Norman Vs Harry

[Beacon]

Harry's resurrection was a huge mistake. His return in BND was painfully awkward and the explanation for his return---a full year later IIRC---was contrived, even by comic book standards. Additionally, he had such a minimal role in the book since then and has since disappeared all together. He had one decent arc ("American Son") and only one truly great moment (the final moments of "Origin of the Species"); the rest was a complete waste. I wonder why Marvel brought him back at all?

The thing I found funniest about Harry’s method of resurrection is that it wasn’t even specific to him. The way they brought back, say, Aunt May was stupid but at least they didn’t follow it with “also all these other dead characters were actors too”. The Mysterio explanation doesn’t just trivialize the characters brought back but it also makes Mysterio himself less of a character and more of a plot device.

The reasons behind bringing Harry back are equally laughable. It would have worked if it had happened at the end of the Clone Saga as planned because that was born out of a writer saying “I have an idea for this character”. No one in OMD had any idea what to do with Harry and I doubt he’d have come back if not for the EiC ordering it.

[RD!]

Harry's resurrection was a huge mistake. His return in BND was painfully awkward and the explanation for his return---a full year later IIRC---was contrived, even by comic book standards. Additionally, he had such a minimal role in the book since then and has since disappeared all together. He had one decent arc ("American Son") and only one truly great moment (the final moments of "Origin of the Species"); the rest was a complete waste. I wonder why Marvel brought him back at all?

Because of Spider-Man 3 I'm guessing. But you're right, it was a huge mistake. Arguably worse than getting rid of the marriage.

[BlitheringToot]

"Spider-Man" #75 was the second or third Spider-Man comic I ever picked up. I loved it. It succinctly explained who Norman was and why he hated Spider-Man, and even though it was my first exposure to the character I was still excited to see him attempt to exact his revenge. Norman is now my second-favorite Spider-Man villain behind Doc Ock (who was in my VERY first Spidey comic). Yes, there have been some missteps with the character along the way ("The Gathering of the Five," the "Super-Adaptoid" bit, and even the end of "Superior"), but I think his resurrection was well worth it. As was May's until "Brand New Day" kicked it out of relevance. Harry's return ... was stupid and pointless, and was a failed attempt to capitalize on "Spider-Man 3." Shouldn't have happened. He should have stayed dead. Indeed, I'm still waiting for him to turn out to be Mysterio in disguise.

[Turlast]

Harry, for the reasons explained by oldschool.

[SpOck]

I think finding out the current Norman is a clone would work wonders for the character. Have Jackal deliver it as a big F-YOU to the guy.

"Guest what Norman, you're not even a real person. Everything you are and everything you think was something I stirred up in a test tube. I only let you live this long so I could see the look on your face when I take it all away from you. But I'm not ready to do that yet. We're still having fun. Just remember, anytime I want, a push of a button, and you're gone. That's for Gwen, by the way."

That would be awesome! I'm sick of Norman, and I really disliked his resurrection and how he was turned into a cheap Lex Luthor ripoff.

[Keeper of the Crows]

Harry's resurrection was a huge mistake. His return in BND was painfully awkward and the explanation for his return---a full year later IIRC---was contrived, even by comic book standards. Additionally, he had such a minimal role in the book since then and has since disappeared all together. He had one decent arc ("American Son") and only one truly great moment (the final moments of "Origin of the Species"); the rest was a complete waste. I wonder why Marvel brought him back at all?

Fully agreed.

At least when Norman was brought back, they used the character. Revelations, Spectacular Spider-Man 250, Revenge of the Green Goblin, A Death in the Family, Thunderbolts, Dark Reign. Some of these storylines may not have been for everyone, and there may have been some missteps along the way (the Gathering of Five), but these were significant stories that used the character.

I would lump Harry’s return with Kraven, who to my knowledge hasn’t even been featured in Amazing proper since his return. But at least Grim Hunt and the Gauntlet were great stories! If my memory serves me correctly, the explanation for Harry’s return was that the same thing that killed him (the goblin formula) also brought him back to life. And wasn’t this backstory was revealed during a custody battle where much of the focus was on the Molten Man? Harry and Kraven both had amazing death stories, and both were brought back to do…what? Personally both characters impacted Peter more when they were in the grave than after their resurrection.

[RobertMacQuarrie1]

Harry's resurrection was a huge mistake. His return in BND was painfully awkward and the explanation for his return---a full year later IIRC---was contrived, even by comic book standards. Additionally, he had such a minimal role in the book since then and has since disappeared all together. He had one decent arc ("American Son") and only one truly great moment (the final moments of "Origin of the Species"); the rest was a complete waste. I wonder why Marvel brought him back at all?

My theory as to why the creators brought him back is that I think that there was a general idea regarding the status quo of the franchise at the time of his return, and that certain elements had to be reintroduced in order to make things more appealing for the fans. I think, at the time, the creative parties were more focused on making things supposedly easier for them rather than genuinely better for the fans. On the surface, those may not seem like competing ideas. It's easy to believe that making things easier for the creators would make things better for the fans. That if they had an easier time telling stories, then those stories would automatically be of better quality. And the lack of Harry in the book, along with other elements that were also changed at the time, could have been regarded as an element that made things supposedly harder for the creators.

The problem with that ideal is that making things easier for creators doesn't necessarily make things better for the fans. Now that isn't to say that all stories have to be ridiculously hard to produce. But often times the story that takes the most effort is the one that is most rewarding for both creator and fan. And I think a major problem with a certain creative element regarding the Spider-Man mythos at the time was that the focus was more on making things easier, and the question as to whether or not that it would genuinely interest the fans or lead to a compelling story was almost secondary. It seemed that the philosophical ideal was that the status quo would simply do most of the work for the creators. That having Spider-Man back a certain way, that having certain characters back in certain roles, would automatically make the book better.

But that wasn't the case. The book was different, not better. And a lack of overall story or arc did hurt the book and the characters. Harry being back did not make things automatically better. Harry being back didn't solve any problems or make things easier for creators or better for fans. The creators still needed to use the character to the best of his ability, and I don't think that they really knew what to do with him. The fact that they had Harry irrationally hate Spider-Man for no apparent reason, given the fact that most of his motivation for hating him was due to his father's death, which itself was undone and the story itself established that Harry was not on good terms with his father, kind of showed that they had no real concrete ideas for Harry. It seemed that they liked the idea of Harry being back, more than the reality of him actually being back.

[Beacon]

At the height of the “Norman is responsible for every bad thing in Peter’s life” thing I thought they should relaunch “What the…?” with a story where Norman manages a burger joint just so he can mess up Peter’s orders. Also I’d reveal that he ran over Peter’s childhood pet with his car. This is all still less silly than the Sins Past and Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers stories that can later.

[Spidey_Legend]

I think finding out the current Norman is a clone would work wonders for the character. Have Jackal deliver it as a big F-YOU to the guy.

"Guest what Norman, you're not even a real person. Everything you are and everything you think was something I stirred up in a test tube. I only let you live this long so I could see the look on your face when I take it all away from you. But I'm not ready to do that yet. We're still having fun. Just remember, anytime I want, a push of a button, and you're gone. That's for Gwen, by the way."

I hope someone in Marvel put your idea on use to explain "Norman's resurrection".

First,it would explain the difference between pre death Norman with nowadays Norman.

And it would add a good come back from Miles to Norman.

[Mister Mets]

I think both resurrections worked.

Norman's done something interesting stuff, and been in some of the best Marvel comics of the last ten years.

Harry's death was a great comic, but it didn't really lead anywhere interesting. I'm glad Peter's best friend is back (even if they're not using him at the moment.)

[Godzilla2099]

I voted Harry

Spectacular Spider-man #200 was one of the most memorable issues I read.

Since Harry's Return, I found the character pointless.

[Shocker]

I voted for Harry, simply because Marvel hasn't hardly done anything with the character. At least with Norman's resurrection, albeit highly controversial at the time, has netted us a bunch of stories. It feels like bringing Harry back was just an editorial mandate to re-establish the old status quo and nothing more.

Pretty sad, especially since he had such a great death in Spec Spidey 200.