Why are DC's minority character's lagging behind Marvel's?

[Killerbee911]

Did you read the post you are quoting in its entirety? I feel that you may not have understood it. Specifically the part about "it shouldn't be a competition." Also may want to check the quotation by the user inferring that publishers should be pushing POCs before any other groups that need representation.
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No you just ran with some twisted version of what you thought I was saying

I am not in charge of Marvel or DC, I am not in charge of making these companies more diverse, and If I was the plan wouldn't instantly make DC half minority characters and put out a mandate that every new character made by a racial minority. What needs to happen and how it should happen are different things. When I come on the internet I talk about what needs to happen, it isn't my job to figure out how things should be implemented fairly and smoothly. Any way which brings me back to what said before there is a reason why racial minorities get more focus on in topic like this one and this post was a longer post me explaining these things but I never said things you thought I was implying so I deleted it why clarify something I never said.

[Alpha]

Am I the only one that feels like Black male superheroes in DC comics have been designed to look like one another since the 90s?

John Henry Irons, John Stewart, Jefferson Pierce, Victor Stone, any actor that plays one of them could play all these different characters without changing much about how he looks, at least as far as how they are designed in comics. They all have the same facial structure, the same hairstyle.

[Alpha]

Mister Terrific has a slimmer face than the rest, and Kaldur has a right angle nose and blonde hair. Jefferson Pierce wearing an Afro at least made him stand out. But it's like Ne-Yo could play any of the others.

[Killerbee911]

Am I the only one that feels like Black male superheroes in DC comics have been designed to look like one another since the 90s?

John Henry Irons, John Stewart, Jefferson Pierce, Victor Stone, any actor that plays one of them could play all these different characters without changing much about how he looks, at least as far as how they are designed in comics. They all have the same facial structure, the same hairstyle.

That is comic book art thing imo not something specific to race in comics, Some artist draws characters as static character swaps the easy example is Psylocke, She was put back in a British body and with some artists, you couldn't tell that she was any different from before. The best thing to happen to characters imo is the movie and tv versions so when an artist draws someone they have a clear reference to use. For example, Captain America, Hawkeye, and Hank Pym all look the same but anyone who sneaks reference at Chris Evans will make him look different.

In a perfect world, you would get Pepe Larraz, Oliver Copiel, Ivan Reis, Steve McNiven, Sara Pichelli, Stuart Immonen, R.B. Silva, Valerio Schiti, etc on books and the consistent similar across styles artist would lead to consistently different looking characters but comic book is a world that has Mike Allred, Joe Mad, Greg Land, Rob Liefeld, Skottie Young, John Romita Jr, etc all drawing and going lead to things looking very different. I would love hard characteristics to stick but just general stuff like hairstyle and skin color is the big concern. But yes it would be nice to see some variance I mean Drake, Will Smith, Anthony Mackie, and Micheal B Jordan have the same haircut in general and look different. It would also be nice to see different body types as well I mean Zendya, Liz Cambage, and Beyonce all are in shape with different body types.

[Jabare]

@Alpha so you're saying DC artists draw most black men the same?

[John Venus]

Yeah, that's also a complex issue. But Talia specifically has been victim of colorism many times, and often times, when she's villainized, she's portrayed with darker skin and, when she's a hero, she has lighter skin.

Whether people consider Damian a POC or not, they should at least acknowledge how DC almost has no Arabic characters and how pretty much all the ones they have have been through racist portrayals and storylines, including him.

I agree. Though DC does have Arab characters they just don't push them like they do the villainous ones like the Al Ghuls or Black Adam (who is more of an anti-hero but still). Even the Al Ghuls seem to have lost their nuance in recent years. Ras started out as an extreme environmentalist who preserved rare and extinct animals and wanted to wipe out humanity. He was a doctor when he was younger and he diagnosed humanity as the disease. Some stories would end with Batman wondering if Ras was correct. Nowadays the League of Assassins is used to facilitate ninja fights.

Well, it's not like they've been very consistent with Talia either. She's usually shown as no darker then Bruce is... why would Damian?

The way Adams drew back then you could tell she was mixed Arab/Chinese descent. She wouldn't look out of place in the streets of Indonesia or Malaysia.

[Confuzzled]

There's not much variation in hair among the black women superheroines either, coz it's either just curly or straight. I think it's a mix of subconscious bias regarding how black people "should wear their hair" and a lack of awareness of diverse hair types and styles.

Not surprising that Static, one of the very few characters to be created by an all-black team, is the only one to buck this trend.

[Alpha]

Yes. Jace Fox/ Tim Fox is another recent exception. He has been drawn with a more predominant jawline, cheekbones, and forehead.

And yes, it's true that there are recocurring molds for white heroes, but Hawkeye and Steve Trevor have definitely been drawn differently for quite a while. Anyway, the problem I have with it when it comes to these black Super-Heroes is that there aren't as many, so if you draw them all in the same mold it makes them feel less unique. And yes, even their body type is the same.

[Alpha]

There's not much variation in hair among the black women superheroines either, coz it's either just curly or straight. I think it's a mix of subconscious bias regarding how black people "should wear their hair" and a lack of awareness of diverse hair types and styles.

Not surprising that Static, one of the very few characters to be created by an all-black team, is the only one to buck this trend.

Not entirely true. That photo I posted showed at least 7 different hairstyles for black women, and all in all, Vixen looks very different from Nubia. It could still be better, but it's more diverse than with black men.

[Sutekh]

Not surprising that Static, one of the very few characters to be created by an all-black team, is the only one to buck this trend.

I have noticed that Static does seem to be the only black male who doesn't go for the shaved head / crewcut / fade look. More big hair or dreds or braids or cornrows would indeed mix things up nicely (although, granted, for some, like John Stewart or Cyborg, short or no hair is pretty much their default, and I wouldn't want to see them go all Painkiller with the long braids...).

But Black Lightning? He used to have hair. And now he has the 'generic black guy' cut. (Marvel does the same thing. Luke Cage used to have hair, but he's also shaved it all off.)

Thus it's a shame that the call for more diversity comes at a time when the industry and titles are in decline, so I think multimedia is the way to go. Vibe actually became popular through the Flash tv show, DC just has to figure out how to harness that popularity into their comics.

Ooh, Vibe. Good example. He's has way more success on the TV than he ever did as a 'Detroit Leaguer.'

Sadly it hasn't really carried over to the comics. I'd love for someone like Cisco or Kaldur/Jackson or Tye Longshadow or Artemis Crock to get some of that Harley Quinn magic where they jump from the screen to the page really successfully.

[Captain Nostalgia]

Ooh, Vibe. Good example. He's has way more success on the TV than he ever did as a 'Detroit Leaguer.'

Sadly it hasn't really carried over to the comics. I'd love for someone like Cisco or Kaldur/Jackson or Tye Longshadow or Artemis Crock to get some of that Harley Quinn magic where they jump from the screen to the page really successfully.

I don't think DC has done the best job of co-ordinating multimedia success with comics.

The Black Lightning mini series came out before the tv show became popular, and while Vibe was on the Flash tv show, I don't recall him popping up anywhere, but alas, perhaps it's easier said than done (Harley's BOP comic flop comes to mind)

[4sake Baned]

Am I the only one that feels like Black male superheroes in DC comics have been designed to look like one another since the 90s?

John Henry Irons, John Stewart, Jefferson Pierce, Victor Stone, any actor that plays one of them could play all these different characters without changing much about how he looks, at least as far as how they are designed in comics. They all have the same facial structure, the same hairstyle.

I’d like to see something like this :


John H Steel - model after Malcolm-Jamal Warner
Long Locs, 6’1-6’3


John GL model after Shamier Anderson
6’0/6’1 Facial hair/ light beard & hair cut/low-mid fade
(future end look) or 6’0/6’1 Facial hair or light beard (future state look)


Jeff - model after Cress Williams & Terrence C. Carson/Kyle Barker 6’5, full beard, short locs

Vic - model after Joivan Wade & Stephan James ( in 21 bridges) , 6’6-6’9 light goatee

Michael - 6’2-6’3 model Isaiah Mustafa & Nate Parker, low-mid fade. Mustache or little no facial hair

Duke- 5’7-5’8, model after John Boyega in attack the block , mid-long locs , (Futures End look)

Wallace - High high top fade with part in design, model after Franz Drameh. 5’9-5’10

Luke - model after Trevor Jackson 6’1-6’3, Full beard, Braids on top fade on the side

Jace - model after Trai Byers 5’10-5’11 light facial hair/mustache & low hair cut

[Alpha]

John H Steel - model after Malcolm-Jamal Warner
Long Locs, 6’1-6’3

I like this exercise of giving specific faces for each character, but that's very different from how John Henry Irons has been depicted until now. Why him specifically (altough I do love that actor)

John GL model after Shamier Anderson
6’0/6’1 Facial hair/ light beard & hair cut/low-mid fade
(future end look) or 6’0/6’1 Facial hair or light beard (future state look)

Isaiah Mustafa would be a great model for John Stewart. It merges the 70s design with the more modern looks. It's the kind of guy that looks like an actual architect, is good looking without seeming like women are constantly throwing themselves at him, and seems like he has a steady hand for leadership while being able to express revolt, smoothness and regret. It could go a long way towards making him stand out from the other guys mentioned.

Jeff - model after Cress Williams & Terrence C. Carson/Kyle Barker 6’5, full beard, short locs

All those guys look very different from each other. You should pick one.

Michael - 6’2-6’3 model Isaiah Mustafa & Nate Parker, low-mid fade. Mustache or little no facial hair

Nate Parker for Mister Terrific is a great pick. Maintains this slimmer facial feature and rectangular facial structure.

Wallace - High high top fade with part in design, model after Franz Drameh. 5’9-5’10

I like the guy that played Wally on CW better. He has more round features that make him kind of adorable

Jace - model after Trai Byers 5’10-5’11 light facial hair/mustache & low hair cut

Nah Jace already has a good distinctive look in Infinite Frontier. Strong jawline and cheekbones along with this really intense forehead that gives him a permanent Kubrick Gaze.

[abetterday]

Because texture differentiates Black mens hair from others it's hard to convey that in a reproduction illustration. But I thought that Chris Cross did a great Job with Jason Rusch Firestorm (2004). I once did fan art of an elseworldjason.jpg Cyborg from Rwanda using an Amasunzu hairstyle. I think that the the inker could be the designated person to bring a sense of texture to hair for Black characters in comics.

[BlueRuggo]

The perceived uniformity of black hair in comics isn't due to a rejection of diverse hairstyles. Rather, as the above poster is stating, it is due to difficulty translating the texture of different styles of black hair into the artwork itself. Add that to the fact that, collectively, blacks tend to have a very limited range of natural hair colors in contrast to whites, and you end up with a group of characters whose appearances have a lot of superficial similarities when illustrated.

The emphasis has always been on hairstyles that are popular and considered in-style at the time, and that holds true for characters of all races and genders.