The Origin of Vibranium... in Captain Marvel?

[XPac]

Beautifully put; and I agree with everything. A "shout out" would be nice, but isn't required. It's a GOOD thing Wakanda stuff is featuring in comics outside of BP, but yeah (sadly)... might have been less baggage to just make up a new alloy and ignore Wakanda things. Which (in my mind) is NOT what we want to see happen, but possibly what we might be heading for.

I suppose that's the trade off to consider. Do you want to keep the stuff isolated to just Wakanda so that it's more rare and special.. or do you want it out there and used as much as possible.

If hypothetically they invented some new uber space metal to replace it in the story and other books decide to use that instead of vibranium in their stories, is that good? Bad? Maybe I'm overthinking it and it doesn't really matter and maybe you'll get complaints from the internet either way. Not sure there's a right answer there.

Or maybe they can just use antarctic vibranium instead. Different properties entirely but I don't think Kazar fans will mind how it's used one way or the other.

[Kieran_Frost]

I suppose that's the trade off to consider. Do you want to keep the stuff isolated to just Wakanda so that it's more rare and special.. or do you want it out there and used as much as possible.

If hypothetically they invented some new uber space metal to replace it in the story and other books decide to use that instead of vibranium in their stories, is that good? Bad? Maybe I'm overthinking it and it doesn't really matter and maybe you'll get complaints from the internet either way. Not sure there's a right answer there.

Or maybe they can just use antarctic vibranium instead. Different properties entirely but I don't think Kazar fans will mind how it's used one way or the other.

THIS!!! It's the trade off fans need to accept and not freak-out over. The higher profile your characters rises, the more you need to learn to "grin-and-bare-it." It's true of all characters. If we don't, very quickly writers will get tired of having to deal with fans over every little thing. I'd rather T'Challa and Wakanda play a bigger role in the MU (across all books). And I accept the "flip-side" of such awesomeness is T'challa and Wakanda won't always be used right or always come out on top. It happens, it happens to all character. T'challa contained in his own little verse is fine, but it won't guarantee we'll always have him around.

It's a difficult one, I get the pros and cons of both, and (for me personally) I choose "the whole MU". I'd rather American Panther Kasper Cole showed up in Waid's Daredevil than not be used at all. I'd rather the origins of Vibranium get explored in Captain Marvel than not explored at all. I'd rather a former Black Panther Wakandan Queen has her story told in Storm's solo than never at all. As long as it's a good story, it doesn't both me who does it, or what "verse" said comic writer is in at the time.

That said... I get why some only want T'Challa used by a BP writer. I feel the same about Wiccan. I DON'T want him a main character in an event, I DON'T want him on a main Avengers team. As long as he's in Young Avengers he's safe, and he'll remain with Hulkling, his character will remain good and powerful and aweomse and he'll remain alive. But I accept the trade off is = sometimes I can go over a year without any Wiccan in any comics; and his reappearance is NEVER guaranteed. If that makes sense?

[Mr MajestiK]

I suppose that's the trade off to consider. Do you want to keep the stuff isolated to just Wakanda so that it's more rare and special..

or do you want it out there and used as much as possible.

You've basically answered your own question in one fell swoop.

If something that's supposed to be "rare and special" suddenly becomes "out there and used as much as possible" would it still be special?

If hypothetically they invented some new uber space metal to replace it in the story and other books decide to use that instead of vibranium in their stories, is that good? Bad? Maybe I'm overthinking it and it doesn't really matter and maybe you'll get complaints from the internet either way. Not sure there's a right answer there.

I'm not sure what "internet complaints" have to do with anything but exploring other natural resources (fictional or otherwise) wouldn't hurt especially as it's not as if Adamantium and Vibranium (of whatever variety) should be the defacto metals with unique properties within the MU.

Or maybe they can just use antarctic vibranium instead. Different properties entirely but I don't think Kazar fans will mind how it's used one way or the other.

It's kind of irrelevant how "Kazar fans" would feel about anything since as you've astutely pointed out, the Antarctic Vibranium with it's own uniquely different properties, is not the variety central to this threads topic.

[XPac]

THIS!!! It's the trade off fans need to accept and not freak-out over. The higher profile your characters rises, the more you need to learn to "grin-and-bare-it." It's true of all characters. If we don't, very quickly writers will get tired of having to deal with fans over every little thing. I'd rather T'Challa and Wakanda play a bigger role in the MU (across all books). And I accept the "flip-side" of such awesomeness is T'challa and Wakanda won't always be used right or always come out on top. It happens, it happens to all character. T'challa contained in his own little verse is fine, but it won't guarantee we'll always have him around.

It's a difficult one, I get the pros and cons of both, and (for me personally) I choose "the whole MU". I'd rather American Panther Kasper Cole showed up in Waid's Daredevil than not be used at all. I'd rather the origins of Vibranium get explored in Captain Marvel than not explored at all. I'd rather a former Black Panther Wakandan Queen has her story told in Storm's solo than never at all. As long as it's a good story, it doesn't both me who does it, or what "verse" said comic writer is in at the time.

That said... I get why some only want T'Challa used by a BP writer. I feel the same about Wiccan. I DON'T want him a main character in an event, I DON'T want him on a main Avengers team. As long as he's in Young Avengers he's safe, and he'll remain with Hulkling, his character will remain good and powerful and aweomse and he'll remain alive. But I accept the trade off is = sometimes I can go over a year without any Wiccan in any comics; and his reappearance is NEVER guaranteed. If that makes sense?

I personally subscribe to the mentality of characters and their concepts being better off when used as much as possible unless you're already an A-lister.

When Doc Oc for example used adamantium in his arms for awhile, they COULD have in theory given Logan a guest spot or even a shout out if they wanted to as Logan is very closely associated with adamantium. But really, Logan gains nothing from the exposure since he's already exposed enough (arguably over exposed). For a character like a Wolverine or a Spider-Man, who appear in multiple books every month anyways, there's generally speaking little to no gain in for them at least in guest spots.

But most characters, Black Panther included, aren't a Wolverine or a Spider-Man. So I actually think they benefit when their stuff is out there. Ideally they would benefit more if the character actually shows up, but even if he doesn't I still believe there's a net gain in that it creates a potential story that wasn't there before. Even if Kelly does add Black Panther in this story, maybe she will next time. Or maybe Bendis over in Guardians of the Galaxy will. The possibilities just get wider when stuff like this is introduced.

And that's especially true with a Guardians of the Galaxy movie coming out. All this stuff interconnecting as much as possible IMO just creates more potential stories.

[Kieran_Frost]

I personally subscribe to the mentality of characters and their concepts being better off when used as much as possible unless you're already an A-lister.

When Doc Oc for example used adamantium in his arms for awhile, they COULD have in theory given Logan a guest spot or even a shout out if they wanted to as Logan is very closely associated with adamantium. But really, Logan gains nothing from the exposure since he's already exposed enough (arguably over exposed). For a character like a Wolverine or a Spider-Man, who appear in multiple books every month anyways, there's generally speaking little to no gain in for them at least in guest spots.

But most characters, Black Panther included, aren't a Wolverine or a Spider-Man. So I actually think they benefit when their stuff is out there. Ideally they would benefit more if the character actually shows up, but even if he doesn't I still believe there's a net gain in that it creates a potential story that wasn't there before. Even if Kelly does add Black Panther in this story, maybe she will next time. Or maybe Bendis over in Guardians of the Galaxy will. The possibilities just get wider when stuff like this is introduced.

And that's especially true with a Guardians of the Galaxy movie coming out. All this stuff interconnecting as much as possible IMO just creates more potential stories.

Agreed. Kelly Sue could b e lighting the spark that triggers a proper exploration of the Vibranium planet; which can only aid Wakanda's profile. Fingers crossed.

[Mr MajestiK]

I personally subscribe to the mentality of characters and their concepts being better off when used as much as possible unless you're already an A-lister.

I personally subscribe to the basic concept of characters being shown actually using the tropes most closely associated with them within their own books with enough consistency to clearly establish and delineate the overall importance and relevance of said trope to the primary characters raison d'être for existing within the overarching metaplot in the first place. (regardless of whatever end of the alphabetical spectrum they've arbitarily been placed in)

When Doc Oc for example used adamantium in his arms for awhile, they COULD have in theory given Logan a guest spot or even a shout out if they wanted to as Logan is very closely associated with adamantium. But really, Logan gains nothing from the exposure since he's already exposed enough (arguably over exposed). For a character like a Wolverine or a Spider-Man, who appear in multiple books every month anyways, there's generally speaking little to no gain in for them at least in guest spots.

And herein lies the fundamental flaw in your argument.

The proliferation or usage of Adamantium outside of books featuring Wolverine has next to no impact on his origin, character or adventures because for the most part, he appears in a plethora of books both within and outside of the X-universe.

T'Challa on the otherhand (excluding the Original Sin mini) only appears in one title alongside an ensemble cast where the need to expand on the other characters within said ensemble group mean that explorations of tropes more closely associated with his world cannot be explored to any real depth without incurring justifiable raised concerns on the part of fans of some of the other cast members such as Namor and Dr Strange who also do not have solo books within which their own personal stories can be expanded upon and examined in more detail.

But most characters, Black Panther included, aren't a Wolverine or a Spider-Man. So I actually think they benefit when their stuff is out there. Ideally they would benefit more if the character actually shows up, but even if he doesn't I still believe there's a net gain in that it creates a potential story that wasn't there before.

The fact that T'Challa and Wakanda were cast as being "overly dependent on Vibranium" in Doomwar only to have Shuri haring off to the Savage Land in the Klaws of the Panther mini, to procure Antarctic Vibranium (with totally different properties to the Wakandan variety) only served to illustrate just how muddled the approach to the subject was in both of the stories Jonathan Maberry penned back-to-back.

Maberry's intervention in the BP mythos particularly where Vibranium was concerned, did not benefit T'Challa in any way whatsoever but only served as a hindrance to other writers who came after him.

Kelly Sue DeConnick's usage of Vibranium may very well serve as a worthy platform from which a future Black Panther centered adventure could be launched but only time will tell if this happens or not.

Even if Kelly does add Black Panther in this story, maybe she will next time. Or maybe Bendis over in Guardians of the Galaxy will. The possibilities just get wider when stuff like this is introduced.

Kelly Sue DeConnick penning a Black Panther tale featuring Queen Shuri would be something worth reading and I could see myself lending such a book the same level of support I'm currently giving to Captain Marvel.


Bendis, not at all.

[XPac]

Agreed. Kelly Sue could b e lighting the spark that triggers a proper exploration of the Vibranium planet; which can only aid Wakanda's profile. Fingers crossed.

To this day I'm surprised no one bothered doing a story about the exploration of vibranium in space. The stuff debuted in the 1960's. It seemed like an obvious and fun story to do.

I hope this DOES trigger SOMEONE to do a more fleshed out story involving the stuff. In this case the story just needed a hard metal and vibranium fit the bill nicely.

[Panic]

I can well understand BP's fans feeling snubbed and marginalised by this move. I suspect it stems from Marvel wanting to up vibranium's profile as a super-metal as opposed to relying on adamantium, which is now off-limits to them in the movies... and Marvel is all about the movies now. I get that there is no actual reason for BP or Wakanda to be a part of the story, but as a courtesy Black Panther and Wankanda should at least have been name-checked, which I'm guessing didn't happen.

[Dabrikishaw]

You know what, no. As a Jean Grey fan, I can empathize with you guys over the mishandling of a character's prominent lore.

[ed2962]

To this day I'm surprised no one bothered doing a story about the exploration of vibranium in space. The stuff debuted in the 1960's. It seemed like an obvious and fun story to do.

I hope this DOES trigger SOMEONE to do a more fleshed out story involving the stuff. In this case the story just needed a hard metal and vibranium fit the bill nicely.

I think it's cuz while Vibranium could provide the starting point for a couple of neat adventures, it's just not something that many fans had a burning desire to know. "What's Vibranium? Oh, it's metal from a meteor that crashed on Earth years ago...cool! Now when's T'Challa going to fight Killmonger again?"

It's like unstable molecules...we could do a story about Reed Richards discovering them, but is it a big deal if they don't?

[XPac]

I can well understand BP's fans feeling snubbed and marginalised by this move. I suspect it stems from Marvel wanting to up vibranium's profile as a super-metal as opposed to relying on adamantium, which is now off-limits to them in the movies... and Marvel is all about the movies now. I get that there is no actual reason for BP or Wakanda to be a part of the story, but as a courtesy Black Panther and Wankanda should at least have been name-checked, which I'm guessing didn't happen.

That may well be a part of it.

I the movies at least they probably can't use adamantium since it's an X-Men thing, so the uber metal of choice for the movie verse might well be vibranium. So raising the profile of it probably isn't a bad idea. And because vibranium is from space and has no established backstory, it's easy to do.

Again, the alternative might have simply been to create a new metal. Or to establish some sort of space varient of uru maybe (Asgardians are sort of space aliens as Kirby defined them).

[XPac]

I think it's cuz while Vibranium could provide the starting point for a couple of neat adventures, it's just not something that many fans had a burning desire to know. "What's Vibranium? Oh, it's metal from a meteor that crashed on Earth years ago...cool! Now when's T'Challa going to fight Killmonger again?"

It's like unstable molecules...we could do a story about Reed Richards discovering them, but is it a big deal if they don't?

Yeah, you're right in saying that there's no burning desire to know the roots of vibranium. More than anything I guess I thought it was a fun and obvious starting point to tell some sort of story (especially for the various Black Panther titles). But yeah... obviously the issue not being addressed was no big deal.

[XPac]

You know what, no. As a Jean Grey fan, I can empathize with you guys over the mishandling of a character's prominent lore.

I don't think it's fair to say vibranium was mishandled in anyway.

Right from the start it was established that vibranium on earth came from a meteour from space. So establishing that there's more of it in space isn't exactly marvel re-inventing the wheel.

[Dabrikishaw]

Actually, Adamantium is public domain. No one has exclusive rights to it. Nothing's stopping Marvel from using it in their movies legally. The best reason for this widespread use of Vibranium to to hype up a Black Panther movie.

[XPac]

Actually, Adamantium is public domain. No one has exclusive rights to it. Nothing's stopping Marvel from using it in their movies legally. The best reason for this widespread use of Vibranium to to hype up a Black Panther movie.

Good news for Ultron then when the next Avengers movie comes out. Technically he had it first anyways.