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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Dick and Babs are suppose to be the same age now. While one can argue Babs is portrayed as too young, one could also argue that Dick is portrayed as too old
    Not sure, Seely's Dick always sounded more young to me than his pre-flashpoint incarnations.

  2. #17
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I agree that the shift for a younger Barbara started with B:TAS where she was depicted as Commissioner Gordon's young daughter in college and was made into a contemporary and love interest of Dick's, so then the comics started shifting her age so that she was closer in age to Dick as Robin (especially when they started to really push them romantically).

    Which is ironic given, by the time of The New Batman Adventures, Barbara was probably around the same age as Batgirl that comic Barbara started out as (mid-20's).

    I think the continued pushing of Barbara as a young Batgirl is because DC still views her as the main Batgirl and, unlike with Dick, DC doesn't want to keep her or promote her in her successor role of Oracle in the comics.

  3. #18
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    Not sure, Seely's Dick always sounded more young to me than his pre-flashpoint incarnations.
    21 young? Though admittedly with Seeley it not really an issue. Its the Titans where they old just seem too old for the age they are suppose to be.
    Last edited by Godlike13; 11-29-2017 at 01:42 PM.

  4. #19
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    In the DC Super Hero Girls line, you have Wonder Woman, Poison Ivy, Harley Quinn and Katana--so I don't see that the character has to be an actual "girl" to be a a DC Super Hero Girl. Besides, I'd think their main market is girls under ten years of age and it seems to me that little girls (just like little boys) have a vague concept of age for anyone older than them. All the DC Super Hero Girls are "old" as far as little girls are concerned.

    While the original Bat-Girl (Betty Kane) was introduced in 1961 and was the same age as Robin (Dick Grayson), Barbara Gordon was created in 1966 and she was always older than Dick in pre-Crisis continuity. There was a conflict for Babs, when the Boy Wonder had a crush on her. She didn't want to reciprocate those feelings at first, because of the age difference. So there was always some romantic tension, which made their relationship interesting. If they're the same age, there's no conflict and it's kind of boring.
    sorry 🍁

  5. #20
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    Huh, all the DC Super Hero Girls are quite girlish.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member Badou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    "Iconic Batgirl" and "post-Crisis" are not terms that go together in any way at all.
    No, Iconic Batgirl and Barbara Gordon go together which is why she is Batgirl. That was my point there. She is young because that is what modern Batgirl is.

  7. #22
    Post Editing OCD Confuzzled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedQueen View Post
    Seems like a weird contradiction. They want to keep Killing Joke canon, which has horrific things done to her that is meant for a older audience, but then keep Babs as a dumbed down version of herself to appeal to the more kiddy crowd. idk I just want them to make up their mind. Because with the timeline so far we've been given she was about 16/17 when TKJ happened so that fact coupled with her massive deaging has even more massive creepy implications regarding TKJ.

    I've never viewed Batgirl as a more younger kids brand sort of thing, because Barbara herself is was never carried that way. I mean she is family friendly in a lot of ways but it's not like she is in the My Little Pony category.

    I wish Barbara was 25 so that way she can keep the history but can still feel more like Babs in writing.
    TKJ wasn't massively gross and creepy with a 20-something Barbara?

    I don't know about Babs not being "younger kids brand". Mostly because other media has always depicted her as the first girl/the only girl to break into the Gotham boy's club, so everyone from a little girl, a teen girl to a young woman could aspire to be her. That's been true since the 60's show to 90's BTAS/TNBA and especially emphasized in The Batman of the 00's, her most prominent role in an other media adaptation yet. I think that's a big reason for the appeal of younger Babs.

  8. #23
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    TKJ wasn't massively gross and creepy with a 20-something Barbara?
    Are you referring specifically to the animated version (2016) or are you discussing just the original graphic novel (first published 1988 and written by Alan Moore)?

  9. #24
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    TKJ wasn't massively gross and creepy with a 20-something Barbara?

    I don't know about Babs not being "younger kids brand". Mostly because other media has always depicted her as the first girl/the only girl to break into the Gotham boy's club, so everyone from a little girl, a teen girl to a young woman could aspire to be her. That's been true since the 60's show to 90's BTAS/TNBA and especially emphasized in The Batman of the 00's, her most prominent role in an other media adaptation yet. I think that's a big reason for the appeal of younger Babs.
    I think the popularity of The Batman take, which is probably the first major promotion of Barbara as a teen Batgirl, might have played a part.

  10. #25
    Incredible Member RedQueen's Avatar
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    Yeah BTAS definitely had a role in deaging. But I felt BTAS never made it a disservice to the character (minus the bruce/babs elements). I don't mind younger Babs, I just want her to feel like Barbara and not...whatever they're trying to do with her now. They're trying so hard to write her like a 21 year old, but I feel like they shouldn't make it define her.

    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    TKJ wasn't massively gross and creepy with a 20-something Barbara?
    What? I never said it wasn't gross? I'm not negating the grossness of TKJ, I'm just insinuating it's now more gross DC would let something like that happen to a 16 year old Barbara all for the sake of keeping it canon in the current timeline when they had the choice to exclude it. She's an underage kid and with all the imagery TKJ does have of her, so how is that not an another disturbing element out of the many of what happens to Barbara in TKJ.

  11. #26
    Spectacular Member Tulku's Avatar
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    Those of us who have been reading Batman Beyond have been asking this question for some time now, because the Beyond Barbara kept being depicted as younger and younger with each succeeding issue. Indeed, it got so bad that some of us assumed that it was going to be a plot point at some time: why is Barbara de-aging? But it turns out that it wasn't a plot point. It was just part of DC's "we don't need no stinkin' continuity" drive.
    "Age is not defined by years, but by regrets...I'm an old man now." --Fighting Yank, "Project Superpowers"

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    Because she is the iconic Batgirl and DC wants to market her as being Batgirl. So they want to keep her in her early 20s so they can keep her college age where the Batgirl title still feels appropriate, and that is how she is being written. She isn't going to be written like she is in her early 30s like she was pre Flashpoint.

    Dick is the same age as her, but he also isn't Robin anymore and is Nightwing. So they are sort of forced to write him as acting a little older as he has Jason, Tim, Damian and even Duke now all after him as being Robin or some version of a Robin in the Batman books as being younger than him.
    When she was first introduced, Barbara Gordon had several years on Dick Grayson. I guess going backward in time like Benjamin Button is one way to keep from being called a cougar.

  13. #28
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oasis1313 View Post
    When she was first introduced, Barbara Gordon had several years on Dick Grayson. I guess going backward in time like Benjamin Button is one way to keep from being called a cougar.
    When she was first introduced, Barbara was employed by the Gotham City public library and appeared to have a position that normally requires at least a college degree, while Dick hadn't even graduated high school yet. (He didn't begin college until 1969; Barbara was introduced in 1966 in an issue cover-dated "January 1967".)

  14. #29
    Astonishing Member batnbreakfast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    When she was first introduced, Barbara was employed by the Gotham City public library and appeared to have a position that normally requires at least a college degree, while Dick hadn't even graduated high school yet. (He didn't begin college until 1969; Barbara was introduced in 1966 in an issue cover-dated "January 1967".)
    Uh, kinky! Well, it would be original if superheroes weren't just about the same age (much like Game of Thrones has a nice non-ageist cast) and it might set up interesting conflicts if only writers were interested in those or able to pull those off. As a 30 something reader of superheroes the brawls really aren't that interesting anymore and I giggle at character moments but they are too few.

  15. #30
    Ultimate Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by batnbreakfast View Post
    Uh, kinky!
    Huh?

    In the early days, Dick and Barbara weren't in any boyfriend/girlfriend relationships.
    Dick may have sometimes been written as if he could have had a crush on Barbara, but she never showed any romantic interest in Dick back in the pre-CoIE stories. And, mind you, Barbara Gordon's Batgirl was around for nearly twenty years (our time) prior to CoIE.

    There was one time when she did kiss Robin when she was Batgirl, it was to shut him up and confuse him; it wasn't a part of any romance.


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