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  1. #1261
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    Also can't help but point out (can't believe I didn't notice this a few months back) that Gary Frank's Luthor looks so much like Clancy Brown. Of course upon realizing that I also just realized that the Animated Series Luthor also resembles Brown.
    Last edited by K. Jones; 09-04-2019 at 08:28 PM.
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  2. #1262
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    It took me 11 issues and ... well, it's been quite a few more months than that. But I'm in a "things are clicking" kind of mood today.
    Good call. I didn’t get that revelation. It totally makes sense. Jon is a scientist and science is about facts and discover. He comes from an earth that is more “real world”. Action causes reaction. But he’s found an earth with limitless potential and in a constant state of flux. A place where he can perform reality altering experiments but things have a way of realigning to create a reality that is similar but very different at the same time. To a scientist with god-like powers the sight the DCU is the ultimate playground. I’m sure Manhattan as a 5th dimensional god can get rather board with standard reality. This “metaverse” is something new and exciting. The one constant is Superman. This is similar to Final Crisis and even Infinite Crisis. Superman is the key to everything.

  3. #1263
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    I'm racking my brains on how Doomsday Clock will conclude, I think we'll get a hopeful ending for both the DC and Watchmen Universes, I'm leaning towards Manhattan becoming Jon Osterman again either by choosing to being depowered or going back to the moment when he had the accident and preventing it.

    I hope Johns doesn't have Lex kill Ozymandias given he that he did that with Alexander Luthor in both Infinite Crisis and Forever Evil, I certainly want Ozy to have his comeuppance.

  4. #1264
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    After that last page in issue#11, I'll just be waiting for issue#12 to start with Supes taking off his pants for a real dick measurement contest
    Great. Now I'm going to be disappointed if Superman doesn't do that and then run up to Manhattan and give him a superspeed superkick to the balls.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jody Garland View Post
    I hadn't even thought about this angle even with the common motif of the moth and flames. Astute observation, man.
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    Last edited by Scott Taylor; 09-05-2019 at 09:51 AM.
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  5. #1265
    Mighty Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    Great. Now I'm going to be disappointed if Superman doesn't do that and then run up to Manhattan and give him a superspeed superkick to the balls.
    "You call that a penis? Let me show you why they call me "Superman"!"



    Anyways, jokes aside, I just remembered one thing, with issue#10 revealing that DCU is a "metaverse", it fits very well with Supes feeling nostalgic when he's transported to the 30's in AC#1000:



    Perhaps it was even foreshadowing.

  6. #1266
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    So, Batman prevented nuclear war & stopped the Watchmen invasion of Gotham, Superman stopped the siege on the whitehouse, and neither one of them broke a sweat. According to plan Ozy?

  7. #1267
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    Quote Originally Posted by Korath View Post
    She wasn't a key character. Ozymandias and - perhaps- Manhattan have been. But Saturn Girl was just one more face in an over-crowded and over-ambitious story, which never managed to have one clear set of events, characters and goals to build upon. Even before this issue, she was pretty much inconsequential for the whole story. Like most other characters (up to and including big names like Wonder Woman and Batman, really).

    But all of this rest on Johns failure to realize that the strenght of Watchmen is a very simple plot ("Someone is killing former vigilantes and must be found"), juxtaposed with a complew setting ("a world very much like our own, on the verge of nuclear annihilation because of the existence of a lone all-powerful individual") allowed the exploration of a small set of characters, which had space to be flesh out and play out with each other, allowing for the deepness of the story. Dr. Manhattan, Rorschach, Nite Owl, Silk Spectre, Ozymandias, and to a lesser extent the Comedian are the sole true characters of the story.

    Meanwhile, in Doomsday Clock, we had, from the beginning Ozymandias, Rorschach II, Mime, Marionette, Saturn Girl, Johnny Thunder, Superman, Batman, Lew, The Comedian, Doctor Manhattan (perhaps others I'm forgetting) which were positionned as important (or at least looked like they would be important). And that's without counting the subplots of the Supermen Theory, Khandaq, the Villains in Gotham (or was it Metropolis?) and perhaps other which have also slipped off my mind.

    Doomsday Clock was always far too crowded, far too unsure of what it wanted to be, what story it wanted to tell, to have more than one and a half important character : Ozymandias and Jon. And that's it. And that's why we are where we are today. Not because of editorial interferences betraying a perfect evergreen story. But an over-ambitious writer who found himself stuck for too long, unable to move and leaving us with a convoluted story which seems to go nowhere, because we don't understand what's at stake inside the story.

    Gary Frank's artwork is stunning however (even if I'm not too fond of the face he gives to Superman).
    Hard agree on all of this. I had high hopes for this series but everything is so abruptly ending that it just reads like Johns hadnít planned this out all tat well.

  8. #1268
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    I also get the "rushed" feeling, but it's still a hell of a ride. I realize, as a comic reader for too long, Ozymandias is about to go down hard ( he looked like a stereotypical comic book villain, sorry). Luthor, Batman, or whoever does it. Do feel sorry for Dr M who is about to lose one he should have no trouble with. Most powerful scenes were Saturn Girl (Long Live the Legion), But veidt saying that the past won't be erased...makes him not the smartest man on THAT Earth. Batman always loses round 1, wins the rematch. That look on Mime's face when Bats shows him he's not the only one with "invisibility powers" was priceless!
    I don't like the delays either, and I respect the criticism, but this is great stuff. Hands down the best comic DC has published recently.

  9. #1269
    Astonishing Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by king81992 View Post
    Maybe Dc is low key doing away with continuity?
    Wasn't that what the whole "Hypertime" thing was for? DC saying, "It's all valid because it all happened, regardless of continuity."

    Oh, and at the end, what the heck is with that street sign that says "Luthor" and the arrow is pointing right at Dr Manhattan?!?

  10. #1270
    Incredible Member Dreaded Porcupine's Avatar
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    Looking forward to the conclusion. Hopefully it comes out before next year. I could have done without seeing Jon’s junk hanging out though. Is Superman supposed to show him his? Seriously what was the point of this?

  11. #1271
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreaded Porcupine View Post
    Looking forward to the conclusion. Hopefully it comes out before next year. I could have done without seeing Jon’s junk hanging out though. Is Superman supposed to show him his? Seriously what was the point of this?
    To show how distant from humanity he is, just like in Watchman. He cares so little for human social norms he walks around in the nude.

  12. #1272
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    To show how distant from humanity he is, just like in Watchman. He cares so little for human social norms he walks around in the nude.
    It is kind of weird though because he stopped doing it when Laurie asked him too, when he was part of his world's super-team. But you're right, he probably went back to it because its who he really is underneath. Inhuman.
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  13. #1273
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    It is kind of weird though because he stopped doing it when Laurie asked him too, when he was part of his world's super-team. But you're right, he probably went back to it because its who he really is underneath. Inhuman.
    Osterman wasn't really shown to be inhuman before his accident. Perhaps a bit socially awkward, but definitely a human personality. Moore's portrayal was one which expressed Dr. Manhattan's inumanity as a function of both his power and his new outlook on the world and its sciences. The DC Universe attracted Jon and the thought had been expressed that it was due to the preponderance of super-powered individuals allowing Jon to find similar lives to feel less alone. Outside of Carver Colman, though, Jon's interacted very little. One might use thae All-Star 3 cover on DClock 10's variant as being a sign of his desires, but with the JSA, Jon's taken an academic examination of the world and its constant crisis caused changes.

    The scene with Marionette and her yet unborn child not being killed is an indicator that he isn't totally removed from human feelings, even if his motivation is not upsetting a future event. Generally though, I'm expecting a set conclusion to Dr. Manhattan's story Does he go out like Rorschach regaining signs of humanity and sanity at the end, or something possibly more tragic, we need to wait (yes, I know. we'll discuss this elsewhere) until DClock 12.

  14. #1274
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Osterman wasn't really shown to be inhuman before his accident. Perhaps a bit socially awkward, but definitely a human personality. Moore's portrayal was one which expressed Dr. Manhattan's inumanity as a function of both his power and his new outlook on the world and its sciences. The DC Universe attracted Jon and the thought had been expressed that it was due to the preponderance of super-powered individuals allowing Jon to find similar lives to feel less alone. Outside of Carver Colman, though, Jon's interacted very little. One might use thae All-Star 3 cover on DClock 10's variant as being a sign of his desires, but with the JSA, Jon's taken an academic examination of the world and its constant crisis caused changes.

    The scene with Marionette and her yet unborn child not being killed is an indicator that he isn't totally removed from human feelings, even if his motivation is not upsetting a future event. Generally though, I'm expecting a set conclusion to Dr. Manhattan's story Does he go out like Rorschach regaining signs of humanity and sanity at the end, or something possibly more tragic, we need to wait (yes, I know. we'll discuss this elsewhere) until DClock 12.
    I canít see Johns giving Manhattan a tragic ending, I think itíll be like Superman: Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow where Manhattan realises what heís done is wrong and decides to remove his powers and becoming human again.

    Veidtís ending will be interesting, I think heíll be brought to justice as killing him would be too easy an option and would essentially make him a martyr

  15. #1275
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonaX View Post
    I can’t see Johns giving Manhattan a tragic ending, I think it’ll be like Superman: Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow where Manhattan realises what he’s done is wrong and decides to remove his powers and becoming human again.

    Veidt’s ending will be interesting, I think he’ll be brought to justice as killing him would be too easy an option and would essentially make him a martyr
    Veidt's an interesting case. He's taken some reprehensible steps, but his goals have been non-villainous. Road to Hell paved with good intentions. Even with his actions on the DC Earth, it's to get Jon to come back and save the Watchmen Earth. My guess is that Johns is going to something different than Moore. Veidt won't getting off free even if strongly tainted. Neither Veidt nor Manhattan have seems to have grown as a result of their actions in Watchmen. Can we realistically expect a lesson to be learned from Doomsday Clock?

    As to where the characters are going after Doomsday Clock, I have a tough time imagining DC leaving it easy to use Manhattan or Veidt in future stories. Not that it couldn't happen. After all, these are superhero comics. But using Veidt and manhattan should be a big thing, if they are used again.

    Mime and Marionette look like they may be blended in the DC Universe.

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