X-Men Gold #17 SPOILERS

[ExodusCloak]

Blue is bad and Gold is worse. But Astonishing, Weapon X, Generation X, Wolverine, Iceman, Jean Grey, and OML (& UA) are all hanging from tolerable to fantastic. I wouldn't necessarily call the lineup "poor"

That's the thing, they're flagships. I don't think Jean Grey was very good only until the last issue. That is because it was mostly rinse and repeat with each guest star. Weapon X is meh.

There was a time when we had good writers on all the books and really bad art. That was when Carey was around. It's just been one worse writer after another

There's a few things here:
- I don't get the impression that any of the writers bar the really niche ones on Iceman are actually excited to write the X-books. In Guggenheim and Soules case it's like it's just a job.
- Ideas are just old ideas with new twists. I don't blame writers for keeping their good ideas for creator owned stuff but it sucks for the X-books.
- I'm not against political messages in comics. In fact there was always something weather it was dialogue against the red scare or Genosha and it's parallel to apartheid south Africa. The world has been quite volatile for a long time and I think Guggenheim is clumsy in trying to address it. I guess since the end of both extinction storyline the X-books need an overarching mission.
- Every character needs a story line. Otherwise don't put them in the roster

[True Believer Tony]

This was okay. I would've appreciated some kind of explanation as to why Logan would invite Ink along. Armor makes sense but Ink? Why is he even still at the school, he's not even a mutant.

[RLAAMJR.]

Ah crap not again.

I agree with you on this. Writers should never write Kurt of how dangerous it is to teleport and not knowing where he is.

[Tenebrae]

Emma Frost has nothing to do with the issue so hold yer wheesht. (Stop derailing the thread)

[RLAAMJR.]

Even at his worst, Claremont is still better than this...

I definitely agree with you however, i didnt like it when he sort of write all the xmen to be not straight.

[lurkerforyears]

That's the thing, they're flagships. I don't think Jean Grey was very good only until the last issue. That is because it was mostly rinse and repeat with each guest star. Weapon X is meh.

There was a time when we had good writers on all the books and really bad art. That was when Carey was around. It's just been one worse writer after another

There's a few things here:
- I don't get the impression that any of the writers bar the really niche ones on Iceman are actually excited to write the X-books. In Guggenheim and Soules case it's like it's just a job.
- Ideas are just old ideas with new twists. I don't blame writers for keeping their good ideas for creator owned stuff but it sucks for the X-books.
- I'm not against political messages in comics. In fact there was always something weather it was dialogue against the red scare or Genosha and it's parallel to apartheid south Africa. The world has been quite volatile for a long time and I think Guggenheim is clumsy in trying to address it. I guess since the end of both extinction storyline the X-books need an overarching mission.
- Every character needs a story line. Otherwise don't put them in the roster

flagships are rarely good
There wasnt a great Uncanny X-Men from Claremont to Gillen
Spin offs are generally better

[nx01a]

I agree with you on this. Writers should never write Kurt of how dangerous it is to teleport and not knowing where he is.

...but the dangers of teleporting blind were pointed out in the book by Kurt himself, and it was a very sensible trap for those who know of his powers to put him in. It's an obstacle for Kurt, not some out of character problem and not something that Guggs got 'wrong'. The real problem is constantly having Rachel unconscious constantly.

[Infernal-Ginger]

Gold has been a disappointment to me. I love the team members alot....but Kitty's constant speeches & preaching is just annoying. The stories start off decent but they have all had very anti-climatic endings. No interest in the space alien story line at all. The stories have been ......boring. Keep hoping each issue will be better.

I am hoping they do some neat development with Rachel now that they dropped the Legion of SH awful costume & horrific Prestige code name.

[Maestroneto]

Issue #30, because nobody demanded it.

[Dementia5]

The real problem is constantly having Rachel unconscious constantly.

Well, now that Storm seems fully awake maybe it’s Rachel’s nap time.

[brainy1313]

Most of the team gets a new costume and Kitty is stuck in this

I'm ready for all the hate but I actually like her uniform. It has a classic look that goes well with her pixie cut. The problem is that Lashley draws it badly. He has a ragged, hard-edged style that works for the new deep space costumes, makes them seem durable and thick. But Kitty's outfit is supposed to be spandex so it should be smooth and not contoured with ridges. Instead, we get something that looks like she's wearing a baggy plastic diaper, yuck! It ruins what otherwise is a pretty decent bondage panel.

[Havok83]

I'm ready for all the hate but I actually like her uniform. It has a classic look that goes well with her pixie cut. The problem is that Lashley draws it badly. He has a ragged, hard-edged style that works for the new deep space costumes, makes them seem durable and thick. But Kitty's outfit is supposed to be spandex so it should be smooth and not contoured with ridges. Instead, we get something that looks like she's wearing a baggy plastic diaper, yuck! It ruins what otherwise is a pretty decent bondage panel.

thats not the problem with it . It was hated on before Lashley's pencil ever touched it

[Wiccan]

I'm ready for all the hate but I actually like her uniform. It has a classic look that goes well with her pixie cut. The problem is that Lashley draws it badly. He has a ragged, hard-edged style that works for the new deep space costumes, makes them seem durable and thick. But Kitty's outfit is supposed to be spandex so it should be smooth and not contoured with ridges. Instead, we get something that looks like she's wearing a baggy plastic diaper, yuck! It ruins what otherwise is a pretty decent bondage panel.

The problem it's that it has underwear above the pants. She wore pretty much the same thing without it back on Whedon's Astonishing X-Men and it was fine.

[brainy1313]

The problem it's that it has underwear above the pants. She wore pretty much the same thing without it back on Whedon's Astonishing X-Men and it was fine.

Well, I guess I'm the only one anywhere that likes it then, haha. And I'm willing to accept it.

So! Other than his work on Kitty (not just the costume but what is up with her eyes being shut or looking like they are), I'm digging Lashley's art, especially when it comes to the design of the planet, the tech and the structures. And there's an awesome panel of Colossus when he's getting ready to face down the fighter craft that I just can't stop starring at.

For a Guggs script, it's above average. And I don't think they're Space Nazis. More like religious fundamentalists. The conflict seems a lot more nuanced in that it's looking more and more that there are no good guys or bad guys in this situation. That both sides have issues but neither is outright evil. The ruling class appear to be more secular, more concerned with status/social standing. Kologoth's followers are the marginalized, the less well-off and looked down upon. Kologoth has got them hooked on this spiritualism like a cult leader. I can see a scenario where neither side wins outright, where they all lose.

Now, to the annoyingly stupid part- Nightcrawler. Why would he risk something so incredibly risky and stupid when he has zero proof that they're going to torture or kill him? In fact, everything contradicts this, the fact that he's still alive in relative comfort inside his cell. So, when he gets impaled, it's stupid-cheesy-funny and not at all shocking. I had the idea that they were going to sacrifice him to their god which would have been way more dramatic.

[Fokken]

I’ll say it. I LIKE Ink.
Wut? Come at me, Cuz.

Okay but #RealTalk: Ink could NOT lift and carry armored Colossus —- unless his Coloss-hand-tatt gives him FULL BODY enhancement and not JUST his hand/fist