Doctor Who IV - Everything Whovian - Would you like a jelly baby?

[Donald]

2) I'm guessing the Master could escape using the Missy technique-absorbing some of the destructive force of the particle to teleport. After all it appears the new TCE has a few other 'apps' on it as well as this episode showed.

The Death particle destroyed all organic life, I'm guessing the Cyberium isn't organic. The Master's mind can hitch a ride on it until he finds a new body. Like a older woman named Missy...

[Kirby101]

Hated it, hated the retcon, and just underwhelmed by her as the Doctor. She never felt like she fit. I don't think the writers or her got a handle on the character this season.

[Celgress]

Hated it, hated the retcon, and just underwhelmed by her as the Doctor. She never felt like she fit. I don't think the writers or her got a handle on the character this season.

I agree with you completely. I use to love Dr. Who but this season is, trash tier storytelling.

I blame Chibnall. He's been a disaster for Who. Ironic when you consider there are clips of a very young Chibnall criticizing the Colin Baker Era writers for destroying Dr. Who and now he's made a fine old mess of things.

[Patrick Gerard]

Why couldn't we have gotten Howard Overman?

I guarantee the plots and humor would be more inventive and I doubt we'd have been subjected to this.

To be absolutely clear: this makes rewatching most nuWho pointless.

Nine carried guilt for the death of his people who were not only not dead but not his people.

Ten went around on a tear about being last of the Time Lords until he embraced humility that was totally unnecessary because he was never even a time lord and he could have kept regenerating into himself as often as he wanted.

Eleven spent a thousand years aging his way through the defense of Christmas when he could have burned through a bajillion regenerations and Clara's deal with the time lords was meaningless as was the effort to save Gallifrey in Day of the Doctor.

Twelve's efforts to redeem Missy were pointless but so too was everything involving the confession dial and Clara's death -- and he could have against just regenerated his way through the problem.

Romana and River are reduced to being nobodies. Clara, Amy, and Rose are likewise nothing special, part of a much larger tapestry whose actions are largely unnecessary and whose sacrifices are wasted.

And so much of old Who is also pointless. Trial of a Time Lord is now a Kangaroo court, even less meaningful than before. Hartnell is a nobody. Baker's altruism towards his own kind and attempts to surpass them are pointless.

Hell if I know what good a Chameleon Arch is or why the Doctor needed one against the Family of Blood.

This reveal reduces 40 years to a series of blundering mistakes that likely led to no good.

[Matt]

clips of a very young Chibnall criticizing the Colin Baker Era writers for destroying Dr. Who

While the writing of that era wasn't the greatest, it was mostly the BBC itself that was keen to see Who end that was the main culprit.
That being said, that era did include notable stories such as Vengeance on Varos and The Two Doctors - stories I'd rate as better than anything from the past two seasons.

(of course, then you have things such as The Twin Dilemma, which was incredibly terrible).

[Matt]

Hated it, hated the retcon, and just underwhelmed by her as the Doctor. She never felt like she fit. I don't think the writers or her got a handle on the character this season.

Underwhelming is a pretty good description of the 13th Doctor, I think.
She seems to be very much like the 5th - an incarnation that simply isn't that effective in situations where other versions would waltz through without breaking a sweat. She has a tendency to babble a lot but personally achieve little.
Take this latest episode, as a quick example:
She gets captured, the Master rants at her for over half the episode, she's helpless against the memories unlocked, an answer is handed to her by a past self, even though she accepts the answer (which happens to be GENOCIDE) she lacks the conviction to actually carry it out ... until Random Old Geezer comes along and does it for her.

Other Doctors would not have accepted genocide (see The Time War and The Moment ... well, except the 7th. But he was a bastard at times - and even then he didn't do it directly. See also Genesis of the Daleks and a whooole bunch of other tales), other Doctors would have found another way (see Gallifrey's supposed destruction and then recovery).

[Vworp Vworp]

The Doctor being changed from a bored Time Lady/Time Lord who ran off seeking adventure to a mysterious chosen one child is, well, stupid and runs counter to everything we know about the character.

How does it? And how has what we know changed?

The First Doctor's childhood, as both we and she remember it, was exactly the same. He grew up on Gallifrey, went to the Academy, was friends with the Master, everything. And as far as the young first Doctor was aware at the time, that was his first life, his only life at that point. Every choice he made, every decision he took, every path he walked, they haven't changed at all. And they were all his choices (OK, with maybe a little help from Clara about picking a Tardis)

Honestly, I've been watching Who since the late 70's and I just don't see how the events of TTC in any way alter or undermine the Doctor's origin as much as we ever knew it. Those events are completely unchanged. If anything, you could argue this casts some doubt on the last attempt to reboot the Doc's past, with all the Seventh Doctor "Didn't we... they have trouble with the prototype" stuff. But honestly, that felt more like turning the Doc into some Rassilon/Omega level ancient Gallifreyan, considerably moreso than this changes our fundamental understanding of the character.

In Cartmel's 'master plan', the Doc was being hinted at being one of the most important and powerful Time Lords in Gallifreyan history who was complicit in the cover up of his own origin. In Chibnall's story, the Doc was just a kid from somewhere else who could regenerate who eventually had their memory erased and subsequently understood their early life to be exactly the same as we did.

Cartmel's plan, had it followed through to it's natural conclusion, literally would have changed everything. The Timeless Children only adds to what we (and the Doc') actually knew.

[Celgress]

I firmly reject Chibnall's vision, abbreviated or not, which is merely a ripoff of Doomsday's OG origin anyhow, enough said.

If anyone likes this that's fine, but I just can't enjoy what Chibs has done to my once-beloved series.

[Vworp Vworp]

Romana and River are reduced to being nobodies. Clara, Amy, and Rose are likewise nothing special, part of a much larger tapestry whose actions are largely unnecessary and whose sacrifices are wasted.

OK, so literally everything you typed in that post is wrong, but let's just pick this one cos it's probably the most "I'm sorry, what now?"

How does the Doctor having a past that neither we or she knew about, in any conceivable way, diminish the actions of any of those characters?

[jetengine]

OK, so literally everything you typed in that post is wrong, but let's just pick this one cos it's probably the most "I'm sorry, what now?"

How does the Doctor having a past that neither we or she knew about, in any conceivable way, diminish the actions of any of those characters?

I believe the idea is that their sacrifices and choices were unnecessary because the Doctor could merely just Mass-Spam regens until he won

[Somecrazyaussie]

While the writing of that era wasn't the greatest, it was mostly the BBC itself that was keen to see Who end that was the main culprit.
That being said, that era did include notable stories such as Vengeance on Varos and The Two Doctors - stories I'd rate as better than anything from the past two seasons.

(of course, then you have things such as The Twin Dilemma, which was incredibly terrible).

Colin had some shockers. But Vengeance On Varos, The Two Doctors, and Revelation Of The Daleks are all top notch.

[Somecrazyaussie]

How does it? And how has what we know changed?

The First Doctor's childhood, as both we and she remember it, was exactly the same. He grew up on Gallifrey, went to the Academy, was friends with the Master, everything. And as far as the young first Doctor was aware at the time, that was his first life, his only life at that point. Every choice he made, every decision he took, every path he walked, they haven't changed at all. And they were all his choices (OK, with maybe a little help from Clara about picking a Tardis)

Honestly, I've been watching Who since the late 70's and I just don't see how the events of TTC in any way alter or undermine the Doctor's origin as much as we ever knew it. Those events are completely unchanged. If anything, you could argue this casts some doubt on the last attempt to reboot the Doc's past, with all the Seventh Doctor "Didn't we... they have trouble with the prototype" stuff. But honestly, that felt more like turning the Doc into some Rassilon/Omega level ancient Gallifreyan, considerably moreso than this changes our fundamental understanding of the character.

In Cartmel's 'master plan', the Doc was being hinted at being one of the most important and powerful Time Lords in Gallifreyan history who was complicit in the cover up of his own origin. In Chibnall's story, the Doc was just a kid from somewhere else who could regenerate who eventually had their memory erased and subsequently understood their early life to be exactly the same as we did.

Cartmel's plan, had it followed through to it's natural conclusion, literally would have changed everything. The Timeless Children only adds to what we (and the Doc') actually knew.

This. It really is just a variation on what we may have got if the show hadn't been axed. I'm not saying TTC was perfect, and I am not totally sold on the direction Chibnall is taking, but it does help settle a number of glaring story hurdles - The Doctor has unlimited regenerations. So that never needs to be addressed again. It also explains why the Time Lords never executed the Doctor and sent her into exile (can't kill her if she'll just regenerate).

We have to understand that The Doctor had forgotten about her true past via Time Lord mind wipes and blockers etc. So, from her standpoint, her stand on Trenzalore was it for her.

And if you want to go into detail, Clara asked the Time Lords to "help him change the future". One could reason the energy they supplied him with was a boost to add the regeneration so it could take out the Daleks and their main ship (That was like an atomic explosion). The Doctor's future implied he met his end on Trenzalore and, for him, it was deemed true as he wasn't aware of his true past and his abilities. But events played out different and negated it.

Plus the Big reason - the writers hadnt thought of going down this route until now. Plus this direction can be undone or negated later on. Nothing is ever set in stone when it comes to Who.

[Silvermoth]

I’m very intrigued. It was a real noodle scratcher but I think I’m on board. I actually wouldn’t mind though having a tiny break from the Master

[Anthony W]

Anyone remember that episode of Community where they describe their parody of Doctor Who, Inspector Spacetime and what happened when they got their first female Inspector?

Britta: Wait..was there a female inspector?

Abed: Yes, and everyone hates her. Not because their sexist, because she sucks.

I couldn't stop thinking about that episode of Community while watching this episode and then seeing the ratings and audience scores. Good things this show is paid for with tax dollars so it can't get cancelled

[Celgress]

Colin had some shockers. But Vengeance On Varos, The Two Doctors, and Revelation Of The Daleks are all top notch.

That they were, great episodes, IMO.