. Hell, I wouldn't be too opposed to Shuri having kids soon to give her something to do.[/QUOTE]
If they can get him a queen, they can certainly play around with the idea of an heir.
And I'm sure Kang would love another super hero kid to kidnap and take into the future. He'said racking up quite a collection.
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[QUOTE=XPac;3333695]I think you can argue marvel did a descent job trying to diversify their line after Secret Wars. Stuff line Moon Girl and Vision and Nighthawk and Squire Girl were attempts at being experimrntal. Results varied of course. But I do think they are trying to do a few different things, knowing going in that the odds most of those attempts will be cancelled within a year. But a few things stuck.[/QUOTE]
True. Don't get me wrong, I don't think breaking the mold is an automatic formula for success. But I think readers respond better to new concepts than repackaged old ones.
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[QUOTE=XPac;3333695]I think you can argue marvel did a descent job trying to diversify their line after Secret Wars. Stuff line Moon Girl and Vision and Nighthawk and Squire Girl were attempts at being experimrntal. Results varied of course. But I do think they are trying to do a few different things, knowing going in that the odds most of those attempts will be cancelled within a year. But a few things stuck.[/QUOTE]
To be FAIR both companies do try in various degrees.
However look at the Marvel backlash and most of it is lead by those who never read the books and can't tell you a thing about any of them. Including store owners.
You can't get mad that Moon Girl or Black Panther WOW had a FEW (since one ordered a few) unsold copies. While ignoring that LARGE pile of Batman, X-Men, Flash, Hal Jordan and other unsold books.
Sure you can toss them in the back issues and jack up the price and NO ONE will buy them. Since others like my store will have 40% off or 25 cent comic sales 4-5 times a year. Not to mention Ebay.
But we get mad and attack Marvel because books like Moon Girl & Black Panther The Crew FORCE you to do quantity control. Which is what every store needs to do.
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[QUOTE=skyvolt2000;3333758]To be FAIR both companies do try in various degrees.
However look at the Marvel backlash and most of it is lead by those who never read the books and can't tell you a thing about any of them. Including store owners.
You can't get mad that Moon Girl or Black Panther WOW had a FEW (since one ordered a few) unsold copies. While ignoring that LARGE pile of Batman, X-Men, Flash, Hal Jordan and other unsold books.
Sure you can toss them in the back issues and jack up the price and NO ONE will buy them. Since others like my store will have 40% off or 25 cent comic sales 4-5 times a year. Not to mention Ebay.
But we get mad and attack Marvel because books like Moon Girl & Black Panther The Crew FORCE you to do quantity control. Which is what every store needs to do.[/QUOTE]
[B] BP WOW and BP Crew aren't good examples though because those were shit books. But I get what your saying. Folks say that showing Characters down their throats garbage and when Marvel tries new ideas folks don't buy them anyways. They are more so just saying they want their comics let alone so they don't have to see it. They don't care about diversity unless it is in the books they like reading, then it's a problem all of a sudden[/B]
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3332372][B]Yes but how many more years then T'Challa has she been able to experience good character building and non-deconstruction after a few years of great character build up? [/QUOTE]
Actually less than him. T'Challa's book has been a lot more consistent than Diana's.
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3332372] Plus she is also on the JL team and right now all we have for T'Challa is the garbage Cotes is doing. [/QUOTE]
Between the book having runs that were average to outright bad since the 2010s and the mixed reception to the movie, I doubt being on the Justice League is doing her any good.
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[QUOTE=XPac;3333314]I bailed on Assembled after catching a couple episodes of the first season. It was so far below the bar EMH set, I just couldn't stick with it. If EMH had never existed, I probably would have stuck around longer. But the knowledge that Assembled replaced it was too much for me.[/QUOTE]
Even with the improvements in quality I'd say [I]Assemble[/I] has made and what it has done right or solidly, I'd still say it hasn't reach the bar or the highs EMH was able to hit in it's 2-season run.
[QUOTE=The Cool Thatguy;3333563]Cass' book wasn't a deconstruction at all, but her own creature entirely. There was no confusing her with any other member of the Bat clan.[/QUOTE]
That's why I also said she made it her own thing, if it wasn't an outright deconstruction.