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[QUOTE=taozen;2346462]He can't dodge a bullet after it has been fired. Spidey is not that fast. [/QUOTE]
[img]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/13/134553/3521846-screen+shot+2013-12-23+at+11.15.04+am.png[/img]
I don't feel like arguing the multiple scans of DD being a bullet timer, especially since we have gotten NOTHING even close to that out of T'challa.
The DD fans can do it in their own thread lol
EDIT:
this should suffice though: [url]http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?65728-Daredevil-vs-Black-Panther[/url]
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Exclusive Preview Pages for Issue #7 are shown [URL="http://www.cbr.com/black-panther-7-exclusive-preview"]here[/URL]
PS.....Can't wait to learn about [SPOIL]the "returns" of both the Vanisher and the Strucker Siblings/Twins[/SPOIL].
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[QUOTE=PaxHouse;2346513]Exclusive Preview Pages for Issue #7 are shown [URL="http://www.cbr.com/black-panther-7-exclusive-preview"]here[/URL]
PS.....Can't wait to learn about [SPOIL]the "returns" of both the Vanisher and the Strucker Siblings/Twins[/SPOIL].[/QUOTE]
Yes more metas at least!
But my god, look how stiff that action art is, especially in the scene Misty gets punched a bunch. Yikes man
I am digging that old school villain talk from the vanisher though lol
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Unlettered Preview of BP: WoW.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CuqxkqGWEAAeufR.jpg[/IMG]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346526]Yes more metas at least!
But my god, look how stiff that action art is, especially in the scene Misty gets punched a bunch. Yikes man
I am digging that old school villain talk from the vanisher though lol[/QUOTE]
Yea, the action is surprisingly stiff, even for Sprouse.
The dialogue structure for this scene...so old fashioned. Wow, lol.
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That BP 7 preview...what in da 7 hells?
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[QUOTE=Cville;2346483]Thanks Realdealholy. Helped confirm my assumptions about Coates.[/QUOTE]
Indeed. I'm far from the biggest Coates hater here, but that interview definitely confirm a lot of things I and others here suspected.
Crossing my fingers that this season, from a narrative standpoint, doesn't end in a completely messy manner.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346510][img]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/13/134553/3521846-screen+shot+2013-12-23+at+11.15.04+am.png[/img]
I don't feel like arguing the multiple scans of DD being a bullet timer, especially since we have gotten NOTHING even close to that out of T'challa.
The DD fans can do it in their own thread lol
EDIT:
this should suffice though: [url]http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?65728-Daredevil-vs-Black-Panther[/url][/QUOTE]
I am not arguing that creators have not depicted such. What I am saying is that when their powers are described and detailed, they are not that fast. Spidey would literally have to break the sound barrier to dodge a bullet. Also DD on many occasion has stated that Cap is faster and stronger than him and BP is faster and more agile than Cap. DD is an Olympic level athlete. This is from Marvel.com on DD, "[B]Daredevil possesses the strength, speed, agility, and endurance, not to mention acrobatic and gymnastic skills, of an Olympic-level athlete.[/B] Through a combination of the tutelage of Stick and self-training, Daredevil is a master of a unique martial art form, which is a hybridized form of American boxing and the Japanese arts of ninjutsu, judo and aiki-jujutsu. Martial arts training has given him an immense degree of concentration and personal control over his body and energy, or Ki."
This is what is listed for Black Panther. "T'Challa's senses and physical attributes have been enhanced to superhuman levels by the heart-shaped herb." That is all that currently have listed which is a problem in itself but T'Challa's abilities have been enhanced to a superhuman level.
T'Challa is on that Captain America, Deathstroke level in his physical attributes. Most creators have not shown this and at times when they do, some fans complain but they really do not know the character.
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[QUOTE=PaxHouse;2346513]Exclusive Preview Pages for Issue #7 are shown [URL="http://www.cbr.com/black-panther-7-exclusive-preview"]here[/URL]
PS.....Can't wait to learn about [SPOIL]the "returns" of both the Vanisher and the Strucker Siblings/Twins[/SPOIL].[/QUOTE]
I am really digging that Mike Deodato Black Panther:D
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[QUOTE=taozen;2346598]I am not arguing that creators have not depicted such. What I am saying is that when their powers are described and detailed, they are not that fast. Spidey would literally have to break the sound barrier to dodge a bullet. Also DD on many occasion has stated that Cap is faster and stronger than him and BP is faster and more agile than Cap. DD is an Olympic level athlete. This is from Marvel.com on DD, "[B]Daredevil possesses the strength, speed, agility, and endurance, not to mention acrobatic and gymnastic skills, of an Olympic-level athlete.[/B] Through a combination of the tutelage of Stick and self-training, Daredevil is a master of a unique martial art form, which is a hybridized form of American boxing and the Japanese arts of ninjutsu, judo and aiki-jujutsu. Martial arts training has given him an immense degree of concentration and personal control over his body and energy, or Ki."
This is what is listed for Black Panther. "T'Challa's senses and physical attributes have been enhanced to superhuman levels by the heart-shaped herb." That is all that currently have listed which is a problem in itself but T'Challa's abilities have been enhanced to a superhuman level.
T'Challa is on that Captain America, Deathstroke level in his physical attributes. Most creators have not shown this and at times when they do, some fans complain but they really do not know the character.[/QUOTE]
And as I said, IN THEORY, that is correct.
It just hasn't been show on panel, where it really matters. It doesn't matter what is said by characters, it doesn't matter what is in encylopedias, interviews, podcasts, or other things.
What matters is what happens in the books, n panels. That is what lasts threw the ages. Unfortunately for T'challa, a lot of his writers haven't been very... creative in showing his abilities. Hopefully, the more he is written, the more some of these high end feats will pop up.
And really... we are going to argue physics in a comic book? Comic book physics don't jive with real world. The amount of force and speed needed to swat a bullet out of the air AND direct it is just... i am pretty sure DD's elbow would explode doing it lol. But... that is comic books. That is a whole otherr argument.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346442]IN THEORY... sure. He should be beyond daredevil. He's supposed to be anyway. Unfortunately, he has very rarely been written like that, on panel.
On panel, if we are talking combat and reaction speed and quickness, no... no he isn't on DD's level. Unfortunately he's never been shown to be that fast as far as I have seen. If you got scans of him on that level, the level of SWATTING AWAY MULTIPLE BULLETS WITH A CANE, reacting AFTER the bullet has been fired (which changes the distinction from bullet timing v aim dodging), please post them so I can add them to my list [url]http://blackpanthermarvel.blogspot.com/p/black-panther-feats.html[/url]
I'm not saying this lightly... i've looked, cut, pasted, with citations, at so many comics my brain hurt. I've risked many of malware and viruses downloading 500 books jsut to find 4 panels in some random annual lol.
T'challa's best speed feat is likely this...
[img]https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Y5pbvJAbzr8/V5E9Q2gOBYI/AAAAAAAAH0k/Qx1XN4pj-dIvVN7szR2UtATafoSLIHd-gCLcB/s1600/catches%2Bblades%2Bthrown%2Bby%2BSS%252C%2Bswad%2B2%2B40.JPG[/img]
[img]https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-95-uaOoWZKg/V5E9Tq9bquI/AAAAAAAAH0o/-CTd-aY0ZAUrz-I-BsfE_r5Ado0n2y_HgCLcB/s1600/catches%2Bblades%2Bthrown%2Bby%2BSS%252C%2Bswad%2B2%2B40%2B2.JPG[/img]
... and that isn't on the level of DD best feats.
Whatever is being said in interviews or encyclopedias don't mean ****. On panel is what matters.[/QUOTE]
[B]Honestly, I don't mind if he isn't a bullet timer like DD, However, if he is supposed to be the 2nd fastest behind quicksilver i would definitely like to see more of that. I think T'Challa's speed feats are more of a gap closing speed then reaction (not that he isn't fast reaction wise, just not much for bullet timing as he doesn't need it as much) which again is fine if he is shown moving faster then heros such as spidey who pride themselves on being tough to catch/hit[/B]
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;2346636][B]Honestly, I don't mind if he isn't a bullet timer like DD, However, if he is supposed to be the 2nd fastest behind quicksilver i would definitely like to see more of that. I think T'Challa's speed feats are more of a gap closing speed then reaction (not that he isn't fast reaction wise, just not much for bullet timing as he doesn't need it as much) which again is fine if he is shown moving faster then heros such as spidey who pride themselves on being tough to catch/hit[/B][/QUOTE]
I don't need him not bullet timign either. He SHOULDN'T be that fast, not based on being below Spidey. Matt is an anomaly
But yeah... definitely would like more on panel showings of his speed. It is surprisingly lacking for a character that is commonly described as being fast. Like really, really lacking. Some of his best feats are when depowered or outside his own damn solos.
We need more stuff like this from McDuffie...
[img]https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IKHNAGC1_no/V301nW38eSI/AAAAAAAAHlc/5CaNwfCrNs01cZQkVvVHCDdsHMYEq_8agCLcB/s1600/dodges%2Btrapsters%2Bthrows%252C%2Bff%2B548%2B2.JPG[/img]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346526]Yes more metas at least!
But my god, look how stiff that action art is, especially in the scene Misty gets punched a bunch. Yikes man
I am digging that old school villain talk from the vanisher though lol[/QUOTE]
[B]Yea the action... Sprouse needs to step it up, its almost at Stelfreeze level of stiff (not hating on his static work though that shiz on point!) action. I am glad more meta's are coming in and Lol on the dialog. I want this comic to be good i really Really REALLY do. We will see how this issue comes along[/B]
[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2346579]Unlettered Preview of BP: WoW.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CuqxkqGWEAAeufR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
[B]Dude that Dora Milaje looks like She-Zuri, freaking BUFF. Maybe she is Zuri or Kilmonger's sister [/B]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346645]I don't need him not bullet timign either. He SHOULDN'T be that fast, not based on being below Spidey. Matt is an anomaly
But yeah... definitely would like more on panel showings of his speed. It is surprisingly lacking for a character that is commonly described as being fast. Like really, really lacking. Some of his best feats are when depowered or outside his own damn solos.
We need more stuff like this from McDuffie...
[img]https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IKHNAGC1_no/V301nW38eSI/AAAAAAAAHlc/5CaNwfCrNs01cZQkVvVHCDdsHMYEq_8agCLcB/s1600/dodges%2Btrapsters%2Bthrows%252C%2Bff%2B548%2B2.JPG[/img][/QUOTE]
[B]Honestly i think Mcduffie probably showed his best speed feats. Like when he jumps on Surfers speeding board and gets the jump on him.[/B]
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"[B]Bad Boy[/B] Reunion Tour"
"Because you're a [B]Thug[/B]" "... for [B]Life[/B]!"
So in season 2, we gon have QDJ quippin French Montana and Future while Luke and Misty look on confused b/c of the generational gap? :p
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Also, glad we lvl'd up from the afrikan putties from power rangers to some actual ability having goons
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2346645]I don't need him not bullet timign either. He SHOULDN'T be that fast, not based on being below Spidey. Matt is an anomaly
But yeah... definitely would like more on panel showings of his speed. It is surprisingly lacking for a character that is commonly described as being fast. Like really, really lacking. Some of his best feats are when depowered or outside his own damn solos.
We need more stuff like this from McDuffie...
[img]https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IKHNAGC1_no/V301nW38eSI/AAAAAAAAHlc/5CaNwfCrNs01cZQkVvVHCDdsHMYEq_8agCLcB/s1600/dodges%2Btrapsters%2Bthrows%252C%2Bff%2B548%2B2.JPG[/img][/QUOTE]
Matt shouldn't be that fast or doing that and then actual superhumans with super human senses are not shown doing it (T'challa). The DD bullet timing is fairly recent, and includes Ben Devil's movie. In Born Again, its cleaely stated that Steve Rogers is on entirely different level, but he lacked grace. Simply put its a choice. A choice of writers choosing who to apply limits and rules too. Yes, T'challa with his training, speed and super human senses should be able to bullet time. The reason he hasn't yet is writers always choosing who and who not to place limits.
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[QUOTE=Victor Freeman;2346862]The DD bullet timing is fairly recent[/QUOTE]
he did it as least as early as in vol 1 #159 in 1979
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[QUOTE=taozen;2346426]Without the heart shaped herb, it is a tossup to which one is faster. It will depend on the writer. With it, it is not even close. With the herb, T'Challa is faster than Hank McKoy before his blue fur mutation. His speed and agility rival Spidey. When T'Challa was created, I read an interview with I Jack Kirby that stated BP was created to be the second fastest hero Marvel hero behind Quicksilver.
DD is just an Olympic level athlete. It has been clearly shown that Captain America is bigger, faster and stronger than DD. Well T'Challa, with the herb, is suppose to faster than Cap.
I have often said that most writers have not really show T'Challa's true physical prowess. To me the following shows the best depiction of BP speed and power of Iron Man Armored Adventures. The scene is below in the first part of this clip. The second that shows BP feats is at the 6:50 mark. T'Challa moves like Spidey with martial arts technique. I want to see that T'Calla in the comics.
[video=youtube;vLy_NebSNvo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLy_NebSNvo[/video][/QUOTE]
One of my favorites, underrated. I agree
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[QUOTE=Victor Freeman;2346862]Matt shouldn't be that fast or doing that and then actual superhumans with super human senses are not shown doing it (T'challa). The DD bullet timing is fairly recent, and includes Ben Devil's movie. In Born Again, its cleaely stated that Steve Rogers is on entirely different level, but he lacked grace. Simply put its a choice. A choice of writers choosing who to apply limits and rules too. Yes, T'challa with his training, speed and super human senses should be able to bullet time. The reason he hasn't yet is writers always choosing who and who not to place limits.[/QUOTE]
[B]Well in priest Case he didn't need to bullet time because the bullets have lost their momentum, In Hudlin's case same thing but more so he would just disable the guns and force them to explode, Liss had him dodging bullets but not really bullet timing and Coates has him taking the momentum to power his force push (which sounds cool on paper and would be cool if he used it to actually make himself run faster with a burst of speed, jump higher, or had his punches and kicks stronger or made a ground slam attack or something cool, use star wars force pushes as the reference). Mcduffie has been the one to truly showcase BP speed feats in terms of dodging things. But i wuld like to see more speed feats, not so much bullet timing but mayeb back on that poorer art spiderman stories from a few months back, when T'Challa guest starred and Spidey commented on how fast T'Challa cleared a room full of goons. Thats the speed feats i like from T'Challa tbh, and if he is truly supposed to be MU fastest hero behind Quickl silver then show it, and make it good. but again it doesn't have to be bullet timing as i feel T'Challa's speed feats are different (and better looking IMO since the weave makes bullet timing moot) [/B]
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[QUOTE=RLAAMJR.;2347007]Waaaa. Storm got.... :([/QUOTE]
I wouldnt worry, coates is a storm fan
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[QUOTE=Rumble;2346839]Also, glad we lvl'd up from the afrikan putties from power rangers to some actual ability having goons[/QUOTE]
none of which are black
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Thanks cville for the interview.
Thanks pax&RDH for the previews
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[QUOTE=Rumble;2346839]Also, glad we lvl'd up from the afrikan putties from power rangers to some actual ability having goons[/QUOTE]
Those dudes are so Z list that AT BEST they are Super Putties
Still funny to see such... pathetic Z list dudes show up. I have no problem with sprinkling in some unique fodder.
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i was catching up on The Vision and T'challa got wrecked in #11 lol. I don't think anyone mentioned it
[img]http://i.imgur.com/j2CqFZs.jpg[/img]
Luckily, the entire Avengers, Ultimates, Inhumans, and more got wrecked as well. Due destroyed them lol
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347584]i was catching up on The Vision and T'challa got wrecked in #11 lol. I don't think anyone mentioned it
[img]http://i.imgur.com/j2CqFZs.jpg[/img]
Luckily, the entire Avengers, Ultimates, Inhumans, and more got wrecked as well. Due destroyed them lol[/QUOTE]
[B]?? Whats going on? was he hallucinating or something[/B]
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[QUOTE=Rumble;2346838]"[B]Bad Boy[/B] Reunion Tour"
"Because you're a [B]Thug[/B]" "... for [B]Life[/B]!"
So in season 2, we gon have QDJ quippin French Montana and Future while Luke and Misty look on confused b/c of the generational gap? :p[/QUOTE]
I would guess.
They have to be somewhere in thier early 30's (but no older cuz Marvel time).
We haven't seen QDJ in decades...but she might be all of 20 by now (Cuz Marvel time).
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;2347672][B]?? Whats going on? was he hallucinating or something[/B][/QUOTE]
No lol
[spoil]Vision wanted to kill the dude/thing who killed his son (I think, I need to read them all again lol). All these heroes gathered there to try and stop him[/spoil]
They got wrecked lol
to be fair, he asked them nicely to get the hell otu of his way first lol
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347584]i was catching up on The Vision and T'challa got wrecked in #11 lol. I don't think anyone mentioned it
[img]http://i.imgur.com/j2CqFZs.jpg[/img]
Luckily, the entire Avengers, Ultimates, Inhumans, and more got wrecked as well. Due destroyed them lol[/QUOTE]
I definately have to check that out as it sounds fun.
Vision, when written as cutting lose, is actually a pretty darn scary powerful character. He's definately a potential team buster that is often overlooked as a heavy hitter. Sort of like Martian Manhunter. People forget how scary powerful that guy is in the League because he's often standing next to Superman.
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should Panther have some anti-Vision protocols on his tablet somewhere?
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[QUOTE=XPac;2347765]I definately have to check that out as it sounds fun.
Vision, when written as cutting lose, is actually a pretty darn scary powerful character. He's definately a potential team buster that is often overlooked as a heavy hitter. Sort of like Martian Manhunter. People forget how scary powerful that guy is in the League because he's often standing next to Superman.[/QUOTE]
It was a straight beat down.
He ON PANEL wrecked Stark, Jane Thor, Carol, Beast, Nova, Medusa, Sam, BP, both spider-Mans, Kamala, Strange, Monica
and it was implied he beat the others as well, which included Adam, Crystal, and ect
while being cold as ice
[img]http://i.imgur.com/OadDyR0.jpg[/img]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347705]No lol
[spoil]Vision wanted to kill the dude/thing who killed his son (I think, I need to read them all again lol). All these heroes gathered there to try and stop him[/spoil]
They got wrecked lol
to be fair, he asked them nicely to get the hell otu of his way first lol[/QUOTE]
[B]I don't think that is a hit you just walk off. Might have to check t that out.[/B]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347800]It was a straight beat down.
He ON PANEL wrecked Stark, Jane Thor, Carol, Beast, Nova, Medusa, Sam, BP, both spider-Mans, Kamala, Strange, Monica
and it was implied he beat the others as well, which included Adam, Crystal, and ect
while being cold as ice
[img]http://i.imgur.com/OadDyR0.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
[B]I guess the question is, Vision is he being written as a continuity power or were the other characters jobbed? Wrecking that many team's is something Thanos Does.[/B]
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A character being a beast in his own book. How about that.
Perhaps Coates should take notes.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347800]It was a straight beat down.
He ON PANEL wrecked Stark, Jane Thor, Carol, Beast, Nova, Medusa, Sam, BP, both spider-Mans, Kamala, Strange, Monica
and it was implied he beat the others as well, which included Adam, Crystal, and ect
while being cold as ice
[img]http://i.imgur.com/OadDyR0.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Calling it now: this entire story is a simulation or something.
There's no way all this hapened and Vizh gets to be an Avenger in the regular book.
And it not like anybody is buying this comic so Marvel can ignore the entire storyline.
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;2347847][B]I guess the question is, Vision is he being written as a continuity power or were the other characters jobbed? Wrecking that many team's is something Thanos Does.[/B][/QUOTE]
Lil of both.
I think you could argue Strange got jobbed (depending oh what power level he is written at of course, Magic is broke in his own book so) as magic shoudl be one avenue to shut Vision down.
Monica you could likely say got jobbed to but... its monica, shes kind of unstoppable if written 100%. Possibly Adam as well.
But, Vision really is a power house when written right.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2347560]Those dudes are so Z list that AT BEST they are [B]Super Putties[/B]
Still funny to see such... pathetic Z list dudes show up. I have no problem with sprinkling in some unique fodder.[/QUOTE]
They got the phone call that they were coming back and were like
[IMG]https://media.giphy.com/media/6DcD3mFmrRDoc/giphy.gif[/IMG]
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[QUOTE=Vic Vega;2347905]Calling it now: this entire story is a simulation or something.
There's no way all this hapened and Vizh gets to be an Avenger in the regular book.
And it not like anybody is buying this comic so Marvel can ignore the entire storyline.[/QUOTE]
His daughter is in Champions though
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[QUOTE=Lord Morph;2347873]A character being a beast in his own book. How about that.
Perhaps Coates should take notes.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://rs196.pbsrc.com/albums/aa116/gaara1416/Loki%20Gifs/loki_kiss_gif_by_miasmanecrosa-d54huzd_zpsd2926689.gif~c200[/img]