-
get them back together.
these are all fictional characters-- the "logic" of keeping them "separate but equal" based on editorial camps is bunk, plain and simple. It's a played out dynamic that should have died long ago. Editors, get over yourselves. You don't own any of this. It's either all the same company or it isn't. It's not 1982 anymore. Being hamstrung by the sensibilities of the distant past is a mistake. You can write anything that you want. Superman and Wonder Woman were a couple for a while. It happened, regardless of the [I]"but wait, why, they can't, etc"[/I]...
Mary Jane is a supporting character in [I]Iron Man[/I] now. The world hasn't blown up.
Storm's solo series didn't last long enough for her to have her own "stormiverse" of supporting characters and villains-- most white fans want her as the side-piece of Cable or Logan at best. They don't even see her as "solo" worthy. For too long Ororo has been written as being "mutant" above being "black", not having any interest in the political strife of people of African descent, and of course, there's the hordes of fandom who do not even see her as "black" per se', as idiotic as that is.
white fandom doesn't want black heroes pwning the "alpha" villains of these comics universes. It doesn't help that Panther's "Metropolis" keeps getting blown up, drowned, mass-rebellioned/mind-controlled, etc...
-
[QUOTE=Redjack;3198180]My personal feeling is that each hero, male or female, should stand on their own and be unique. While i thought it was a fun choice to make Storm and T'Challa a couple at the time and was very much on their team in terms of hoping the marriage would go, marrying them diluted BOTH their stories.
Anything like a realistic depiction of that union would had them constantly torn apart by their divided loyalties. Storm is a MUTANT above all things and that would include T'Challa. The Black Panther is the ruler and thus the servant of Wakanda above e all other things. The moment those two drives came into conflict they would have to split because, regardless of the wishes of the two at the center, the "families" would never be able to actually mesh. And neither would turn their back on their family in favor of each other and that's where their marriage would ALWAYS lead.
My personal pref is for each central figure to have their own adventures, their own "Gotham City," their own adventures and their own friends and lovers that re COMPLETELY separate from anything that happens when they overlap into some other book.
Many of you have pointed out how impossible it is to navigate the X-Books unless your title is part of that set (and even then).
If i were writing the book I would make storm that lost love that always has a way into his heart but she would not be the one who ends up with the whole thing. That would be someone new and unexpected who would challenge and support him at the same time.
Also, both Storm and T'Challa are alphas. Both, in theory, are the sole focus of a book that bears their name. Why would I diminish storm by putting her in his shadow? why would I diminish him by putting him in hers?
Storm needs her OWN stuff, her own toys , her own rogues, her OWN path, her OWN loves and hates and so does T'Challa.
That's my opinion. Mileage varies (and that's okay. =))[/QUOTE]
Both characters exist within a much vaunted "shared universe" so the whole idea that their being married constitutes as some insurmountable problem doesn't really hold up under scrutiny.
And additionally, their being characters from two different books, doesn't negate the fact that where Priest, Hudlin and McDuffie were able to portray the relationship/marriage realistically whilst growing Ororo as a character who finally (with T'Challa's help) reconnected with her paternal family as well as expand into the wider MU as a member of the FF, the X-Office, their writers and a coterie of regressive readership were more interested in trashing T'Challa, Wakanda, the BP mythos and even Ororo who was seen as being "too black" by association to T'Challa and thusly, no longer the exotic fetishism femme of indeterminate ethnic identity they were primarily enamoured of.
As Queen of Wakanda, Ororo had access to incredible wealth, technological advancements coupled with political clout that could have been of great use to the X-men in particular and the mutant cause in general.
Additionally, her marriage to T'Challa also served as a brilliant bridge from which to traverse the gap between humans and mutants as envisaged within Professor Charles Xaviers dream but I suppose in hindsight, that this wouldn't have played to the X-Offices narrow vision that prefers to have the X-men and mutants in never ending conflict with the rest of the MU.
One should never forget that we're for the most part, talking about fictional characters existing within a fantasy based realm unfortunately written by some individuals who impose their real world biases and prejudices into said fictional world's which in term stifles creativity across the board.
Ororo is no less of a mutant now than she was back when Christopher J Priest, Reginald Hudlin and Dwayne McDuffie featured her in their respective BP and FF runs than she is now, in Coates BP book.
The primary problem Priest, Hudlin and McDuffie had as writers is that they had the "audacity" to characterise and depict Ororo as a fully fleshed out woman of unambiguous African descent first and foremost as opposed to just focusing on the same mutation that didn't prevent any of her fellow X-men from being recognised as Irish, Canadian, German or Jewish.
That was the sticking point and primary problem for many of the marriage detractors as evidenced by the wholly false narrative of "Hudlin only married them because they're black" that was pushed by the aforementioned detractors ad nauseum.
I've never subscribed to the conceit of personal ethnicity taking a backseat to the individuals actual mutation but that's just me.
Peace.
-
[QUOTE=Hypestyle;3198503]get them back together.
these are all fictional characters-- the "logic" of keeping them "separate but equal" based on editorial camps is bunk, plain and simple. It's a played out dynamic that should have died long ago. Editors, get over yourselves. You don't own any of this. It's either all the same company or it isn't. It's not 1982 anymore. You can write anything that you want. Superman and Wonder Woman were a couple for a while. It happened, regardless of the [I]"but wait, why, they can't, etc"[/I]...
Mary Jane is a supporting character in [I]Iron Man[/I] now. The world hasn't blown up.
Storm's solo series didn't last long enough for her to have her own "stormiverse" of supporting characters and villains-- most white fans want her as the side-piece of Cable or Logan at best. They don't even see her as "solo" worthy. For too long Ororo has been written as being "mutant" above being "black", not having any interest in the political strife of people of African descent, and of course, there's the hordes of fandom who do not even see her as "black" per se', as idiotic as that is.
white fandom doesn't want black heroes pwning the "alpha" villains of these comics universes. It doesn't help that Panther's "Metropolis" keeps getting blown up, drowned, mass-rebellioned/mind-controlled, etc...[/QUOTE]
It's possible to do ... the question mark is whether or not it's possible to sustain. Yeah, they did get Superman and Wonder Woman together ... but like Storm and BP they also broke up. It works so long as the WW and SM writers are on the same page. But what happens if SM writers decide they want him with Lois or WW writers want him with Steve?
It's why characters dating but not getting married is probably the best compromise. It makes things less messy if someone decides to shift gears and do something else.
-
I'm just saying...
It's very unlikely to happen but, if I was ever to be writing either of their solo books, if they weren't already a couple when I got the handoff they wouldn't become one while I was driving. The X-Verse is a minefield and would always take more control of Storm's story than anything she's doing wth BP. [B]For me[/B] it's better to build her up as a solo for at least two years before even thinking about putting the two of them even into "dating" each other.
But, like I said, it's EXTREMELY unlikely that I'll get to write ether of them solo. This is just me as a fan talking.
-
[url]https://www.previewsworld.com/Catalog/NOV172178[/url]
-
[QUOTE=Redjack;3198554]I'm just saying...
It's very unlikely to happen but, if I was ever to be writing either of their solo books, if they weren't already a couple when I got the handoff they wouldn't become one while I was driving. The X-Verse is a minefield and would always take more control of Storm's story than anything she's doing wth BP. [B]For me[/B] it's better to build her up as a solo for at least two years before even thinking about putting the two of them even into "dating" each other.
But, like I said, it's EXTREMELY unlikely that I'll get to write ether of them solo. This is just me as a fan talking.[/QUOTE]
That's Marvel's loss.
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;3198586]That's Marvel's loss.[/QUOTE]
thanks but I think it's just bad timing. Figuring Coates will write BP's book for AT LEAST the next year AND this new Storm book starting up, no way I'd get n there for at least two years. By then, whatever's being planned for BP/Storm will already be in play. Also, Coates' version of BP's universe is SO different from anything I'm thinking about I wouldn't know where to start if I did get a shot at it.
-
[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;3198586]That's Marvel's loss.[/QUOTE]
[B]I agree with This, If Marvel's new approach for Black Panther is to simply hire people who are new to comics instead of Also looking at people with experience (and have proven their ability in other medium's to capture the Characters essence) then that is incredibly short sighted. black panther shouldn't be relagated to a dipping your feet into comics Character like he is being treated now. With his rising popularity, he should be getting both new and experienced writer's wanting to tell stories that elevate him and Wakanda, form people who WANT to write him, not use him to get the characters they actually want to write.
That Said Redjack, of you were giving the opportunity, what would you want to explore in BP?[/B]
-
[QUOTE=Redjack;3198621]thanks but I think it's just bad timing. Figuring Coates will write BP's book for AT LEAST the next year AND this new Storm book starting up, no way I'd get n there for at least two years. By then, whatever's being planned for BP/Storm will already be in play. Also, Coates' version of BP's universe is SO different from anything I'm thinking about I wouldn't know where to start if I did get a shot at it.[/QUOTE]
I think that Coates take on BP is far removed from anything most long term fans of the BP mythos would like. Lol!
I'm just glad we have the Black Panther to look forward to in 2018 and a grip of pre-Coates back issues to reminisce over. :cool:
-
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3198645][B]I agree with This, If Marvel's new approach for Black Panther is to simply hire people who are new to comics instead of Also looking at people with experience (and have proven their ability in other medium's to capture the Characters essence) then that is incredibly short sighted. black panther shouldn't be relagated to a dipping your feet into comics Character like he is being treated now. With his rising popularity, he should be getting both new and experienced writer's wanting to tell stories that elevate him and Wakanda, form people who WANT to write him, not use him to get the characters they actually want to write.
That Said Redjack, of you were giving the opportunity, what would you want to explore in BP?[/B][/QUOTE]
Agreed 100%.
-
[QUOTE=4sake Baned;3198584][url]https://www.previewsworld.com/Catalog/NOV172178[/url][/QUOTE]
That sounds fun. I wonder if the familiar faves from SHIELD are the Agents of Shield crew. It would me meat reading them interact with BP.
-
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3198645][B]I agree with This, If Marvel's new approach for Black Panther is to simply hire people who are new to comics instead of Also looking at people with experience (and have proven their ability in other medium's to capture the Characters essence) then that is incredibly short sighted. black panther shouldn't be relagated to a dipping your feet into comics Character like he is being treated now. With his rising popularity, he should be getting both new and experienced writer's wanting to tell stories that elevate him and Wakanda, form people who WANT to write him, not use him to get the characters they actually want to write.
That Said Redjack, of you were giving the opportunity, what would you want to explore in BP?[/B][/QUOTE]
One thing about the movie coming out, Marvel likes to have a ton of comics material out at the same time. I'm sure we'll see spin offs, etc by different writers.
-
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3198645][B]I agree with This, If Marvel's new approach for Black Panther is to simply hire people who are new to comics instead of Also looking at people with experience (and have proven their ability in other medium's to capture the Characters essence) then that is incredibly short sighted. black panther shouldn't be relagated to a dipping your feet into comics Character like he is being treated now. With his rising popularity, he should be getting both new and experienced writer's wanting to tell stories that elevate him and Wakanda, form people who WANT to write him, not use him to get the characters they actually want to write.
That Said Redjack, of you were giving the opportunity, what would you want to explore in BP?[/B][/QUOTE]
If given the shot? I dunno. I'd probably spend some time building him a real Rogue's Gallery of both old and new villains. I'd give him adversaries that could actually beat him. My feeling is the villains should actually be better than the heroes and that heroes should have to work hard for every win. Personally, I'd downplay the mystic stuff. That's never interested me much wth T'Challa. My feeling about him is that he's constantly dancing between HERO and KING and the two jobs don't always go in the same direction. He's basically always going to be letting someone down, no matter what he chooses.
I haven't given the comics version much thought in that way because, once Marvel chose Mr. Coates, I knew it would be unlikely I'd ever get to write him.
-
[QUOTE=Redjack;3198713]If given the shot? I dunno. I'd probably spend some time building him a real Rogue's Gallery of both old and new villains. I'd give him adversaries that could actually beat him. My feeling is the villains should actually be better than the heroes and that heroes should have to work hard for every win. Personally, I'd downplay the mystic stuff. That's never interested me much wth T'Challa. My feeling about him is that he's constantly dancing between HERO and KING and the two jobs don't always go in the same direction. He's basically always going to be letting someone down, no matter what he chooses.
I haven't given the comics version much thought in that way because, once Marvel chose Mr. Coates, I knew it would be unlikely I'd ever get to write him.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, it's supposed to hard. That's why I never understood why books upgrade heroes power levels so much. Why make it easier for heroes to beat people who they'be already beaten at their previous power levels a dozen times before.
Villains need to be more powerful and scarier. After awhile we just stop believing they actually have a chance of winning, and that just takes the fun out of the fights.
-
[QUOTE=XPac;3198736]Yeah, it's supposed to hard. That's why I never understood why books upgrade heroes power levels so much. Why make it easier for heroes to beat people who they'be already beaten at their previous power levels a dozen times before.
Villains need to be more powerful and scarier. After awhile we just stop believing they actually have a chance of winning, and that just takes the fun out of the fights.[/QUOTE]
I remember Chris Claremont saying saying something to the effect of the villain should actually be more powerful than the hero otherwise what's the point?