New Outsiders

[Mutant God]

John Constatine
Azrael
Vigilante
Phantom Stranger
Freight Train
Nyssa Raatko
Atomic Knight
Fetish

[Outside_85]

It's funny because I was going to post a thread about a new Outsiders Team since none of the originals and well-known members are unavailable, I was thinking that for the Teen Titans, Damian needs his own generation, so what I would do is that the TT would consist of him, Aqualad, Kid Flash, Red Arrow, Wonder Woman's half-sister (the one that can manipulate sand or something) and Superboy (if he joins, mostly an ally) while Starfire, Beast Boy and Raven can form into a new Outsiders team with an addition of two more members (maybe Looker and Halo).

I was thinking of something along the same lines.
It's clear the old members of the Teen Titans, like Starfire, Raven, Beastboy and such, are not going to get anything in terms of fair due on that book. They are just there to legitimize the current team as a Teen Titans team, while focus and development is usually on the latest additions.
So why not move them off to something like Outsiders where they get to be something new and hopefully not end up as wallpaper?

That said, I think I might prefer an all new team and name, due to the Outsiders being long established... so I get that moving a bunch of old TT characters into the clubhouse is kinda like seeing the Justice League take up the Justice Society name.

[Factor]

I agree the classic NTT are not getting their due in Teen Titans, but I think they should be moved to Titans instead of Outsiders. Sure, the Titans cast would get a little bigger, but 10 is actually an okay number and they could go biweekly under a better creative team and I think the book would be just fine.
I don't want Outsiders to be just another Titans or Young Justice book. The team already has its own mythology and classic members, no need to import from much from other teams. I'd rather have proper versions of all teams coexisting.

OUTSIDERS: Katana, Black Lightning, Metamorpho, Geo-Force, Grace, Looker and Bronze Tiger.
TITANS: Nightwing, Donna, Wally, Arsenal, Bumbleebe, Tempest, Omen, Raven, Starfire, Beast Boy and Raven.
YOUNG JUSTICE: Tim Drake, Kon-El, Wonder Girl, Impulse, Aqualad, Ms Martian and Empress.
SUPER SONS: Damian and Jon + Circe's daughter, Kid Wally and Emiko as supporting cast.

+ maybe a fresh new Teen Titans: Power Girl (Tanya), Blue Beetle, Traci 13, Bunker, Pre-Flashpoint Solstice, Ravager, Kid Devil and Amethyst. (Basically a collection of mostly independent teen heroes with solo potential).

[Outside_85]

I agree the classic NTT are not getting their due in Teen Titans, but I think they should be moved to Titans instead of Outsiders. Sure, the Titans cast would get a little bigger, but 10 is actually an okay number and they could go biweekly under a better creative team and I think the book would be just fine.
I don't want Outsiders to be just another Titans or Young Justice book. The team already has its own mythology and classic members, no need to import from much from other teams. I'd rather have proper versions of all teams coexisting.

OUTSIDERS: Katana, Black Lightning, Metamorpho, Geo-Force, Grace, Looker and Bronze Tiger.
TITANS: Nightwing, Donna, Wally, Arsenal, Bumbleebe, Tempest, Omen, Raven, Starfire, Beast Boy and Raven.
YOUNG JUSTICE: Tim Drake, Kon-El, Wonder Girl, Impulse, Aqualad, Ms Martian and Empress.
SUPER SONS: Damian and Jon + Circe's daughter, Kid Wally and Emiko as supporting cast.

+ maybe a fresh new Teen Titans: Power Girl (Tanya), Blue Beetle, Traci 13, Bunker, Pre-Flashpoint Solstice, Ravager, Kid Devil and Amethyst. (Basically a collection of mostly independent teen heroes with solo potential).

Not sure if Titans needs more members, Dan appears to struggle already to give the current group equal time as it is.
But while your suggestions are sound... save there being 2 Raven's on Titans , I was wondering if we couldn't have the classic Outsiders you suggested and have the Nightwing/Arsenal-type of team running alongside it under another name. Like you have the public face in Titans, and you have the shadier 'Outsiders' like team in the background.

[HandofPrometheus]

I agree the classic NTT are not getting their due in Teen Titans, but I think they should be moved to Titans instead of Outsiders. Sure, the Titans cast would get a little bigger, but 10 is actually an okay number and they could go biweekly under a better creative team and I think the book would be just fine.
I don't want Outsiders to be just another Titans or Young Justice book. The team already has its own mythology and classic members, no need to import from much from other teams. I'd rather have proper versions of all teams coexisting.

OUTSIDERS: Katana, Black Lightning, Metamorpho, Geo-Force, Grace, Looker and Bronze Tiger.
TITANS: Nightwing, Donna, Wally, Arsenal, Bumbleebe, Tempest, Omen, Raven, Starfire, Beast Boy and Raven.
YOUNG JUSTICE: Tim Drake, Kon-El, Wonder Girl, Impulse, Aqualad, Ms Martian and Empress.
SUPER SONS: Damian and Jon + Circe's daughter, Kid Wally and Emiko as supporting cast.

+ maybe a fresh new Teen Titans: Power Girl (Tanya), Blue Beetle, Traci 13, Bunker, Pre-Flashpoint Solstice, Ravager, Kid Devil and Amethyst. (Basically a collection of mostly independent teen heroes with solo potential).

Agree with all of this. Bronze Tiger on Outsiders would be so nice.

[SmokeMonster]

Green Arrow
White Canary
Black Lightning
Element Woman
Midnighter

They would be Batman's secret squad of unofficial JL members to do things the JL publicly can't.

The book would be fairly gritty, dealing with street crime, like DC's version of the Defenders.

[Thor-Ul]

Green Arrow
White Canary
Black Lightning
Element Woman
Midnighter

They would be Batman's secret squad of unofficial JL members to do things the JL publicly can't.

The book would be fairly gritty, dealing with street crime, like DC's version of the Defenders.

I could dig this team.

[Thor-Ul]

DETECTIVE COMICS #982
Written by BRYAN HILL • Art by MIGUEL MENDONÇA • Cover by EDDY BARROWS • Variant cover by MARK BROOKS
“On the Outside” part one! Duke Thomas. Cassandra Cain. They and other young heroes don’t intend to stand down, no matter what Batman thinks is best. Who can Batman trust to guide them? They need a teacher…and Black Lightning fits the bill!
On sale JUNE 13 • 32 pg, FC, $2.99 US • RATED T

DETECTIVE COMICS #983
Written by BRYAN HILL • Art by MIGUEL MENDONÇA • Cover by EDDY BARROWS • Variant cover by MARK BROOKS
“On the Outside” part two! Batman wanted Black Lightning involved in the lives of his protégés—but how involved was the Dark Knight thinking? What kind of missions will Jefferson Pierce take them on? And what, exactly, is he whispering in their ears about Batman himself?
On sale JUNE 27 • 32 pg, FC, $2.99 US • RATED T

Maybe the hint of things to come?

[chief12d]

Maybe the hint of things to come?

Didn't the writer or someone he's working with all but confirm that yesterday? I'd have to look it up, but it looks like we're getting an Outsiders book featuring at least Black Lightning, Cass, and Duke.

I honestly don't know if I'm crazy about the Outsiders becoming an extension of the Bat-books, even though they've always towed that line. Cass is being done major disservice in the franchise and Duke isn't exactly a star player either, but the Outsiders should get a lineup that doesn't consist of too many underutilized Bat-characters. I'm all for a mixed classic lineup and the inclusion of characters in the broader DCU that need spotlight like Bronze Tiger. But I guess it depends on the size of the team.

[Assam]

Didn't the writer or someone he's working with all but confirm that yesterday? I'd have to look it up, but it looks like we're getting an Outsiders book featuring at least Black Lightning, Cass, and Duke.

I saw what you're referring to and yeah, it's definitely looking likely.

I honestly don't know if I'm crazy about the Outsiders becoming an extension of the Bat-books, even though they've always towed that line.

The original book was called Batman and the Outsiders and there's almost always been at least one Bat character on the team. This wouldn't even be the first time more than one Bat was present.

Cass is being done major disservice in the franchise

That depends on how the Bat franchise treats her once she's on this team.

I'm all for a mixed classic lineup and the inclusion of characters in the broader DCU that need spotlight like Bronze Tiger. But I guess it depends on the size of the team.

Agree with all of this. Bronze Tiger on Outsiders would be so nice.

Neat that I'm not the only one who really wants to see Ben on this team.

Personally I don't want there to be more than 7 team members. Some writers are capable of juggling more (Tynion wasn't even really capable of juggling six at any given time) but while I trust Hill a lot, I've also never seen him on a team book.

[Raijin]

I can't see myself being a fan of Black Lightning training Bruce`s sidekicks. Let Luke Fox do that. Black Lightning should be his own man and The Outsiders should be his own thing as well.

[Assam]

Let Luke Fox do that.

Umm, what? Don't follow your train of thought there. And speaking of trains, Luke is probably on a one way train to limbo after 'Tec.

Black Lightning should be his own man and The Outsiders should be his own thing as well.

The Outsiders was not originally its own thing though. It isn't as if it was its own franchise that Batman took over. Having two Bat characters (we have no reason to believe any other BatFam members save possibly Bruce will be on this team) doesn't take away Jefferson being his own man, especially if he's the one calling the shots.

[Raijin]

Umm, what? Don't follow your train of thought there. And speaking of trains, Luke is probably on a one way train to limbo after 'Tec.



The Outsiders was not originally its own thing though. It isn't as if it was its own franchise that Batman took over. Having two Bat characters (we have no reason to believe any other BatFam members save possibly Bruce will be on this team) doesn't take away Jefferson being his own man, especially if he's the one calling the shots.

You don't follow my train of thought? I thought it was straightforward. Guess not. It makes sense for a character within the Batfam to train people like Cass and Duke. Luke was a name I just thought of first. It's not a big deal.

And i don't really care what The Outsiders originally were, no offense. Things in the comics change all the time. DC seems like they want to push Black Lightning and I welcome that. But giving him Batman`s former team along with his sidekicks isn't for me. It may work for others and that's okay. Not trying to argue.

[Assam]

You don't follow my train of thought because it went over your head, I guess.

Wow, seriously?

It makes sense for a character within the Batfam to train people like Cass and Duke. Luke was a name I just thought of first.

These characters aren't interchangeable. Luke could tutor them, but that's really all he'd have to offer, especially in Cass's case. Not to mention we have no idea if he's even going to be on good terms again with the BatFamily by the time 'Tec ends.

Plus, the training set-up is likely just for this arc. Once the Outsiders book spins out of it and we get more characters, it'd likely switch to a more standard leader/ teammates dynamic.

And i don't really care what The Outsiders originally were, no offense. Things in the comics change all the time. DC seems like they want to push Black Lightning and I welcome that. But giving him Batman`s former team along with his sidekicks isn't for me. It may work for others and that's okay. Not trying to argue.

If your problem is just that you'd rather Jefferson have his own ongoing, well, unless his trades sell AMAZING, that just isn't in the cards given the performance of his mini.

[Raijin]

Wow, seriously?



These characters aren't interchangeable. Luke could tutor them, but that's really all he'd have to offer, especially in Cass's case. Not to mention we have no idea if he's even going to be on good terms again with the BatFamily by the time 'Tec ends.

Plus, the training set-up is likely just for this arc. Once the Outsiders book spins out of it and we get more characters, it'd likely switch to a more standard leader/ teammates dynamic.



None of this is random though. Jefferson was a founding member of the Outsiders, one of his kids having been on the team as well. Cass has also been on the team before, as have multiple other Bat characters. They, along with whoever else ends up on the team, are who DC and/or Hill wants here.

If your problem is just that you'd rather Jefferson have his own ongoing, well, unless his trades sell AMAZING, that just isn't in the cards given the performance of his mini.

I really don't think you're getting it. But we can leave it at that though. I love Black Lightning and I`m curious to see where it goes. Even if I don't agree with him training Batkids. Very good titles you read by the way.