How did YOU like Zack Snyder's Justice League? (NO SPOILERS-Vote after watching)

[Ilan Preskovsky]

I would've loved to watch a Justice League film directed by Zack Snyder, but it wasn't to be.

And yet I would have loved a Justice League film directed by Joss Whedon. Neither of us got our wish.

[SXVA]

Lol, you say the DCEU fans are spoiled because they don't like the new tone, and direction, yet in the same post complained about how MoS, and BvS, didn't depict Superman how he "should be", and how you would've wrote it off if it didn't change. Sounds the same, to me.

Also, people are complaining because this Whedon Cut is chopped up, has bad CGI (due to the lighting, and the new setting of the end fight), has awkward tonal changes, and is very thin on plot.

I'm a fan of MoS, and BvS:UE. I also enjoyed WW. However, after 4 viewings of JL, I've come down from my initial excitement, and have decided that the film is just....fine.

I simply didn't like it and accepted that and avoided things involving those movies and instead focused on other stuff i did like. If it came up in situations i was in and asked about it i might express myself on the matter but i wasn't on social media attacking people and complaining about it all day or going into discussions about the movie and tearing it down/i was simply hoping and waiting for a change. By comparison i've seen so much negative attacking and tearing down and vitriol from DC fans and Snyder supporters toward DC/Whedon/Johns/WB, etc. I would refer to that as spoiled based on what i've seen. If they really did enjoy Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman then they were able to experience two massive franchise movies that they enjoyed but not everyone else seen and experienced these movies in the same way. I would've loved to enjoy these movies but found them to be extremely disappointing.

There's a long and deep history of the Superman character. Yes, there is a "should be" applied when you're talking about a mainstream franchise movie with the character. Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman is the most mishandled and misinterpreted Superman i've ever seen outside of fan fiction. That might be okay with a niche less mainstream graphic novel but not the comic book superhero main franchise movies. There's also a long history and precedent for comic books and superheroes within comic books in various things like style/tone, etc. These aren't stand alone original movies. They are mainstream franchise superhero movies based on characters from comic books. Marvel gets that and it's why they've found so much success and connected with such a variety of people from young to old. DC is now starting to move in that direction as well, i read something recently regarding Cavil stating that after Justice League it's time to tell a Superman story that's closer to the comics and he's excited to play a Superman from the comics. And for some like myself, i share in that excitement.

[Lightning Rider]

I simply didn't like it and accepted that and avoided things involving those movies and instead focused on other stuff i did like. If it came up in situations i was in and asked about it i might express myself on the matter but i wasn't on social media attacking people and complaining about it all day or going into discussions about the movie and tearing it down/i was simply hoping and waiting for a change. By comparison i've seen so much negative attacking and tearing down and vitriol from DC fans and Snyder supporters toward DC/Whedon/Johns/WB, etc. I would refer to that as spoiled based on what i've seen. If they really did enjoy Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman then they were able to experience two massive franchise movies that they enjoyed but not everyone else seen and experienced these movies in the same way. I would've loved to enjoy these movies but found them to be extremely disappointing.

There's a long and deep history of the Superman character. Yes, there is a "should be" applied when you're talking about a mainstream franchise movie with the character. Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman is the most mishandled and misinterpreted Superman i've ever seen outside of fan fiction. That might be okay with a niche less mainstream graphic novel but not the comic book superhero main franchise movies. There's also a long history and precedent for comic books and superheroes within comic books. These aren't stand alone original movies. They are mainstream franchise superhero movies based on characters from comic books. Marvel gets that and it's why they've found so much success and connected with such a variety of people from young to old. DC is now starting to move in that direction as well, i read something recently regarding Cavil stating that after Justice League it's time to tell a Superman story that's closer to the comics and he's excited to play a Superman from the comics. And for some like myself, i share in that excitement.

The thing is "Superman from the comics" in many many classic stories behaves and experiences the same things that MoS and BvS Superman does. It's not some weird individual alternate take, though it is one different to what casuals have been exposed to in mainstream media. I can respect someone not preferring it, but I don't like fans calling it inaccurate.

[SXVA]

The thing is "Superman from the comics" in many many classic stories behaves and experiences the same things that MoS and BvS Superman does. It's not some weird individual alternate take, though it is one different to what casuals have been exposed to in mainstream media. I can respect someone not preferring it, but I don't like fans calling it inaccurate.

I'm mainly referring to style and tone not necessarily behavior.

Superman is for the most part the greatest hope in comics, for those familiar with Superman comics can we at least agree with this point on the matter? The Man of Tomorrow, the hope for a better future, the one you can count on when all else fails, etc.

Within this is a bright, lighter style/tone in relationship to hope and this is seen throughout the history of the character in the mainstream. There might be some deviation in less mainstream graphic novels or there might be a story arc here and there that takes a turn off the path like Superman's death but it eventually comes back to this constant. It is in a series format and so there can be moments, a story arc here and there where it doesn't always follow this style/tone/vision but for a time and then it always goes back to that.

Snyder's style and tone in his movies including Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman is more similar to graphic novels from people like Miller and Moore and they are dark and brooding and hopeless and is targeted more at people who desire a different style/tone to comic books that's serious and darker.. The antithesis to Superman comics as aforementioned. Yes, to put your biggest mainstream comic book superhero movies to this theme and in within this style/tone is completely inaccurate and misrepresented.

From various things i've seen on Justice League and from what Cavil has stated moving toward the future it would seem that DC and the powers that be are attempting to move things back toward comic books, lighthearted adventures, hope, brighter, fun, etc... And regarding their biggest mainstream franchise movies i'd agree with this decision fully and support it.

For those who prefer a more serious/darker vision i realize that sucks for them but these are mainstream comic book superhero movies after all. How can anyone expect differently. I can't even believe something like Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman was even made in the first place. I believe that's a testament to the Superman character and the influence and popularity that even that was able to find a place.

[manofsteel1979]

Honestly the only Whedon stuff in JL I liked was most of the Superman stuff he did. ( Aside from the " thirstiest Woman" line with Martha and the " you smell good " and " itchy" lines which got some groans in the theater when I watched it again on Monday.) The rest...Meh.

I don't mind some of the humor and I like that Kal is smiling more and less dour, but I think Supes general arc in JL was going to be largely the same if Snyder got to finish the movie. Most of the JL vs Superman stuff,The last Bruce and Clark scene on the farm and the shirt rip at the end was all Snyder.

[SXVA]

Honestly the only Whedon stuff in JL I liked was most of the Superman stuff he did. ( Aside from the " thirstiest Woman" line with Martha and the " you smell good " and " itchy" lines which got some groans in the theater when I watched it again on Monday.) The rest...Meh.

I don't mind some of the humor and I like that Kal is smiling more and less dour, but I think Supes general arc in JL was going to be largely the same if Snyder got to finish the movie. Most of the JL vs Superman stuff,The last Bruce and Clark scene on the farm and the shirt rip at the end was all Snyder.

Oh really?

"Superman’s return is at the center of Justice League and, evidently, the core of the reshoots. Put simply, all of Henry Cavill in Justice League (except for possibly two shots) is from Whedon." / "barely any of Zack Snyder’s Superman is in Justice League"

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...yder-whedon/2/

Not only that but Batman was originally going to be suicidal and Superman was going to have a much darker style/tone the same as Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman. Do you think Snyder was just going to change things up from his previous work?

The funny thing to me is a lot of people are hating on Whedon from social media but some of their favorite lines and moments of the movie that they call out as what they liked was probably from Joss. Then you have people hating on DC/Johns/Whedon for how they changed the movie but in the next paragraph saying they had fun with the movie which is pretty much the mission statement of change for the movie. If they had fun then it was a pretty much a success.

[TooFlyToFail]

I'm mainly referring to style and tone not necessarily behavior.

Superman is for the most part the greatest hope in comics, for those familiar with Superman comics can we at least agree with this point on the matter? The Man of Tomorrow, the hope for a better future, the one you can count on when all else fails, etc.

Within this is a bright, lighter style/tone in relationship to hope and this is seen throughout the history of the character in the mainstream. There might be some deviation in less mainstream graphic novels or there might be a story arc here and there that takes a turn off the path like Superman's death but it eventually comes back to this constant. It is in a series format and so there can be moments, a story arc here and there where it doesn't always follow this style/tone/vision but for a time and then it always goes back to that.

Snyder's style and tone in his movies including Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman is more similar to graphic novels from people like Miller and Moore and they are dark and brooding and hopeless and is targeted more at people who desire a different style/tone to comic books that's serious and darker.. The antithesis to Superman comics as aforementioned. Yes, to put your biggest mainstream comic book superhero movies to this theme and in within this style/tone is completely inaccurate and misrepresented.

From various things i've seen on Justice League and from what Cavil has stated moving toward the future it would seem that DC and the powers that be are attempting to move things back toward comic books, lighthearted adventures, hope, brighter, fun, etc... And regarding their biggest mainstream franchise movies i'd agree with this decision fully and support it.

For those who prefer a more serious/darker vision i realize that sucks for them but these are mainstream comic book superhero movies after all. How can anyone expect differently. I can't even believe something like Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman was even made in the first place. I believe that's a testament to the Superman character and the influence and popularity that even that was able to find a place.

It was hopeless? The whole point was to build up to the hope, and light. You talk about the MoS, and BvS, fans but you sound just as entitled.

[TooFlyToFail]

Oh really?

"Superman’s return is at the center of Justice League and, evidently, the core of the reshoots. Put simply, all of Henry Cavill in Justice League (except for possibly two shots) is from Whedon." / "barely any of Zack Snyder’s Superman is in Justice League"

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...yder-whedon/2/

Not only that but Batman was originally going to be suicidal and Superman was going to have a much darker style/tone the same as Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman. Do you think Snyder was just going to change things up from his previous work?

The funny thing to me is a lot of people are hating on Whedon from social media but some of their favorite lines and moments of the movie that they call out as what they liked was probably from Joss. Then you have people hating on DC/Johns/Whedon for how they changed the movie but in the next paragraph saying they had fun with the movie which is pretty much the mission statement of change for the movie. If they had fun then it was a pretty much a success.

Dude if you watch the movie, you can tell which Superman scenes Zack filmed. All the farm scenes, and the Supes resurrection scene, minus the last Batman part.

[SXVA]

It was hopeless? The whole point was to build up to the hope, and light. You talk about the MoS, and BvS, fans but you sound just as entitled.

Or, since you enjoy those movies you might be too close to see what i'm saying. Superman IS hope.

We clearly have very different ways of looking at this whole situation. If you enjoyed those movies fair enough and too each their own. I'm excited for a potentially new direction.

[TooFlyToFail]

Or, since you enjoy those movies you might be too close to see what i'm saying. Superman IS hope.

We clearly have very different ways of looking at this whole situation. If you enjoyed those movies fair enough and too each their own. I'm excited for a potentially new direction.

I agree. Superman is hope. The difference is that I feel Superman learning that about himself through hardship, and having every reason not to, but still carrying that cross/burden, allows that hope to resonate more, and have more weight.

Him simply being good because his daddy taught him to, and was the perfect dad, is the easy, basic way. MLK, for instance, is still respected despite his flaws as a man, so why can't Superman?

The biggest problem with this Superman was that his arc wasn't allowed to finish properly through a trilogy, like originally planned. I think the trilogy should've been MoS, MoS2, and then BvS, with JL being a continuation of the overall DCEU story.

[SXVA]

I agree. Superman is hope. The difference is that I feel Superman learning that about himself through hardship, and having every reason not to, but still carrying that cross/burden, allows that hope to resonate more, and have more weight.

Him simply being good because his daddy taught him to, and was the perfect dad, is the easy, basic way. MLK, for instance, is still respected despite his flaws as a man, so why can't Superman?

The biggest problem with this Superman was that his arc wasn't allowed to finish properly through a trilogy, like originally planned. I think the trilogy should've been MoS, MoS2, and then BvS, with JL being a continuation of the overall DCEU story.

What you described as sort of a personal journey and character growth i don't take issue with. Again, my main issue with Snyder's work is style and tone not fitting mainstream comic book superheroes and characters like Superman in particular..

With Superman i feel a brighter/lighter tone and style is a necessary vision to represent and capture this spirit of hope and the years of precedent/history. That doesn't mean he can't go on a personal journey or experience some adversity. The tone/style/ambience/atmosphere is extremely important and if we both agree that Superman is hope than i feel strongly this should be represented and approached as such and that's not what i experienced or seen at all in those previous movies. The style/tone/atmosphere/presentation was dark. broody, grim and hopeless to me and for that reason is why i state that is one of the worst representations of Superman i've seen.

Keep in mind that these movies are the main (stream) comic book super hero franchise movies for DC with some of their biggest and most popular characters. That is why i'm so unwavering about it. If it was a less mainstream side graphic novel or a less mainstream side movie i wouldn't take too much of an issue with such a representation, however... we are talking about the biggest mainstream Superman comic book movies.

I'm not calling Snyder a bad director, i don't have much issues with his other films outside of the DCEU. My only issue with Snyder leading these big franchise movies is that i don't feel his style and tone and presentation is a good representation for some of these characters. A Batman solo movie, a Justice League Dark movie, maybe even an Orion movie exploring the New Gods, etc i might very well enjoy.

...but again, we seem to be of two different minds here and how we are interpreting and experiencing and seeing this. I'm glad that you and others were able to find something they connected with and enjoyed in those movies but i'm also glad and excited that i'm going to be able to start enjoying DC movies and be excited about them with the current direction they appear to be going in with Wonder Woman, changes to Justice League and moving toward a Flash/Aquaman movie that potentially might share a similar vision to this.

[manofsteel1979]

Oh really?

"Superman’s return is at the center of Justice League and, evidently, the core of the reshoots. Put simply, all of Henry Cavill in Justice League (except for possibly two shots) is from Whedon." / "barely any of Zack Snyder’s Superman is in Justice League"

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...yder-whedon/2/

Not only that but Batman was originally going to be suicidal and Superman was going to have a much darker style/tone the same as Man of Steel/Batman vs Superman. Do you think Snyder was just going to change things up from his previous work?

The funny thing to me is a lot of people are hating on Whedon from social media but some of their favorite lines and moments of the movie that they call out as what they liked was probably from Joss. Then you have people hating on DC/Johns/Whedon for how they changed the movie but in the next paragraph saying they had fun with the movie which is pretty much the mission statement of change for the movie. If they had fun then it was a pretty much a success.

Any scene that doesn't have the cgi moustache removal is Snyder's because all of Whedon's scenes were reshoots while Cavill was filming MI. That includes the about 90 percent of the fight at the memorial ( up until he grabs Batman...THAT is Whedon) the scene on the farm when he reunites with Martha ( the scenes with Lois were reshot by Whedon Because you can spot the CGI lip) , the Bruce and Clark scene at the farm is all Snyder Because again, no CGI moustache removal and the last scene with Clark changing into Supes and flying away was Snyder.

Yes, the pre credits phone video was Whedon, as well as most of the Supes fight against Steppenwolf( although a few shots Were​ Snyder's )and the post credit scene with Flash. That is not in dispute. Yes there may have been a little more dark Supes, and it's probable early on when JL was supposed to be two movies it was likely Supes was supposed to end JL under Darkseid's control and would have redeemed himself in part 2, but even before Whedon became involved at all, it was decided JL was now 1 movie and Supes general arc of Resurrection/ being out of it for a little while until ultimately coming to his senses and joining the final fight against Steppenwolf and ultimately being back to normal and back to being Clark Kent and a more " Classic" Superman was in place.

The main changes Whedon made were some more jokes and humor ( which SOME I liked...I actually liked the exchange with Cyborg and the Truth and Justice line) and the rescuing civilians scenes and shortening the " dark out of it" Supes period by a few minutes.

Supes general arc in JL was set. Whedon just changed the tone essentially. But the destination was always the same once JL Became one film. That's a fact.

[manofsteel1979]

What you described as sort of a personal journey and character growth i don't take issue with. Again, my main issue with Snyder's work is style and tone not fitting mainstream comic book superheroes and characters like Superman in particular..

With Superman i feel a brighter/lighter tone and style is a necessary vision to represent and capture this spirit of hope and the years of precedent/history. That doesn't mean he can't go on a personal journey or experience some adversity. The tone/style/ambience/atmosphere is extremely important and if we both agree that Superman is hope than i feel strongly this should be represented and approached as such and that's not what i experienced or seen at all in those previous movies. The style/tone/atmosphere/presentation was dark. broody, grim and hopeless to me and for that reason is why i state that is one of the worst representations of Superman i've seen.

Keep in mind that these movies are the main (stream) comic book super hero franchise movies for DC with some of their biggest and most popular characters. That is why i'm so unwavering about it. If it was a less mainstream side graphic novel or a less mainstream side movie i wouldn't take too much of an issue with such a representation, however... we are talking about the biggest mainstream Superman comic book movies.

I'm not calling Snyder a bad director, i don't have much issues with his other films outside of the DCEU. My only issue with Snyder leading these big franchise movies is that i don't feel his style and tone and presentation is a good representation for some of these characters. A Batman solo movie, a Justice League Dark movie, maybe even an Orion movie exploring the New Gods, etc i might very well enjoy.

...but again, we seem to be of two different minds here and how we are interpreting and experiencing and seeing this. I'm glad that you and others were able to find something they connected with and enjoyed in those movies but i'm also glad and excited that i'm going to be able to start enjoying DC movies and be excited about them with the current direction they appear to be going in with Wonder Woman, changes to Justice League and moving toward a Flash/Aquaman movie that potentially might share a similar vision to this.

IF we get more DC movies beyond Wonder Woman 2 and Aquaman. JL's box office being tepid puts the future in Jeopardy.

[Dcsmall]

Hi guys, I have to say I loved the film and would give it a solid 8.5/10.

Now maybe I'm not your typical movie-goer or just like dark toned superhero movies, but I also liked BvS. I only started reading comic books last week and have been trying to fly through DC Rebirth's timeline and maybe this superhero/comic craze I have myself in has me so happy with Justice League. What I loved about it was the characters and humor. Okay, I get the villian was CGI stuffed and not the best, but he kicked ass in action scenes.

I'd never seen MOS or BvS in the cinema and when going to see Justice League, I was thinking..."why Ben Affleck and why is JL getting so much crap, I really wanted DC to have a solid move franchise cause I prefer their comics." But I was so surprised by the film. The opening scene with Wonder Woman standing on the statute of Justice and her amazing theme song kicking in gave me chills. The film is light-hearted enough not to be as dark as the other movies in the franchise, but I always felt Marvel movies where just too light and the stakes never seemed high when everything was kind of happy go lucky even during Civil War.

I didn't like Jason Momoa's first scenes of Aquaman but he quickly grew on me by the final fight with some funny moments. I think Ezra Miller stole the show as Flash as he was quirky,nerdy and shy making for hilarious scenes. I also even really liked Affleck as Batman, he's really nailed down the performance of someone who's been fighting crime for 20 years. I'm not sure how I feel about Irons as Alfred but he's growing on me with every film.

Overall, I think the film suffered from bad critic reviews which hammered the box offices, I mean it has 41% on Rotten Tomato while Fast and Furious 7 has 81%, I know different audiences maybe, but I feel maybe critics were too harsh on the film, it wasn't Avenger, but it didn't try to be. It had a lot of backstory for Flash and Cyborg to fit in and 2hrs was definitely not long enough, maybe another 30mins would have been ideal and I do hope there is an extended edition to watch sometime.

TL;DR

Story - Okay
Character - Brilliant
Tone - Not too Dark but felt real.
Length - Could be longer. (Never heard that before :P)

[Wyndham]

And yet I would have loved a Justice League film directed by Joss Whedon. Neither of us got our wish.

Well, either would've been preferable.