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[QUOTE=Pulp Fiction;3562063]-The lines he got to say at the museum criticising them for stealing the artifacts
-Killed Klaw
-Called out wakanda for not helping black people
-Called out T'Chaka for killing his father
-"hey auntie"
-"is this your king?"
-beats T'Challa's ass
-gets the camera spin when walking into the throne room
-gets the better theme music
-"all that challenge sh*t is over"
-"a kid from oakland believing in fairytales"
-"Bury me with my ancestors"
-"death is better than bondage"
Coogler wanted to make his boy look as good as possible[/QUOTE]
I'll certainly say that Coogler made Killmonger look cool... but heroic isn't a word I would use to describe him.
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[QUOTE=KidStranglehold;3562119]Seriously I hope in the relaunch Black Panther book we at least get NEW and ORIGINAL Black Panther rogue galleries. Because when it comes to original Black Panther villains he has been lackluster and has been a weakness of the character. This is something both Priest and Hudlin should have developed more. There never really was any long lasting villains.[/QUOTE]
I think he's similar to Batman in that he has a lot of interesting rogues... but they're a bit underpowered. There's a place for guys like Killmnoger and Achebe and Hunter, but they probably need to mix it up a little with higher end metas.
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[QUOTE=KidStranglehold;3562119]Seriously I hope in the relaunch Black Panther book we at least get NEW and ORIGINAL Black Panther rogue galleries. Because when it comes to original Black Panther villains he has been lackluster and has been a weakness of the character. This is something both Priest and Hudlin should have developed more. There never really was any long lasting villains.[/QUOTE]
Since this new arc is in space, hopefully Coates can get creative and give us some colorful new villains. But then again, Coates.
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so will the Panther be a guest star in the forthcoming Dan Slot [I]Fantastic Four [/I]series? I guess we'll soon see.
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[QUOTE=Jabare;3561817]So honest opinion do you think the new BP centric Avengers season will have quality animation or be the same quality as the past Avengers seasons?
Has anyone kept up with the cartoon?[/QUOTE]
I thought the Disney animation was cancelled. when are the new ones coming out ?
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[QUOTE=XPac;3561938]Marvel just can't seem to get real quality animation for their cartoons for some reason. I assumed getting bought by Disney would lead to some improvement in that area, but if anything I think their cartoons declined in quality.[/QUOTE]
I don't really like the look of the cartoons either. the writing for the ones I saw at least were also kinda cheesy.
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[QUOTE=BlackClaw;3562168]Since this new arc is in space, hopefully Coates can get creative and give us some colorful new villains. But then again, Coates.[/QUOTE]
In the least I think we're getting an increase in the power level of the opponents he's facing. The big bad this season is pretty high up there. I'm hoping the BP franchise can steal that one for themselves, as it's always nice to have a few really high end rogues in ones gallery. It's something BP is sorely lacking in.
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[QUOTE=Pulp Fiction;3562063]-The lines he got to say at the museum criticising them for stealing the artifacts
-Killed Klaw
-Called out wakanda for not helping black people
-Called out T'Chaka for killing his father
-"hey auntie"
-"is this your king?"
-beats T'Challa's ass
-gets the camera spin when walking into the throne room
-gets the better theme music
-"all that challenge sh*t is over"
-"a kid from oakland believing in fairytales"
-"Bury me with my ancestors"
-"death is better than bondage"
Coogler wanted to make his boy look as good as possible[/QUOTE]
[B]-"I Neva freeze"
-Drops 100+ feet while simultaneously throwing EMP beads to disable kidnapper's vehicles
- Whooped kidnapper's asses
-His people chanting his name as he walks out of the Royal talon
-whoops M'Bakus ass
-"Yield! Don't make me kill you" "You have fought with honor, now Yield! Your people still need you"
- casino scene "We are taking Klaw, you have been warned"
- Jump's 20+ to a moving vehicle, rips the roof off and ragdolls the driver
- Kinectic blasts SUV and acrobatic flips unto moving car in front of SUV
- Wall runs after Being blasted off/jumping off car, into ripping off car tire
-"Every breath you take is mercy from me"
-Plants bug on Ross
-"I don't care about Klaw, the only reason I don't kill you where you stand is because I know who you are, now what do you want"
-"I am not King of all people, I am King of Wakanda and it is my responsibility to keep my people safe and keep our resources from falling Into the hands of people like you"
- Still offers compassion to Erik after having two opportunities to kill him
- All of you are wrong speech
- speech to M'Baku that turns him into an ally
- "N'Jadaka! I never yielded, and as you can see, I am not dead" while brimming with swagger
- Kinect blasts border tribe and destroys dragon flier into one Swift motion
- Takes down armored rhino
-You have become the people you wish to conquer lines
-Puts the dagger where it needs to be
- Shows Erik the Wakandan sunset instead of killing him
- "Maybe we can still heal you"
- The wise build Bridges speech
Pretty sure Coogler did our boy right
[/B]
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[QUOTE=Pulp Fiction;3562063]-The lines he got to say at the museum criticising them for stealing the artifacts
-Killed Klaw
-Called out wakanda for not helping black people
-Called out T'Chaka for killing his father
-"hey auntie"
-"is this your king?"
-beats T'Challa's ass
[B]-gets the camera spin when walking into the throne room
-gets the better theme music[/B]
-"all that challenge sh*t is over"
-"a kid from oakland believing in fairytales"
-"Bury me with my ancestors"
-"death is better than bondage"
Coogler wanted to make his boy look as good as possible[/QUOTE]
The camera spin highlights how the world has been turned upside down when Killmonger assumes the throne.
Also, with regards to the musical theme, while it's completely subjective as to whose is better, I did notice something really cool in terms of the score and the storytelling on a rewatch (rest of this post is transposed from a Facebook post I made).
So, "Ancestral Plane" from Ludwig Goransson's score, specifically the section from 01:50-3:05
[video=youtube;GlklhLJrxnM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlklhLJrxnM[/video]
This section plays as T'Challa visits his father in the ancestral plane.
The 2:17 mark is when T'Challa's father, first appears, and then it builds as T'Challa falls to his knees around the 2:40 mark and says, "I'm sorry [for failing to save you]." Around the 2:46 mark is when T'Chaka tells his son, "Stand up. You are a king." And then there's a light motif that plays from 2:54-3:04.
This motif appears at several places in the score, here it's played by strings, but you can also hear it in the brass in [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYu6Jk36pKA"]T'Challa's theme (2:12-2:24[/URL]) and it is [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uC0jw3jAhpg"]played by the fula flute in Killmonger's theme (0:00-0:11)[/URL].
It is a motif that represents the royal family, and it's one of the first clues to Killmonger's heritage. Understanding this is essential to understanding the moment later in the film.
You see, that section on "Ancestral Plane" (1:50-3:05) plays again later, in that flashback where Zuri reveals to T'Challa that Killmonger is T'Challa's cousin. I'm not sure that it's the exact same recording, but it is for sure the same composition.
The 2:17 mark is when T'Chaka sticks his claws into N'Jobu, and Zuri laments to T'Challa that T'Chaka killed his own brother to save Zuri's life. T'Challa then asks about the child (Killmonger). Zuri says, "We left him." And then there's this beautiful moment of storytelling through music. Right now the family motif should play; it's the same composition. But it doesn't. Instead, we're greeted by silence and a shot of young Killmonger looking up into the night sky, his family literally and musically stripped from him.
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3562006][B] Redjack is at the helm (he did the crocodile necklace episode) so he will do him justice[/B][/QUOTE]
Absolutely. I've known Geoff Thorne a long time, have read many of his comics and prose novels (and shame on all of y'all who didn't buy Mosaic) and I can say that Black Panther is a character he was born to write. Especially now, whatever this Galactic Empire of Wakanda thing turns out to be, I really wish Geoff was in writing that comic.
[QUOTE=KidStranglehold;3562119]Seriously I hope in the relaunch Black Panther book we at least get NEW and ORIGINAL Black Panther rogue galleries. Because when it comes to original Black Panther villains he has been lackluster and has been a weakness of the character. This is something both Priest and Hudlin should have developed more. There never really was any long lasting villains.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely. A strong supporting cast and a regular rogues gallery are two essential ingredients to making a superhero truly iconic. Think of characters like Superman, Batman, and Spider-Man, several of their friends and enemies are just as famous as they are, even among those who've never read a comic. Everyone knows who Batman is, and most could also name characters like The Joker, The Riddler, Catwoman, and The Penguin (and probably also Bane and Scarecrow now, thanks to the Nolan films), as his villains (as well as knowing who Alfred and Commissioner Gordon are). I'd say BP needs a good 8-12 new good supervillains that could be his semi-recurring nemesis'. Original characters, that are specific to him, as much as Doctor Octopus is thought of as a "Spider-Man villain."
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[QUOTE=Ezyo1000;3562225][B]-"I Neva freeze"
-Drops 100+ feet while simultaneously throwing EMP beads to disable kidnapper's vehicles
- Whooped kidnapper's asses
-His people chanting his name as he walks out of the Royal talon
-whoops M'Bakus ass
-"Yield! Don't make me kill you" "You have fought with honor, now Yield! Your people still need you"
- casino scene "We are taking Klaw, you have been warned"
- Jump's 20+ to a moving vehicle, rips the roof off and ragdolls the driver
- Kinectic blasts SUV and acrobatic flips unto moving car in front of SUV
- Wall runs after Being blasted off/jumping off car, into ripping off car tire
-"Every breath you take is mercy from me"
-Plants bug on Ross
-"I don't care about Klaw, the only reason I don't kill you where you stand is because I know who you are, now what do you want"
-"I am not King of all people, I am King of Wakanda and it is my responsibility to keep my people safe and keep our resources from falling Into the hands of people like you"
- Still offers compassion to Erik after having two opportunities to kill him
- All of you are wrong speech
- speech to M'Baku that turns him into an ally
- "N'Jadaka! I never yielded, and as you can see, I am not dead" while brimming with swagger
- Kinect blasts border tribe and destroys dragon flier into one Swift motion
- Takes down armored rhino
-You have become the people you wish to conquer lines
-Puts the dagger where it needs to be
- Shows Erik the Wakandan sunset instead of killing him
- "Maybe we can still heal you"
- The wise build Bridges speech
Pretty sure Coogler did our boy right
[/B][/QUOTE]
Co-signing all that.
And, really to me, nothing tops the simplicity of that final (pre-credits) scene in Oakland. When that young Black boy walks up to T'Challa asking [I]is that your spaceship?[/I] And then [I]who are you?[/I] Just that [U]look[/U] on Boseman's face, without even speaking, said everything about how important the character and what he represents is.
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[QUOTE=XPac;3562130]I think he's similar to Batman in that he has a lot of interesting rogues... but they're a bit underpowered. There's a place for guys like Killmnoger and Achebe and Hunter, but they probably need to mix it up a little with higher end metas.[/QUOTE]
"underpowered" has zero to do with it. Batman's rogue gallery are LONG LASTING and stay around. Killmonger(even tho he's in limbo), Man-Ape and Klaw are Panther's only real iconic villains. Wheres Hunter? Wheres Achebe especially...
How can you compare the Joker, Bane, Riddler. Deadshot, Poison Ivy, Killer Croc, Scarecrow, Black Mask and the whole damn list. There is a reason why Batman villains appear in so many stories outside of Batman. Its a reason why they can have their OWN stories. How can you compare Batman villians with Panthers? Like I said being underpowered has *&^% to do with it. Its more of writers not being creative enough to make new and original villains that become iconic to the Black Panther's mythos.
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[QUOTE=BlackClaw;3562168]Since this new arc is in space, hopefully Coates can get creative and give us some colorful new villains. But then again, Coates.[/QUOTE]
I would like to see him show Black Panther whooping ass against alien martial artists. It would be a giant character upgrade to see Panther go up against an alien tyrant and free its people. But then again its Coates. If Coates wants to use the whole silly slave narrative then why not show slavery in an alien society and have Panther/Wakanda acting as John Brown? Instead of ruining the mythos.
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[QUOTE=iblogalot;3562316]
Absolutely. A strong supporting cast and a regular rogues gallery are two essential ingredients to making a superhero truly iconic. Think of characters like Superman, Batman, and Spider-Man, several of their friends and enemies are just as famous as they are, even among those who've never read a comic. Everyone knows who Batman is, and most could also name characters like The Joker, The Riddler, Catwoman, and The Penguin (and probably also Bane and Scarecrow now, thanks to the Nolan films), as his villains (as well as knowing who Alfred and Commissioner Gordon are). I'd say BP needs a good 8-12 new good supervillains that could be his semi-recurring nemesis'. Original characters, that are specific to him, as much as Doctor Octopus is thought of as a "Spider-Man villain."[/QUOTE]
Very good post. Rogue galleries are underrated when it comes to character development. There is a reason why they are needed.
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[QUOTE=iblogalot;3562316]Absolutely. I've known Geoff Thorne a long time, have read many of his comics and prose novels (and shame on all of y'all who didn't buy Mosaic) and I can say that Black Panther is a character he was born to write. Especially now, whatever this Galactic Empire of Wakanda thing turns out to be, I really wish Geoff was in writing that comic.
Absolutely. A strong supporting cast and a regular rogues gallery are two essential ingredients to making a superhero truly iconic. Think of characters like Superman, Batman, and Spider-Man, several of their friends and enemies are just as famous as they are, even among those who've never read a comic. Everyone knows who Batman is, and most could also name characters like The Joker, The Riddler, Catwoman, and The Penguin (and probably also Bane and Scarecrow now, thanks to the Nolan films), as his villains (as well as knowing who Alfred and Commissioner Gordon are). I'd say BP needs a good 8-12 new good supervillains that could be his semi-recurring nemesis'. Original characters, that are specific to him, as much as Doctor Octopus is thought of as a "Spider-Man villain."[/QUOTE]
[B] Geoff did the hec episode and croc. Those were amazing. And honestly on this thread he said he was interested in doing a BP comic. I hope he gets the chance. He mosiac was great. And yeah o wish he was doing galactic empire Wakanda because it wouldn't be used as a analog to trash the mythos.
In all honesty I would like for Redjack AND Evan Narcisse to each get an ongoing. Redjack on the BP main book and Narcisse on the Rise title, have it get more promoting too like they do with coates.
As for Villains, there are Villains that simply needs revamps. Solomon prey, Baron macbre, king cadaver, malice, madam slay, Achebe, and the supremacists can all be used. Zenzi and Tetu could also use rework. [/B]