The long road to KNIGHTFALL: the fall was longer than most think

[Buried Alien]

I'm still really curious about this narrative of fan reaction. Are there any archives or articles or reviews that help shape the narrative, or is it all experiential?

The Internet was *just* getting underway as KNIGHTFALL was unfolding, and was still two years away from being in common usage, so it's difficult to get a gauge on what wide public response to Azrael was. Among my circle of friends, we thought the Azrael/Jean Paul Valley character was cool, and liked the look of the Azrael Batman armored suit, but at the same time, we also knew that we did not want AzBats to permanently replace the traditional Bruce Wayne Batman.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[AzraelOnline]

I'm still really curious about this narrative of fan reaction. Are there any archives or articles or reviews that help shape the narrative, or is it all experiential?

I've typed up a good number of interviews you can read here from my archives of back issues. This should give you pretty decent insight straight from the people working on the books at that time.

The Internet was *just* getting underway as KNIGHTFALL was unfolding, and was still two years away from being in common usage, so it's difficult to get a gauge on what wide public response to Azrael was. Among my circle of friends, we thought the Azrael/Jean Paul Valley character was cool, and liked the look of the Azrael Batman armored suit, but at the same time, we also knew that we did not want AzBats to permanently replace the traditional Bruce Wayne Batman.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I can just say as a reader who was around back then (if only more of us would come out of the woodwork here) I never heard any negativity about Azrael, or the character as Batman. I think if you even look at back issues of trades from back then the general consensus was very positive to JPV as Batman among fans. I always heard good things from other readers and people at shops in my state (Florida), as well as at conventions (though back then they weren't very big in my state).
It really seems to just be the bloggers here at CBR who hate the character and, from the looks of it EVERYTHING about the 90's in general.

[SicariiDC]

Indeed they were not written in that matter. They were supposed to be non canon stories. But was Knightfall even in some minds at the time of those stories? I don't think so. But you can cleary see The Killing Joke as a prelude to Sword of Azreal because it is the first arc where Barbara Gordon plays a big part as Oracle. So doing that Denis O'Neil made events of the Killing Joke canon.

If you look at modern Batman (1986-on), he is always in situations where he gets broken down. Up to a point where he can't take it anymore and really breaks. Look at Knightfall, look at No Man's Land (he want's to save the city on his own but finally relises he needs help), look at RIP, look at Endgame.

I see Knightfall as a part of a much larger arc that goes as follows:
(Killing Joke)
Vengence of Bane
Sword of Azrael
Knightfall
Knightquest
KnightsEnd
Prodigual
Troika
Contagion
Legacy
Cataclysm
Aftershock
No Man's Land
New Gotham
Batman fugitive
Batman murderer

This is how I tend to look at it too

[SicariiDC]

I've typed up a good number of interviews you can read here from my archives of back issues. This should give you pretty decent insight straight from the people working on the books at that time.



I can just say as a reader who was around back then (if only more of us would come out of the woodwork here) I never heard any negativity about Azrael, or the character as Batman. I think if you even look at back issues of trades from back then the general consensus was very positive to JPV as Batman among fans. I always heard good things from other readers and people at shops in my state (Florida), as well as at conventions (though back then they weren't very big in my state).
It really seems to just be the bloggers here at CBR who hate the character and, from the looks of it EVERYTHING about the 90's in general.

The previews world Denny O'Neil interview was cool, thanks

[jb681131]

I can just say as a reader who was around back then (if only more of us would come out of the woodwork here) I never heard any negativity about Azrael, or the character as Batman. I think if you even look at back issues of trades from back then the general consensus was very positive to JPV as Batman among fans. I always heard good things from other readers and people at shops in my state (Florida), as well as at conventions (though back then they weren't very big in my state).
It really seems to just be the bloggers here at CBR who hate the character and, from the looks of it EVERYTHING about the 90's in general.

Well in the 90's the comics industry was in a crisis. Sales for Marvel and DC were low. They didn't have much readers. This means lots of people quit reading because they were fed up with Batman. The few that remained of course liked it, else they wouldn't be reading.

[Aioros22]

Indeed they were not written in that matter. They were supposed to be non canon stories. But was Knightfall even in some minds at the time of those stories? I don't think so. But you can cleary see The Killing Joke as a prelude to Sword of Azreal because it is the first arc where Barbara Gordon plays a big part as Oracle. So doing that Denis O'Neil made events of the Killing Joke canon.

If you look at modern Batman (1986-on), he is always in situations where he gets broken down. Up to a point where he can't take it anymore and really breaks. Look at Knightfall, look at No Man's Land (he want's to save the city on his own but finally relises he needs help), look at RIP, look at Endgame.

I see Knightfall as a part of a much larger arc that goes as follows:
(Killing Joke)
Vengence of Bane
Sword of Azrael
Knightfall
Knightquest
KnightsEnd
Prodigual
Troika
Contagion
Legacy
Cataclysm
Aftershock
No Man's Land
New Gotham
Batman fugitive
Batman murderer

We all know Moore didn`t intended KJ to be the origin of anything especific but that story and The Cult were certainly referenced as and in canon. The Cult had a small fallout in Waid (or was it Mike Baron) Flash when Wally was still learning to live up with the mantle.