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[QUOTE=Crazy Diamond;2252117]Haven't read much of Coates run except for the first issue. In a few days, I'll catch up with it and see if it matches up with what I'm seeing in this thread which so far sounds like a shame. I do like the renegade couple but Zenzi seemed rather one note and I do not like the use of mind control to justify character behavior. Too often it seems like a cop-out and rather weird if Coates is trying to be more realistic. Considering the miner revolts and riots in South Africa in 2012, I didn't know why he didn't just draw from that instead of going halfway between "realistic" and "superhero plot".
Heteronormative as a term was around long before Coates and there have been several Black writers in sci-fi and fantasy who have challenged the idea of straight = normal = the ideal over the years. Two examples I can think of off the top of my head are Samuel Delaney and Octavia Butler. If queer theory is showing up in BP that could be interesting depending on how it's handled.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the headsup on the pre-Coates usage of the "heteronormative" terminology.
Coates possibly citing the ideology of a paedophile apologist and NAMBLA affiliate like Samuel L Delaney says it all. :smh:
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The problem with Coates isn't the writing. Maybe you could say his pacing is slow but that is general comics problem to me. The narrative choices are the problem. Even Mr. Majestic's Flowery Language above wont make this Simpish Inept T'Challa okay, it wont make him getting beat or voluntarily taking punches better, it wont make him less incompetent, it wont make these Rape Camps disappear, etc. Coates not being a comic book writer is not the issue here. His incessant Character Assasination of T'Challa is, his lack of basic understanding of the character is, his disrespect for continuity is the problem, his Boko Haraming of Wakanda is the problem, His Eurocentric Vision for Wakanda is at fault, and his lack of understanding or believe in Afro-Futurism is at fault. The quality of Prose is irrelevant to me. Color it however you want a crap burger is a crap burger and no amount of Hot Sauce or Ketchup will change that.
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[QUOTE=JediKage;2252390]The problem with Coates isn't the writing. Maybe you could say his pacing is slow but that is general comics problem to me. The narrative choices are the problem. Even Mr. Majestic's Flowery Language above wont make this Simpish Inept T'Challa okay, it wont make him getting beat or voluntarily taking punches better, it wont make him less incompetent, it wont make these Rape Camps disappear, etc. Coates not being a comic book writer is not the issue here. His incessant Character Assasintion of T'Challa is, his lack of basic understanding of the character is, his disrespect for continuity is the problem, his Boko Haraming of Wakanda is the problem, His Eurocentric Vision for Wakanda is at fault, and his lack of understanding or believe in Afro-Futurism is at fault. The quality of Prose is irrelevant to me. Color it however you want a crap burger is a crap burger and no amount of Hot Sauce or Ketchup will change that.[/QUOTE]
Bro!
YOU DAMN WELL KILT IT! :COOL:
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[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;2252366]You devour the meet and bones of every false narrative with every chomp of your factual jaws.
The detritus littered path of your devastating passage is testifys to the profligate potency of your professionaly applied rage.
Epicurean mayhem was ever your forte.[/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#000000"]Your effusive praise is equally met by your prolific pummeling of the nauseating narrative of which we have the mal-odious misfortune of perusing.[/COLOR]
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[QUOTE=JediKage;2252390]The problem with Coates isn't the writing. Maybe you could say his pacing is slow but that is general comics problem to me. The narrative choices are the problem. Even Mr. Majestic's Flowery Language above wont make this Simpish Inept T'Challa okay, it wont make him getting beat or voluntarily taking punches better, it wont make him less incompetent, it wont make these Rape Camps disappear, etc. Coates not being a comic book writer is not the issue here. His incessant Character Assasintion of T'Challa is, his lack of basic understanding of the character is, his disrespect for continuity is the problem, his Boko Haraming of Wakanda is the problem, His Eurocentric Vision for Wakanda is at fault, and his lack of understanding or believe in Afro-Futurism is at fault. The quality of Prose is irrelevant to me. Color it however you want a crap burger is a crap burger and no amount of Hot Sauce or Ketchup will change that.[/QUOTE]
Can you smell what Jedikage is cooking? Solid.
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[QUOTE=Crazy Diamond;2252117]Haven't read much of Coates run except for the first issue. In a few days, I'll catch up with it and see if it matches up with what I'm seeing in this thread which so far sounds like a shame. I do like the renegade couple but Zenzi seemed rather one note and I do not like the use of mind control to justify character behavior. Too often it seems like a cop-out and rather weird if Coates is trying to be more realistic. Considering the miner revolts and riots in South Africa in 2012, I didn't know why he didn't just draw from that instead of going halfway between "realistic" and "superhero plot".
Heteronormative as a term was around long before Coates and there have been several Black writers in sci-fi and fantasy who have challenged the idea of straight = normal = the ideal over the years. Two examples I can think of off the top of my head are Samuel Delaney and Octavia Butler. If queer theory is showing up in BP that could be interesting depending on how it's handled.[/QUOTE]
No PC zone with me. Black Panther is about a straight black male. He's the star of the book. This just means he should have wrote this elsewhere.
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[QUOTE=Marvell2100;2252423][COLOR="#000000"]Your effusive praise is equally met by your prolific pummeling of the nauseating narrative of which we have the mal-odious misfortune of perusing.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]
Zounds!
I fall back in awe of unparralelled tempestuousness take down of Coates perfiduous perversion of the now beleagured Black Panther mythos.
We are indeed in the last days.
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[QUOTE=Marvell2100;2252428]Can you smell what Jedikage is cooking? Solid.[/QUOTE]
He came with the Stone Cold Steve Austin stunner fo'sho. :cool:
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Coates doesn't deserve to be listed in the same paragraph as Octavia Butler.
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[QUOTE=JediKage;2252390]The problem with Coates isn't the writing. Maybe you could say his pacing is slow but that is general comics problem to me. The narrative choices are the problem. Even Mr. Majestic's Flowery Language above wont make this Simpish Inept T'Challa okay, it wont make him getting beat or voluntarily taking punches better, it wont make him less incompetent, it wont make these Rape Camps disappear, etc. Coates not being a comic book writer is not the issue here. His incessant Character Assasination of T'Challa is, his lack of basic understanding of the character is, his disrespect for continuity is the problem, his Boko Haraming of Wakanda is the problem, His Eurocentric Vision for Wakanda is at fault, and his lack of understanding or believe in Afro-Futurism is at fault. The quality of Prose is irrelevant to me. Color it however you want a crap burger is a crap burger and no amount of Hot Sauce or Ketchup will change that.[/QUOTE]
I wish I could put this in a Sig.
He flat out sucks! Bar none the worst there has ever been.
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[QUOTE=UltimateTy;2252199]Also Coates whole thing with him finding it hard to believe T'challa wouldn't hook up with the Dora's
Its hard being a Marvel fan right now between this book and Iron Man I'm finding hard to care for Marvel in general.[/QUOTE]
Honestly this is a tell. I been calling him out on the fact that Aneka was like a 2nd mother to him and friend of T'chaka. She was his partner and actually is the one who formed the Dora army. T'challa was a advisor. But nah, people defended him. It's clear his research is shotty.
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[QUOTE=JediKage;2252446]Coates doesn't deserve to be listed in the same paragraph as Octavia Butler.[/QUOTE]
Real talk.
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Look if Coates was doing a story about an Original IP African Kingdom then by all means he is free to right whatever he wants. He is not writing an Original IP though. And thus we have a right to hold his feet to the fire.
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[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;2252438]Zounds!
I fall back in awe of unparralelled tempestuousness take down of Coates perfiduous perversion of the now beleagured Black Panther mythos.
We are indeed in the last days.[/QUOTE]
It's been a cruel summer bro.
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[QUOTE=Victor Freeman;2252459]Honestly this is a tell. I been calling him out on the fact that Aneka was like a 2nd mother to him and friend of T'challa. She was his partner and actually is the one who formed the Dora army. T'challa was a advisor. But nah, people defended him. It's clear his research is shotty.[/QUOTE]
[SIZE=3]
Ayo and Aneka are standing right next to their King in these panels....
[IMG]http://i67.tinypic.com/nfr4ax.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/2dse25y.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i63.tinypic.com/2mg44dx.jpg[/IMG]
So, I'm wondering who the hell Coates has running in around in the BP solo book as agitated Midnight Angels on dat Thelma & Louise tip?
Xpac might know.[/SIZE]
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[QUOTE=Victor Freeman;2252459]Honestly this is a tell. I been calling him out on the fact that Aneka was like a 2nd mother to him and friend of T'chaka. She was his partner and actually is the one who formed the Dora army. T'challa was a advisor. But nah, people defended him. It's clear his research is shotty.[/QUOTE]
Why research a character or nation when you're just going to screw them anyway.
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[QUOTE=Marvell2100;2252504]It's been a cruel summer bro.[/QUOTE]
Thou hath never born false witness.
Verily and forsooth.
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[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;2252505][SIZE=3]
Ayo and Aneka are standing right next to their King in these panels....
[IMG]http://i67.tinypic.com/nfr4ax.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/2dse25y.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i63.tinypic.com/2mg44dx.jpg[/IMG]
So, I'm wondering who the hell Coates has running in around in the BP solo book as agitated Midnight Angels on dat Thelma & Louise tip?
Xpac might know.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]
[B]I want to know when all if this takes place because it doesn't make sense. Would be nice to think this was after what's going on in Wakanda in the Solo but..[/B]
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;2252538][B]I want to know when all if this takes place because it doesn't make sense. Would be nice to think this was after what's going on in Wakanda in the Solo but..[/B][/QUOTE]
The conclusion of Hickman's [B]Secret Wars II[/B] dovetails directly into the opening issues of Al Ewing's [B]Ultimates[/B] book.
Coates chose to push ahead with the nonsense he's writing regardless.
And Marvel Editorial allowed it.
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[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;2251497]One thing I've noticed while rereading Priest is that Coates story isn't necessarily that far out of the realm of other BP stories. The problem, from my perspective, is that this would typically be the "B Plot". Priest's Panther would be working on other things while all this unfolded. Instead Coates has made the revolution his A plot, and the subsequent villain stuff doesn't "Pop" as much and feels more tacked on.
[B]I think if he wrote this from an action mindset rather than an academic one he could still cover a lot of the ground he's attempting to, and still have a book that is fun[/B].[/QUOTE]
That's another part of the problem. He's said he's not really an action oriented writer and that it's the least interesting part for him.
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Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG]
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/quote]
To bad.
Smh........
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
God damn Stelfreeze, the man is killing it
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[QUOTE=JediKage;2252390]The problem with Coates isn't the writing. Maybe you could say his pacing is slow but that is general comics problem to me. The narrative choices are the problem. Even Mr. Majestic's Flowery Language above wont make this Simpish Inept T'Challa okay, it wont make him getting beat or voluntarily taking punches better, it wont make him less incompetent, it wont make these Rape Camps disappear, etc. Coates not being a comic book writer is not the issue here. His incessant Character Assasination of T'Challa is, his lack of basic understanding of the character is, his disrespect for continuity is the problem, his Boko Haraming of Wakanda is the problem, His Eurocentric Vision for Wakanda is at fault, and his lack of understanding or believe in Afro-Futurism is at fault. The quality of Prose is irrelevant to me. Color it however you want a crap burger is a crap burger and no amount of Hot Sauce or Ketchup will change that.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Victor Freeman;2252433]No PC zone with me. Black Panther is about a straight black male. He's the star of the book. This just means he should have wrote this elsewhere.[/QUOTE]
Real As It Gets..
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Zenzi character design ( not really the way she is written) is the only great thing about TNC BP everything else meh or almost unspeakable awful imo...
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[QUOTE=Marvell2100;2252507]Why research a character or nation when you're just going to screw them anyway.[/QUOTE]
That way you can cover your basic base with a in continuity reference here and there to cover up the screwing so to speak
Geoff John made that a artform in his writing
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[QUOTE=Smoov-E;2252843][B]That way you can cover your basic base with a in continuity reference here and there to cover up the screwing so to speak
[/B]
Geoff John made that a artform in his writing[/QUOTE]
Yup..........
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Wow. Beautiful cover.
It'll be interesting to see how this book sells and what audience may have already been created for it. Some but of course not all BP fans will be drawn to it or at least curious, but with its premise and Roxane Gay's following and known subject matter/output the test will be how many in the black queer community and black feminist community will check it out.
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[QUOTE=Mr MajestiK;2252567]The conclusion of Hickman's [B]Secret Wars II[/B] dovetails directly into the opening issues of Al Ewing's [B]Ultimates[/B] book.
Coates chose to push ahead with the nonsense he's writing regardless.
And Marvel Editorial allowed it.[/QUOTE]
Marvel Editorial is just as guilty as Coates writing on BP. IMO probably more so, because they gave the okay for the script.
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Its funny because normally I am against Heavy Handed Editorials. But when a chracters' core attributes are fundamentally undermine in their own solo, yeah Editorial should do something. But Marvel is happy with the Buzz and Sales I assume.
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I won't be supporting this book. I'm barely bringing myself to read the current panther run. All this book does is solidify Coat's pet heros and give him further reason to not invest in characterizing (properly) Tchalla or the royal family.
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2252775]Variant cover for BP: WoW #1, by Stelfreeze.
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cqga55eUEAAUOCR.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
[B] Absolutely Beautiful. The writing should match the artwork [/B]
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[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe4C-y-HUS0[/url]
How fast is Black Panther running in Civil War?
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[QUOTE=memnoch;2253231][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe4C-y-HUS0[/url]
How fast is Black Panther running in Civil War?[/QUOTE]
Thank you. We could use something to cheer about here.
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[QUOTE=Realdealholy;2235940]Numbers are in for July.
BP #4....72K.
36 40.82 $3.99 MAR Black Panther (2016) 4 [B] 72,302[/B] 3 75,037 -2,735 -3.64% 1
[url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/dc-comics-rebirth-dominates-julys-top-20-sales-positions?utm_campaign=dc-comics-rebirth-dominates-julys-top-20-sales-positions&utm_medium=internal_links&utm_source=breaking_banner[/url]
Compared to BP #3 that did 75k and BP #2 that did 77k.
Honestly, I'm shocked. I don't hate this run as much as others, but I'd never though the numbers would stay this high for this long, especially considering the many flaws this run has.
We really are in different times, everyone.[/QUOTE]
Each new issue makes me more and more disappointed with this series..but I keep buying it though; digital and print lol.
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[QUOTE=Anonymousmc;2252942]Marvel Editorial is just as guilty as Coates writing on BP. IMO probably more so, because they gave the okay for the script.[/QUOTE]
Yes, but this is operating under the assumption that marvel editorial even gets the character. Dont forget under their watch we had Maybury, wedding destruction, getting owned by his ex and namor! so the high bar set by the cap film and ending of secret wars 2 was immediately smashed to pieces the first pages of Coates book.
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[QUOTE=memnoch;2253231][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe4C-y-HUS0[/url]
How fast is Black Panther running in Civil War?[/QUOTE]
That video is legit... strong research skills and effort.
[img]https://images.rapgenius.com/02e3e892ac8523b81e04008fee7dcd0a.360x270x36.gif[/img]]
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Welcome back MoS. Glad to have you around here again.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;2253538]That video is legit... strong research skills and effort.
[img]https://images.rapgenius.com/02e3e892ac8523b81e04008fee7dcd0a.360x270x36.gif[/img]][/QUOTE]
[Img]https://media.giphy.com/media/xKy2w6LehxxHa/giphy.gif[/IMG]
[B] Welcome back. Remember don't be a stranger to the HEF [/B]
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[QUOTE=dkrook;2253408]Yes, but this is operating under the assumption that marvel editorial even gets the character. Dont forget under their watch we had Maybury, [B]wedding destruction, getting owned by his ex and namor![/B] so the high bar set by the cap film and ending of secret wars 2 was immediately smashed to pieces the first pages of Coates book.[/QUOTE]
Marvel and DC are all about Writer Clout.
The day Reg left Marvel the clock was ticking(and Reg left because Alonzo-who also had clout-got promoted off his book).
In thier absence the person who had the most clout in charge of those characters would have been whoever ran the Xbooks then.
If Reg were still around the marrage would still be a thing fans flack or no. If Bendis (who has all the clout) had cared about either character the
marrage would still be a thing fans flack or no.
Look how many peeps hate Jessica Jones being married to Cage.
But nobody's gonna touch that but Bendis himself.