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Fine,
You win.
The Adversary is an omniversal menace who can only be defeated for good by the divine majesty that is Storm.
T'challa is nothing. The BP book only serves to glorify the power that Storm should have had from the beginning. Nothing else matters.
All hail the Hadari bloody Yao!
Are you happy now? Does filling the [B]BLACK PANTHER APPRECIATION THREAD[/B] with posts glorifying someone else fill your life with meaning?
Because I can't think of ONE POST you've made in this thread that actually appreciates T'Challa. It's all Storm this, Storm that, "Adversary is a universal threat" yadda yadda yadda.
I for one, no longer give a damn. As the ancients put it: *plonk*
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So, we have a "black panther fan" in this thread who:
- says T'challa would be a mary sue if he defeated Adversary.
- hasn't read Priest run at all. or likely any bp focused story
- downplays T'challa's defeat of Mephisto because said person read a couple panels with no backstory whatsoever.
- ignores all evidence that backs up anything anyone says, ignores all posts that are contrary to said persons beliefs, and has no idea how comic book canon works
Can't we just recognize this for what it is?
[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;3742357]I can see why they are a good match up. Both can be defeated by locking them in a metal box.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;3742366]Obviously you would use metal. Wood only works on Vampires and Alan Scott.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;3742423]Her only real weakness is getting people to buy books titled "Storm".
Oh and hammers.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;3742562]These are action driven stories. There's a reason an Oracle solo was never going to be a seller. No one wants to read about a hero whose main power is delegating responsibility.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Things Fall Apart;3742572]Buying time by fighting the mid bosses while the main person recovers is the recipe for every season of Dragonball Z.
The guys buying time aren't the main characters. It's the guy who becomes a God and cinches the win.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://gifimage.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/bang-bang-gif.gif[/img]
[img]https://media1.tenor.com/images/b13a853530d6a7429abc8a6f41cbc098/tenor.gif?itemid=5359748[/img]
[QUOTE=FLEX HECTIC;3742591]OOPS I dropped something...
[video=youtube;5FuJmHL0xag]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FuJmHL0xag[/video][/QUOTE]
[img]https://media1.giphy.com/media/un1u5EN4iCGaY/giphy.gif[/img]
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In a single run, we had T'challa mind whammy Thanos with broken junk on the fly and T'challa ascend to the plane of cosmic beings of untold power by taking the power away from an ancient God and ripping Logo, a character who was going around and destroying the highest cosmic beings in existence, in half.
If only Ewing didn't bore everyone to sleep in between.
Bast have mercy.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3742352]I dont care for tchalla because I'm pointing out he shouldn't be beating characters who are universal threats? no that is not how that will work and just because you don't like my opinions on the matter you most certainly do not have the authority to tell me to stop.
let coates story play out. we dont know yet what happened to the gods so before jumping to the conclusion of sayin who doesnt care about wakanda, step back breathe and let the story wrap up. the missing gods is clearly a loose end that will be tied up at a later point.[/QUOTE]
[B]You know nothing about Tchalla if your trying to call him a Mary Sue by saying he couldn't find a way to beat adversary. You know who else would call him a Mary Sue and use that weak ass statement as a way to discredit his capabilities? Unfans.
So trying to say that BP Fans, who know what T'Challa is capable of doing are wanting him to turn into a Mary Sue because he figures out a way to defeat adversary even though he has taken on much more credible threats them him or you know, created a a ship that survived the death of everything, or fought god Doom who literally held the power of all the beyonders and survived despite being grossly out matched (same god Doom that broke fully Phoenix powered Cyclops neck in 2 sec flat and ripped Thanos spine out in 2 sec flat and incinerated the top half of namortin 1 sec flat) with the infinity guantlet. On top of Tchalla already facing big cosmic threats like Galactus and Thanos and finding ways to beat them. Saying we fans that know all of this are somehow wanting T'Challa to be a Mary Sue to find a way to beat adversary, who is not on the same level at all.. is a weak argument at best and the Mary Sue comment just shows a lack of Bp knowledge [/B]
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[QUOTE=FLEX HECTIC;3742556]Wakanda Football...
(Translated from Xhosa of course) :cool:
Wakandan Sports Commentator: "King T'challa takes the snap at his own one yard line... He breaks left, spins... HE-COULD-GO-ALL-THE- Waaaaaaay... Breaks one tackle, then another... Leaps over a defender pivots and reverses field, breaks another tackle... Straight stiff arms a defender, breaks another tackle and flips right into the end zo... Wait a minute he fumbles the football... It's recovered in the end zone by STORM... And the crowd goes wild!"
Dora Cheerleaders: "Stormy, Stormy she's are man if she can't do it no one can!"
Wakandan Sports Commentator: "What a play and by default even though King T'challa carried the football all the way to the goal line Storm gets the credit in the box score so she has a game day average of one carry, 99 yards and one touchdown a game! WOW, what stats she might get a scholarship or drafted to the pros if she keeps it up!!!"
King T'challa: "It's just not fair!"
[video=youtube;PQnYkQHHDLU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQnYkQHHDLU[/video][/QUOTE]
[B] If this ain't the funniest isht I read today. Keep posting digital gold flex[/B]
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3742678]now I believe I see why no one wanted to post scans of how tchalla defeated Mephisto. lololol
black panther issue 3-4 (1998)
Tchalla goes to Mephistos realm and was able to defeat him by allowing mephisto to take his soul, which so happened to be tethered to all the noble souls of his ancestor (mephisto doesnt know this however because he cant read minds unless he is invited). Mephisto couldn't handle all those souls and begged tchalla to release him of his debt of acquiring his soul.
[img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/8uSe847GshjRfZbmVqVE-aFh1CIQ3-Xc3uFVFidVxtjYbaTDeT70uLq8F8gy1S8bYSXelC4K0zC5=s1600[/img]
So even here, Tchalla needed help via his ancestors souls to defeat Mephisto. this is cool showing for bo and the ancestors. now my question is how was how he won against mephisto here would allow him to beat adversary????[/QUOTE]
[B] Actually people did post scans about this some odd Page's ago when it was first brought up, as well as went into a detailed breakdown of how he beat Mephisto. So "lololol" it was already explained and it shows Tchallas genius in using HIS OWN RESOURCES to defeat Mephisto. This little game your trying to play is beyond old[/B]
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3742908]In a single run, we had T'challa mind whammy Thanos with broken junk on the fly and T'challa ascend to the plane of cosmic beings of untold power by taking the power away from an ancient God and ripping Logo, a character who was going around and destroying the highest cosmic beings in existence, in half.
If only Ewing didn't bore everyone to sleep in between.
Bast have mercy.[/QUOTE]
[B]Don't forget he outsmarted Galactus and used Kimoyo to get his ancient Tech back up and running to transform him to the life bringer.[/B]
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[QUOTE=XPac;3742498]And all of Wakanda did play a part in beating adversary. Literally.
She couldn't have done it without them.[/QUOTE]
They shouldn't have needed her in the first place.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3742603]yasssss I love me some nakia!!!! such a good movie![/QUOTE]
I thought you hated Nakia.
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[QUOTE=MindofShadow;3742904]Can't we just recognize this for what it is?[/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/541/879/ed7.png[/IMG]
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Mbaku: "Are you done?"
[video=youtube;NbJvPrd-Pq8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbJvPrd-Pq8[/video]
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I am hoping for BP2 that we get to see more of how the different tribes live.
I am not sure if that is possible or not (aka would it actually be entertaining?) but I would love the see the difference between the Jabari lands and the lands of the River tribe for instance.
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[QUOTE=MouserGrey;3742819]That seems to be what you fail to see. Shadow physics could have been explored further, adding a feat to T'Challa or Wakanda. You get to brag now that Storm is a god now because Coates put the tease on paper, correct. But before that it's only been insinuated she was a goddess. Coates could have added a believable scenario using the guile of BP to trick him into a teleportation loop with shadow physics long enough to get Adversary out of town. Or do you think shadow physics has no good reason to be explored as a viable avenue to persuit for a narrative?[/QUOTE]
Shadow physics in the past has allowed him to find vibraninum on a quantum level, create weapons that could be used against vibranium, and create a unstable teleportation device. Perhaps it could have been used but I still don't believe it would have been effective against a character like Adversary because physical means cannot harm him. Shadow physics is still based upon science as it relates to alchemy which is still a physical method of matter transformation and not something of the spirit or divine. This was something Adversary kept hammering home to Forge in X-factor.
[QUOTE=Beware Of Geek;3742824]Fine,
You win.
The Adversary is an omniversal menace who can only be defeated for good by the divine majesty that is Storm.
T'challa is nothing. The BP book only serves to glorify the power that Storm should have had from the beginning. Nothing else matters.
All hail the Hadari bloody Yao!
Are you happy now? Does filling the [B]BLACK PANTHER APPRECIATION THREAD[/B] with posts glorifying someone else fill your life with meaning?
Because I can't think of ONE POST you've made in this thread that actually appreciates T'Challa. It's all Storm this, Storm that, "Adversary is a universal threat" yadda yadda yadda.
I for one, no longer give a damn. As the ancients put it: *plonk*[/QUOTE]
Actually, Adversary is [U][B]not[/B][/U] an omniversal menace just a universal one, and yes Coates canonized that O'roro could defeat him which explains why he feared her so many years ago during the Uncanny issue.
I never said T'challa is nothing. So because I understand a character's limits (in this case T'challa) that somehow means I am reducing him to nothing? Do you see the ridiculousness in your assertion? You claim that Coates has sullied the Wakandan mythos by having O'roro defeat adversary instead of T'challa, but even with T'challa's high end feats he didn't win it alone. With Logos, he had the help of Tiger God and with Mephisto he had help of his ancestors' souls. So why is there a double standard here that he sought the help of his ex-wife to defeat Adversary?
Goddess. Relax. Me correcting false statements about a [B][U]metal box[/U][/B] beating able to defeat Adversary, or the incorrect notion Storm was always [U][B]just a mutant[/B][/U] is not my attempt to glorify characters over T'challa. It is to correct misinformation. If you can seriously argue that a metal box can beat Adversary then you simply don't understand Adversary as a character or the capability of his power (which a lot is still very unknown about him).
And so what? You can't think of a post where I actually appreciate T'challa? Doesn't mean I don't or haven't, and I certainly have NOTHING to prove to you. I appreciate T'challa for being a strategist who can get ish done even when the odds are stacked against him. I'm not going to type on this keyboard making ridiculous claims of him being able to beat characters like the One Above All, or Roma, or other multiversal/universal threats on his own simply because it's his appreciation thread. All of his high-end showings required him using his cunning and strategic mind to win; he understood his opponent and the tools he needed to defeat them. He didn't do it all on his own. This wasn't the case with Logos, or with Mephisto and if you don't like me pointing out this truth, as I told another poster it's not my problem.
Lastly, if you don't want to talk about Storm then don't bring up her and what Coates is doing with her in the [U][B]CURRENT[/B][/U] BP books. I'm not the one crying every day, time and time again, about how Coates is the worst thing since Ebola because Storm beat Adversary instead of BP, and how he support gets more shine in his book than BP. Like seriously, you want to get on this high-horse and talk condescendingly about this being an appreciation thread but is all this moaning and groaning I see posters do here (including you) really an appreciation of the things Tchalla is doing because it doesn't sound like it to me. All in all, keep the conversation on T'challa and appreciate him if you don't want the discussion to go in direction of O'roro.
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3742926][B]You know nothing about Tchalla if your trying to call him a Mary Sue by saying he couldn't find a way to beat adversary. You know who else would call him a Mary Sue and use that weak ass statement as a way to discredit his capabilities? Unfans.
So trying to say that BP Fans, who know what T'Challa is capable of doing are wanting him to turn into a Mary Sue because he figures out a way to defeat adversary even though he has taken on much more credible threats them him or you know, created a a ship that survived the death of everything, or fought god Doom who literally held the power of all the beyonders and survived despite being grossly out matched (same god Doom that broke fully Phoenix powered Cyclops neck in 2 sec flat and ripped Thanos spine out in 2 sec flat and incinerated the top half of namortin 1 sec flat) with the infinity guantlet. On top of Tchalla already facing big cosmic threats like Galactus and Thanos and finding ways to beat them. Saying we fans that know all of this are somehow wanting T'Challa to be a Mary Sue to find a way to beat adversary, who is not on the same level at all.. is a weak argument at best and the Mary Sue comment just shows a lack of Bp knowledge [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3742993][B] Actually people did post scans about this some odd Page's ago when it was first brought up, as well as went into a detailed breakdown of how he beat Mephisto. So "lololol" it was already explained and it shows Tchallas genius in using HIS OWN RESOURCES to defeat Mephisto. This little game your trying to play is beyond old[/B][/QUOTE]
I never called T'challa a mary sue. I asked a question to a poster would him beating certain characters who are leaps and leaps beyond him in power be perceived as him being one. And he did find a way to beat Adversary. He found a way with his ex-wife's help and that of the Wakandan mystics. T'challa can do anything he wants against high-tier characters when he has certain boosts, such as the infinity gauntlet as you mentioned when he fought god Doom; however, in the case of Adversary all he had was his technology and even the mystics that he went to power were not enough to destroy or counter the Adversary's power. He therefore sought the help of someone who had a power who exceeded his own (just as he did when he went to the Tiger God for his fight against Logos) to beat Adversary. I don't see you and others getting up in arms about Tchalla needing the Tiger God's help, so why is it such a crime that he went to O'roro in this instance when he knew the power that was within her? It just seems like a huge double standard and frankly if you and others here are honest, the issue you have is that it was Ororo. That is the problem and trying to make it anything other than that is simply not factually sound.
T'challa used his knowledge that Mephisto couldn't read minds to trick him into wanting his soul, because he knew that his soul was tethered to the many Wakandan ancestors of the past. Yes it was his genius/mind that allowed him to win (he understood the limitation of Mephisto power's), but had he not had the souls of this ancestors he would not have been able to overcome Mephisto. That is fact and that is from BP issue 4 (1998). I just read it last night.
[QUOTE=BlackClaw;3743113]I thought you hated Nakia.[/QUOTE]
I never said I hated Nakia. In fact I liked the movie and I enjoyed Nakia very much in it. Now if we are talking about the comics and who should be with Tchalla, then I would make the argument it shouldn't be her because she tried to kill him. That said, doesn't mean I hate the character simply I don't think she is the one for Tchalla.
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Not BP related.
I'm only through 3 episodes and Bushmaster is on my list for top villain mostly because he might be the coolest.
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[QUOTE=butterflykyss;3743495]Shadow physics in the past has allowed him to find vibraninum on a quantum level, create weapons that could be used against vibranium, and create a unstable teleportation device. Perhaps it could have been used but I still don't believe it would have been effective against a character like Adversary because physical means cannot harm him. Shadow physics is still based upon science as it relates to alchemy which is still a physical method of matter transformation and not something of the spirit or divine. This was something Adversary kept hammering home to Forge in X-factor.
Actually, Adversary is [U][B]not[/B][/U] an omniversal menace just a universal one, and yes Coates canonized that O'roro could defeat him which explains why he feared her so many years ago during the Uncanny issue.
I never said T'challa is nothing. So because I understand a character's limits (in this case T'challa) that somehow means I am reducing him to nothing? Do you see the ridiculousness in your assertion? You claim that Coates has sullied the Wakandan mythos by having O'roro defeat adversary instead of T'challa, but even with T'challa's high end feats he didn't win it alone. With Logos, he had the help of Tiger God and with Mephisto he had help of his ancestors' souls. So why is there a double standard here that he sought the help of his ex-wife to defeat Adversary?
Goddess. Relax. Me correcting false statements about a [B][U]metal box[/U][/B] beating able to defeat Adversary, or the incorrect notion Storm was always [U][B]just a mutant[/B][/U] is not my attempt to glorify characters over T'challa. It is to correct misinformation. If you can seriously argue that a metal box can beat Adversary then you simply don't understand Adversary as a character or the capability of his power (which a lot is still very unknown about him).
And so what? You can't think of a post where I actually appreciate T'challa? Doesn't mean I don't or haven't, and I certainly have NOTHING to prove to you. I appreciate T'challa for being a strategist who can get ish done even when the odds are stacked against him. I'm not going to type on this keyboard making ridiculous claims of him being able to beat characters like the One Above All, or Roma, or other multiversal/universal threats on his own simply because it's his appreciation thread. All of his high-end showings required him using his cunning and strategic mind to win; he understood his opponent and the tools he needed to defeat them. He didn't do it all on his own. This wasn't the case with Logos, or with Mephisto and if you don't like me pointing out this truth, as I told another poster it's not my problem.
Lastly, if you don't want to talk about Storm then don't bring up her and what Coates is doing with her in the [U][B]CURRENT[/B][/U] BP books. I'm not the one crying every day, time and time again, about how Coates is the worst thing since Ebola because Storm beat Adversary instead of BP, and how he support gets more shine in his book than BP. Like seriously, you want to get on this high-horse and talk condescendingly about this being an appreciation thread but is all this moaning and groaning I see posters do here (including you) really an appreciation of the things Tchalla is doing because it doesn't sound like it to me. All in all, keep the conversation on T'challa and appreciate him if you don't want the discussion to go in direction of O'roro.
I never called T'challa a mary sue. I asked a question to a poster would him beating certain characters who are leaps and leaps beyond him in power be perceived as him being one. And he did find a way to beat Adversary. He found a way with his ex-wife's help and that of the Wakandan mystics. T'challa can do anything he wants against high-tier characters when he has certain boosts, such as the infinity gauntlet as you mentioned when he fought god Doom; however, in the case of Adversary all he had was his technology and even the mystics that he went to power were not enough to destroy or counter the Adversary's power. He therefore sought the help of someone who had a power who exceeded his own (just as he did when he went to the Tiger God for his fight against Logos) to beat Adversary. I don't see you and others getting up in arms about Tchalla needing the Tiger God's help, so why is it such a crime that he went to O'roro in this instance when he knew the power that was within her? It just seems like a huge double standard and frankly if you and others here are honest, the issue you have is that it was Ororo. That is the problem and trying to make it anything other than that is simply not factually sound.
T'challa used his knowledge that Mephisto couldn't read minds to trick him into wanting his soul, because he knew that his soul was tethered to the many Wakandan ancestors of the past. Yes it was his genius/mind that allowed him to win (he understood the limitation of Mephisto power's), but had he not had the souls of this ancestors he would not have been able to overcome Mephisto. That is fact and that is from BP issue 4 (1998). I just read it last night.
I never said I hated Nakia. In fact I liked the movie and I enjoyed Nakia very much in it. Now if we are talking about the comics and who should be with Tchalla, then I would make the argument it shouldn't be her because she tried to kill him. That said, doesn't mean I hate the character simply I don't think she is the one for Tchalla.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I sometimes think people don't differentiate between not liking a character and simply not shipping a character.
You can like comic Nakia just fine, yet still be against a teenage psychopath dating Black Panther. Teenage psychopaths can be fun chacacters in and of themselves... they just don't necessarily make ideal love interests for an adult protagonist, that's all.
And of course comic Nakia is an entirely different thing from movie Nakia. So that's completely apples and oranges.