Snyder and Superman: Top 4 Comics that shaped Snyder's Superman Trilogy

[Johnny Thunders!]

Zack Snyder really tried to challenge the public perception of Superman. He dived into some of the more mature themes and ideas that post 80's comics often dealt with. I was thinking which ones led us to his Superman and the DCEU as it is for better or worse.

1. John Byrne's Man of Steel: Clark first and Superman second, it may have always been that way originally but don't come looking for any Superboy in Snyder's Universe.

2. Miracle Man by Alan Moore: There are shots of General Zod that absolutely remind me of Kid Miracle Man. Add that and the devastation of Metropolis, Super people on Earth are seismic events and Snyder did it on screen almost as horrifically as Moore and others did on page.

3. The Dark Knight Returns: SO much fun to see on screen, I know it hurts as a Superman fan, but what can you do. (I kind of think Barbatos might be working with DCEU execs.)

4. Alex Ross's Justice League/Kingdom Come: I have been reading his JUSTICE series and there is so much Ross's Superman in Cavill.

In my dreams the Justice League movies would be 1. White Martians 2. Crime Syndicate/Legion of Doom 3. New Gods 4. Kingdom Come. I also think the detached and distant Superman of Kingdom Come would be consistent with the wandering Clark of Man of Steel.

(Honorable Mention: Howard Porter's Justice League, when I look at Momoa's Aquaman, he just takes me back to Rock of Ages)

I definitely don't think there is a dearth of source material for the DCEU. I wonder if general audiences just weren't ready for such a new Superman.
I hope we see a Justice League again soon. I think it's inevitable it will gain in appreciation once it's screen at home. I personally am willing to forgive ALOT to see more Justice League on screen. Oh well, still got the comics!

I'm sure I missed some comics but I figure since Zack is my generation he would have about the same reading list!

[Powerboy]

1. John Byrne's Man of Steel: Clark first and Superman second, it may have always been that way originally but don't come looking for any Superboy in Snyder's Universe.

I think originally he was definitely Superman first and Clark second. Byrne changed that though there may have been hints of it before.

3. The Dark Knight Returns: SO much fun to see on screen, I know it hurts as a Superman fan, but what can you do. (I kind of think Barbatos might be working with DCEU execs.)

I think it was Dark Knight reversed with Batman being the one in the wrong although the main similarity is simply that the heroes have to hate and fight each other.

4. Alex Ross's Justice League/Kingdom Come: I have been reading his JUSTICE series and there is so much Ross's Superman in Cavill.

[GreatKungLao]

Actually BvS is better than The Dark Knight Returns. It didn't made Superman to be a government's pawn and also clearly established with a Knightmare scene that if Superman loses restraints, he can kill Batman with a single push of his palm and then during their fight he says "If I wanted it, you would be dead already", which is so true, he holds himself back the entire fight, because he doesn't want to kill Batman, which would have been so easy to do if he wanted to. I was so happy with the montage where Superman helps around the world, would it be Mexico or Russia, he has will to help all of humanity without letting himself be USA's dog.

[Ishmael]

Superman Comics #1 (1939) the origin page.

On this page we have Clark Kent's father saying: "Now listen to me Clark! This great strength of yours - you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!"

Given how much criticism Snyder took for his portrayal of Pa Kent, it was actually more in keeping with his first appearance than often realized. Fans may not have liked it because it departed from what we've seen of Pa Kent over the years, but it was actually grounded pretty solidly in that original warning (which it seems to me to develop).

And I agree that BvS is better than The Dark Knight Returns. DKR did nothing but take a massive dump on Superman.

[DochaDocha]

We're missing the obvious one, Death of Superman (Superman #75).

Also, does Snyder even considering having Superman kill Zod if not for Superman #22 (though I guess this is included in the Byrne Superman description).

I probably wouldn't credit any one origin story, but the idea of a wandering Superman who tried to find his place in the world feels like a post-2000 development.

[JBatmanFan05]

And I agree that BvS is better than The Dark Knight Returns. DKR did nothing but take a massive dump on Superman.

It was an alternate take on the characters. And frankly (pun intended?), Miller spinning Superman that way was a stroke of utter creative genius (and no doubt would have been done by a later writer had Miller not done so). Like Secret Empire storyline in 1974 with Nixon, Miller, like so many politically minded young writers, found a compelling way to simplify and symbolize high political and geopolitical stakes with Batman and Superman.

Miller was just trying to tell a (alternate dystopic future) story. And it worked fantastically. Some have to look at the story apart from the pro-Superman stance, the unpredictable uncontrollable effects it had on Superman. Same with Batman fans and Frank Miller.

I have no problem myself thinking DKR is much better than BvS (and a lot of comics and graphic novels), even though future writers and editors and etc let DKR (and Watchmen) influence them too much or for too long.

[The World]

Off the top of my head I'd probably say

World of Krypton by Byrne and Mignola

Man of Steel by Byrne

Death of Superman

and The Dark Knight Returns

Honestly I've seen alot of attempts to muddy the waters with where the influence for Snyder's Superman came from but even with a surface level knowledge of Superman's history across the ages it's pretty clear that probably %90-%95 of it came from the post crisis late 80's - 90's iteration of the character. Living Kents, no krypto, muted childhood, War like Jor-El, muted Krypton, the focus on farm life, Doomsday, that take on the Worlds Finest, sauve Clark Kent, the Lois/Clark relationship etc.

There were things I like and other things I didn't but the attempt I've seen by others to push this off on other era's is a bit funny. Was anything from the this take from any of the other eras?

[Adekis]

World of Krypton by Byrne and Mignola

Actually BvS is better than The Dark Knight Returns. It didn't made Superman to be a government's pawn

Superman Comics #1 (1939) the origin page.

On this page we have Clark Kent's father saying: "Now listen to me Clark! This great strength of yours - you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!"

Given how much criticism Snyder took for his portrayal of Pa Kent, it was actually more in keeping with his first appearance than often realized. Fans may not have liked it because it departed from what we've seen of Pa Kent over the years, but it was actually grounded pretty solidly in that original warning (which it seems to me to develop).

I'm 100% on board with these statements.

I don't know about Kingdom Come, but that's probably mostly because I am really hard on Kingdom Come as a story. I know that it's sort of the big obvious and famous "Superman quits and comes back" story that's easy to point to, and obviously that's a major element of Dawn of Justice, but there's enough other stories like that, I don't think it has to be KC. Also, in KC Kal's more like "if you guys don't like me, screw you too!" whereas in Dawn he's more like "am I doing more harm than good?" which is very different, I think. Maybe more like KC's end than it's more famous quitting at the start, and at the end Kal doesn't come back to being Superman and Ross in particular seems to conclude that quitting being Superman, just to be "Clark with powers" is the best way forward, which doesn't seem to be what happens in Dawn at all. At the same time, no other "Superman quits and returns" story seems to have the level of attention paid to "maybe I'm doing more harm than good" as Dawn does. Hrm...

[Johnny Thunders!]

Earth One is worth a mention too. JMS and his red sun aliens are Kryptonians for all intents and purposes. I mean Kingdom Come because of Alex Ross. Batman looks like he stepped out of Justice. Clark does wander away from Man. I am not hard on Kingdom Come. In those old Silver Age stories, he sometimes acts emotionally stunted just to prove a point. KC works like that for me. I’m reading all the Alex Ross Superman to keep Justice League mania going.

[Burning Eyes]

Off the top of my head, I would say that Snyder was clearly influenced by the following works:

John Byrne's Man of Steel
Superman: Earth One
The Dark Knight Returns (although, as others have mentioned, with the twist that it is Batman who is in the wrong, allowing his own paranoia to get the better of him because he did not have the whole picture)
The Death of Superman

BONUS
Justice League: Origin by Geoff Johns


EDIT
Back after a LONG Hiatus from CBR.

[Powerboy]

It was an alternate take on the characters. And frankly (pun intended?), Miller spinning Superman that way was a stroke of utter creative genius (and no doubt would have been done by a later writer had Miller not done so). Like Secret Empire storyline in 1974 with Nixon, Miller, like so many politically minded young writers, found a compelling way to simplify and symbolize high political and geopolitical stakes with Batman and Superman.

Miller was just trying to tell a (alternate dystopic future) story. And it worked fantastically. Some have to look at the story apart from the pro-Superman stance, the unpredictable uncontrollable effects it had on Superman. Same with Batman fans and Frank Miller.

I have no problem myself thinking DKR is much better than BvS (and a lot of comics and graphic novels), even though future writers and editors and etc let DKR (and Watchmen) influence them too much or for too long.

I found "DKR" to be a combination of brilliance and absurdity even before the stuff about Superman. It's a slippery slope story about characters taken to their extremes in some ways. The artwork is a symbol of that with grossly exaggerated jut-jawed characters.

But I think the exaggeration and, for Superman fans, the way Superman is treated, do distract from much of the brilliance and nuances of the story.

One of the interesting and annoying things when it came out was that several people I knew perceived Superman as always having been the way he was portrayed in DKR, basically the whole "Super Dick" garbage which, outside of "Imaginary Stories" and misleading covers and splash pages, I totally don't get.

[Kuwagaton]

Well welcome back, friend.

Honestly I've seen alot of attempts to muddy the waters with where the influence for Snyder's Superman came from but even with a surface level knowledge of Superman's history across the ages it's pretty clear that probably %90-%95 of it came from the post crisis late 80's - 90's iteration of the character. Living Kents, no krypto, muted childhood, War like Jor-El, muted Krypton, the focus on farm life, Doomsday, that take on the Worlds Finest, sauve Clark Kent, the Lois/Clark relationship etc.

There were things I like and other things I didn't but the attempt I've seen by others to push this off on other era's is a bit funny. Was anything from the this take from any of the other eras?

Jor-el, war like? I'd actually say:

World of Krypton - this Krypton had a harsh coldness. Emotion based thought makes for anomalies in this society. Genetic binds and the holographic legacy Jor-El passes down through the birthing matrix are huge components of the story.

Birthright - Clark finding his place in the world explored in detail, a meat and potatoes rendition of the Daily Planet, and Superman fighting to show himself as a true son of Krypton in the midst of an city smashing invasion. If anyone liked Man of Steel and chose to pursue the comics, this would be the story I'd start with recommending.

Superman vol. 2 #22 - Superman killing Zod is a very, very big deal.

New 52 - Jor and Lara as action heroes, more sense of wonder in the discoveries of Kryptonian artifacts and taking to the sky, and a wary government facilitating the schemes of Lex.

DKR and KC are probably the biggest influences he'd actually cite, but I have no interest in those stories. I'm sure he'd also cite Death Of, but the story is flipped. BvS has a Christ parallel and that's sort of the opposite of how he originally died.

[JBatmanFan05]

I found "DKR" to be a combination of brilliance and absurdity even before the stuff about Superman. It's a slippery slope story about characters taken to their extremes in some ways. The artwork is a symbol of that with grossly exaggerated jut-jawed characters.

But I think the exaggeration and, for Superman fans, the way Superman is treated, do distract from much of the brilliance and nuances of the story.

That's good that you appreciated what it was trying to do. It's always sad for me to read fans blaming all these things on Miller and Moore (as if they could control what the industry took from their work as far as influence and the degree and longevity of the influence) when they were the epitome of what you want and wanted writers to be: creative and fresh and smart storytellers

One of the interesting and annoying things when it came out was that several people I knew perceived Superman as always having been the way he was portrayed in DKR, basically the whole "Super Dick" garbage which, outside of "Imaginary Stories" and misleading covers and splash pages, I totally don't get.

I don't get it either. It's one thing to have subjectively perceived Superman having evolved to appear symbolize different things post-war, this Eisenhower era feel about him and his comics and tv and radio shows. It's another to think postwar Superman matched DKR's version so very much that Miller "nailed" him. That's ridiculous. Miller twisted him to an extreme.